TJ Falls to 14th in the Nation Per US News

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:It amazes me how many people think FCPS just used a racial quota for TJ admissions. Everyone — including the farthest-left member of the school board — knows that would be racist and illegal, so why does anyone think FCPS would give it a second thought?

Clearly you haven’t read the emails between the two “farthest left” memebers of the school board who referenced EXACTLY this and how the percentage of Asian students would certainly be reduced by the criteria they were supporting.
They knew that it would.
That was fine with them.
It read as if they were laughing about it and thought it was funny.

So yeah—they don’t care because “white adjacent” I guess?

So, those emails were about a different proposed but not adopted admissions process...

The entire reason to redo admissions was to increase blacks and lower the amount of Asians.

One of the main reasons to change admissions was to increase the number of Black students. They increased the overall class size in order to not lower the number of Asian students.

They succeeded at both - without quotas or race used in the admissions process.

They absolutely reduced the number of Asians, as they wanted to.

Went from 74% Asian to 61.64% Asians. They absolutely did reduce the number of Asians by increasing blacks and Hispanics, which was exactly the goal of changing admissions.

The number of Asians stayed about the same, since they increased the class size to accommodate the increased numbers of URMs. You are referring to percentage. Why? Look at numbers.

I’m not sure where that info is. The info I found and can see is that in the class of 2024, there were 57 kids from Longfellow and 33 kids from Cooper and for the class of 2027, there were 30 kids from Longfellow and only 16 kids from Cooper. I don’t think the kids from McLean are becoming less qualified for TJ but there is a significant drop in spots for kids from McLean.

There was another thread showing the decline of Asian students. This year’s class is only 57%. That is quite a drop. So the drop in rankings is a direct reflection of admission changes. Many people were saying that only the last class was based on the new admissions model, which isn’t true.

https://www.fcps.edu/news/offers-extended-thomas-jefferson-high-school-science-and-technology-class-2028


Merit Test based Admissions:
Class of 2019, Asian American students received 70.20%
Class of 2020, Asian American students received 71.34%
Class of 2021, Asian American students received 74.90%
Class of 2023, Asian American students received 72.87%
Class of 2024, Asian American students received 73.05%

Admissions changed to Essay based, and increased enrollment of 8th grade algebra1 students:
Class of 2025, Asian American students received 54.36%
Class of 2026, Asian American students received 59.82%
Class of 2027, Asian American students received 61.64%.
Class of 2028, Asian American students received 57.27%

This is not the sole factor for decline; there are two additional aspects. Firstly, the caliber of Asian students admitted has decreased. Previously, the merit-based admission test in math, science, and English ensured that the 315 admitted asian students from a pool of 1500 asian applicants were all proficient, advanced, and top-notch. However, the current lottery process makes random selections from the 1500 asian applicant pool, leading to a wide variety of math levels and proficiencies among the selected Asian students. Secondly, while there were previously only 20+ Algebra 1 students admitted before the admission changes, there are now approximately 150 Algebra 1 students admitted into each class. However, these lower level math admissions have taken seats that were previously offered to two year advanced math students from Longfellow, Oakton, etc.

I have a freshman at Langley and he knows several kids who really should be at TJ. It is ridiculous that a kid in remedial math is at TJ while kids who are two grades ahead in math and winning science and math competitions did not get in.

I thought I remembered seeing it posted in other thread here that used to be over 50% (was it as high as 70%??) of students were coming it taking algebra 2 in 8th grade? Saw now 150 might be admitted that are taking algebra 1 in 8th grade (v algebra 2)- that is what had me wanting to remember the % of incoming students that would have completed algebra 2 before starting TJ. I thought it was a huge % pre- admissions change.

Before admissions change, 35% of admits were algebra 2, and 61% were geometry, and 4% were algebra 1.
After admissions change, 18% of admits are algebra 2, 51 percent are geometry, and 31% are algebra 1.

Great. Kids who weren’t on the super accelerated track from early ES have a chance to attend. There is not just one path towards STEM.

