APS Families--Pls email county and school boards by Tues. 5/24!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Zero period is a class scheduled before first period sonstudents taking zero period classes start around 7:30 and are finished earlier in the day some days due to block scheduling than the student with a typical schedule. One of my sons had his AP English class zero period at WL five years ago and hated it. He ended up with a zero period class after having to rearrange his schedule three weeks into the school year.

Me again. I should add that when my son had his zero period class at WL one of his biggest complaints was that many students arrived 5-15 minutes late for class, including him, regularly, which often meant that class also started late or was repeatedly interrupted.

[Anonymous]

I know the AH conversation is an important one, but I wish people would start a separate thread. It makes it harder to track the conversation about what solutions were proposed in the meeting last night.

I watched the meeting on TV and they spoke most concretely about shift scheduling, building capacity at Arlington Tech (which they speculated could have interest exceeding 800 kids), and exploring some use of the Ed Center. There was also a brief mention of letting kids take college-level classes if they are able-- I am not sure if that means busing kids out to Mason or they had something else in mind. One of the SB members also mentioned "work release" which I think meant finding kids an internship in the community where they could get academic credit. Apparently Virginia just changed its graduation standards for high school to require fewer classroom hours and to rollback on standardized testing-- that was the bill that the governor just signed at Wakefield. I'm skeptical that an internship provides the same meaningful experience as classroom work though, at least for college bound kids.

And let's not forget that there was a line on the spreadsheet for 1,000 secondary seats "TBD"- so who knows what that means. But I don't think they have a 4th comprehensive HS in mind. Maybe a smaller choice high school, like a second HB, but there was not any specific discussion so I am speculating here.

[Anonymous]

An AH thread is here:
http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/0/559430.page#8961745

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Zero period is a class scheduled before first period sonstudents taking zero period classes start around 7:30 and are finished earlier in the day some days due to block scheduling than the student with a typical schedule. One of my sons had his AP English class zero period at WL five years ago and hated it. He ended up with a zero period class after having to rearrange his schedule three weeks into the school year.

Thanks! So it sounds like due to overcrowding they offer some classes before school generally starts and then they may leave before the school day typically ends. This way they have less people occupying the space during regular school hours.

Hasn't Fairfax county moved high school start times back due to the studies and here we're asking teenagers to use them before the typical school day even begins? DoYorktown and Wakefield do this? Or is it just W-L?

HB also has a zero period, but it starts later than those at other high schools, because HB's regular start time is later. IOW, zero period at HB starts closer to 8 than to 7:30. It is most popular with kids who do need to leave school before the regular end of day in HB (e.g., students who play sports at their home high schools, etc.).

My DS goes to W-L, and we've been happy with his experience there. But there is no question that the school is bursting at the seams, and they seem happy whenever students have any excuse to be off campus. My DS has an independent study class this year (because a desired class did not fit into his schedule), so he has the afternoon "off" every other day. This hasn't been a problem for my responsible 18-year-old, but I can easily imagine this situation being a pretty bad idea for a different kid. I also think being away from school so much has contributed to my DS's relative lack of engagement in school activities, etc. this year (yes, some of that could be senioritis, but there isn't a lot of additional evidence supporting the senioritis theory, since his grades remain good). I think a sense of connection and "belonging" to a group is a really important component of adolescent mental health, and the idea of encouraging our teens to be less present/involved in their schools really troubles me (unless something else is filling that void).

Thank you. This is very helpful. We are zoned for WL, and since our kids are still young I was wondering what the impact would be of having all this off-site time and/or separate sites, etc. I do think a sense of belonging and community are very important during the high school years also.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I know the AH conversation is an important one, but I wish people would start a separate thread. It makes it harder to track the conversation about what solutions were proposed in the meeting last night.

