If you DON'T live in DC, why did you ultimately decide to go private?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Long post to type, but would have saved lots of people flaming you!!

I doubt it. Honestly, it was pretty clear to me (and presumably to others) where both you (OP) and the poster (no redeeming value) were coming from.

But some people engage in flame wars for sport (or therapy, I don't know). Others don't ever want to see their side/choice not get equal attention/praise/validation. And nuance is often lost in DCUM discussions, no matter how hard/how many posters try to inject it into the mix.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. 10:39 response was actually very valuable, far more so than just saying "I'd never choose public". It answered my question with regard to the reasons. Some people may not agree with some or all of your reasons. I may not agree with some or all of your reasons, yet they give me additional things to think about to see if they matter to us or not.

Long post to type, but would have saved lots of people flaming you!!

Thanks. I do not mind being flamed. I am very happy and confident in my choices for my children and my family. The main reason I choose to go into the detail was the negative connotations people try to give private school by calling it a bubble. In the Washington metro area, the so-called "best" publics in MOCO, Arlington and FFCO, can be as much or more of the kind of "bubble" many PPs are suggesting due to economic and skin-color self-selecting of where one buys a home. Some people fail to consider that just because others have a similar HHI and skin color does not mean they will have where near the same values. Quitye the opposite I have found.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

... The only reason I would consider that public might be a better choice would be due to an offering of diversity (whether socio-economic or skin color or religion) but, in the DC metro region's schools, this one reason does not exist. In Washington, DC, private schools are, in many cases, more diverse than the best area publics, largely because the school roster is not based on geographical proximity/ability to buy expensive property. The privates we considered in Washington have an excellent tradition of FA and in recruiting many types of diveristy for admission. Further, the parents who make the effort to review, research, and apply their child/ren to schools and, if necessary go even further by applying for FA, are to my mind, the parents most thoughtfully and actively involved in ensuring their children are not only well-educated but also excellent citizens and well mannered, well brought up, good people. That type of parent, the "thoughtful one" (for lack of a better term) can not be characterized as one with the financial ability to buy a million dollar home or with the skin color or religion to feel comfortable buying in any and all neighborhoods. For me, however, that thoughtful parent is the one that I want to have parenting the children with whom my children go to school. I am certainly not saying parents who send children to public schools are inherently unthinking or uncaring. Rather, I think you find far fewer parents who have not thought long and hard about their children's educational experience (an experience that includes more than just academics) in privates due largely to the effort required to get a child into private school.

Further, I prefer the greater access that private school gives me to oversee and participate in my childrens' school experience. Lastly, the issue which is most important to me is the values and morals my children are surrounded by in their school environment. I want these to reflect our family values and morals. That is much, much easier to find in a self-selected private school and virtually impossible to find in public. Indeed, other posters may prefer to color this aspect negatively by calling it a bubble or snobbery but, I do not believe it is either, as it is a value judgment based not on money nor class, not color or relgious affiliation, but a judgement based on a shared belief, both with other parents who have chosen the school and those who run the school, that the attributes of a person's charater are shaped largely by the company they keep as they grow. I want my children to grow and learn with other children who's parents I know are as interested in strong character and strong morals as they are in strong academics

I've seen the "private schools are more diverse than public schools" argument here frequently, and I've held my tongue. I've seen people proudly post lists of the racial makeup of their schools. But I just have to take issue with the self-serving, self-congratulatory argument that "private schools have more diversity than the best publics." This just isn't true. The best publics are the magnets. And in Maryland, they are located in: Eastern Middle School (along University Boulevard), Takoma Park Middle School (red zone), Blair High School (needs no introduction, probably) and Richard Montgomery High School (Rockville). These schools are all far more diverse, from an SES point of view, than any private school I can think of. Some will certainly counter that the magnets are a bubble, but in fact magnet kids take only 3-4 magnet classes -- out of 8 or 9 classes total per semester -- so they actually have plenty of interaction with non-magnet kids in english and social studies (for science magnet kids) or science and math (for english magnet kids) and in art, gym, and all the other electives. BCC, another great public that is not a magnet, is actually very diverse too, both racially and in SES.

Diversity is more than the skin color of the kids in a class, it's also socio-economic. And socio-economic diversity just doesn't exist in the private schools we've been involved with.Many of the AA families in our private are way richer than we are. The minority kids in your schools are most probably the kids of doctors, lawyers, and international bureaucrats. On another thread somebody pointed out that most schools give full FA to 1-3 kids per year, and these may not all be low-income minority kids.

I do agree you can control the values your kids are exposed to better in a private than public school. For myself, I like my kids going to chapel once a week. But three points about this. (1) Private school kids do drugs and alcohol just as much as public school kids - maybe a better class of drugs, but it's still there. (2) Is it really in your kid's best interest to shield him from opposing points of view? What happens when he or she has to work with people with opposing points of view in the real world? And (3), there is also a negative set of values, with the social climbing, competitive vacations, and fashion competitions that we see every day in private school.

I find the whole "private schools are more diverse than good public schools" argument distasteful, because it seems willfully self-deceiving. It's demonstratively false, at least when you consider SES in addition to the brown skin color of the Pakistani doctors' kids at your school.

Signed,

a mom with kids in both private and public schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Long post to type, but would have saved lots of people flaming you!!