I had college-educated, English speaking, engaged parents and I didn’t really take off in math until middle school. Then I went on to excel in STEM in HS, college, and grad school (top 10 programs). Not every future STEM star is going to do well on a test in 2nd grade that gets them on the multiyear acceleration train.

I have 2 kids in AAP. Both tested into Algebra in 7th grade with no preparation. They don’t test into it in 2nd grade. You can also be put into an advanced math track even if you didn’t test into AAP in 2nd grade. My second son puts absolutely zero effort into school. I didn’t want him to do algebra in 7th and he still tested in by testing high on the IAAT, getting advanced pass on SOLs and getting a 4 in math. This kid does not study at all and plays video games and basketball all day. He does not fit your test prepped kumon kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:At some point though the entire school would become Asian because other minorities wouldn't want to go. I think the solution is to split up TJ into two stem schools.

No

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For a long time the number one school in the nation, US News now has TJ at #14. Not sure how much is a change in methodology, how much is the admissions policy (surprised to see WTOP call that one out below, because they usually parrot the FCPS party line on everything), and how much is other schools getting better.

Following controversial changes to its admissions policy in 2021 to boost diversity, Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Virginia remains the top ranked school in the D.C. region and 14th in the nation, slipping from the top 10. It’s also the 5th ranked STEM school in the nation.

https://wtop.com/education/2024/04/regions-best-high-schools/

Unfortunately these rankings always lag behind and things would be better if they had moved to the less toxic selection process sooner. I think they're still paying for the drop in student quality that was caused by the test buying fiasco.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:sad, race to the bottom; however, this area always votes for this equity crap, so no surprise.

And by bottom you mean going from 100th percentile to 99.95th percentile in national rankings. There are over 25,000 public high schools in America. They are 14th based on the arbitrary criteria of one random magazine, and you think that's the bottom? These are still the best and brightest kids in the entire region, and if a kid got on who isn't a complete genius in math, but he/she is great at math and can actually do something socially - that's a win in my book.

Past tense. No longer. That’s why people are objecting to the new admissions policies. Schools have guaranteed spots for kids, even if those kids taking those spots are by far not the brightest kids in the region. The admissions testing was dumbed down. The minimum math standard was dumbed down. The principal is posting goals about remediation work. Do you seriously think this still means only the brightest attend TJ?

I know! It's horrible how kids from average schools are now taking spots from kids who have spent years prepping at Curie for this once in a lifetime opportunity. It's also cost parents tens of thousands in prep costs and there's no guarantee that will payoff these days.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they wanted to mess around with admissions to diversify the school, fine. Just don’t ask everyone else to keep pretending it’s still truly exceptional. The declining rankings based on data for a class that was admitted under the old system but largely educated under the new regime is the canary in the coal mine.

FCPS started messing with admissions for the class of 2025. This was the start of increasing URM enrollment and decreasing Asian percentages.

Correct. But obviously the environment at the school has changed over time, including since those students were admitted in 2021. It’s not a school for exceptional kids doing exceptional things now so much as a platform to allow some above-average kids who are not exceptional to enjoy the reputational benefits of attending a school that was once, but is no more, one of the top HS in the country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It amazes me how many people think FCPS just used a racial quota for TJ admissions. Everyone — including the farthest-left member of the school board — knows that would be racist and illegal, so why does anyone think FCPS would give it a second thought?

Clearly you haven’t read the emails between the two “farthest left” memebers of the school board who referenced EXACTLY this and how the percentage of Asian students would certainly be reduced by the criteria they were supporting.
They knew that it would.
That was fine with them.
It read as if they were laughing about it and thought it was funny.

So yeah—they don’t care because “white adjacent” I guess?

So, those emails were about a different proposed but not adopted admissions process...

The entire reason to redo admissions was to increase blacks and lower the amount of Asians.

One of the main reasons to change admissions was to increase the number of Black students. They increased the overall class size in order to not lower the number of Asian students.

They succeeded at both - without quotas or race used in the admissions process.

They absolutely reduced the number of Asians, as they wanted to.

