Automatically enrolled into Algebra 1 honors
![[Post New]](/jforum/templates/default/images/icon_minipost_new.gif){kind=icon}
Anonymous
Slowing down later doesn't necessarily fill gaps that occurred before a kid started in algebra 1. I have my aap kid at mathnasium because I think the FCPS math curriculum is way too haphazard. For example, my kid's class covered order of operations before the exponents lesson. I want to cover any gaps now before it becomes a problem down the road. |
Anonymous
Kids at title 1 schools have had access to AAP and Advanced math. Far fewer were ready for Algebra 1 in 7th grade, they simply didn’t get the scores on the IAAT or SOL to qualify for the class. They took A1H in 8th grade, which is still ahead of the curve. Pushing poor kids into A1H in 6th and 7th grade is not going to provide Title 1 kids any benefit. Most were not ready for A1H in 7th grade, which means most are not ready for it in 6th grade. The A1H classes for 7th graders at schools like Poe and Herndon were not full because the kids did not score high enough to be able to take the class. Lowering the scores and eliminating one test does not change the fact that the kids could not hit the score that was needed. So now we are going to place smart kids who are less likely to have the parental support at home to help them with homework or understanding concepts into a HS class 2-3 years early because equity? FCPS needed to fix the issue of making A1H accessible to students in 6th grade across the County and not just at the 20 schools that allowed it. That is different then changing the standards so that more kids are placed into Algebra 1 from poor schools. The push for Algebra by 8th grade wasn’t really needed because something like 75% of the kids in the County took Algebra by 8th grade. The kids who were not taking it are kids who struggle with math and need the slower path. They need classes that move at a slower pace, review the material more, and help deepen fundamental skills. They don’t need to try and push the kids that are doing well in math into Algebra in 6th or 7th grade, that does nothing to help the kids who are not ready in 8th grade. |
Anonymous
10-1 odds say that they are like the people going “But Singapore, Korea, China, Japan…” who are unwilling to point to the number of hours those kids spend studying outside of school. There is an enlightening video on the Singapore PISA study habits on YouTube. Kids go to school for longer then they do in the US, come home, go to tutoring programs, come home, and study until bedtime, which is late at night. They don’t have down time. They don’t play with their friends. They don’t play a sport, unless it is programmed by their parents. They study. And if they don’t do well enough on the PISA test, they go to vo tech school, in 7th grade. |
Anonymous
My daughter has half her 6th grade class doing algebra 1. Kids were crying over it, at least 3-4 kids have tutors, several kids go to outside math programs, and one kid is consistently cheating. And the majority of them are miserable. If all these kids were ready for it, none of this would be necessary. For title 1 kids, given them access without the supports or underlying math foundations is a recipe for disaster. Not everyone will be able to afford the supplements needed to make it through. |
Anonymous
There presumably is research that the kids who meet whatever benchmark on algebra-readiness tests are in fact ready for Algebra. Otherwise, the tests themselves wouldn't make sense. There isn't any research indicating that putting unready kids into early Algebra I will be anything other than a disaster. I really do think that expanding access to 6th grade Algebra is the right call, providing that the kids are truly ready. Nothing is gained from taking a class for which the kid has already mastered all of the material. Also, if providing 6th grade Algebra eliminates summer geometry, then many kids will end up in the same place that they would have before (8th grade Algebra II), but with a much better grasp of geometry. What FCPS is doing right now is really dumb. |
Anonymous
You keep calling A1H in 8th "ahead of the curve," but in the very same post admit that 75% take Algebra by 8th and only the kids who struggle with math don't. Algebra 1 in 8th is not "ahead of the curve," it is on target for an average (not at all advanced) student. Algebra 1 in 7th is easily doable for by good students, even those not in AAP. Algebra 1 in 6th should be only for the kids who do well in advanced math and enjoy it, but that is a much larger group of kids than you think it is. The material is not difficult for smart kids. It is only the study habits and desire to earn the A that has some of them getting B's or C's. It seems to me like you are freaking out about it because you want to hold your kid back, and you don't want to feel guilty about so many other kids having a head start on your kid because of your decision. |
