NYC law partner w/ kids: "$850K gross is not enough to live on"

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Main Line and Westchester are not much comparison. Philadelphia is a very poor city. It has so much history and good food but the people are so provincial and often don't leave the state ever. The politics of the state are ridiculous and stuck in the 1800s.

yep. Not at all the density of high-powered legal jobs as NYC. so it’s not really a comparison for most NYC partners, except in that if they believe they are “poor” in NYC then yes, maybe they need to trade some of the prestige and money of NYC for something slower paced. I went to law school in NYC and practiced in Philly at the beginning of my career and the cool thing is that most of my cohort went on to do a broad variety of interesting stuff in/around Philly (small firms, legal aid, DA, AG, opened own non-law businesses) specifically because Philly is so much more affordable and you are not locked into the law firm track the way you are in NYC.

Exactly. No one is arguing Philly is more exciting or even overall better. But it is better not to live in a shoebox and shoehorning three kids into a tiny space so you can brag about being a New Yorker. Go look at Rittenhouse if you want an urban neighborhood in Philly.

+10000. The people who insist on doing this are insufferable.

They also are typically lifelong renters.

Yep. You need to have family money, be in finance, or be an entrepreneur to live the life the redditor wants. Being a non-rainmaker partner doesn’t cut it and their NW will be a fraction of what it would be if they lived in the suburbs or a lower cost of living metro.

Again - the density of law and finance jobs cannot be paralleled in other cities. People move to NYC because they want the NYC lifestyle- which yes, includes less square footage but much much more to do outside of the home and higher power work. If you don’t want that then don’t move there, but don’t delude yourself into thinking New Yorkers are crying themselves to sleep over your McMansion.

This is debatable, especially when you have kids. Whenever I’m in NYC visiting family/friends I’m struck by how the only thing to do is go out to eat or to a playground. If you’re actually wealthy with multiple nannies then maybe you’re living a fabulous NY lifestyle. But the average $800k lawyer is hardly living it up. They aren’t doing anything you can’t do in any metro area in the US. They are just doing it with less square footage and less disposable income.

Correct. They have 2-3 regular neighborhood restaurants (not Le Bernadin) like they would in Scarsdale or Bethesda and they take advantage of NYC's artistic offerings to a similar degree (almost never).

No one is jealous of or impressed by your living in NYC, unless you have a 30+mm net worth, big apartment, weekend house, and place in Florida or Aspen for the winter. Then yes, lord it over us.

lol now I’m positive you have never lived in NYC and don’t know any New Yorkers.

(sarcasm) Yea, real New Yorkers go to Per Se every Wednesday as a family tradition. They bring their 2 year olds to Broadway shows and take in the Frick with their 4th grader after school. They are enjoying NYC to the fullest and use amenities you couldn't find anywhere else in the world besdies London Dubai and Hong Kong.

Yeah I still know you’re not a New Yorker 😂 Do you really think when people talk about great NYC food they mean Per Se?

Keller is one of the world’s most accomplished chefs. No one cares about your newest Tibetan-El Salvadoran fusion in a random pocket of Queens. It is a bad substitute for you being unable to travel in five star style so you feel compelled to knock down high dining.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t know if they still do this but the ABA or some entity used to do a comparison of attorney salaries to cost of living in particular areas. If you looked at it, it made zero sense financially to be a lawyer in NyC. Small cities also didn’t fare very well because the drop off in lawyer comp was too sharp for the lower COL to make it worth it. The sweet spot was mid range cities like Chicago, Washington, Boston, Houston, if I remember correctly. Probably Atlanta now too.
If anyone can find it, I’d be curious to see it.