Went from 74% Asian to 61.64% Asians. They absolutely did reduce the number of Asians by increasing blacks and Hispanics, which was exactly the goal of changing admissions.

The number of Asians stayed about the same, since they increased the class size to accommodate the increased numbers of URMs. You are referring to percentage. Why? Look at numbers.

I’m not sure where that info is. The info I found and can see is that in the class of 2024, there were 57 kids from Longfellow and 33 kids from Cooper and for the class of 2027, there were 30 kids from Longfellow and only 16 kids from Cooper. I don’t think the kids from McLean are becoming less qualified for TJ but there is a significant drop in spots for kids from McLean.

There was another thread showing the decline of Asian students. This year’s class is only 57%. That is quite a drop. So the drop in rankings is a direct reflection of admission changes. Many people were saying that only the last class was based on the new admissions model, which isn’t true.

https://www.fcps.edu/news/offers-extended-thomas-jefferson-high-school-science-and-technology-class-2028


Merit Test based Admissions:
Class of 2019, Asian American students received 70.20%
Class of 2020, Asian American students received 71.34%
Class of 2021, Asian American students received 74.90%
Class of 2023, Asian American students received 72.87%
Class of 2024, Asian American students received 73.05%

Admissions changed to Essay based, and increased enrollment of 8th grade algebra1 students:
Class of 2025, Asian American students received 54.36%
Class of 2026, Asian American students received 59.82%
Class of 2027, Asian American students received 61.64%.
Class of 2028, Asian American students received 57.27%

This is not the sole factor for decline; there are two additional aspects. Firstly, the caliber of Asian students admitted has decreased. Previously, the merit-based admission test in math, science, and English ensured that the 315 admitted asian students from a pool of 1500 asian applicants were all proficient, advanced, and top-notch. However, the current lottery process makes random selections from the 1500 asian applicant pool, leading to a wide variety of math levels and proficiencies among the selected Asian students. Secondly, while there were previously only 20+ Algebra 1 students admitted before the admission changes, there are now approximately 150 Algebra 1 students admitted into each class. However, these lower level math admissions have taken seats that were previously offered to two year advanced math students from Longfellow, Oakton, etc.

I have a freshman at Langley and he knows several kids who really should be at TJ. It is ridiculous that a kid in remedial math is at TJ while kids who are two grades ahead in math and winning science and math competitions did not get in.

I thought I remembered seeing it posted in other thread here that used to be over 50% (was it as high as 70%??) of students were coming it taking algebra 2 in 8th grade? Saw now 150 might be admitted that are taking algebra 1 in 8th grade (v algebra 2)- that is what had me wanting to remember the % of incoming students that would have completed algebra 2 before starting TJ. I thought it was a huge % pre- admissions change.

Before admissions change, 35% of admits were algebra 2, and 61% were geometry, and 4% were algebra 1.
After admissions change, 18% of admits are algebra 2, 51 percent are geometry, and 31% are algebra 1.

Great. Kids who weren’t on the super accelerated track from early ES have a chance to attend. There is not just one path towards STEM.

I had college-educated, English speaking, engaged parents and I didn’t really take off in math until middle school. Then I went on to excel in STEM in HS, college, and grad school (top 10 programs). Not every future STEM star is going to do well on a test in 2nd grade that gets them on the multiyear acceleration train.

I have 2 kids in AAP. Both tested into Algebra in 7th grade with no preparation. They don’t test into it in 2nd grade. You can also be put into an advanced math track even if you didn’t test into AAP in 2nd grade. My second son puts absolutely zero effort into school. I didn’t want him to do algebra in 7th and he still tested in by testing high on the IAAT, getting advanced pass on SOLs and getting a 4 in math. This kid does not study at all and plays video games and basketball all day. He does not fit your test prepped kumon kid.

We did not have this option. They "told" us the track with zero ability to change it. My kid was 99th percentile in math and put on the Algebra 8th grade track at 10. No ability to move up or change tracks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It amazes me how many people think FCPS just used a racial quota for TJ admissions. Everyone — including the farthest-left member of the school board — knows that would be racist and illegal, so why does anyone think FCPS would give it a second thought?

