Anyone’s kid apply to more than 20 schools?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:May I summarize what is happening here?

Top stat kids are in a position where they need to apply 20+ colleges in order to get in anywhere they feel they deserved to be in.

Top stat kids (top 10% of any high schools)are more or less applying the same list of schools- top50 U and top 30 LAC. And schools in the big cities (Boston, NYC, LA)and nice towns get very popular.

Their application more or less all look similar.
It’s literally about who gets to read it and find it intriguing. Basically random luck. Fit might be important but it’s actually a luxury in this climate.

Yes, you need a handful of targets and safeties. But apply as many reach as you can and choose from where you get in. Then you can talk about the fit amongst where you got in.

Again, I’m talking about top stat kid who didn’t make it to ED or EA at desired schools.

Key issues is "Top stat kids are in a position where they need to apply 20+ colleges in order to get in anywhere they feel they deserved to be in."

They need to rethink "where they feel they deserve to be in"

At the core that is the issue. So many with "top stats" feel they must attend a T25-30 school. Once you get over that mindset, you can run a much better process. Why would you randomly apply to T25 schools just because "you deserve to be there"? Why not search and find places you actually want to be? You are approaching the process incorrectly, IMO. Putting prestige (based loosely on an antiquated rankings system) at the top rather than actually searching quality for your kid---where will they fit in, where will they be happy, because that is where they will excel the most. There is no way more than 3-4 schools in the T20 are all "the perfect/best school" for any single kid. Each university is so different.

Why do you think they want anything less than they deserve?
They skipped two math levels and finishing high school with Multi-variables.
They took 8+ APs and got 5s from most.
They put years and years of hard work in their ECs.
They are ambitious and competitive.
They researched and they actually want to be at top 25!
Prestige is what ambitious kids want!
Not applying many reach schools is just giving up after all the hard work.
For what? So you won’t get disappointed?

And when they get shut out from T25, then what?

Of course you need a handful of safeties and targets.
That’s given.
We are talking about 10-12 reach schools they need to apply on top of that.
Build the list from bottom up.
3 safeties, 3 targets, then fill it up with reaches you like and really work on the essays.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:May I summarize what is happening here?

Top stat kids are in a position where they need to apply 20+ colleges in order to get in anywhere they feel they deserved to be in.

Top stat kids (top 10% of any high schools)are more or less applying the same list of schools- top50 U and top 30 LAC. And schools in the big cities (Boston, NYC, LA)and nice towns get very popular.

Their application more or less all look similar.
It’s literally about who gets to read it and find it intriguing. Basically random luck. Fit might be important but it’s actually a luxury in this climate.

Yes, you need a handful of targets and safeties. But apply as many reach as you can and choose from where you get in. Then you can talk about the fit amongst where you got in.

Again, I’m talking about top stat kid who didn’t make it to ED or EA at desired schools.

Key issues is "Top stat kids are in a position where they need to apply 20+ colleges in order to get in anywhere they feel they deserved to be in."

They need to rethink "where they feel they deserve to be in"

At the core that is the issue. So many with "top stats" feel they must attend a T25-30 school. Once you get over that mindset, you can run a much better process. Why would you randomly apply to T25 schools just because "you deserve to be there"? Why not search and find places you actually want to be? You are approaching the process incorrectly, IMO. Putting prestige (based loosely on an antiquated rankings system) at the top rather than actually searching quality for your kid---where will they fit in, where will they be happy, because that is where they will excel the most. There is no way more than 3-4 schools in the T20 are all "the perfect/best school" for any single kid. Each university is so different.

Why do you think they want anything less than they deserve?
They skipped two math levels and finishing high school with Multi-variables.
They took 8+ APs and got 5s from most.
They put years and years of hard work in their ECs.
They are ambitious and competitive.
They researched and they actually want to be at top 25!
Prestige is what ambitious kids want!
Not applying many reach schools is just giving up after all the hard work.
For what? So you won’t get disappointed?

This is the downfall for many entitled kids and parents.

There will be no down fall if you apply 20+ schools.
That’s the topic of this thread.
Sorry if you are not up to the task.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:May I summarize what is happening here?