How can she possibly face her hometown friends and family and convince them she’s “made it” if she lived in Houston, Lincoln Park, or Buckhead? Only losers don’t live in nyc.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Main Line and Westchester are not much comparison. Philadelphia is a very poor city. It has so much history and good food but the people are so provincial and often don't leave the state ever. The politics of the state are ridiculous and stuck in the 1800s.

yep. Not at all the density of high-powered legal jobs as NYC. so it’s not really a comparison for most NYC partners, except in that if they believe they are “poor” in NYC then yes, maybe they need to trade some of the prestige and money of NYC for something slower paced. I went to law school in NYC and practiced in Philly at the beginning of my career and the cool thing is that most of my cohort went on to do a broad variety of interesting stuff in/around Philly (small firms, legal aid, DA, AG, opened own non-law businesses) specifically because Philly is so much more affordable and you are not locked into the law firm track the way you are in NYC.

Exactly. No one is arguing Philly is more exciting or even overall better. But it is better not to live in a shoebox and shoehorning three kids into a tiny space so you can brag about being a New Yorker. Go look at Rittenhouse if you want an urban neighborhood in Philly.

+10000. The people who insist on doing this are insufferable.

They also are typically lifelong renters.

Yep. You need to have family money, be in finance, or be an entrepreneur to live the life the redditor wants. Being a non-rainmaker partner doesn’t cut it and their NW will be a fraction of what it would be if they lived in the suburbs or a lower cost of living metro.

Again - the density of law and finance jobs cannot be paralleled in other cities. People move to NYC because they want the NYC lifestyle- which yes, includes less square footage but much much more to do outside of the home and higher power work. If you don’t want that then don’t move there, but don’t delude yourself into thinking New Yorkers are crying themselves to sleep over your McMansion.

No one is arguing that the density of jobs (in almost any industry) is higher in Manhattan than elsewhere. Anyone with the ability to do decently well in law or finance in NYC has the ability to plan and execute on a law or finance career in a less financially constraining locale. The Redditor could have targeted Chicago, Boston, and DC, all have robust big law markets. That does not even include satellite offices that pay well.

Not everyone trades square footage to live in Manhattan. Rich people have 4,000+ SF apartments the same size of what they would have if they live in the suburbs. The Redditor isn't rich, and that is the problem here. The Redditor will most likely never be rich on this trajectory, as in buy a 4BR condo and send his three children to private school while growing a nest egg commensurate with a 800k income. I hope access to artisanal niche sushi at 3am was worth the sacrifice, along with the symphony performances he has not been to in six years.

I don't live in a McMansion or in Philly.

The redditor IS rich wtf. Stop it. (Also she’s a woman.)

If you cannot afford a bedroom for each of your children then you are not rich.

She CAN afford it. she’s being deceptive about her income and making ridiculous claims about how there is no SFH worth buying under $2 mil in the NYC suburbs.

She is saying she can’t get a 4BR in the city. Which is true if she doesn’t want to live in a downmarket area of nyc. 850k doesn’t get you three tuitions and decent 4BR with any cushion. You don’t get to be an elite in nyc with that salary, which is what the redditor wants

[Anonymous]

What HHI gets you three tuitions and a 4br comfortably in nyc?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What HHI gets you three tuitions and a 4br comfortably in nyc?

Three tuitions is about 180k after tax. As a full pay, the schools will harass you to donate a substantial amount. If you think you can get away with only a couple thousand and still have your child matriculate to a good HS or college, you are mistaken. Keep in mind a plurality (and a majority of the full pays) will have a weekend house, if not in a luxury area then somewhere like the Catskills. You cannot do a staycation in the city, you will have to go to FL or VT (if you're being cheap) for your sanity and so your kids know there is grass that isn't surrounded by tall buildings.

NYC is death by a thousand cuts. Three children you will probably have an oversize car and pay more for parking (15k+ per year, not including the lease or insurance). Hope that they don't get into an expensive sport.

If you have the cash to buy a co-op or condo, the maintenance can easily run 4k+ per month (in nicer pre-wars it can be over 8k). Contractors are more expensive.

Without family support, I don't think a life between 96th Street in Manhattan and Park Slope with three children should be attempted without at least 2mm per year. You can make it work, but your net worth and ability to retire well will be crippled.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:JFC. My best friend lives in NYC. She is a teacher, and her husband is a librarian. They rent and apartment and their two daughters share a room. It's not ideal, but they have enough "to live on," without family money.