Clearly you haven’t read the emails between the two “farthest left” memebers of the school board who referenced EXACTLY this and how the percentage of Asian students would certainly be reduced by the criteria they were supporting.
They knew that it would.
That was fine with them.
It read as if they were laughing about it and thought it was funny.

So yeah—they don’t care because “white adjacent” I guess?

So, those emails were about a different proposed but not adopted admissions process...

The entire reason to redo admissions was to increase blacks and lower the amount of Asians.

One of the main reasons to change admissions was to increase the number of Black students. They increased the overall class size in order to not lower the number of Asian students.

They succeeded at both - without quotas or race used in the admissions process.

They absolutely reduced the number of Asians, as they wanted to.

Went from 74% Asian to 61.64% Asians. They absolutely did reduce the number of Asians by increasing blacks and Hispanics, which was exactly the goal of changing admissions.

The number of Asians stayed about the same, since they increased the class size to accommodate the increased numbers of URMs. You are referring to percentage. Why? Look at numbers.

I’m not sure where that info is. The info I found and can see is that in the class of 2024, there were 57 kids from Longfellow and 33 kids from Cooper and for the class of 2027, there were 30 kids from Longfellow and only 16 kids from Cooper. I don’t think the kids from McLean are becoming less qualified for TJ but there is a significant drop in spots for kids from McLean.

There was another thread showing the decline of Asian students. This year’s class is only 57%. That is quite a drop. So the drop in rankings is a direct reflection of admission changes. Many people were saying that only the last class was based on the new admissions model, which isn’t true.

https://www.fcps.edu/news/offers-extended-thomas-jefferson-high-school-science-and-technology-class-2028


Merit Test based Admissions:
Class of 2019, Asian American students received 70.20%
Class of 2020, Asian American students received 71.34%
Class of 2021, Asian American students received 74.90%
Class of 2023, Asian American students received 72.87%
Class of 2024, Asian American students received 73.05%

Admissions changed to Essay based, and increased enrollment of 8th grade algebra1 students:
Class of 2025, Asian American students received 54.36%
Class of 2026, Asian American students received 59.82%
Class of 2027, Asian American students received 61.64%.
Class of 2028, Asian American students received 57.27%

This is not the sole factor for decline; there are two additional aspects. Firstly, the caliber of Asian students admitted has decreased. Previously, the merit-based admission test in math, science, and English ensured that the 315 admitted asian students from a pool of 1500 asian applicants were all proficient, advanced, and top-notch. However, the current lottery process makes random selections from the 1500 asian applicant pool, leading to a wide variety of math levels and proficiencies among the selected Asian students. Secondly, while there were previously only 20+ Algebra 1 students admitted before the admission changes, there are now approximately 150 Algebra 1 students admitted into each class. However, these lower level math admissions have taken seats that were previously offered to two year advanced math students from Longfellow, Oakton, etc.

I have a freshman at Langley and he knows several kids who really should be at TJ. It is ridiculous that a kid in remedial math is at TJ while kids who are two grades ahead in math and winning science and math competitions did not get in.

That happened in many schools. The new admissions dropped important information from the test and teachers’ recommendations, so winning STEM competition awards doesn’t mean anything. Without the information, they can no longer identify students who are capable and motivated. Within each MS, TJ admissions has become a lottery. Well-deserved kids got rejected, mediocre/lay-back kids got offered. Even the group of admitted Asian students now is understandably weaker than Asian students in the old system.

There is anecdotal evidence that FCPS reduced the number of truly superstar kids at TJ and tried to make more of the kids "really good" but not great. But that will not be really clear until the National Merit Semifinalists (NMS) are awarded next year. Based on rumored pre-PSAT scores from current juniors, TJ's NMS will fall dramatically from its usual 150 or so per year. We will know in a year, but with remedial math, top teachers resigning, rumored discipline problems, etc., things are not looking good for TJ's long term reputation.