Anonymous
Most of the Country doesn't allow Algebra 1 in until 8th grade and it is not a large percentage of the kids. FCPS has a different bar but nationally, 9th grade is when people take Algebra 1 with the advanced kids taking it in 8th grade. FCPS's policy, prior to relaxing the rules on who can take A1H in 7th and adding A1H in 6th, was already far ahead of the rest of the country. |
Anonymous
Going to need to see a source on this claim since the very rural part of Virginia where I grew up offered it to me a couple decades ago in 7th grade. I think you are just making stuff up at this point. |
Anonymous
That's sad 
My child reports all but 1 kid in his class of 31 are having a good time and scoring well. I have obviously not talked to everyone, but the half dozen families I've spoken to are very hands off, no tutors or support beyond parents making sure kids do homework each night. We all kind of let the kids take the lead. This is a very middle class FCPS neighborhood. If they're smart, the 5th grade advanced math classes will be using the time after the SOL to teach the couple of math 7 skills that the kids will skip over who go straight to algebra 1. (As someone who taught middle school math for over a decade, the vast majority of M7 is just a repeat of M6 or not relevant to algebra 1 foundations...) |
Anonymous
https://www.e-jps.org/archive/view_article?pid=jps-39-4-9 Here ya go. There are articles in the Wall Street Journal and NY Times that have summaries on google showing similar numbers, I don't have a subscription so I can't read them to verify. "A typical secondary school mathematics course sequence would start with Algebra I and continue with Geometry, Algebra II, Pre-Calculus, and Calculus. For academically prepared students, enrolling in Algebra I before secondary school— typically 7th or 8th grade—gives an advantage in increasing students’ likelihood of later enrolling in higher level mathematics courses such as Calculus and Advanced Placement (AP) mathematics courses during secondary school. However, when eligible students do not have access to Algebra I in middle school their likelihood of experiencing this enrichment is decreased. In the United States (US), only 60% of schools that serve 8th graders offer Algebra I and 24% of all 8th graders are enrolled in the course (USDOE, 2018). Black and Latino students are less likely to have access to Algebra I in middle school, especially when they attend segregated schools. Despite being 15% and 25% of the overall 8th-grade population, Black and Latino students make up only 10% and 18% of students enrolled in 8th grade Algebra I (Patrick et al., 2020)." Google Algebra in MS and take a look at the numbers. |
Anonymous
DP. This is all oversimplified. For southern states, it's common to have pretty robust gifted and magnet programs. The regular middle schools might not offer algebra, because everyone who would take it would already be in the magnet or gifted program and have access there. Also, if a middle school doesn't offer algebra, that doesn't mean that the middle schoolers there lack access to Algebra. In some schools, the kids at that level take the class at the local high school. This is often the way it is handled at smaller charter or private schools where middle and high schools share a campus. The middle school doesn't technically offer algebra or geometry, because the eligible kids walk 1 minute to the high school hallway/building and take it there. So, the real question not answered by your data is the fraction of the bright kids who have MAP or other scores suggesting algebra placement, but lack access. It's also not clear what "ahead of the curve" means in this context? Is 8th grade algebra ahead of the curve of all US students enrolled in a high school? Probably. Is it ahead of the curve for college bound high school students? No. It's pretty average. It is ahead for college bound kids who are aiming STEM majors and are in large, highly educated cities with generally affluent populations? No way. It's behind. |
Anonymous
|
Taking Algebra 1 in grade 7 instead of grade 6, put the kid at a disadvantage?
|
Anonymous
No. Taking it in 8th grade rather than 7th might put the kid at a disadvantage. Taking it in 6th could be advantageous for your specific kid, if they're already completely ready for algebra, love math, and want to take more of the advanced classes. The only potential disadvantage of not taking it in 6th is that your kid might be pretty bored for an extra year. Colleges aren't going to care either way. |
Anonymous
That's a whim and a pie in the sky attitude. Throwing these "poor families" into the wind and saying, "Fly! Fly! I know you can do it!" And all at the same time, not listening to teachers. Not listening to parents. |
Anonymous
|