Way fewer people than you think are reading "two daughters share a room" while calculating a teacher and librarian salary and think this is palatable. Go on Zillow, look at townhouses under 750k in Logan Circle with 3BR. Then tell us that the sacrifice to call yourself a New Yorker makes any sense here. Your best friend isn't living. She is a wagie and being super selfish trying to live out some weird fantasy.

lol ok. We know you’d say the same thing if she was living in DC too.

People making 800k and owning a 750k townhouse with a room for each child in DC in a safe neighborhood would not spark an 11-page thread. It would be a responsible decision, if anything a bit too stingy.

You don’t think they’d be on here insulting anyone who lived in Logan Circle? lol.

No one would say buying a 750k townhouse on a 800k income is foolish, no they wouldn’t.

Of course they would. They would say you were slumming it in a crime ridden neighborhood to make a point. let alone if you sent the kids to the DCPS elementary.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Main Line and Westchester are not much comparison. Philadelphia is a very poor city. It has so much history and good food but the people are so provincial and often don't leave the state ever. The politics of the state are ridiculous and stuck in the 1800s.

yep. Not at all the density of high-powered legal jobs as NYC. so it’s not really a comparison for most NYC partners, except in that if they believe they are “poor” in NYC then yes, maybe they need to trade some of the prestige and money of NYC for something slower paced. I went to law school in NYC and practiced in Philly at the beginning of my career and the cool thing is that most of my cohort went on to do a broad variety of interesting stuff in/around Philly (small firms, legal aid, DA, AG, opened own non-law businesses) specifically because Philly is so much more affordable and you are not locked into the law firm track the way you are in NYC.

Exactly. No one is arguing Philly is more exciting or even overall better. But it is better not to live in a shoebox and shoehorning three kids into a tiny space so you can brag about being a New Yorker. Go look at Rittenhouse if you want an urban neighborhood in Philly.

+10000. The people who insist on doing this are insufferable.

They also are typically lifelong renters.

Yep. You need to have family money, be in finance, or be an entrepreneur to live the life the redditor wants. Being a non-rainmaker partner doesn’t cut it and their NW will be a fraction of what it would be if they lived in the suburbs or a lower cost of living metro.

Again - the density of law and finance jobs cannot be paralleled in other cities. People move to NYC because they want the NYC lifestyle- which yes, includes less square footage but much much more to do outside of the home and higher power work. If you don’t want that then don’t move there, but don’t delude yourself into thinking New Yorkers are crying themselves to sleep over your McMansion.

This is debatable, especially when you have kids. Whenever I’m in NYC visiting family/friends I’m struck by how the only thing to do is go out to eat or to a playground. If you’re actually wealthy with multiple nannies then maybe you’re living a fabulous NY lifestyle. But the average $800k lawyer is hardly living it up. They aren’t doing anything you can’t do in any metro area in the US. They are just doing it with less square footage and less disposable income.

Just because your idea of “doing something” is driving to an exurban trampoline park doesn’t mean that’s everyone. NYC has everything and if you don’t want that then yeah, don’t live there.

Most people here don't live in the exurbs. There is a wide gulf between trampoline park and living in HCOL Brooklyn on 800k. The Redditor could make 400k in DC or Chicago and live a far better life with all of the urban amenities she thinks she needs to be fulfilled.

She can literally by a 4 bedroom house right now on Metro North. She doesn’t want to. She thinks she is entitled to 4 bedrooms in the fully gentrified part of Brooklyn for $1 mil.

Agree there are lots of options that would work but they involve trade offs that the Reddit poster doesn’t want TJ make. You can’t live the perfect life in nyc (bedroom for each kid, super short commute, great schools) for $850K. But you can’t make some trade offs and have it all work out just fine.