The 100+ point drop in average scores I’ve read about on here is probably based on the bottom 1/3 scoring dramatically lower rather than the collective class scoring lower as a group. There are still top kids acing PSAT/NMSQ. In order for that large of a drop to take place, the lower scores are probably closer to 1100.

[Anonymous]

No test prep can replace parents. 15 mins a day for ES kids will make a huge difference.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:sad, race to the bottom; however, this area always votes for this equity crap, so no surprise.

And by bottom you mean going from 100th percentile to 99.95th percentile in national rankings. There are over 25,000 public high schools in America. They are 14th based on the arbitrary criteria of one random magazine, and you think that's the bottom? These are still the best and brightest kids in the entire region, and if a kid got on who isn't a complete genius in math, but he/she is great at math and can actually do something socially - that's a win in my book.

Past tense. No longer. That’s why people are objecting to the new admissions policies. Schools have guaranteed spots for kids, even if those kids taking those spots are by far not the brightest kids in the region. The admissions testing was dumbed down. The minimum math standard was dumbed down. The principal is posting goals about remediation work. Do you seriously think this still means only the brightest attend TJ?

I know! It's horrible how kids from average schools are now taking spots from kids who have spent years prepping at Curie for this once in a lifetime opportunity. It's also cost parents tens of thousands in prep costs and there's no guarantee that will payoff these days.

What is Curie?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:sad, race to the bottom; however, this area always votes for this equity crap, so no surprise.

And by bottom you mean going from 100th percentile to 99.95th percentile in national rankings. There are over 25,000 public high schools in America. They are 14th based on the arbitrary criteria of one random magazine, and you think that's the bottom? These are still the best and brightest kids in the entire region, and if a kid got on who isn't a complete genius in math, but he/she is great at math and can actually do something socially - that's a win in my book.

Past tense. No longer. That’s why people are objecting to the new admissions policies. Schools have guaranteed spots for kids, even if those kids taking those spots are by far not the brightest kids in the region. The admissions testing was dumbed down. The minimum math standard was dumbed down. The principal is posting goals about remediation work. Do you seriously think this still means only the brightest attend TJ?

I know! It's horrible how kids from average schools are now taking spots from kids who have spent years prepping at Curie for this once in a lifetime opportunity. It's also cost parents tens of thousands in prep costs and there's no guarantee that will payoff these days.

TJ is not going to make dumb kids smart, but glad to have them in the class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:sad, race to the bottom; however, this area always votes for this equity crap, so no surprise.

And by bottom you mean going from 100th percentile to 99.95th percentile in national rankings. There are over 25,000 public high schools in America. They are 14th based on the arbitrary criteria of one random magazine, and you think that's the bottom? These are still the best and brightest kids in the entire region, and if a kid got on who isn't a complete genius in math, but he/she is great at math and can actually do something socially - that's a win in my book.

Past tense. No longer. That’s why people are objecting to the new admissions policies. Schools have guaranteed spots for kids, even if those kids taking those spots are by far not the brightest kids in the region. The admissions testing was dumbed down. The minimum math standard was dumbed down. The principal is posting goals about remediation work. Do you seriously think this still means only the brightest attend TJ?

I know! It's horrible how kids from average schools are now taking spots from kids who have spent years prepping at Curie for this once in a lifetime opportunity. It's also cost parents tens of thousands in prep costs and there's no guarantee that will payoff these days.

What is Curie?

Curie is an enrichment center that teaches advanced math and science to mostly elementary and middle school kids. We have our child going there. Let me know if you want to know more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:sad, race to the bottom; however, this area always votes for this equity crap, so no surprise.

And by bottom you mean going from 100th percentile to 99.95th percentile in national rankings. There are over 25,000 public high schools in America. They are 14th based on the arbitrary criteria of one random magazine, and you think that's the bottom? These are still the best and brightest kids in the entire region, and if a kid got on who isn't a complete genius in math, but he/she is great at math and can actually do something socially - that's a win in my book.

Past tense. No longer. That’s why people are objecting to the new admissions policies. Schools have guaranteed spots for kids, even if those kids taking those spots are by far not the brightest kids in the region. The admissions testing was dumbed down. The minimum math standard was dumbed down. The principal is posting goals about remediation work. Do you seriously think this still means only the brightest attend TJ?

