Automatically enrolled into Algebra 1 honors

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A good read. https://www.nwea.org/blog/2024/when-are-students-ready-for-algebra/?hl=en-US#:~:text=And%20students%20who%20complete%20Algebra,negative%20consequences%20on%20their%20achievement.

"Students needed to score around a 235 to 238 on MAP Growth in the spring of seventh grade to be on track to score proficient at the end of an Algebra 1 course. "

A 50% chance of being only proficient? I assume proficient in this case means passing, not outright mastery. Sounds like a low bar.

This was an eye-opener. The author of the article said that of the kids with a 235-238 on the MAP, 50% of those kids could probably handle it, and 50% could struggle with it. He said it would be understandable for a school district to raise the bar and require more preparation and proficiency for Algebra I. Mine has a 245 on MAP in the 6th, and I don't think she's ready to take a high school course that will go on her transcript. Sure, maybe she'll make a high C or a B in 7th grade, but why not give it a year and give her more prep? Go for the A in 8th grade?

You do what's appropriate for your kid, even hold back one additional year and go for Alg1 in 9th grade, if that ensures an A on the transcript. FCPS has already been accommodating the needs of students like yours, but ignoring the needs of advanced students, until now.

Of the approximate 14000 FCPS 6th graders, 700 advanced kids' needs are being met by Alg1 program. Why and how does a program meeting the needs of 5% of total 6th grade kids concern you?

DP. You should be concerned about the way Alg 1 is being implemented. If they let any kids, whether ready or not, enroll in the class, then the teacher is going to slow down the class and water down the content to meet the majority of the kids where they are. While it would be nice to imagine that the teacher will maintain standards and let kids earn poor grades or drop down, the reality is that doing so is a huge administrative hassle for the teacher. If the class is filled only with kids who truly are ready, then both the kids who weren't ready and won't have to struggle in a class that is too hard for them and the kids who were ready and won't have to deal with a dumbed-down class will benefit.

FWIW, I think it's great that they're expanding access to Alg. I in 6th, but they should be using a higher threshold for entry. If they don't want to gatekeep the class, then they should provide more detailed information to parents to allow the parents to make a truly informed decision.

This argument doesn't make sense, that only the 6th grade alg1 class has students of mixed abilities, and not in any other 7th, 8th, or 9th grade alg1 classes. If anything, any dumbing down is more likely happening in those upper grades.

Actually, it makes a lot of sense since prior to this shift to remove all prerequisites, 7th grade A1H required pass advanced SOL, and scoring over 91st percentile on IAAT. Dumbing down has absolutely been happening in the upper grades but this shift to remove any guardrails from A1H in 7th and now 6th too will impact these advanced classes that used to be quite rigorous. This is a hs level honors course and there absolutely should be a higher threshold for admission than simply passing the 6th grade SOL.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A good read. https://www.nwea.org/blog/2024/when-are-students-ready-for-algebra/?hl=en-US#:~:text=And%20students%20who%20complete%20Algebra,negative%20consequences%20on%20their%20achievement.

"Students needed to score around a 235 to 238 on MAP Growth in the spring of seventh grade to be on track to score proficient at the end of an Algebra 1 course. "

A 50% chance of being only proficient? I assume proficient in this case means passing, not outright mastery. Sounds like a low bar.

This was an eye-opener. The author of the article said that of the kids with a 235-238 on the MAP, 50% of those kids could probably handle it, and 50% could struggle with it. He said it would be understandable for a school district to raise the bar and require more preparation and proficiency for Algebra I. Mine has a 245 on MAP in the 6th, and I don't think she's ready to take a high school course that will go on her transcript. Sure, maybe she'll make a high C or a B in 7th grade, but why not give it a year and give her more prep? Go for the A in 8th grade?

You do what's appropriate for your kid, even hold back one additional year and go for Alg1 in 9th grade, if that ensures an A on the transcript. FCPS has already been accommodating the needs of students like yours, but ignoring the needs of advanced students, until now.

