MCSL rule changes for summer 2026

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

[Anonymous]

It's just not fun is the problem. Swimming in crowded pools learning defensive swimming habits then going up against club swimmers that are paying for open lanes. The club swimmers clearly don't prefer the crowded summer league lanes, but they like the ribbons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

Yeah I was going to mention this too- B meets get cancelled a lot because of the tendency for evening storms, and are rarely made up.

To the people claiming there would be no volunteers if the apparently existing MCSL rule to attend practices was enforced- oookay. Who do you think is volunteering for the B meets now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

Yeah I was going to mention this too- B meets get cancelled a lot because of the tendency for evening storms, and are rarely made up.

To the people claiming there would be no volunteers if the apparently existing MCSL rule to attend practices was enforced- oookay. Who do you think is volunteering for the B meets now?

Why don't the clubs have Saturday meets during the summer? Do they only swim indoors during the winter or something.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

Yeah I was going to mention this too- B meets get cancelled a lot because of the tendency for evening storms, and are rarely made up.

To the people claiming there would be no volunteers if the apparently existing MCSL rule to attend practices was enforced- oookay. Who do you think is volunteering for the B meets now?

Every single one of our B Meet officials has a club swimmer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

Yeah I was going to mention this too- B meets get cancelled a lot because of the tendency for evening storms, and are rarely made up.

To the people claiming there would be no volunteers if the apparently existing MCSL rule to attend practices was enforced- oookay. Who do you think is volunteering for the B meets now?

Why don't the clubs have Saturday meets during the summer? Do they only swim indoors during the winter or something.

in PVS, they do their best to schedule around summer league meets so that... club swimmers and officials can do both

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

Yeah I was going to mention this too- B meets get cancelled a lot because of the tendency for evening storms, and are rarely made up.

To the people claiming there would be no volunteers if the apparently existing MCSL rule to attend practices was enforced- oookay. Who do you think is volunteering for the B meets now?

Every single one of our B Meet officials has a club swimmer.

+1, and some of our officials work B meets even when they don’t have a kid swimming in it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

Yeah I was going to mention this too- B meets get cancelled a lot because of the tendency for evening storms, and are rarely made up.

To the people claiming there would be no volunteers if the apparently existing MCSL rule to attend practices was enforced- oookay. Who do you think is volunteering for the B meets now?

Why don't the clubs have Saturday meets during the summer? Do they only swim indoors during the winter or something.

in PVS, they do their best to schedule around summer league meets so that... club swimmers and officials can do both

Just trying to think of ways you could make club swimming more fun you know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

So the weather is the fault of club swimmers? As for not wanting to associate with the "B-team" kids, this makes no sense. Rather, it sounds like there is a bit of resentment of the parents of club swimmers don't want to associate with the parents of non-club swimmers.

What this really comes down to is that parents of summer-only swimmers want their kids swimming in A meets because they go to summer practices. If that's what they want, then go ahead and "ban" club swimmers if they don't attend X number of practices. MCSL will collapse, teams will fold, and pools will all close for lack of revenue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

So the weather is the fault of club swimmers? As for not wanting to associate with the "B-team" kids, this makes no sense. Rather, it sounds like there is a bit of resentment of the parents of club swimmers don't want to associate with the parents of non-club swimmers.

What this really comes down to is that parents of summer-only swimmers want their kids swimming in A meets because they go to summer practices. If that's what they want, then go ahead and "ban" club swimmers if they don't attend X number of practices. MCSL will collapse, teams will fold, and pools will all close for lack of revenue.

I don't really think it's that big of an issue, "most" club swimmers don't swim summer league. I think it's only a few clubs that seem to have a large number of club swimmers. Many of the summer league teams probably have one or two and they are probably going to all of the practices because it's their friends from the neighborhood. There are a few high ranked clubs where the A-meets are dominated by club swimmers. The thing is these kids often aren't all that great compared to club swimmers that win in the club meets. They just want the ribbons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

So the weather is the fault of club swimmers? As for not wanting to associate with the "B-team" kids, this makes no sense. Rather, it sounds like there is a bit of resentment of the parents of club swimmers don't want to associate with the parents of non-club swimmers.

What this really comes down to is that parents of summer-only swimmers want their kids swimming in A meets because they go to summer practices. If that's what they want, then go ahead and "ban" club swimmers if they don't attend X number of practices. MCSL will collapse, teams will fold, and pools will all close for lack of revenue.

I don't really think it's that big of an issue, "most" club swimmers don't swim summer league. I think it's only a few clubs that seem to have a large number of club swimmers. Many of the summer league teams probably have one or two and they are probably going to all of the practices because it's their friends from the neighborhood. There are a few high ranked clubs where the A-meets are dominated by club swimmers. The thing is these kids often aren't all that great compared to club swimmers that win in the club meets. They just want the ribbons.

