Paying for a second or third tier college

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Virginia of it all really distorts this question—Virginia and California are really the only states with more than one public college that is on par with nationally renowned privates.

That said, I am the oldest of three kids and went to any Ivy. My brother, the second oldest, went to a top 50 school with high name recognition. My sister, the youngest, went to a no-name regional SLAC on a full ride merit scholarship. I have an excellent, high-earning career. My brother has a very good career and is married to an extremely successful woman. My sister has been laid off multiple times and is still struggling to find her purpose.

People complain about paying full freight for these schools in the lower half of the top 50 but ime the outcomes are good because the peer group is solid. But if the choice is between noname private or non-flagship public, it gets tough.

Personally I think only Cal, UCLA, UMich and GT are on par with the top private colleges.

Yea, well, who gives a shit what you think personally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Virginia of it all really distorts this question—Virginia and California are really the only states with more than one public college that is on par with nationally renowned privates.

That said, I am the oldest of three kids and went to any Ivy. My brother, the second oldest, went to a top 50 school with high name recognition. My sister, the youngest, went to a no-name regional SLAC on a full ride merit scholarship. I have an excellent, high-earning career. My brother has a very good career and is married to an extremely successful woman. My sister has been laid off multiple times and is still struggling to find her purpose.

People complain about paying full freight for these schools in the lower half of the top 50 but ime the outcomes are good because the peer group is solid. But if the choice is between noname private or non-flagship public, it gets tough.

Personally I think only Cal, UCLA, UMich and GT are on par with the top private colleges.

Yea, well, who gives a shit what you think personally.

Starting early with that wine I see. Angry drunk?

[Anonymous]

In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Virginia of it all really distorts this question—Virginia and California are really the only states with more than one public college that is on par with nationally renowned privates.

That said, I am the oldest of three kids and went to any Ivy. My brother, the second oldest, went to a top 50 school with high name recognition. My sister, the youngest, went to a no-name regional SLAC on a full ride merit scholarship. I have an excellent, high-earning career. My brother has a very good career and is married to an extremely successful woman. My sister has been laid off multiple times and is still struggling to find her purpose.

People complain about paying full freight for these schools in the lower half of the top 50 but ime the outcomes are good because the peer group is solid. But if the choice is between noname private or non-flagship public, it gets tough.

Personally I think only Cal, UCLA, UMich and GT are on par with the top private colleges.

Yea, well, who gives a shit what you think personally.

Starting early with that wine I see. Angry drunk?

I think that PP has anger issues rather than alcoholic issues.

The whole point of this forum is for everyone to chime in with their opinions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

UCs? Nah. In-state is fine. Paying OOS tuition so your DC can take the same class as community college transfers? No.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

UCs? Nah. In-state is fine. Paying OOS tuition so your DC can take the same class as community college transfers? No.

The CC transfers take the intro and most lower division classes in their CC. As for upper division classes, you can choose the really hard classes or even take Ph.D. classes as an undergrad. Cal has the best 3-5 Ph.D. programs in almost every single subject, so the Ph.D. classmates are outstanding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

UCs? Nah. In-state is fine. Paying OOS tuition so your DC can take the same class as community college transfers? No.

The CC transfers take the intro and most lower division classes in their CC. As for upper division classes, you can choose the really hard classes or even take Ph.D. classes as an undergrad. Cal has the best 3-5 Ph.D. programs in almost every single subject, so the Ph.D. classmates are outstanding.

Meh...they weather is nice, but I still don't think I will encourage DC to apply to any UCs. Too far so that adds up in travel as well. Would rather see them suffer a bit in knee deep snow!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

So you base school selection on acceptance rate? Thats weird.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The point of going to college is not just to take classes. It is the peer group and the academic environment.

Any school with an average SAT below 1500 is probably not really worth 100K COA. If the peer group is not at that level, then what exactly are you paying for?

Conversely, if the state school average above 1500, then yes it's better than going to a private with a lower average. You want your DC to be surrounded by serious, highly capable students.

Test optional schools have a lot of dummies.

Take those off your list.

Then the list will look like this:

Tier 1
HYPSM, JHU, Upenn, Brown, CalTech.

Tier2
Cornell, Dartmouth, Rice, CMU, Georgetown

Tier 3
Gatech, UT

Rice is Test optional

Rice is test recommended. If you have examples of unhooked kids getting in without test scores, would be interesting to know.

So are a lot of TO schools, they're test preferred if you look on their CDS profiles.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

UCs are test blind. UMich is a better option due to that. UMich, UVa, UNC, UT, GT are good OOs only for a few majors. Others go private or instate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

So you base school selection on acceptance rate? Thats weird.

+1

McDonald’s is also very popular.

Your data is wrong btw, Florida is 38% in state.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

UCs are test blind. UMich is a better option due to that. UMich, UVa, UNC, UT, GT are good OOs only for a few majors. Others go private or instate.

Michigan is test optional, so the applicants with deficient test scores can just as easily hide (since that’s your theory of UC applicants - which is idiotic, by the way).

Additionally, though acceptance rates are obviously not the only thing to consider (or even among the Top 10 things to consider), there’s no amount of money that I WOULDN’T wager on the proposition that the Top 10 - 15% of in-state students accepted at UCLA and Cal are SUBSTANTIALLY more capable than the Top 40% of in-state students accepted at UM.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

So you base school selection on acceptance rate? Thats weird.

+1

McDonald’s is also very popular.

Your data is wrong btw, Florida is 38% in state.

https://www.ivywise.com/blog/college-admission-rates/

Yeah, but actually no …

You can also pull up the actual data in webcasts as it’s reported (on video, in person) by the UF admissions team directly to the university’s Board of Trustees, but it will only make you feel smaller because the acceptance rate has become even more competitive this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The point of going to college is not just to take classes. It is the peer group and the academic environment.

Any school with an average SAT below 1500 is probably not really worth 100K COA. If the peer group is not at that level, then what exactly are you paying for?

Conversely, if the state school average above 1500, then yes it's better than going to a private with a lower average. You want your DC to be surrounded by serious, highly capable students.

.

2% of students have an SAT score of 1500 or above. I would hate to spend four years with a group that all scored in the top 2%. Luckily no such colleges exist.

I’d rather be with a variety of students from all over. Bill Clinton, partier and smart guy got a 1030 on the SAT. Most of the athletes making millions of dollars have average scores.

Do you know how many colleges there are in this country? All T50 colleges belong to the top 2% of colleges in the US.

Just discussing SATs the Ivy Leagues have about 25% of accepted students at or under 1500 scores. The top 50 below Tier 1 colleges average a score in the 10% tile which is about 1390.

Most good colleges accept 1200 and up SAT scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In general (i.e., not major specific) , I would only consider the following OOS publics:

UCLA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 13%.

UC Berkeley: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are below 15%.

UVA: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25%.

UF: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 25% (plus OOS COA is low).

Georgia Tech: In-state and OOS acceptance rates are both below 28%.

That’s it …

Michigan, UNC, Texas, and Washington? Yeah, I’m not paying OOS tuition for any school that accepts nearly 40% of its in-state applicants.

Wisconsin, Indiana, Maryland? Not a chance.

So you base school selection on acceptance rate? Thats weird.

Reading is fundamental!

I said that I’d only CONSIDER those school as an OOS applicant. That consideration would affect the range of choices I’d have when I’d make a SELECTION, sure, but dismissing acceptance rates altogether is as myopic as pretending that rankings don’t matter.