I watched the meeting on TV and they spoke most concretely about shift scheduling, building capacity at Arlington Tech (which they speculated could have interest exceeding 800 kids), and exploring some use of the Ed Center. There was also a brief mention of letting kids take college-level classes if they are able-- I am not sure if that means busing kids out to Mason or they had something else in mind. One of the SB members also mentioned "work release" which I think meant finding kids an internship in the community where they could get academic credit. Apparently Virginia just changed its graduation standards for high school to require fewer classroom hours and to rollback on standardized testing-- that was the bill that the governor just signed at Wakefield. I'm skeptical that an internship provides the same meaningful experience as classroom work though, at least for college bound kids.

And let's not forget that there was a line on the spreadsheet for 1,000 secondary seats "TBD"- so who knows what that means. But I don't think they have a 4th comprehensive HS in mind. Maybe a smaller choice high school, like a second HB, but there was not any specific discussion so I am speculating here.

Thanks for posting this. I caught some of it last night and heard the above. Didn't they talk about exploring options at VHC, Buck and the Ed Center? I agree that isn't necessarily a new high school. b/t/w do you know what document they were referring to that had the VHC Carlin Springs on it (having tuned in a bit later)? I didn't see it in Murphy's CIP on the school board website.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Zero period is a class scheduled before first period sonstudents taking zero period classes start around 7:30 and are finished earlier in the day some days due to block scheduling than the student with a typical schedule. One of my sons had his AP English class zero period at WL five years ago and hated it. He ended up with a zero period class after having to rearrange his schedule three weeks into the school year.

Thanks! So it sounds like due to overcrowding they offer some classes before school generally starts and then they may leave before the school day typically ends. This way they have less people occupying the space during regular school hours.

Hasn't Fairfax county moved high school start times back due to the studies and here we're asking teenagers to use them before the typical school day even begins? DoYorktown and Wakefield do this? Or is it just W-L?

HB also has a zero period, but it starts later than those at other high schools, because HB's regular start time is later. IOW, zero period at HB starts closer to 8 than to 7:30. It is most popular with kids who do need to leave school before the regular end of day in HB (e.g., students who play sports at their home high schools, etc.).

My DS goes to W-L, and we've been happy with his experience there. But there is no question that the school is bursting at the seams, and they seem happy whenever students have any excuse to be off campus. My DS has an independent study class this year (because a desired class did not fit into his schedule), so he has the afternoon "off" every other day. This hasn't been a problem for my responsible 18-year-old, but I can easily imagine this situation being a pretty bad idea for a different kid. I also think being away from school so much has contributed to my DS's relative lack of engagement in school activities, etc. this year (yes, some of that could be senioritis, but there isn't a lot of additional evidence supporting the senioritis theory, since his grades remain good). I think a sense of connection and "belonging" to a group is a really important component of adolescent mental health, and the idea of encouraging our teens to be less present/involved in their schools really troubles me (unless something else is filling that void).

It would be a tremendous service if the W-L PTA could field a survey about the practical effects of all of these changes (zero periods, hoteling for teachers, etc.) on the kids, esp. since similar changes are being planned for the other two high schools. Are there best practices, things parents should know, things kids should know, things administrators should know...? APS surveys are usually too high level to get at these kinds of issues.

[Anonymous]

Once the barn door is opened on things like flex scheduling and internet learning in high school, it seems like they become permanent solutions to our capacity problems, in the same way that we have learned to live with fleets of trailers in the fields of our schools. Did you hear the eagerness in the school board member who was marveling at how economic a solution flex scheduling is?

This is really depressing. If we had acted earlier, could we have made them find the land to build a 4th high school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Once the barn door is opened on things like flex scheduling and internet learning in high school, it seems like they become permanent solutions to our capacity problems, in the same way that we have learned to live with fleets of trailers in the fields of our schools. Did you hear the eagerness in the school board member who was marveling at how economic a solution flex scheduling is?

This is really depressing. If we had acted earlier, could we have made them find the land to build a 4th high school?