I know! It's horrible how kids from average schools are now taking spots from kids who have spent years prepping at Curie for this once in a lifetime opportunity. It's also cost parents tens of thousands in prep costs and there's no guarantee that will payoff these days.

We have been hearing about Curie a lot, and are inclined towards enrolling DC there. Can you elaborate in detail about the Curie costing parents tens of thousands in prep costs? We are not interested in TJ, just math and science enrichment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm happy TJ dropped to 14. I hope it drops out of the top 50 next year and expect it will. This school is a bastion of elitism and colonial oppression. I was a key player in the admissions policy change and the drop in the standings was deliberate and intentional and I'm happy about it.

Sounds like rubbish to me, but if you are a "key player," why not put yourself out there in the WP or even one of the local tabloids like the Gazette since you are so proud of the what the admissions change will bring to TJ?

+1, but if not then hi Jay Matthews! TJ alumni remember you well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It amazes me how many people think FCPS just used a racial quota for TJ admissions. Everyone — including the farthest-left member of the school board — knows that would be racist and illegal, so why does anyone think FCPS would give it a second thought?

Clearly you haven’t read the emails between the two “farthest left” memebers of the school board who referenced EXACTLY this and how the percentage of Asian students would certainly be reduced by the criteria they were supporting.
They knew that it would.
That was fine with them.
It read as if they were laughing about it and thought it was funny.

So yeah—they don’t care because “white adjacent” I guess?

So, those emails were about a different proposed but not adopted admissions process...

The entire reason to redo admissions was to increase blacks and lower the amount of Asians.

One of the main reasons to change admissions was to increase the number of Black students. They increased the overall class size in order to not lower the number of Asian students.

They succeeded at both - without quotas or race used in the admissions process.

They absolutely reduced the number of Asians, as they wanted to.

Went from 74% Asian to 61.64% Asians. They absolutely did reduce the number of Asians by increasing blacks and Hispanics, which was exactly the goal of changing admissions.

The number of Asians stayed about the same, since they increased the class size to accommodate the increased numbers of URMs. You are referring to percentage. Why? Look at numbers.

I’m not sure where that info is. The info I found and can see is that in the class of 2024, there were 57 kids from Longfellow and 33 kids from Cooper and for the class of 2027, there were 30 kids from Longfellow and only 16 kids from Cooper. I don’t think the kids from McLean are becoming less qualified for TJ but there is a significant drop in spots for kids from McLean.

There was another thread showing the decline of Asian students. This year’s class is only 57%. That is quite a drop. So the drop in rankings is a direct reflection of admission changes. Many people were saying that only the last class was based on the new admissions model, which isn’t true.

https://www.fcps.edu/news/offers-extended-thomas-jefferson-high-school-science-and-technology-class-2028


Merit Test based Admissions:
Class of 2019, Asian American students received 70.20%
Class of 2020, Asian American students received 71.34%
Class of 2021, Asian American students received 74.90%
Class of 2023, Asian American students received 72.87%
Class of 2024, Asian American students received 73.05%

Admissions changed to Essay based, and increased enrollment of 8th grade algebra1 students:
Class of 2025, Asian American students received 54.36%
Class of 2026, Asian American students received 59.82%
Class of 2027, Asian American students received 61.64%.
Class of 2028, Asian American students received 57.27%

This is not the sole factor for decline; there are two additional aspects. Firstly, the caliber of Asian students admitted has decreased. Previously, the merit-based admission test in math, science, and English ensured that the 315 admitted asian students from a pool of 1500 asian applicants were all proficient, advanced, and top-notch. However, the current lottery process makes random selections from the 1500 asian applicant pool, leading to a wide variety of math levels and proficiencies among the selected Asian students. Secondly, while there were previously only 20+ Algebra 1 students admitted before the admission changes, there are now approximately 150 Algebra 1 students admitted into each class. However, these lower level math admissions have taken seats that were previously offered to two year advanced math students from Longfellow, Oakton, etc.

