Can we talk Covid? What we did right and wrong

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a nurse who worked the front line here are the biggest 3 mistakes that I saw that I think can easily be fixed next time.

1. Making people so scared and having medical offices close down so that people didn't go to the doctor with health concerns. The uptick in cancer and other preventable diseases went up because didn't or couldn't get checked out. Ive had quite a few patients say their symptoms started in lockdown but they didn't go to the doctor because of either the fear of Covid or appts were impossible to get.

2. The "2 more weeks" narrative. Putting an end date on something is never good. Because when that end date gets extended, people lose trust the next time you give one

3. In similar vain to the 2 more weeks. The masking issue. It was so back and forth and I think could have been handled much better.

2.

Thanks you for working in healthcare and thank you for your prudent input. You seem to be be able to understand the nexus between science and public policy. It's a delicate balancing act. Have you ever considered running for local office of any sort?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:omg just stop we did nothing right because of MAGA IDIOTS AND TRUMP

over a million Americans died

In Florida way more than they are admitting to my sister is an emergency room dr.

Americans are literally dumbest of dumb.

Gosh the LWNJ narrative. So mandating outdoor church services be ended but allowing BLM protests all over the country. Riiiiiight!

Florida does not hold the most deaths.

Being told to treat everyone as having the virus made zero sense.

You can easily find the ages of the people who died and the stats on those who had co morbidities.

We told people to avoid sunshine and ventilation and closed gyms and told them to stay inside.

So many failures and it wasn’t a presidential issue.

This forum is lousy with LWNJs.

The fact is, Operation Lightspeed was excellent, efficient, and well managed, no matter how much you hate trump.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^^ +1

No way I’m getting an experimental nRna clot shot if nobody cares that millions of unvaccinated flooding the border is no big deal. I’ll just wait and see what happens to the mRNA vaxxed and boosted over 5-10 years.

Lemme guess. You’re uneducated.

If logical and high IQ equals “uneducated” then yes.

Everyone, the owner of Twitter has entered the chat...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:omg just stop we did nothing right because of MAGA IDIOTS AND TRUMP

over a million Americans died

In Florida way more than they are admitting to my sister is an emergency room dr.

Americans are literally dumbest of dumb.

Gosh the LWNJ narrative. So mandating outdoor church services be ended but allowing BLM protests all over the country. Riiiiiight!

Florida does not hold the most deaths.

Being told to treat everyone as having the virus made zero sense.

You can easily find the ages of the people who died and the stats on those who had co morbidities.

We told people to avoid sunshine and ventilation and closed gyms and told them to stay inside.

So many failures and it wasn’t a presidential issue.

This forum is lousy with LWNJs.

The fact is, Operation Lightspeed was excellent, efficient, and well managed, no matter how much you hate trump.

What does the acronym LWNJs stand for? It seems you and other posters know, but I have no idea.

[Anonymous]

Not having a pandemic team early to help contain the original outbreak in China. (may have failed anyway)

Once that was out, not following the pandemic playbook that existed and said not to close schools etc. unless conditions were worse than they were. (I think closing in spring 2020 when things were unclear is easily forgivable, but in fall 2020, schools should have been open everywhere.)

The confusing communications regarding masking. They didn't want to say "N95s will help" because there was a shortage.

Confusing communications about what the "lockdowns" (which were never serious lockdowns) were for. Was it to avoid overwhelming hospitals, or was it to eliminate COVID? In retrospect it was the latter, but the communication was unclear.

The oversell on the vaccines eventually backfired. They were game changers, but COVID didn't vanish.

Having politicians do so much talking about the pandemic. (The pandemic playbook emphasized politicians doing the communication to limit politicization of it.)

The very strict policies for childcare and the lack of acknowledgment that society counts on functioning childcare and schools in order for people to work.

Lack of investment in improving indoor air quality in public spaces.

Extreme politicization on both sides (but especially the right IMO), but this is beyond COVID

What did we do right? I loved the community spirit on the hyper local level. The vaccines were out on an astounding timeline, huge advancements in mRNA tech in a short amount of time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It didn’t help that the cdc had no opinion of the border being swarmed by unvaccinated people that spread out into the country. Then said “ religious services, can be efficient vectors for virus transmission”.

Makes science look political and nonsense.

Of Covid was actually dangerous the CDC would have recommended closing the border. It was a huge indication that Covid was not that big a deal and the main reason I didn’t get the clot shot. If Covid was really a threat the CDC would recommend against infected / unvaccinated hordes entering the country.