Hence she is a whiner if she believes that being a law partner entitled her from having to ever make any financial tradeoffs … because of course living in McLean and having a more boring and less lucrative practice is also a tradeoff

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Main Line and Westchester are not much comparison. Philadelphia is a very poor city. It has so much history and good food but the people are so provincial and often don't leave the state ever. The politics of the state are ridiculous and stuck in the 1800s.

yep. Not at all the density of high-powered legal jobs as NYC. so it’s not really a comparison for most NYC partners, except in that if they believe they are “poor” in NYC then yes, maybe they need to trade some of the prestige and money of NYC for something slower paced. I went to law school in NYC and practiced in Philly at the beginning of my career and the cool thing is that most of my cohort went on to do a broad variety of interesting stuff in/around Philly (small firms, legal aid, DA, AG, opened own non-law businesses) specifically because Philly is so much more affordable and you are not locked into the law firm track the way you are in NYC.

Exactly. No one is arguing Philly is more exciting or even overall better. But it is better not to live in a shoebox and shoehorning three kids into a tiny space so you can brag about being a New Yorker. Go look at Rittenhouse if you want an urban neighborhood in Philly.

+10000. The people who insist on doing this are insufferable.

They also are typically lifelong renters.

Yep. You need to have family money, be in finance, or be an entrepreneur to live the life the redditor wants. Being a non-rainmaker partner doesn’t cut it and their NW will be a fraction of what it would be if they lived in the suburbs or a lower cost of living metro.

Again - the density of law and finance jobs cannot be paralleled in other cities. People move to NYC because they want the NYC lifestyle- which yes, includes less square footage but much much more to do outside of the home and higher power work. If you don’t want that then don’t move there, but don’t delude yourself into thinking New Yorkers are crying themselves to sleep over your McMansion.

This is debatable, especially when you have kids. Whenever I’m in NYC visiting family/friends I’m struck by how the only thing to do is go out to eat or to a playground. If you’re actually wealthy with multiple nannies then maybe you’re living a fabulous NY lifestyle. But the average $800k lawyer is hardly living it up. They aren’t doing anything you can’t do in any metro area in the US. They are just doing it with less square footage and less disposable income.

Correct. They have 2-3 regular neighborhood restaurants (not Le Bernadin) like they would in Scarsdale or Bethesda and they take advantage of NYC's artistic offerings to a similar degree (almost never).

No one is jealous of or impressed by your living in NYC, unless you have a 30+mm net worth, big apartment, weekend house, and place in Florida or Aspen for the winter. Then yes, lord it over us.

lol now I’m positive you have never lived in NYC and don’t know any New Yorkers.

(sarcasm) Yea, real New Yorkers go to Per Se every Wednesday as a family tradition. They bring their 2 year olds to Broadway shows and take in the Frick with their 4th grader after school. They are enjoying NYC to the fullest and use amenities you couldn't find anywhere else in the world besdies London Dubai and Hong Kong.

Yeah I still know you’re not a New Yorker 😂 Do you really think when people talk about great NYC food they mean Per Se?

Keller is one of the world’s most accomplished chefs. No one cares about your newest Tibetan-El Salvadoran fusion in a random pocket of Queens. It is a bad substitute for you being unable to travel in five star style so you feel compelled to knock down high dining.

Ok dude 😂 Have fun in Bethesda.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Main Line and Westchester are not much comparison. Philadelphia is a very poor city. It has so much history and good food but the people are so provincial and often don't leave the state ever. The politics of the state are ridiculous and stuck in the 1800s.

yep. Not at all the density of high-powered legal jobs as NYC. so it’s not really a comparison for most NYC partners, except in that if they believe they are “poor” in NYC then yes, maybe they need to trade some of the prestige and money of NYC for something slower paced. I went to law school in NYC and practiced in Philly at the beginning of my career and the cool thing is that most of my cohort went on to do a broad variety of interesting stuff in/around Philly (small firms, legal aid, DA, AG, opened own non-law businesses) specifically because Philly is so much more affordable and you are not locked into the law firm track the way you are in NYC.