Top stat kids are in a position where they need to apply 20+ colleges in order to get in anywhere they feel they deserved to be in.

Top stat kids (top 10% of any high schools)are more or less applying the same list of schools- top50 U and top 30 LAC. And schools in the big cities (Boston, NYC, LA)and nice towns get very popular.

Their application more or less all look similar.
It’s literally about who gets to read it and find it intriguing. Basically random luck. Fit might be important but it’s actually a luxury in this climate.

Yes, you need a handful of targets and safeties. But apply as many reach as you can and choose from where you get in. Then you can talk about the fit amongst where you got in.

Again, I’m talking about top stat kid who didn’t make it to ED or EA at desired schools.

Key issues is "Top stat kids are in a position where they need to apply 20+ colleges in order to get in anywhere they feel they deserved to be in."

They need to rethink "where they feel they deserve to be in"

At the core that is the issue. So many with "top stats" feel they must attend a T25-30 school. Once you get over that mindset, you can run a much better process. Why would you randomly apply to T25 schools just because "you deserve to be there"? Why not search and find places you actually want to be? You are approaching the process incorrectly, IMO. Putting prestige (based loosely on an antiquated rankings system) at the top rather than actually searching quality for your kid---where will they fit in, where will they be happy, because that is where they will excel the most. There is no way more than 3-4 schools in the T20 are all "the perfect/best school" for any single kid. Each university is so different.

Why do you think they want anything less than they deserve?
They skipped two math levels and finishing high school with Multi-variables.
They took 8+ APs and got 5s from most.
They put years and years of hard work in their ECs.
They are ambitious and competitive.
They researched and they actually want to be at top 25!
Prestige is what ambitious kids want!
Not applying many reach schools is just giving up after all the hard work.
For what? So you won’t get disappointed?

This is the downfall for many entitled kids and parents.

There will be no down fall if you apply 20+ schools.
That’s the topic of this thread.
Sorry if you are not up to the task.

Yep. The entitled kid will get the safety school he/she "deserves."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:May I summarize what is happening here?

Top stat kids are in a position where they need to apply 20+ colleges in order to get in anywhere they feel they deserved to be in.

Top stat kids (top 10% of any high schools)are more or less applying the same list of schools- top50 U and top 30 LAC. And schools in the big cities (Boston, NYC, LA)and nice towns get very popular.

Their application more or less all look similar.
It’s literally about who gets to read it and find it intriguing. Basically random luck. Fit might be important but it’s actually a luxury in this climate.

Yes, you need a handful of targets and safeties. But apply as many reach as you can and choose from where you get in. Then you can talk about the fit amongst where you got in.

Again, I’m talking about top stat kid who didn’t make it to ED or EA at desired schools.

Key issues is "Top stat kids are in a position where they need to apply 20+ colleges in order to get in anywhere they feel they deserved to be in."

They need to rethink "where they feel they deserve to be in"

At the core that is the issue. So many with "top stats" feel they must attend a T25-30 school. Once you get over that mindset, you can run a much better process. Why would you randomly apply to T25 schools just because "you deserve to be there"? Why not search and find places you actually want to be? You are approaching the process incorrectly, IMO. Putting prestige (based loosely on an antiquated rankings system) at the top rather than actually searching quality for your kid---where will they fit in, where will they be happy, because that is where they will excel the most. There is no way more than 3-4 schools in the T20 are all "the perfect/best school" for any single kid. Each university is so different.

Why do you think they want anything less than they deserve?
They skipped two math levels and finishing high school with Multi-variables.
They took 8+ APs and got 5s from most.
They put years and years of hard work in their ECs.
They are ambitious and competitive.
They researched and they actually want to be at top 25!
Prestige is what ambitious kids want!
Not applying many reach schools is just giving up after all the hard work.
For what? So you won’t get disappointed?

This is the downfall for many entitled kids and parents.

There will be no down fall if you apply 20+ schools.
That’s the topic of this thread.
Sorry if you are not up to the task.

This exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We will apply to 3 schools and if he doesn’t get in we are going to community college and transferring to big state school

We? It’s your kid, not you. Cut the cord.

[Anonymous]

Check back in in late March.

