Why are private schools not transparent with their test scores?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

OP, this is your original post. you used the word demand. And you directed this at the rest of us, "you should demand . . ." Most of us disagree and aren't demandind any such thing. Sorry to disappoint you.

Not my post you fool. Sorry to bring you down from your antipsychotic high.

Information about the educational outcomes of students in private school (e.g., test results) is useful for many students and families making decisions about purchasing these services.

No one cares that it does not matter to you.

Not sure who "you" are but if you are OP, this is your post. Go back and read it.

[Anonymous]

The woman alleging that her son was too dumb to go to a public magnet but smart enough to get into an elite private is still dreaming sorry

Anonymous wrote:When you wake up I'll follow up on what SAT tutoring parlor you have decided to send your child to?

Thanks

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Another poster in favor of seeing the scores. I'm also an economist.

Asymmetry of information is NEVER a good thing.

I'm absolutely appalled by some of the arguments here.
1. Equating withholding info with eating spinach? WTF? Especially since only one of these is good for you, with "because I said so" you undermine your credibility as a debator, not to mention as a parent.
2. Because I won't use it, you can't have it. Do you feel the same about the calorie count on that Big Mac, which lots of folks don't care about, but you and I do?
3. Go to public schools instead. This poster is a jerk, there's no other explanation.

1. The PP was not equating "withholding info" with eating spinach. She was using the example of going around and around with her children, answering their questions over and over again, and yet they continue to deny she is answering their questions. Critical thinking skills that allow you to parse this sort of thing are not reflected in SAT scores.

2. The point was that OP wants to enlist the rest of us in a crusade that we think is a bad idea. It isn't that we don't care about the information, its that we think releasing this information could lead schools to treat it as some kind of meaningful data point (when it isn't) and start "teaching to the test" which is exactly why most of us took our children out of public schools. I am happy to see fast food restaurants race to appeal to the public as the healthiest. That would be a good thing. I do not want my DC's schools to feel they have to race to present to the public the highest SAT scores (though my guess is that their schools actually would) because is not a goal I want them to focus on.

3. The public school option actually makes sense in context because they are now, by law, measured by their test scores. So we all can see how that is going. If its what you want, go at it.

[Anonymous]

What?

Are you answering for the poster or the actual poster?

Either way your brains are both peas in a pod.

[Anonymous]

Ahhhh! Numbers people.

Some numbers people --- engineers, economists --- have a fair amount of difficulty with the non-quantifiable.

It seems that the private schools in DC are unwilling to publish "the numbers" because they don't feel its a reasonable way to assess what they offer. Or that they fear that "the numbers" will become the mission, as appears to have happened in some public schools. Or that the tyranny of the numbers will mean they can't admit those who might affect them negatively even though they have legitimate reasons to want to do so.

The "numbers" people disagree. They have to have them to understand, to compare, to assess. How else can they create spreadsheets? How else will they know what they are paying for?

The demand for spots in the more desirable private schools is high enough so that the schools don't have to play the numbers game. And those who must have "the numbers" are then stuck in a quandry.

A recommended solution to this is "demand the numbers. If only the villagers would surround the school with torches and pitchforks, those Admissions people would then have to give us the numbers we need.

The problem is that many of us don't need the numbers. We make assessments on the non-quantifiable.

One of our boys went to Gonzaga. What numerical value should we have assigned to the experience of going to school on North Capitol Street, in the heart of the City or "The Hood" with the Capitol in view? How might one quantify the pervasive, electric enthusiasm that pervades the school? How many points for the Jesuit education or the values that underlie the educational mission?

[Anonymous]

By the time my DS graduates from HS he is going to have to be able to know how to take the SAT and do well enough on it that he will be able to get into the schools that his grades would otherwise make him eligible for. That is, I hope he will do well enough on them so that they don't become the reason he won't be able to apply to certain schools, since schools do have cut-off scores. If his HS teaches him how to do that, why would I complain? Most HS I've heard of have students take PSATs to get a sense of how their students do. If the schools have to send the scores on to colleges, they have them. To post the range for public consumption seems simple.

[Anonymous]

They're happy to post exmission info. It's really the same thing. Bragging rights. Just significantly less accurate. Those of us who are asking for scores are just looking for reat info instead of info that can be affected by legacies, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:By the time my DS graduates from HS he is going to have to be able to know how to take the SAT and do well enough on it that he will be able to get into the schools that his grades would otherwise make him eligible for. That is, I hope he will do well enough on them so that they don't become the reason he won't be able to apply to certain schools, since schools do have cut-off scores. If his HS teaches him how to do that, why would I complain? Most HS I've heard of have students take PSATs to get a sense of how their students do. If the schools have to send the scores on to colleges, they have them. To post the range for public consumption seems simple.

It may be simple.

But you steadfastly refuse to grasp the school's reasons for not providing the data.