Exactly. No one is arguing Philly is more exciting or even overall better. But it is better not to live in a shoebox and shoehorning three kids into a tiny space so you can brag about being a New Yorker. Go look at Rittenhouse if you want an urban neighborhood in Philly.

+10000. The people who insist on doing this are insufferable.

They also are typically lifelong renters.

Yep. You need to have family money, be in finance, or be an entrepreneur to live the life the redditor wants. Being a non-rainmaker partner doesn’t cut it and their NW will be a fraction of what it would be if they lived in the suburbs or a lower cost of living metro.

Again - the density of law and finance jobs cannot be paralleled in other cities. People move to NYC because they want the NYC lifestyle- which yes, includes less square footage but much much more to do outside of the home and higher power work. If you don’t want that then don’t move there, but don’t delude yourself into thinking New Yorkers are crying themselves to sleep over your McMansion.

No one is arguing that the density of jobs (in almost any industry) is higher in Manhattan than elsewhere. Anyone with the ability to do decently well in law or finance in NYC has the ability to plan and execute on a law or finance career in a less financially constraining locale. The Redditor could have targeted Chicago, Boston, and DC, all have robust big law markets. That does not even include satellite offices that pay well.

Not everyone trades square footage to live in Manhattan. Rich people have 4,000+ SF apartments the same size of what they would have if they live in the suburbs. The Redditor isn't rich, and that is the problem here. The Redditor will most likely never be rich on this trajectory, as in buy a 4BR condo and send his three children to private school while growing a nest egg commensurate with a 800k income. I hope access to artisanal niche sushi at 3am was worth the sacrifice, along with the symphony performances he has not been to in six years.

I don't live in a McMansion or in Philly.

The redditor IS rich wtf. Stop it. (Also she’s a woman.)

If you cannot afford a bedroom for each of your children then you are not rich.

She CAN afford it. she’s being deceptive about her income and making ridiculous claims about how there is no SFH worth buying under $2 mil in the NYC suburbs.

She is saying she can’t get a 4BR in the city. Which is true if she doesn’t want to live in a downmarket area of nyc. 850k doesn’t get you three tuitions and decent 4BR with any cushion. You don’t get to be an elite in nyc with that salary, which is what the redditor wants

So she’s a whiner. check.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What HHI gets you three tuitions and a 4br comfortably in nyc?

Three tuitions is about 180k after tax. As a full pay, the schools will harass you to donate a substantial amount. If you think you can get away with only a couple thousand and still have your child matriculate to a good HS or college, you are mistaken. Keep in mind a plurality (and a majority of the full pays) will have a weekend house, if not in a luxury area then somewhere like the Catskills. You cannot do a staycation in the city, you will have to go to FL or VT (if you're being cheap) for your sanity and so your kids know there is grass that isn't surrounded by tall buildings.

NYC is death by a thousand cuts. Three children you will probably have an oversize car and pay more for parking (15k+ per year, not including the lease or insurance). Hope that they don't get into an expensive sport.

If you have the cash to buy a co-op or condo, the maintenance can easily run 4k+ per month (in nicer pre-wars it can be over 8k). Contractors are more expensive.

Without family support, I don't think a life between 96th Street in Manhattan and Park Slope with three children should be attempted without at least 2mm per year. You can make it work, but your net worth and ability to retire well will be crippled.

I have relatives with an HHI of likely around 800k-1mil doing just fine. The bought a browntstone in a less gentrified area, sent their kids to the less gentrified elementary schools then privates, and have a great life. 2 kids not 3 but with 3 would have just hustled harder to get into the better public or done cheaper Catholic.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Main Line and Westchester are not much comparison. Philadelphia is a very poor city. It has so much history and good food but the people are so provincial and often don't leave the state ever. The politics of the state are ridiculous and stuck in the 1800s.

yep. Not at all the density of high-powered legal jobs as NYC. so it’s not really a comparison for most NYC partners, except in that if they believe they are “poor” in NYC then yes, maybe they need to trade some of the prestige and money of NYC for something slower paced. I went to law school in NYC and practiced in Philly at the beginning of my career and the cool thing is that most of my cohort went on to do a broad variety of interesting stuff in/around Philly (small firms, legal aid, DA, AG, opened own non-law businesses) specifically because Philly is so much more affordable and you are not locked into the law firm track the way you are in NYC.