I understand the bond process, but what I don't know is whether they would have the legal right to call a special election for an off cycle bond issue to buy land for a 4th HS if it became available. But the County is at 9.8% on their 10% bond limit if I read the slide last night correctly. So there isn't a ton of wiggle room. I really got the vibe that a 4th comprehensive HS is off the table, but they were willing to maybe use the Buck or VHC land for some sort of supplemental space. One of the SB members mentioned the need to invest more in ART if we were going to be requiring HS students to move around to different locations in the county during the day. That made me think that maybe the land would become some sort of educational annex for all three high schools. For example (and this is just me thinking out loud), you could create a "science building" where all your lab space is located for all three high schools-- and then you bus HS kids from all three schools there for science classes during the week. Again, this was not proposed-- it is just my guess at what they are envisioning?!?!? They need more classroom space, but in a model like that, they would not need space for additional fields which seems to be the rub with building a 4th high school. However, that also would mean that our kids would lose a chunk of their day to commuting, which doesn't seem ideal either. Getting from W-L or Yorktown to the VHC land would be 15-20 min.

[Anonymous]

Yeah I agree that the vibe I got was that a fourth, full-sized high school was not possible. The chair of the School Board even admitted this outright, while encouraging the County Board to consider smaller plots of land.

This is a terrible, terrible thing for my kids.

[Anonymous]

4th HS got streetcared...

[Anonymous]

Well, looks like it's private for us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: Did you hear the eagerness in the school board member who was marveling at how economic a solution flex scheduling is?

Hey, how about the high schools get APS and county space for classrooms during the school day, and school and county employees work a flex schedule -- late and early shifts?

This is really depressing. If we had acted earlier, could we have made them find the land to build a 4th high school?

You can't make them find land. There's only so much in Arlington.

Had parents been willing to compromise more, it might (MIGHT) have been possible to earn the county's goodwill by reducing demands for funds and land: Affordable housing on the Buck property, a high school (or building that included a high school) on the VHC property. Giving up 1:1 and FLES, going back to early release but providing a bigger subsidy for extended day for low-income households.

Every time you demand that the county "fully fund" a bloated budget, you're cementing your reputation as grabby.

[Anonymous]

I have heard multiple parents on various APS committees say that VHC is apparently too small for a full size high school because there is not enough room for field space. However, it would be big enough for a middle school. So, in theory, you could build a new middle school at VHC and then turn Kenmore into a HS. That proposal was floating around on one of the earlier APS CIP decks. I think it got killed though for lack of funding and also the fact that it would take too long to complete. (You would need to build the middle school out, move the Kenmore MS kids to VHC, and then start construction on turning Kenmore into a high school building.) This is all second hand info.

The SB and CB plan makes high school start to sound a lot like a college set-up, only without the dorms and buildings in close proximity to each other like they would be on a university campus. I can see that working for 18 year olds, but that is a lot of freedom for an immature freshman. I don't love the idea of 9th grade academy, but I'd rather have that than a 14 year old wandering around the county all day who may or may not actually be attending class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, looks like it's private for us.

a win win win for you and both the County Board an School Board.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: Did you hear the eagerness in the school board member who was marveling at how economic a solution flex scheduling is?

Hey, how about the high schools get APS and county space for classrooms during the school day, and school and county employees work a flex schedule -- late and early shifts?

This is really depressing. If we had acted earlier, could we have made them find the land to build a 4th high school?

You can't make them find land. There's only so much in Arlington.

Had parents been willing to compromise more, it might (MIGHT) have been possible to earn the county's goodwill by reducing demands for funds and land: Affordable housing on the Buck property, a high school (or building that included a high school) on the VHC property. Giving up 1:1 and FLES, going back to early release but providing a bigger subsidy for extended day for low-income households.

Every time you demand that the county "fully fund" a bloated budget, you're cementing your reputation as grabby.

It is NOT grabby to see a high school deficit of 2,700 seats and think "hey, a new high school would be appropriate here." It is not grabby to think flex scheduling and internet learning are not good enough solutions to a seat crisis when we have just committed to spending $100M on 750 high school seats.