That’s just as ridiculous as the people claiming we would have gotten rid of Covid if people just stayed home for 2/4/6 weeks at the beginning. If we closed the borders do you really think we would have kept Covid out? Or do you think Covid was already spreading in the US by the time we knew we needed to worry about it?

Even if it wasn’t spreading by March, do you really think we could have instituted and enforced border controls on US citizens that would have been sufficiently draconian to keep infected individuals from returning to the country and spreading it? Somehow I doubt you would have been ok with mandatory two-week, supervised quarantines on US citizens. And it always would have only been a matter of time before it slipped through.

Uh huh…

Millions of unvaccinated undocumented people spreading around the country is no big deal in a “deadly pandemic”. Covid was so benign that common sense could afford to be jettisoned. It was never worse than a bad flu.

This makes no sense. What about the 330 million unvaccinated people in 2020? Or the percentage of people in red states that didn't get vaccinated? You haven't explained by undocumented immigrants and illegal border crossings would have a substantial effect in the context of the entire population.

Either would going to work or church. Or not wearing filthy unwashed cloth masks or masks that aren’t changed every hour and not n-95 quality. Millions of undocumented , unvaccinated people flooding the border and spreading into the country means that vaccinations don’t stop the spread and there is no reason to require vaccine for government jobs, military or entrance to concerts or arenas.

It’s all the stupidest, illogical nonsense.

If your complaint is that things like the vaccine mandates weren’t going to significantly reduce transmission, sure, I agree with you. At least, they weren’t going to do so in any sort of lasting way. But you seemed to be claiming that not “closing the border” contributed to a significant increase in transmissions. I can’t think of any justification for that.

I'm not necessarily convinced that churches would have significantly contributed to overall infection numbers, particularly since I doubt many people would have gone to them in the areas where they did halt services, but they would have significantly increased the risk for the people attending those services. It's just that their numbers would have been drowned out by the case numbers from everyone else.

Actual “Deadly” pandemics don’t allow millions of unvaccinated undocumented people to flood the country. “Undeadly” flu level viruses are ok with it.

Common sense 101.

With absolutely no evidence, or even a coherent argument, to back up that claim.

I’ll send the Ebola infected into your home then document the results.

Are you suggesting undocumented immigrants are significantly more likely to be infected with Covid than the US population at-large? If so, got any evidence to back that up?

https://nypost.com/2021/07/15/30-percent-of-m...d-covid-shot-report/

https://www.oecd.org/coronavirus/policy-respo...r-children-e7cbb7de/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:omg just stop we did nothing right because of MAGA IDIOTS AND TRUMP

over a million Americans died

In Florida way more than they are admitting to my sister is an emergency room dr.

Americans are literally dumbest of dumb.

Gosh the LWNJ narrative. So mandating outdoor church services be ended but allowing BLM protests all over the country. Riiiiiight!

Florida does not hold the most deaths.

Being told to treat everyone as having the virus made zero sense.

You can easily find the ages of the people who died and the stats on those who had co morbidities.

We told people to avoid sunshine and ventilation and closed gyms and told them to stay inside.

So many failures and it wasn’t a presidential issue.

This forum is lousy with LWNJs.

The fact is, Operation Lightspeed was excellent, efficient, and well managed, no matter how much you hate trump.

What does the acronym LWNJs stand for? It seems you and other posters know, but I have no idea.

Left Wing NutJob. I believe it was coined after RWNJ (Right Wing NutJob).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:omfg. we did what we could with the info we had. people who want to relitigate Covid forever drive me insane. it happened, we got through it, move on with your damn lives already

How dare we discuss the Holocaust. The War between the states.

I mean it is all over. Why on earth would anyone discuss it in 2022?

Roll eyes.

There are genuinely people who survived the Holocaust who act less victimized than people whose kids had to do distance learning for like 6 months so c’mon

Try 18 months. Try some people are still doing distance learning mandated by their schools l district.

Still? No. Absolutely not. Anyone doing distance online learning in 2022 is doing it by CHOICE. Same for 2021.

You are so wrong. Get out of your little bubble!

Link the district. You’re lying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It didn’t help that the cdc had no opinion of the border being swarmed by unvaccinated people that spread out into the country. Then said “ religious services, can be efficient vectors for virus transmission”.

Makes science look political and nonsense.