Exactly. No one is arguing Philly is more exciting or even overall better. But it is better not to live in a shoebox and shoehorning three kids into a tiny space so you can brag about being a New Yorker. Go look at Rittenhouse if you want an urban neighborhood in Philly.

+10000. The people who insist on doing this are insufferable.

They also are typically lifelong renters.

Yep. You need to have family money, be in finance, or be an entrepreneur to live the life the redditor wants. Being a non-rainmaker partner doesn’t cut it and their NW will be a fraction of what it would be if they lived in the suburbs or a lower cost of living metro.

Again - the density of law and finance jobs cannot be paralleled in other cities. People move to NYC because they want the NYC lifestyle- which yes, includes less square footage but much much more to do outside of the home and higher power work. If you don’t want that then don’t move there, but don’t delude yourself into thinking New Yorkers are crying themselves to sleep over your McMansion.

This is debatable, especially when you have kids. Whenever I’m in NYC visiting family/friends I’m struck by how the only thing to do is go out to eat or to a playground. If you’re actually wealthy with multiple nannies then maybe you’re living a fabulous NY lifestyle. But the average $800k lawyer is hardly living it up. They aren’t doing anything you can’t do in any metro area in the US. They are just doing it with less square footage and less disposable income.

Correct. They have 2-3 regular neighborhood restaurants (not Le Bernadin) like they would in Scarsdale or Bethesda and they take advantage of NYC's artistic offerings to a similar degree (almost never).

No one is jealous of or impressed by your living in NYC, unless you have a 30+mm net worth, big apartment, weekend house, and place in Florida or Aspen for the winter. Then yes, lord it over us.

+1000. For all but the impossibly wealthy, living in NYC with children is exhausting.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Main Line and Westchester are not much comparison. Philadelphia is a very poor city. It has so much history and good food but the people are so provincial and often don't leave the state ever. The politics of the state are ridiculous and stuck in the 1800s.

yep. Not at all the density of high-powered legal jobs as NYC. so it’s not really a comparison for most NYC partners, except in that if they believe they are “poor” in NYC then yes, maybe they need to trade some of the prestige and money of NYC for something slower paced. I went to law school in NYC and practiced in Philly at the beginning of my career and the cool thing is that most of my cohort went on to do a broad variety of interesting stuff in/around Philly (small firms, legal aid, DA, AG, opened own non-law businesses) specifically because Philly is so much more affordable and you are not locked into the law firm track the way you are in NYC.

Exactly. No one is arguing Philly is more exciting or even overall better. But it is better not to live in a shoebox and shoehorning three kids into a tiny space so you can brag about being a New Yorker. Go look at Rittenhouse if you want an urban neighborhood in Philly.

+10000. The people who insist on doing this are insufferable.

They also are typically lifelong renters.

Yep. You need to have family money, be in finance, or be an entrepreneur to live the life the redditor wants. Being a non-rainmaker partner doesn’t cut it and their NW will be a fraction of what it would be if they lived in the suburbs or a lower cost of living metro.

Again - the density of law and finance jobs cannot be paralleled in other cities. People move to NYC because they want the NYC lifestyle- which yes, includes less square footage but much much more to do outside of the home and higher power work. If you don’t want that then don’t move there, but don’t delude yourself into thinking New Yorkers are crying themselves to sleep over your McMansion.

This is debatable, especially when you have kids. Whenever I’m in NYC visiting family/friends I’m struck by how the only thing to do is go out to eat or to a playground. If you’re actually wealthy with multiple nannies then maybe you’re living a fabulous NY lifestyle. But the average $800k lawyer is hardly living it up. They aren’t doing anything you can’t do in any metro area in the US. They are just doing it with less square footage and less disposable income.