[Anonymous]

This paragraph in this article https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/07/briefing/the-misguided-war-on-the-sat.html

tells us the state of admissions without standardized scores. It is a lottery! If it is a lottery don't you want more tickets which means more applications? The price of the ticket is time spent filling out more applications and extreme stress for the kids.

Comeaux — a professor of higher education at the University of California, Riverside, and co-chair of the state’s review of standardized tests — favors this approach. He agrees that the SAT and ACT predict later success. But he prefers a stripped-down admissions system in which colleges set minimum requirements, based largely on high school grades, and then admit students by lottery. “Having a lottery,” Comeaux said, “would make us radically rethink what it means to gain access and also to learn, rather than accepting the status quo.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It seems like the 3 cohorts of reaches, targets, and safeties are no longer valid buckets for non hooked DMV students. It’s basically schools that have 75% acceptance rate and less than 75%. Anything in the bucket of acceptance rate less than 75% is a lottery ticket for strong stat student in the DMV area (non URM, non athletes, no hooks). Since there really isn’t a rhyme or reason for how those schools accept student because of the blackhole of holistic admissions, for non hook students they have to apply to numerous schools to have a higher statistical chance for just getting an acceptance…it’s just math.

Agree with this.

You may want to double check your math if you think applying to 20 schools with a 5% accept rate adds up to 100% chance of getting one of them.

Definitely a frenzy if DC applies to 5 reaches and gets none of them so they apply to five more because maybe these will be different.

It’s a “bloodbath” when your kid gets into 7 schools because you haven’t heard from the higher prestige ones yet, and surely you HAVE TO go to the highest ranked school.

You’re all doing this to yourselves. Not everyone is playing this game, but the ones who are, well they are doing exactly the wrong strategies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This paragraph in this article https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/07/briefing/the-misguided-war-on-the-sat.html

tells us the state of admissions without standardized scores. It is a lottery! If it is a lottery don't you want more tickets which means more applications? The price of the ticket is time spent filling out more applications and extreme stress for the kids.

Comeaux — a professor of higher education at the University of California, Riverside, and co-chair of the state’s review of standardized tests — favors this approach. He agrees that the SAT and ACT predict later success. But he prefers a stripped-down admissions system in which colleges set minimum requirements, based largely on high school grades, and then admit students by lottery. “Having a lottery,” Comeaux said, “would make us radically rethink what it means to gain access and also to learn, rather than accepting the status quo.”

You want more tickets in the SAME DRAWING to improve your odds.

Applying to 20 schools is playing 20 DIFFERENT lotteries. They are independent draws.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1550 / 3.9 GPA - rejected in ED round.

Total ~30 Colleges

10 focused with will written essays
10 mix of safety & target where essays are not required, such as Middleburry, Colby etc
10 additional target/ reach where the essays are being recycled

Avoiding colleges that don't favor test scores.

You and your son consider Middlebury and Colby to be a target/safety? I’m assuming these 30 apps are mainly for RD? No wonder he needs to apply to 30 schools!

Not OP, but Middlebury and Colby are definitely safeties for this student.
Middlebury has acceptance rate of nearly 50% in ED!!!!! It looks like if you just meet some basic standards and are willling to pay 90000 for remote VT you are in

Nobody sane thinks a 50/50 shot is a “safety”.

Would you take a medicine that had a 50% chance of killing you, or would you prefer the one that has a 10% chance of killing you.

People are being “shut out” because their sense of entitlement does not let them compute what a real safety is.

They think it means “the schools where I will have tolerable embarrassment sending my kid” not “the place where they have a 90% chance of admission so we always have this option.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This paragraph in this article https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/07/briefing/the-misguided-war-on-the-sat.html

tells us the state of admissions without standardized scores. It is a lottery! If it is a lottery don't you want more tickets which means more applications? The price of the ticket is time spent filling out more applications and extreme stress for the kids.

Comeaux — a professor of higher education at the University of California, Riverside, and co-chair of the state’s review of standardized tests — favors this approach. He agrees that the SAT and ACT predict later success. But he prefers a stripped-down admissions system in which colleges set minimum requirements, based largely on high school grades, and then admit students by lottery. “Having a lottery,” Comeaux said, “would make us radically rethink what it means to gain access and also to learn, rather than accepting the status quo.”