Of Covid was actually dangerous the CDC would have recommended closing the border. It was a huge indication that Covid was not that big a deal and the main reason I didn’t get the clot shot. If Covid was really a threat the CDC would recommend against infected / unvaccinated hordes entering the country.

That’s just as ridiculous as the people claiming we would have gotten rid of Covid if people just stayed home for 2/4/6 weeks at the beginning. If we closed the borders do you really think we would have kept Covid out? Or do you think Covid was already spreading in the US by the time we knew we needed to worry about it?

Even if it wasn’t spreading by March, do you really think we could have instituted and enforced border controls on US citizens that would have been sufficiently draconian to keep infected individuals from returning to the country and spreading it? Somehow I doubt you would have been ok with mandatory two-week, supervised quarantines on US citizens. And it always would have only been a matter of time before it slipped through.

Uh huh…

Millions of unvaccinated undocumented people spreading around the country is no big deal in a “deadly pandemic”. Covid was so benign that common sense could afford to be jettisoned. It was never worse than a bad flu.

This makes no sense. What about the 330 million unvaccinated people in 2020? Or the percentage of people in red states that didn't get vaccinated? You haven't explained by undocumented immigrants and illegal border crossings would have a substantial effect in the context of the entire population.

Either would going to work or church. Or not wearing filthy unwashed cloth masks or masks that aren’t changed every hour and not n-95 quality. Millions of undocumented , unvaccinated people flooding the border and spreading into the country means that vaccinations don’t stop the spread and there is no reason to require vaccine for government jobs, military or entrance to concerts or arenas.

It’s all the stupidest, illogical nonsense.

If your complaint is that things like the vaccine mandates weren’t going to significantly reduce transmission, sure, I agree with you. At least, they weren’t going to do so in any sort of lasting way. But you seemed to be claiming that not “closing the border” contributed to a significant increase in transmissions. I can’t think of any justification for that.

I'm not necessarily convinced that churches would have significantly contributed to overall infection numbers, particularly since I doubt many people would have gone to them in the areas where they did halt services, but they would have significantly increased the risk for the people attending those services. It's just that their numbers would have been drowned out by the case numbers from everyone else.

Actual “Deadly” pandemics don’t allow millions of unvaccinated undocumented people to flood the country. “Undeadly” flu level viruses are ok with it.

Common sense 101.

With absolutely no evidence, or even a coherent argument, to back up that claim.

I’ll send the Ebola infected into your home then document the results.

Are you suggesting undocumented immigrants are significantly more likely to be infected with Covid than the US population at-large? If so, got any evidence to back that up?

I’m suggesting that increasing the population of infected and unvaccinated people by the hordes is never done during an actual dangerous pandemic. During a high level flu and far less dangerous contagion like weak and relatively safe contagions like Covid it’s ok.

It's also reasonable to believe that if they are willing to illegally cross the border, they aren't going to self quarantine for two weeks after crossing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am reading this book Gone Viral by Justin Hart.

https://www.target.com/p/gone-viral-by-justin...__D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

We really got so much wrong with our response to Covid. I fear so much for our children and the business les that failed due to the draconian measures out in place by 50 governors and all the school districts.

I heard the author talking about how swingsets in certain California parks are still locked.

The disease killed so few statistically. So many died due to failure to thrive because they were not allowed visits and human contact. The mentally challenged died not able to be visited by their long time caregivers. The medical field lost so much money as elective procedures were cancelled.

The thing is I believe this will happen again and the power hungry brokers will once again put in these horrid measures.

You are…. Uninformed. School districts didn’t make decisions, governors did.
I don’t know any who died from failure to thrive.. I know many who died from Covid.

You sound republican. I’m so sorry.

The vast majority who died were elderly, obese, had other co-morbities. This is not a political issue. We applied draconian rules to everyone. We are not talking about other countries, we are talking about what we did here.

Those rules were implemented not by governors solely, some school districts were not applying the rules universally across the states.

Many many people didn’t die from Covid, they died with Covid. Those who failed to thrive did so while not being allowed to to be visited by family in their nursing homes or other end of life facilities. You had to have masked funerals over zoom with loved ones not in attendance to an outdoor gravesite.

We have kids who needed face contact without masks to learns to speak correctly. They could sit on the side of each other yet all lay down next to each other for nap time.

Heck there are people on DCUM who won’t go out to eat and are still masking to this day!

You are insufferable.