Correct. They have 2-3 regular neighborhood restaurants (not Le Bernadin) like they would in Scarsdale or Bethesda and they take advantage of NYC's artistic offerings to a similar degree (almost never).

No one is jealous of or impressed by your living in NYC, unless you have a 30+mm net worth, big apartment, weekend house, and place in Florida or Aspen for the winter. Then yes, lord it over us.

+1000. For all but the impossibly wealthy, living in NYC with children is exhausting.

Did you live in NYC with children? I’m not so sure what’s exhausting about having your kids’ elementary school two blocks away; multiple playgrounds, parks, libraries and museums within walking distance; delicious (affordable and fast) food options on every block; then when they turn 13 they can get themselves wherever they need to go on the subway?

Totally fine if that is not for you but you just sound like a rube when you make those kinds of statements.

[Anonymous]

My niece was attacked on the 6, no thanks.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Main Line and Westchester are not much comparison. Philadelphia is a very poor city. It has so much history and good food but the people are so provincial and often don't leave the state ever. The politics of the state are ridiculous and stuck in the 1800s.

yep. Not at all the density of high-powered legal jobs as NYC. so it’s not really a comparison for most NYC partners, except in that if they believe they are “poor” in NYC then yes, maybe they need to trade some of the prestige and money of NYC for something slower paced. I went to law school in NYC and practiced in Philly at the beginning of my career and the cool thing is that most of my cohort went on to do a broad variety of interesting stuff in/around Philly (small firms, legal aid, DA, AG, opened own non-law businesses) specifically because Philly is so much more affordable and you are not locked into the law firm track the way you are in NYC.

Exactly. No one is arguing Philly is more exciting or even overall better. But it is better not to live in a shoebox and shoehorning three kids into a tiny space so you can brag about being a New Yorker. Go look at Rittenhouse if you want an urban neighborhood in Philly.

+10000. The people who insist on doing this are insufferable.

They also are typically lifelong renters.

Yep. You need to have family money, be in finance, or be an entrepreneur to live the life the redditor wants. Being a non-rainmaker partner doesn’t cut it and their NW will be a fraction of what it would be if they lived in the suburbs or a lower cost of living metro.

Again - the density of law and finance jobs cannot be paralleled in other cities. People move to NYC because they want the NYC lifestyle- which yes, includes less square footage but much much more to do outside of the home and higher power work. If you don’t want that then don’t move there, but don’t delude yourself into thinking New Yorkers are crying themselves to sleep over your McMansion.

This is debatable, especially when you have kids. Whenever I’m in NYC visiting family/friends I’m struck by how the only thing to do is go out to eat or to a playground. If you’re actually wealthy with multiple nannies then maybe you’re living a fabulous NY lifestyle. But the average $800k lawyer is hardly living it up. They aren’t doing anything you can’t do in any metro area in the US. They are just doing it with less square footage and less disposable income.

Correct. They have 2-3 regular neighborhood restaurants (not Le Bernadin) like they would in Scarsdale or Bethesda and they take advantage of NYC's artistic offerings to a similar degree (almost never).

No one is jealous of or impressed by your living in NYC, unless you have a 30+mm net worth, big apartment, weekend house, and place in Florida or Aspen for the winter. Then yes, lord it over us.

+1000. For all but the impossibly wealthy, living in NYC with children is exhausting.

Did you live in NYC with children? I’m not so sure what’s exhausting about having your kids’ elementary school two blocks away; multiple playgrounds, parks, libraries and museums within walking distance; delicious (affordable and fast) food options on every block; then when they turn 13 they can get themselves wherever they need to go on the subway?

Totally fine if that is not for you but you just sound like a rube when you make those kinds of statements.

+1. I lived with two kids in a NYC suburb - that was exhausting. Moved back when they were 6 and 8, and life became easy.

[Anonymous]

There are many good NYC publics, however getting a full K-12 education in them requires a bit of luck and hustle. Especially if you can’t afford private as a backup. Many NYers who can’t afford private move to the burbs just so there’s less dice rolling involved in which schools their kids attend.