Of the approximate 14000 FCPS 6th graders, 700 advanced kids' needs are being met by Alg1 program. Why and how does a program meeting the needs of 5% of total 6th grade kids concern you?

DP. You should be concerned about the way Alg 1 is being implemented. If they let any kids, whether ready or not, enroll in the class, then the teacher is going to slow down the class and water down the content to meet the majority of the kids where they are. While it would be nice to imagine that the teacher will maintain standards and let kids earn poor grades or drop down, the reality is that doing so is a huge administrative hassle for the teacher. If the class is filled only with kids who truly are ready, then both the kids who weren't ready and won't have to struggle in a class that is too hard for them and the kids who were ready and won't have to deal with a dumbed-down class will benefit.

FWIW, I think it's great that they're expanding access to Alg. I in 6th, but they should be using a higher threshold for entry. If they don't want to gatekeep the class, then they should provide more detailed information to parents to allow the parents to make a truly informed decision.

This argument doesn't make sense, that only the 6th grade alg1 class has students of mixed abilities, and not in any other 7th, 8th, or 9th grade alg1 classes. If anything, any dumbing down is more likely happening in those upper grades.

In the past, the kids taking Honors Algebra I in 7th needed to complete Math 7 (AAP 6th grade math) and meet the IAAT and SOL pass advanced benchmarks. Kids taking it in 8th fully completed Math 8 and weren't skipping any content. Kids in the old system taking it in 6th needed to meet some very high benchmarks, still complete math 7, and then still meet the IAAT and SOL benchmarks to move onto Algebra. Yes, there would be some degree of mixed ability and preparedness. IME, teachers are going to teach to the lower side of middle in a class. The low middle would still have been reasonably ready for Algebra.

This last year is the first one where kids skipped both Math 7 and 8 when moving into Algebra, but they did need high MAP scores to suggest Algebra readiness. Now, they're removing any and all guardrails. Kids who were struggling with Math 6 can jump right up into algebra. The low middle will shift from kids ready for Algebra to kids needing significant pre-algebra instruction/remediation.

[Anonymous]

You know what I find crazy? Is how much time Reid and the county spent on feedback and roll out of the boundary review or the new high school or ‘listening sessions’ in different parts of the county… and this just gets rolled out over night.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You know what I find crazy? Is how much time Reid and the county spent on feedback and roll out of the boundary review or the new high school or ‘listening sessions’ in different parts of the county… and this just gets rolled out over night.

That's the FCPS way. They did the same thing with changing the grade book to 70/30, changing rules about attendance, the 50% minimum, piloting full inclusion, and so on. Reid and the current School Board members will be long gone by the time anyone is ready to admit the policies didn't work and were a bad idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You know what I find crazy? Is how much time Reid and the county spent on feedback and roll out of the boundary review or the new high school or ‘listening sessions’ in different parts of the county… and this just gets rolled out over night.

Last year there was no notification, no hint that Algebra 1 pilot will be rolled out with advanced pass SOL as the criteria. We didn’t figure on making sure DD was preparing for SOL. We took it lightly as we gad no idea it will have a big impact.
My DD scored 495 and missed the cut off of 500 in SOL. She will be taking Algebra 1 in grade 7 and if ready and she wants, geometry in summer to catch up with her AAP peers.
Or she may not be able to catch up as taking online geometry in summer is not advisable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A good read. https://www.nwea.org/blog/2024/when-are-students-ready-for-algebra/?hl=en-US#:~:text=And%20students%20who%20complete%20Algebra,negative%20consequences%20on%20their%20achievement.

"Students needed to score around a 235 to 238 on MAP Growth in the spring of seventh grade to be on track to score proficient at the end of an Algebra 1 course. "

A 50% chance of being only proficient? I assume proficient in this case means passing, not outright mastery. Sounds like a low bar.