I can’t speak for MCSL, but in NVSL, many of the fastest kids in PVS (and the nation), swim for summer league. They ARE actually that great. It has nothing to do with ribbons. Club swimming is a grind. Summer swim is an opportunity to swim as a team in a fun environment. The high division teams where club swimmers dominate A meets tend to have the kids that dominate at club meets.

[Anonymous]

Or you could build a team environment that's welcoming to everyone and kids really want to hang out together. That's our pool. The club swimmers bring some points and get ribbons and are appreciated but much of the team spirit is B meet kids and parents and it's a good time for all. My kids will probably never swim an A meet and they still go and cheer and I help out at both types of meets.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

So the weather is the fault of club swimmers? As for not wanting to associate with the "B-team" kids, this makes no sense. Rather, it sounds like there is a bit of resentment of the parents of club swimmers don't want to associate with the parents of non-club swimmers.

What this really comes down to is that parents of summer-only swimmers want their kids swimming in A meets because they go to summer practices. If that's what they want, then go ahead and "ban" club swimmers if they don't attend X number of practices. MCSL will collapse, teams will fold, and pools will all close for lack of revenue.

I don't really think it's that big of an issue, "most" club swimmers don't swim summer league. I think it's only a few clubs that seem to have a large number of club swimmers. Many of the summer league teams probably have one or two and they are probably going to all of the practices because it's their friends from the neighborhood. There are a few high ranked clubs where the A-meets are dominated by club swimmers. The thing is these kids often aren't all that great compared to club swimmers that win in the club meets. They just want the ribbons.

I don’t think this is actually true. We are in a smaller local league than NVSL or MCSL and the majority of our teams have multiple club swimmers. Some of them are not particularly fast, but some of them are the kids who you see in A finals and winning PVS champs events. The club kids, particularly the faster ones, definitely are not regularly attending summer league practice. The fast club kids don’t care about the ribbons, the ones that are fast have a million of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents who don’t want club swimmers in summer leagues, start new league for teams that don’t allow club swimmers, problem solved

No one is saying that. But attendance at a certain number of practices in order to be able to participate in a meet or game is not uncommon in sports. Club swimming parents just feel their kids should be exempted from anything like this, which I find interesting.

Honestly, having the club kids at practice takes up lane space from the kids that only practice with the summer team. This is why our team doesn’t care if the club kids don’t come to summer practice. The practices are crowded enough as it is, you don’t need to make it worse when the club kids are already practicing elsewhere.

And do the kids even know this issue exists? The club swimmers are mainly swimming A meets anyway, so the kids that only swim B meets are unlikely to overlap with those swimmers.

I think that is the rub. They don't see any problems with not going to the crowded practices. "It's too crowded anyway you should appreciate us not bringing our kids", which by the way we do appreciate. But then, they crowd out the recreational swimmers from the A meets by taking lanes and not leaving any, which we don't appreciate.

It would be one thing if there were no B meets and the summer only/frequent practice attendees were not able to compete because of the club kids taking all the A meet slots, but everyone is getting a chance to compete. Whether you swim in an A meet or B meet is dependent on how fast you are, and for the club swimmers there is no correlation between attending summer practices and how fast they swim at meets. What you really want is club kids to be banned from summer swim so that the summer only kids have the chance to swim in A meets. I really would be fine if my kid wasn’t allowed to do summer league, it won’t take up my Saturday mornings anymore and no more volunteering, but you’re going to be hard pressed to have enough people to work automation, serve as the meet referee, and serve as S/T judges because most of us are the parents of club swimmers.

It's just that B-meets are so limited. Last year like 2 out of five were canceled by rain. This year there were two canceled by rain. We ended up having an intrasquad make up.

Yes, the club kids should be somewhere else nine times out of ten. You just don't understand how underwhelming it is to see kids swim year-round with professional coaches, compete (and lose often times) to summer kids. Oh, we've got a ribbon. It's one thing if it's like a rec basketball team and everyone is in the same class and they are all friends, but in our summer league team that isn't the case. The A-team kids clearly don't want to associate with the "B-team" kids(except the ones that are club swimmers, but don't have the times.).

So the weather is the fault of club swimmers? As for not wanting to associate with the "B-team" kids, this makes no sense. Rather, it sounds like there is a bit of resentment of the parents of club swimmers don't want to associate with the parents of non-club swimmers.

What this really comes down to is that parents of summer-only swimmers want their kids swimming in A meets because they go to summer practices. If that's what they want, then go ahead and "ban" club swimmers if they don't attend X number of practices. MCSL will collapse, teams will fold, and pools will all close for lack of revenue.

Dramatic much? Our coaches already encourage ALL summer swimmers to attend practices. Is everyone attending every day? Of course not. But I'm having a hard time thinking of anyone on our team who is literally only showing up on Saturday mornings an no other times. You sound entitled.