I have a freshman at Langley and he knows several kids who really should be at TJ. It is ridiculous that a kid in remedial math is at TJ while kids who are two grades ahead in math and winning science and math competitions did not get in.

I thought I remembered seeing it posted in other thread here that used to be over 50% (was it as high as 70%??) of students were coming it taking algebra 2 in 8th grade? Saw now 150 might be admitted that are taking algebra 1 in 8th grade (v algebra 2)- that is what had me wanting to remember the % of incoming students that would have completed algebra 2 before starting TJ. I thought it was a huge % pre- admissions change.

Before admissions change, 35% of admits were algebra 2, and 61% were geometry, and 4% were algebra 1.
After admissions change, 18% of admits are algebra 2, 51 percent are geometry, and 31% are algebra 1.

Great. Kids who weren’t on the super accelerated track from early ES have a chance to attend. There is not just one path towards STEM.

I had college-educated, English speaking, engaged parents and I didn’t really take off in math until middle school. Then I went on to excel in STEM in HS, college, and grad school (top 10 programs). Not every future STEM star is going to do well on a test in 2nd grade that gets them on the multiyear acceleration train.

I have 2 kids in AAP. Both tested into Algebra in 7th grade with no preparation. They don’t test into it in 2nd grade. You can also be put into an advanced math track even if you didn’t test into AAP in 2nd grade. My second son puts absolutely zero effort into school. I didn’t want him to do algebra in 7th and he still tested in by testing high on the IAAT, getting advanced pass on SOLs and getting a 4 in math. This kid does not study at all and plays video games and basketball all day. He does not fit your test prepped kumon kid.

We did not have this option. They "told" us the track with zero ability to change it. My kid was 99th percentile in math and put on the Algebra 8th grade track at 10. No ability to move up or change tracks.

In FCPS? If so, your principal pretty flagrantly violated FCPS policy. Advanced math is offered in every single ES in FCPS, and kids who are performing well on beginning of year tests, iready, and/or SOLs can move up into advanced math even as late as 6th grade. Kids in advanced math are allowed to sit for IAAT and the 7th grade math SOL when in 6th grade. The kids who meet the benchmark are allowed to enroll in algebra in 7th grade. A 99th percentile kid ought to be placed in advanced math, unless there's something else going on that you're not telling us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It amazes me how many people think FCPS just used a racial quota for TJ admissions. Everyone — including the farthest-left member of the school board — knows that would be racist and illegal, so why does anyone think FCPS would give it a second thought?

Clearly you haven’t read the emails between the two “farthest left” memebers of the school board who referenced EXACTLY this and how the percentage of Asian students would certainly be reduced by the criteria they were supporting.
They knew that it would.
That was fine with them.
It read as if they were laughing about it and thought it was funny.

So yeah—they don’t care because “white adjacent” I guess?

So, those emails were about a different proposed but not adopted admissions process...

The entire reason to redo admissions was to increase blacks and lower the amount of Asians.

One of the main reasons to change admissions was to increase the number of Black students. They increased the overall class size in order to not lower the number of Asian students.

They succeeded at both - without quotas or race used in the admissions process.

They absolutely reduced the number of Asians, as they wanted to.

Went from 74% Asian to 61.64% Asians. They absolutely did reduce the number of Asians by increasing blacks and Hispanics, which was exactly the goal of changing admissions.

The number of Asians stayed about the same, since they increased the class size to accommodate the increased numbers of URMs. You are referring to percentage. Why? Look at numbers.

I’m not sure where that info is. The info I found and can see is that in the class of 2024, there were 57 kids from Longfellow and 33 kids from Cooper and for the class of 2027, there were 30 kids from Longfellow and only 16 kids from Cooper. I don’t think the kids from McLean are becoming less qualified for TJ but there is a significant drop in spots for kids from McLean.