Seems like you are stuck. You are unlikely to provoke a popular uprising that forces the school to do what you want.

[Anonymous]

Ahhhh! Numbers people.

Some numbers people --- engineers, economists --- have a fair amount of difficulty with the non-quantifiable.

It seems that the private schools in DC are unwilling to publish "the numbers" because they don't feel its a reasonable way to assess what they offer. Or that they fear that "the numbers" will become the mission, as appears to have happened in some public schools. Or that the tyranny of the numbers will mean they can't admit those who might affect them negatively even though they have legitimate reasons to want to do so.

The "numbers" people disagree. They have to have them to understand, to compare, to assess. How else can they create spreadsheets? How else will they know what they are paying for?

The demand for spots in the more desirable private schools is high enough so that the schools don't have to play the numbers game. And those who must have "the numbers" are then stuck in a quandry.

A recommended solution to this is "demand the numbers. If only the villagers would surround the school with torches and pitchforks, those Admissions people would then have to give us the numbers we need.

The problem is that many of us don't need the numbers. We make assessments on the non-quantifiable.

One of our boys went to Gonzaga. What numerical value should we have assigned to the experience of going to school on North Capitol Street, in the heart of the City or "The Hood" with the Capitol in view? How might one quantify the pervasive, electric enthusiasm that pervades the school? How many points for the Jesuit education or the values that underlie the educational mission?

Numbers and quantifiable educational performance variables are equally as important as non-quantifiable and fit variables in making decisions concerning matriculation to private and/or public schools.

What's wrong with a due-diligence menu of beef and veggies? Then we can all choose our preference!

One doesn't need to be an accountant, engineer or right-wing religious nutcase to understand such a simple concept.

Transparency trumps asymmetric information for the nutty wannabe economist

[Anonymous]

It doesn't matter whether OP or anyone else thinks private schools should publish their test scores. They don't have to and they choose not to and (at least around here) they still have way more applicants than spaces. Don't like it? Too bad.

[Anonymous]

It seems that the private schools in DC are unwilling to publish "the numbers" because they don't feel its a reasonable way to assess what they offer. Or that they fear that "the numbers" will become the mission, as appears to have happened in some public schools. Or that the tyranny of the numbers will mean they can't admit those who might affect them negatively even though they have legitimate reasons to want to do so.

Did the school tell you this was their reasoning? If so, my you are so gullible if you believe this faith

[Anonymous]

Ahhhh! Numbers people.

Some numbers people --- engineers, economists --- have a fair amount of difficulty with the non-quantifiable.

It seems that the private schools in DC are unwilling to publish "the numbers" because they don't feel its a reasonable way to assess what they offer. Or that they fear that "the numbers" will become the mission, as appears to have happened in some public schools. Or that the tyranny of the numbers will mean they can't admit those who might affect them negatively even though they have legitimate reasons to want to do so.

Ahhh. This fear of numbers may explain America's downward spiral to the bottom of the global heap when it comes to mathematics and STEM related disciplines. Let's open another Kumon or SAT tutoring parlor for these preppies and their Ivy ambitions.

Amazing these people do not know what numbers mean and how to interpret them; thus they prefer to delete them so others can't see.

[Anonymous]

It may be simple.

But you steadfastly refuse to grasp the school's reasons for not providing the data.

Seems like you are stuck. You are unlikely to provoke a popular uprising that forces the school to do what you want.

Tell us what your schools reason is for not providing the data? Do not tell us your interpretation of their reason?
Do you believe the spin?

Do all area D.C. uphold this reason?

[Anonymous]

Many here seem paralysed and petrified that knowledge of SAT and other test scores reflecting academic performance will somehow damage their schools and ruin their intoxicated worship of their image of private schools. They do not have a high opinion of these private schools and their educational mission because they feel release of this information will somehow put a loaded gun to their collective heads forcing these schools to teach to the test "like in public school". A pity indeed. Why would anyone, certainly private schools with the obviously far better brand, diminish their brand by teaching to the test? Doesn't the public know the private school brand is far better and would immediately punish their matriculation stats if these schools started to teach to the test?

Sounds like not a hell of a lot of confidence/faith in these private schools if hiding information (knowledge) from the public is preferable to transparency?

[Anonymous]

No, we just feel like we opted out of this BS when we chose not to send our kids to public post-NCLB and we're not eager to see the same mentality re-establish itself in local private schools.

Nor do we feel any lack of transparency wrt performance measures within our DCs' schools. That's more of an issue for applicants than for the parents of kids who are enrolled. We do see scores, exmissions, awards, etc. -- both for our own kids and aggregates -- as well as assignments and work done. We also know that all of this info is available to the people whose judgments of the quality of our kids' education actually matter -- e.g. college admissions officers.

So it's hard to get outraged about the inability of anonymous DCUM posters to pierce this alleged veil. Especially when the most vocal among the aggrieved seem like real jerks.