1. Are those who are elderly, obese, or have other co-morbities less valuable?

2. Schools are always super-spreaders of viruses, so keeping them closed until we had vaccines was the right move.

3. Why are masked funerals a problem? I attended several funerals, including two of people who died from Covid complications (and who were, since you seem to think they are more worthy, fairly young, healthy individuals), masked. No one at any of the funerals was complaining about being masked.

4. Why do you care if some people are still masked to this day? You seem to have strong feelings, evident through your use of an exclamation point, about strangers' choice to mask or not to go out to eat. How does that impact you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am reading this book Gone Viral by Justin Hart.

https://www.target.com/p/gone-viral-by-justin...__D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

We really got so much wrong with our response to Covid. I fear so much for our children and the business les that failed due to the draconian measures out in place by 50 governors and all the school districts.

I heard the author talking about how swingsets in certain California parks are still locked.

The disease killed so few statistically. So many died due to failure to thrive because they were not allowed visits and human contact. The mentally challenged died not able to be visited by their long time caregivers. The medical field lost so much money as elective procedures were cancelled.

The thing is I believe this will happen again and the power hungry brokers will once again put in these horrid measures.

You are…. Uninformed. School districts didn’t make decisions, governors did.
I don’t know any who died from failure to thrive.. I know many who died from Covid.

You sound republican. I’m so sorry.

The vast majority who died were elderly, obese, had other co-morbities. This is not a political issue. We applied draconian rules to everyone. We are not talking about other countries, we are talking about what we did here.

Those rules were implemented not by governors solely, some school districts were not applying the rules universally across the states.

Many many people didn’t die from Covid, they died with Covid. Those who failed to thrive did so while not being allowed to to be visited by family in their nursing homes or other end of life facilities. You had to have masked funerals over zoom with loved ones not in attendance to an outdoor gravesite.

We have kids who needed face contact without masks to learns to speak correctly. They could sit on the side of each other yet all lay down next to each other for nap time.

Heck there are people on DCUM who won’t go out to eat and are still masking to this day!

You are insufferable.

1. Are those who are elderly, obese, or have other co-morbities less valuable?

2. Schools are always super-spreaders of viruses, so keeping them closed until we had vaccines was the right move.

3. Why are masked funerals a problem? I attended several funerals, including two of people who died from Covid complications (and who were, since you seem to think they are more worthy, fairly young, healthy individuals), masked. No one at any of the funerals was complaining about being masked.

4. Why do you care if some people are still masked to this day? You seem to have strong feelings, evident through your use of an exclamation point, about strangers' choice to mask or not to go out to eat. How does that impact you?

We get it. You very much support Covid restrictions and think it was all worthwhile.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It didn’t help that the cdc had no opinion of the border being swarmed by unvaccinated people that spread out into the country. Then said “ religious services, can be efficient vectors for virus transmission”.

Makes science look political and nonsense.

Of Covid was actually dangerous the CDC would have recommended closing the border. It was a huge indication that Covid was not that big a deal and the main reason I didn’t get the clot shot. If Covid was really a threat the CDC would recommend against infected / unvaccinated hordes entering the country.

That’s just as ridiculous as the people claiming we would have gotten rid of Covid if people just stayed home for 2/4/6 weeks at the beginning. If we closed the borders do you really think we would have kept Covid out? Or do you think Covid was already spreading in the US by the time we knew we needed to worry about it?

Even if it wasn’t spreading by March, do you really think we could have instituted and enforced border controls on US citizens that would have been sufficiently draconian to keep infected individuals from returning to the country and spreading it? Somehow I doubt you would have been ok with mandatory two-week, supervised quarantines on US citizens. And it always would have only been a matter of time before it slipped through.

Uh huh…

Millions of unvaccinated undocumented people spreading around the country is no big deal in a “deadly pandemic”. Covid was so benign that common sense could afford to be jettisoned. It was never worse than a bad flu.

This makes no sense. What about the 330 million unvaccinated people in 2020? Or the percentage of people in red states that didn't get vaccinated? You haven't explained by undocumented immigrants and illegal border crossings would have a substantial effect in the context of the entire population.

Either would going to work or church. Or not wearing filthy unwashed cloth masks or masks that aren’t changed every hour and not n-95 quality. Millions of undocumented , unvaccinated people flooding the border and spreading into the country means that vaccinations don’t stop the spread and there is no reason to require vaccine for government jobs, military or entrance to concerts or arenas.

It’s all the stupidest, illogical nonsense.