This was an eye-opener. The author of the article said that of the kids with a 235-238 on the MAP, 50% of those kids could probably handle it, and 50% could struggle with it. He said it would be understandable for a school district to raise the bar and require more preparation and proficiency for Algebra I. Mine has a 245 on MAP in the 6th, and I don't think she's ready to take a high school course that will go on her transcript. Sure, maybe she'll make a high C or a B in 7th grade, but why not give it a year and give her more prep? Go for the A in 8th grade?

You do what's appropriate for your kid, even hold back one additional year and go for Alg1 in 9th grade, if that ensures an A on the transcript. FCPS has already been accommodating the needs of students like yours, but ignoring the needs of advanced students, until now.

Of the approximate 14000 FCPS 6th graders, 700 advanced kids' needs are being met by Alg1 program. Why and how does a program meeting the needs of 5% of total 6th grade kids concern you?

DP. You should be concerned about the way Alg 1 is being implemented. If they let any kids, whether ready or not, enroll in the class, then the teacher is going to slow down the class and water down the content to meet the majority of the kids where they are. While it would be nice to imagine that the teacher will maintain standards and let kids earn poor grades or drop down, the reality is that doing so is a huge administrative hassle for the teacher. If the class is filled only with kids who truly are ready, then both the kids who weren't ready and won't have to struggle in a class that is too hard for them and the kids who were ready and won't have to deal with a dumbed-down class will benefit.

FWIW, I think it's great that they're expanding access to Alg. I in 6th, but they should be using a higher threshold for entry. If they don't want to gatekeep the class, then they should provide more detailed information to parents to allow the parents to make a truly informed decision.

This is a good point. Honestly, I haven't talked to one teacher who thinks this is a good idea. Why does no one listen to teachers?

So you went around and talked to all alg1 teachers of all 700 students?

Go away you aren't contributing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know what I find crazy? Is how much time Reid and the county spent on feedback and roll out of the boundary review or the new high school or ‘listening sessions’ in different parts of the county… and this just gets rolled out over night.

Last year there was no notification, no hint that Algebra 1 pilot will be rolled out with advanced pass SOL as the criteria. We didn’t figure on making sure DD was preparing for SOL. We took it lightly as we gad no idea it will have a big impact.
My DD scored 495 and missed the cut off of 500 in SOL. She will be taking Algebra 1 in grade 7 and if ready and she wants, geometry in summer to catch up with her AAP peers.
Or she may not be able to catch up as taking online geometry in summer is not advisable.

But why are you worrying about "catching up," and why are you upset that you couldn't push your child into 6th grade Algebra? If she only got a 495 on the 6th grade math SOL, there's no way she should be skipping math 7 and 8 and moving into Algebra. She is nowhere near having mastery all of the pre algebra foundations that she needs. The kids who barely reached the 500 cutoff are probably struggling, or they're the ones causing the class to be watered down. You should be happy that you dodged a bullet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know what I find crazy? Is how much time Reid and the county spent on feedback and roll out of the boundary review or the new high school or ‘listening sessions’ in different parts of the county… and this just gets rolled out over night.

Last year there was no notification, no hint that Algebra 1 pilot will be rolled out with advanced pass SOL as the criteria. We didn’t figure on making sure DD was preparing for SOL. We took it lightly as we gad no idea it will have a big impact.
My DD scored 495 and missed the cut off of 500 in SOL. She will be taking Algebra 1 in grade 7 and if ready and she wants, geometry in summer to catch up with her AAP peers.
Or she may not be able to catch up as taking online geometry in summer is not advisable.

But why are you worrying about "catching up," and why are you upset that you couldn't push your child into 6th grade Algebra? If she only got a 495 on the 6th grade math SOL, there's no way she should be skipping math 7 and 8 and moving into Algebra. She is nowhere near having mastery all of the pre algebra foundations that she needs. The kids who barely reached the 500 cutoff are probably struggling, or they're the ones causing the class to be watered down. You should be happy that you dodged a bullet.

