4 people dead after gunman opens fire on military recruitment office in TN

[Anonymous]

How hard is it to understand that - in this case- you have a sick kid who's easily swayed by radical beliefs in order to give purpose to his life?

perhaps not a "group" necessarily - but radical thought

I haven't followed his life that closely, but I believe his family was dysfunctional. Wasn't the mother abused by her husband?

[Anonymous]

To me, if you walk into a church/recruiting center/movie theatre/school/mall/anywhere and shoot up a bunch of people, you are terrorist scum.

I don't care if you are inspired by the KKK, extremist religious views (Muslim, Christian, voices in your head, whatever)--if you have the ability to take human lives like that, you are a terrorist.

I'm not anymore threatened by ISIS than I am by a nameless/faceless American plotting against someone from their apartment.

Everything in our country is so politicized but I choose to use a binary scale of judgement when judging good and evil. The Chattanoga and Charleston shooters are exactly the same to me.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:To me, if you walk into a church/recruiting center/movie theatre/school/mall/anywhere and shoot up a bunch of people, you are terrorist scum.

I don't care if you are inspired by the KKK, extremist religious views (Muslim, Christian, voices in your head, whatever)--if you have the ability to take human lives like that, you are a terrorist.

I'm not anymore threatened by ISIS than I am by a nameless/faceless American plotting against someone from their apartment.

Everything in our country is so politicized but I choose to use a binary scale of judgement when judging good and evil. The Chattanoga and Charleston shooters are exactly the same to me.

If you are concerned about politicization of such killings, why choose such a politicized word as "terrorist". The word once was used to describe attacks against the public aimed at changing government policy. Now it has become a description for anything we don't like (even non-violence). If you want to de-politicize Chattanoga and Charleston, call the perpetrators what they are: murderers.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe he was depressed. Maybe he was feeling pressure at home. Maybe he had low self-worth. Who knows.
There are millions of depressed people and people feeling pressure and worthless.
They don’t go to a recruitment center and take out 5 people.
The guy is a terrorist. His recent writings and statements verify that.
He was looking to be a martyr. But, he is really a coward.

They may not go to recruitment centers, but they do go to schools and movie theaters. But, being white, they aren't called terrorists.

And, yet, Dylan Roof has been called a domestic terrorist.
The more we find out about Abdulazeez, the more we find that he was identifying with and inspired by Muslim terrorists.
Why white-wash it?

Actually, you are 180 degrees wrong. There has been nothing to suggest that he was inspired by Muslim terrorists. To the contrary, the more we find out about him the more he appears to have been suffering from mental illness.

Actually you are BOTH wrong. Jeff, I think you meant to write "there's been nothing to PROVE he was inspired by Islam."

Had you written that, I would agree with you. First, as I have said from the start of this thread, the investigation is just beginning, so it's too early to conclusively say what his exact motive or motives were.

Frankly, mixed motives appear to in loved from what I can speculate about at this point; he seems to have grown up as an all-American boy; as American (or more so) than Casey Kasem or Omar Sharif.

But recently he was on the verge of bankruptcy, taking sleeping pills out of desperation over his overnight job schedule, and had a long history of abusing illegal drugs. Plus he had a history of depression and suicidal thoughts.

Speculating again, I'd say those factors could easily account for 90% of his chosen suicide method (Google "suicide by cop").

The remaining 10% though: you cannot ignore a few facts and questions: he initially targeted a military site. Then he targeted a second military site - that both were military sites is not a coincidence!

So the question is: what was his grudge against our military? Had he been turned down for service? Was he bullied by a future service member? What?

Further, he made only 2 blog posts. But they were long. And not only were they ambiguous, they are clouded by cultural interpretations: devout Moslems find them quite ordinary; other experts might see them quite differently . I am no expert and am not sure what to make of them (again, the investigation is just beginning).

And hen there is the trip to Yemmen. And the devout American at his gym who kept ranting about jihads.

The targets, the trip, the gym guy, his uncle arrested overseas - Jeff, these areas for investigation DO suggest a possible motive or partial motive. So there is a "suggestion" (or several).

Prudence dictates we wait for the results of the investigation here.

[Anonymous]

Todays news says he was looking up whether jihad would earn forgiveness for drunkeness

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:
Actually you are BOTH wrong. Jeff, I think you meant to write "there's been nothing to PROVE he was inspired by Islam."

Had you written that, I would agree with you. First, as I have said from the start of this thread, the investigation is just beginning, so it's too early to conclusively say what his exact motive or motives were.

Frankly, mixed motives appear to in loved from what I can speculate about at this point; he seems to have grown up as an all-American boy; as American (or more so) than Casey Kasem or Omar Sharif.

But recently he was on the verge of bankruptcy, taking sleeping pills out of desperation over his overnight job schedule, and had a long history of abusing illegal drugs. Plus he had a history of depression and suicidal thoughts.

Speculating again, I'd say those factors could easily account for 90% of his chosen suicide method (Google "suicide by cop").

The remaining 10% though: you cannot ignore a few facts and questions: he initially targeted a military site. Then he targeted a second military site - that both were military sites is not a coincidence!

So the question is: what was his grudge against our military? Had he been turned down for service? Was he bullied by a future service member? What?

Further, he made only 2 blog posts. But they were long. And not only were they ambiguous, they are clouded by cultural interpretations: devout Moslems find them quite ordinary; other experts might see them quite differently . I am no expert and am not sure what to make of them (again, the investigation is just beginning).

And hen there is the trip to Yemmen. And the devout American at his gym who kept ranting about jihads.

The targets, the trip, the gym guy, his uncle arrested overseas - Jeff, these areas for investigation DO suggest a possible motive or partial motive. So there is a "suggestion" (or several).