If your complaint is that things like the vaccine mandates weren’t going to significantly reduce transmission, sure, I agree with you. At least, they weren’t going to do so in any sort of lasting way. But you seemed to be claiming that not “closing the border” contributed to a significant increase in transmissions. I can’t think of any justification for that.

I'm not necessarily convinced that churches would have significantly contributed to overall infection numbers, particularly since I doubt many people would have gone to them in the areas where they did halt services, but they would have significantly increased the risk for the people attending those services. It's just that their numbers would have been drowned out by the case numbers from everyone else.

Actual “Deadly” pandemics don’t allow millions of unvaccinated undocumented people to flood the country. “Undeadly” flu level viruses are ok with it.

Common sense 101.

With absolutely no evidence, or even a coherent argument, to back up that claim.

I’ll send the Ebola infected into your home then document the results.

Are you suggesting undocumented immigrants are significantly more likely to be infected with Covid than the US population at-large? If so, got any evidence to back that up?

I’m suggesting that increasing the population of infected and unvaccinated people by the hordes is never done during an actual dangerous pandemic. During a high level flu and far less dangerous contagion like weak and relatively safe contagions like Covid it’s ok.

It's also reasonable to believe that if they are willing to illegally cross the border, they aren't going to self quarantine for two weeks after crossing.

Then it’s reasonable to not require vaccination for any reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It didn’t help that the cdc had no opinion of the border being swarmed by unvaccinated people that spread out into the country. Then said “ religious services, can be efficient vectors for virus transmission”.

Makes science look political and nonsense.

Of Covid was actually dangerous the CDC would have recommended closing the border. It was a huge indication that Covid was not that big a deal and the main reason I didn’t get the clot shot. If Covid was really a threat the CDC would recommend against infected / unvaccinated hordes entering the country.

That’s just as ridiculous as the people claiming we would have gotten rid of Covid if people just stayed home for 2/4/6 weeks at the beginning. If we closed the borders do you really think we would have kept Covid out? Or do you think Covid was already spreading in the US by the time we knew we needed to worry about it?

Even if it wasn’t spreading by March, do you really think we could have instituted and enforced border controls on US citizens that would have been sufficiently draconian to keep infected individuals from returning to the country and spreading it? Somehow I doubt you would have been ok with mandatory two-week, supervised quarantines on US citizens. And it always would have only been a matter of time before it slipped through.

Uh huh…

Millions of unvaccinated undocumented people spreading around the country is no big deal in a “deadly pandemic”. Covid was so benign that common sense could afford to be jettisoned. It was never worse than a bad flu.

This makes no sense. What about the 330 million unvaccinated people in 2020? Or the percentage of people in red states that didn't get vaccinated? You haven't explained by undocumented immigrants and illegal border crossings would have a substantial effect in the context of the entire population.

Either would going to work or church. Or not wearing filthy unwashed cloth masks or masks that aren’t changed every hour and not n-95 quality. Millions of undocumented , unvaccinated people flooding the border and spreading into the country means that vaccinations don’t stop the spread and there is no reason to require vaccine for government jobs, military or entrance to concerts or arenas.

It’s all the stupidest, illogical nonsense.

If your complaint is that things like the vaccine mandates weren’t going to significantly reduce transmission, sure, I agree with you. At least, they weren’t going to do so in any sort of lasting way. But you seemed to be claiming that not “closing the border” contributed to a significant increase in transmissions. I can’t think of any justification for that.

I'm not necessarily convinced that churches would have significantly contributed to overall infection numbers, particularly since I doubt many people would have gone to them in the areas where they did halt services, but they would have significantly increased the risk for the people attending those services. It's just that their numbers would have been drowned out by the case numbers from everyone else.

Actual “Deadly” pandemics don’t allow millions of unvaccinated undocumented people to flood the country. “Undeadly” flu level viruses are ok with it.

Common sense 101.

With absolutely no evidence, or even a coherent argument, to back up that claim.

I’ll send the Ebola infected into your home then document the results.

Are you suggesting undocumented immigrants are significantly more likely to be infected with Covid than the US population at-large? If so, got any evidence to back that up?

I’m suggesting that increasing the population of infected and unvaccinated people by the hordes is never done during an actual dangerous pandemic. During a high level flu and far less dangerous contagion like weak and relatively safe contagions like Covid it’s ok.

It's also reasonable to believe that if they are willing to illegally cross the border, they aren't going to self quarantine for two weeks after crossing.

Then it’s reasonable to not require vaccination for any reason.

Exactly. Requiring vaccination for jobs or entry was unscientific and sub-human behavior.