So, you are saying if my DS scored 495 just due to lack of prep and effort, that was needed to score more than 500, she should not be in Algebra 1 in grade 6?
And now all of AAP will be able to take it from this year, even if kids score 401 or some where between 400 to 500?
Was it fair to current AAP 6th grades who were not allowed to take it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know what I find crazy? Is how much time Reid and the county spent on feedback and roll out of the boundary review or the new high school or ‘listening sessions’ in different parts of the county… and this just gets rolled out over night.

Last year there was no notification, no hint that Algebra 1 pilot will be rolled out with advanced pass SOL as the criteria. We didn’t figure on making sure DD was preparing for SOL. We took it lightly as we gad no idea it will have a big impact.
My DD scored 495 and missed the cut off of 500 in SOL. She will be taking Algebra 1 in grade 7 and if ready and she wants, geometry in summer to catch up with her AAP peers.
Or she may not be able to catch up as taking online geometry in summer is not advisable.

But why are you worrying about "catching up," and why are you upset that you couldn't push your child into 6th grade Algebra? If she only got a 495 on the 6th grade math SOL, there's no way she should be skipping math 7 and 8 and moving into Algebra. She is nowhere near having mastery all of the pre algebra foundations that she needs. The kids who barely reached the 500 cutoff are probably struggling, or they're the ones causing the class to be watered down. You should be happy that you dodged a bullet.

So, you are saying if my DS scored 495 just due to lack of prep and effort, that was needed to score more than 500, she should not be in Algebra 1 in grade 6?
And now all of AAP will be able to take it from this year, even if kids score 401 or some where between 400 to 500?
Was it fair to current AAP 6th grades who were not allowed to take it?

Yes. I'm saying that kids who aren't close to a perfect score on the SOL and aren't 99th percentile on MAP are not ready for and don't belong in 6th grade Algebra I, regardless of whether they put forth any prep or effort. FCPS is doing a disservice to all of their kids by putting kids into Algebra who aren't even close to ready and have weak math foundations. It will result in some combination of kids needing to drop down midyear, perhaps missing some foundational content, kids constantly struggling and not really understanding what they're doing, and kids receiving a watered down Algebra I class that inadequately prepares them for Algebra II and pre-calculus.

A kid who scores 495 has some significant gaps in their knowledge base. They still need to spend more time with pre-algebra content to be ready for algebra. I bet if your kid sat for the M7H final at the end of 5th, they'd score terribly. They're not at all ready to skip it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You know what I find crazy? Is how much time Reid and the county spent on feedback and roll out of the boundary review or the new high school or ‘listening sessions’ in different parts of the county… and this just gets rolled out over night.

Last year there was no notification, no hint that Algebra 1 pilot will be rolled out with advanced pass SOL as the criteria. We didn’t figure on making sure DD was preparing for SOL. We took it lightly as we gad no idea it will have a big impact.
My DD scored 495 and missed the cut off of 500 in SOL. She will be taking Algebra 1 in grade 7 and if ready and she wants, geometry in summer to catch up with her AAP peers.
Or she may not be able to catch up as taking online geometry in summer is not advisable.

But why are you worrying about "catching up," and why are you upset that you couldn't push your child into 6th grade Algebra? If she only got a 495 on the 6th grade math SOL, there's no way she should be skipping math 7 and 8 and moving into Algebra. She is nowhere near having mastery all of the pre algebra foundations that she needs. The kids who barely reached the 500 cutoff are probably struggling, or they're the ones causing the class to be watered down. You should be happy that you dodged a bullet.

I think you have a fundamentally different view about child development and education than most of the parents on this thread.

So, you are saying if my DS scored 495 just due to lack of prep and effort, that was needed to score more than 500, she should not be in Algebra 1 in grade 6?
And now all of AAP will be able to take it from this year, even if kids score 401 or some where between 400 to 500?
Was it fair to current AAP 6th grades who were not allowed to take it?