Prudence dictates we wait for the results of the investigation here.

Other than you, I've seen no source for his trip to Yemen. Do you have a source for supporting that allegation?

You are confusing "being a Muslim" and "knowing people who rant about Jihad" with "being inspired by". The items you note allow for the possibility that he was inspired by Islam, but don't actually suggest that he was. The uncle arrested in Jordan has more to do with the dictatorial nature of the Jordanian government than any guilt or innocence on the uncle's behalf. When the Jordanians learned there was a connection, they simply grabbed him up and, likely, started "putting him to the test'. By now he has likely pled guilty to the Kennedy assassination and promised to reveal where he buried Jimmy Hoffa. As you note, the overwhelming evidence we've seen so far is that a depressed young man decided to end his life by taking actions he believed would lead to his death (and not be considered suicide).

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To me, if you walk into a church/recruiting center/movie theatre/school/mall/anywhere and shoot up a bunch of people, you are terrorist scum.

I don't care if you are inspired by the KKK, extremist religious views (Muslim, Christian, voices in your head, whatever)--if you have the ability to take human lives like that, you are a terrorist.

I'm not anymore threatened by ISIS than I am by a nameless/faceless American plotting against someone from their apartment.

Everything in our country is so politicized but I choose to use a binary scale of judgement when judging good and evil. The Chattanoga and Charleston shooters are exactly the same to me.

If you are concerned about politicization of such killings, why choose such a politicized word as "terrorist". The word once was used to describe attacks against the public aimed at changing government policy. Now it has become a description for anything we don't like (even non-violence). If you want to de-politicize Chattanoga and Charleston, call the perpetrators what they are: murderers.

Yea, I was actually agreeing with your point from a few posts before about not differentiating between the Chattanooga killer, Sandy Hook etc.

My point is that if the word "terrorist" is going to be used (just the reality of the situation), it should apply to anyone who terrorizes a community.

But your point is well taken.

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Actually you are BOTH wrong. Jeff, I think you meant to write "there's been nothing to PROVE he was inspired by Islam."

Had you written that, I would agree with you. First, as I have said from the start of this thread, the investigation is just beginning, so it's too early to conclusively say what his exact motive or motives were.

Frankly, mixed motives appear to in loved from what I can speculate about at this point; he seems to have grown up as an all-American boy; as American (or more so) than Casey Kasem or Omar Sharif.

But recently he was on the verge of bankruptcy, taking sleeping pills out of desperation over his overnight job schedule, and had a long history of abusing illegal drugs. Plus he had a history of depression and suicidal thoughts.

Speculating again, I'd say those factors could easily account for 90% of his chosen suicide method (Google "suicide by cop").

The remaining 10% though: you cannot ignore a few facts and questions: he initially targeted a military site. Then he targeted a second military site - that both were military sites is not a coincidence!

So the question is: what was his grudge against our military? Had he been turned down for service? Was he bullied by a future service member? What?

Further, he made only 2 blog posts. But they were long. And not only were they ambiguous, they are clouded by cultural interpretations: devout Moslems find them quite ordinary; other experts might see them quite differently . I am no expert and am not sure what to make of them (again, the investigation is just beginning).

And hen there is the trip to Yemmen. And the devout American at his gym who kept ranting about jihads.

The targets, the trip, the gym guy, his uncle arrested overseas - Jeff, these areas for investigation DO suggest a possible motive or partial motive. So there is a "suggestion" (or several).

Prudence dictates we wait for the results of the investigation here.

Other than you, I've seen no source for his trip to Yemen. Do you have a source for supporting that allegation?

You are confusing "being a Muslim" and "knowing people who rant about Jihad" with "being inspired by". The items you note allow for the possibility that he was inspired by Islam, but don't actually suggest that he was. The uncle arrested in Jordan has more to do with the dictatorial nature of the Jordanian government than any guilt or innocence on the uncle's behalf. When the Jordanians learned there was a connection, they simply grabbed him up and, likely, started "putting him to the test'. By now he has likely pled guilty to the Kennedy assassination and promised to reveal where he buried Jimmy Hoffa. As you note, the overwhelming evidence we've seen so far is that a depressed young man decided to end his life by taking actions he believed would lead to his death (and not be considered suicide).

Todays news said he was doing computer searches on whether jihad would 'forgive' drunkeness which it's clear he struggled with /his family.frowned upon - maybe he frowned upon (when he wasn't drunk). We've all been there struggling, but id say looking to jihad instead of AA is rare.

[Anonymous]

Correction, I have no idea how rare it is - I'm sure a lot of people turn to religion - but his computer searches were looking up 'jihad'- a fairly loaded term if ever there was one.

[Anonymous]

His family also frowned on his interest in "ultimate fighting" type sports (not sure exactly how to term his interest, but there were "cage fights" involved).

Anyway, supposedly he won one of his fights and upon leaving the "ring" victorious, his father started berating him for participating.

But again, the investigation is just beginning. We should wait for the results.

What we should not have had to wait for was Obama recognizing this as the tragic deaths of 5 of our finest and lowering the WH flag; he immediately lowered it for the 3 Boston victims and they were not even service members! Even today, he only lowered it due to political pressure; his delay speaks volumes.

[Anonymous]

Being commander in chief is not a mantle Obama wears easily. Despite their professed Support for military families' there is little the Obama's do that does not seem like an afterthought..his dealings with the military, from the very first ignoring advice on iraq, setting deadlines etc have been pretty much the least favorite part of his job I'm guessing. This awkwardness is just the natural extension of that. He doesn't get the military or its role in our society.