There was another thread showing the decline of Asian students. This year’s class is only 57%. That is quite a drop. So the drop in rankings is a direct reflection of admission changes. Many people were saying that only the last class was based on the new admissions model, which isn’t true.

https://www.fcps.edu/news/offers-extended-thomas-jefferson-high-school-science-and-technology-class-2028


Merit Test based Admissions:
Class of 2019, Asian American students received 70.20%
Class of 2020, Asian American students received 71.34%
Class of 2021, Asian American students received 74.90%
Class of 2023, Asian American students received 72.87%
Class of 2024, Asian American students received 73.05%

Admissions changed to Essay based, and increased enrollment of 8th grade algebra1 students:
Class of 2025, Asian American students received 54.36%
Class of 2026, Asian American students received 59.82%
Class of 2027, Asian American students received 61.64%.
Class of 2028, Asian American students received 57.27%

This is not the sole factor for decline; there are two additional aspects. Firstly, the caliber of Asian students admitted has decreased. Previously, the merit-based admission test in math, science, and English ensured that the 315 admitted asian students from a pool of 1500 asian applicants were all proficient, advanced, and top-notch. However, the current lottery process makes random selections from the 1500 asian applicant pool, leading to a wide variety of math levels and proficiencies among the selected Asian students. Secondly, while there were previously only 20+ Algebra 1 students admitted before the admission changes, there are now approximately 150 Algebra 1 students admitted into each class. However, these lower level math admissions have taken seats that were previously offered to two year advanced math students from Longfellow, Oakton, etc.

I have a freshman at Langley and he knows several kids who really should be at TJ. It is ridiculous that a kid in remedial math is at TJ while kids who are two grades ahead in math and winning science and math competitions did not get in.

I thought I remembered seeing it posted in other thread here that used to be over 50% (was it as high as 70%??) of students were coming it taking algebra 2 in 8th grade? Saw now 150 might be admitted that are taking algebra 1 in 8th grade (v algebra 2)- that is what had me wanting to remember the % of incoming students that would have completed algebra 2 before starting TJ. I thought it was a huge % pre- admissions change.

Before admissions change, 35% of admits were algebra 2, and 61% were geometry, and 4% were algebra 1.
After admissions change, 18% of admits are algebra 2, 51 percent are geometry, and 31% are algebra 1.

Great. Kids who weren’t on the super accelerated track from early ES have a chance to attend. There is not just one path towards STEM.

I had college-educated, English speaking, engaged parents and I didn’t really take off in math until middle school. Then I went on to excel in STEM in HS, college, and grad school (top 10 programs). Not every future STEM star is going to do well on a test in 2nd grade that gets them on the multiyear acceleration train.

I have 2 kids in AAP. Both tested into Algebra in 7th grade with no preparation. They don’t test into it in 2nd grade. You can also be put into an advanced math track even if you didn’t test into AAP in 2nd grade. My second son puts absolutely zero effort into school. I didn’t want him to do algebra in 7th and he still tested in by testing high on the IAAT, getting advanced pass on SOLs and getting a 4 in math. This kid does not study at all and plays video games and basketball all day. He does not fit your test prepped kumon kid.

We did not have this option. They "told" us the track with zero ability to change it. My kid was 99th percentile in math and put on the Algebra 8th grade track at 10. No ability to move up or change tracks.

In FCPS? If so, your principal pretty flagrantly violated FCPS policy. Advanced math is offered in every single ES in FCPS, and kids who are performing well on beginning of year tests, iready, and/or SOLs can move up into advanced math even as late as 6th grade. Kids in advanced math are allowed to sit for IAAT and the 7th grade math SOL when in 6th grade. The kids who meet the benchmark are allowed to enroll in algebra in 7th grade. A 99th percentile kid ought to be placed in advanced math, unless there's something else going on that you're not telling us.

I’m skeptical about pp and her kid. If a kid is good in math, they would be in the more advanced math group. During the school year, these small math groups constantly change.

I’m the pp who said I have 2 kids in AAP including a lazy kid who still tested into Algebra. At my kids’ school, they give pre accessments in the beginning of the unit and group kids whether they know the material or not. That kid never knew the material so was in the lower math group but would always learn the math and get a 4 or master material by the end of the unit. That is how he got into algebra.