You want more tickets in the SAME DRAWING to improve your odds.

Applying to 20 schools is playing 20 DIFFERENT lotteries. They are independent draws.

The ENTIRE college process is ONE DRAW.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This paragraph in this article https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/07/briefing/the-misguided-war-on-the-sat.html

tells us the state of admissions without standardized scores. It is a lottery! If it is a lottery don't you want more tickets which means more applications? The price of the ticket is time spent filling out more applications and extreme stress for the kids.

Comeaux — a professor of higher education at the University of California, Riverside, and co-chair of the state’s review of standardized tests — favors this approach. He agrees that the SAT and ACT predict later success. But he prefers a stripped-down admissions system in which colleges set minimum requirements, based largely on high school grades, and then admit students by lottery. “Having a lottery,” Comeaux said, “would make us radically rethink what it means to gain access and also to learn, rather than accepting the status quo.”

You want more tickets in the SAME DRAWING to improve your odds.

Applying to 20 schools is playing 20 DIFFERENT lotteries. They are independent draws.

The ENTIRE college process is ONE DRAW.

Yes…esp since kids applying from school school to many of the same colleges.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This paragraph in this article https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/07/briefing/the-misguided-war-on-the-sat.html

tells us the state of admissions without standardized scores. It is a lottery! If it is a lottery don't you want more tickets which means more applications? The price of the ticket is time spent filling out more applications and extreme stress for the kids.

Comeaux — a professor of higher education at the University of California, Riverside, and co-chair of the state’s review of standardized tests — favors this approach. He agrees that the SAT and ACT predict later success. But he prefers a stripped-down admissions system in which colleges set minimum requirements, based largely on high school grades, and then admit students by lottery. “Having a lottery,” Comeaux said, “would make us radically rethink what it means to gain access and also to learn, rather than accepting the status quo.”

You want more tickets in the SAME DRAWING to improve your odds.

Applying to 20 schools is playing 20 DIFFERENT lotteries. They are independent draws.

The ENTIRE college process is ONE DRAW.

That is definitely not how statistics or probability works.

Explains a lot about people’s behavior, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:1550 / 3.9 GPA - rejected in ED round.

Total ~30 Colleges

10 focused with will written essays
10 mix of safety & target where essays are not required, such as Middleburry, Colby etc
10 additional target/ reach where the essays are being recycled

Avoiding colleges that don't favor test scores.

You and your son consider Middlebury and Colby to be a target/safety? I’m assuming these 30 apps are mainly for RD? No wonder he needs to apply to 30 schools!

Not OP, but Middlebury and Colby are definitely safeties for this student.
Middlebury has acceptance rate of nearly 50% in ED!!!!! It looks like if you just meet some basic standards and are willling to pay 90000 for remote VT you are in

Tell that this this kid:
https://talk.collegeconfidential.com/t/can-more-graduated-seniors-do-actual-results-threads/211052/2562?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This paragraph in this article https://www.nytimes.com/2024/01/07/briefing/the-misguided-war-on-the-sat.html

tells us the state of admissions without standardized scores. It is a lottery! If it is a lottery don't you want more tickets which means more applications? The price of the ticket is time spent filling out more applications and extreme stress for the kids.

Comeaux — a professor of higher education at the University of California, Riverside, and co-chair of the state’s review of standardized tests — favors this approach. He agrees that the SAT and ACT predict later success. But he prefers a stripped-down admissions system in which colleges set minimum requirements, based largely on high school grades, and then admit students by lottery. “Having a lottery,” Comeaux said, “would make us radically rethink what it means to gain access and also to learn, rather than accepting the status quo.”

You want more tickets in the SAME DRAWING to improve your odds.

Applying to 20 schools is playing 20 DIFFERENT lotteries. They are independent draws.

The ENTIRE college process is ONE DRAW.

Yes…esp since kids applying from school school to many of the same colleges.

Innumeracy’s a real problem, I can see now why parents here are pushing STEM so hard.

I regret to inform people that “surely we are due for a win if we play enough” is the doom of many a compulsive gambler.