I doubt it. Honestly, it was pretty clear to me (and presumably to others) where both you (OP) and the poster (no redeeming value) were coming from.

But some people engage in flame wars for sport (or therapy, I don't know). Others don't ever want to see their side/choice not get equal attention/praise/validation. And nuance is often lost in DCUM discussions, no matter how hard/how many posters try to inject it into the mix.

Actually, it wasn't clear to me at all what her underlying assumptions were. And when she spelled them out today, I found myself disagreeing, vehemently, and from personal experience.

[Anonymous]

Proving several of my points, I think!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Proving several of my points, I think!

If you're responding to me, 19:09, then I have to tell you that I have kids in both public and private. I'm not some random public booster of the sort people apparently think come on here out of spite/jealousy/neediness. Instead, I have actual experience with both public and private schools. Unlike the "no redeeming qualities" poster, I am basing my disagreement with her on my actual experience with both public and private schools.

And why, BTW, did she have to phrase her post that way? Writing "no redeeming qualities" about public school is the sign of a thoughtless person who doesn't care who she offends. No wonder she got flamed.

[Anonymous]

19:09 again. Thinking about it, I should have said:

Writing there are "no redeeming qualities" about public schools is the sign of a thoughtless, *ignorant* person who doesn't care who she offends. No wonder she got flamed.

Now I have to look around my own private, and wonder if there are other such offensive parents, who think like that poster but just don't say it. The combination of ignorance, smugness, and willingness to offend sort of makes my skin crawl.

[Anonymous]

The original post should have been "if you don't live in DC what's the best way to social climb in to that scene. Discuss..."

[Anonymous]

We are in mont county in the far flung suburbs and will apply to the gc high school.
The public is excellent but not working for us. I am interested in the Ryken program. We cannot really afford this, but I think dc would greatly benefit from the program and will be disappointed if we do not get in. There are no other privats near us, and dc did not do well in 7th. Long story, but hoping that if dc does better in 8th it will be enough to qualify for the Ryken program.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The original post should have been "if you don't live in DC what's the best way to social climb in to that scene. Discuss..."

uhhh, because that wasn't my question.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Thanks. I do not mind being flamed. I am very happy and confident in my choices for my children and my family. The main reason I choose to go into the detail was the negative connotations people try to give private school by calling it a bubble. In the Washington metro area, the so-called "best" publics in MOCO, Arlington and FFCO, can be as much or more of the kind of "bubble" many PPs are suggesting due to economic and skin-color self-selecting of where one buys a home. Some people fail to consider that just because others have a similar HHI and skin color does not mean they will have where near the same values. Quitye the opposite I have found.

This makes no sense at all. You are writing very conflicting things, but apparently you have convinced yourself they are compatible:
(1) you claim privates are more "diverse" than public schools, but you also claim they they have the homogeneity of values that you seek (your post of 10:39). These are mutually exclusive. You won't have homegeneity of values when there is real SES diversity, that's the whole friggin' point.
(2) you claim that the values in a "good" public in a wealthy district are are "quite the opposite" from the values in a private school full of even wealthier kids. You don't explain this, and perhaps it's unexplainable.

You need to face that your kids are in a "bubble" of other privileged kids. So are mine. I'm sorry if the word "bubble" offends you, but it's a fact.

I accept this fact, although I view the loss of real diversity as a "sacrifice" made in order to get some of the other benefits of a private school education. I do not try to delude myself, as you are apparently doing, that your private has more "real" diversity than a good public, or that "homegeneity of values" is compatible with diversity.

If you want to be "happy with your choices" you have to look them in the eye and accept them for what they are. Tell us the pros outweigh the cons, but don't delude yourself into thinking there are no cons, like being in a bubble.

[Anonymous]

Actually, the post you quoted seems to say it's a bubble either way (good public vs. private). And she'd rather her bubble be constructed around shared values than shared zip code/housing price/race.

And she does seem pretty clear about her choices whereas you seem really angry and incapable of listening to and understanding different point of views. Sounds like anyone who doesn't see things your way is self-deluding. Which is kind of bizarre from a self-professed champion of diversity.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Actually, the post you quoted seems to say it's a bubble either way (good public vs. private). And she'd rather her bubble be constructed around shared values than shared zip code/housing price/race.

And she does seem pretty clear about her choices whereas you seem really angry and incapable of listening to and understanding different point of views. Sounds like anyone who doesn't see things your way is self-deluding. Which is kind of bizarre from a self-professed champion of diversity.

Wow, way to twist a post around. That's called an ad hominem attack - attacking the poster (who doesn't sound like your description at all) instead of the argument. Where's the so-called anger in her post? She said she had KIDS IN PRIVATE SCHOOL. She's apparently just trying to have a discussion, whereas you look like you're incredibly threatened by her points.

The no redeeming poster sounds exceptionally unreflective and thoughtless, or, she's AFRAID to admit that her choices are not all roses, that she can't have it all, because she's irrationally afraid of words like bubble. For her sake, I hope that it's fear, and not lack of thinking skills, that explain her unreflective posts.

[Anonymous]

Lots of projection going on there!

[Anonymous]

Anybody who would write "there are no redeeming qualities to public schools" seems like a person who doesn't think before she writes.