Divisionals really shows why the unfair birthday rule matters

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:On our team, in the younger ages, most of the divisionals swimmers were swimming in the “wrong” age group. 11 year olds swimming as 9/10. 9 year olds swimming as 8&under. In the older kids, many of those dominating came back from college to swim a final year.

This rule was literally cooked up in a back room by the parents of summer birthday kids. It should be done away with. We follow USA Swimming rules for everything else. We should for aging up as well.

I was curious if this is even true. So lets look at the NVSL results for divisional in the top 3 divisions for boys 9/10

Division 1 Freestyle: 4/12 are 9 years old. 9 year old placed 2nd
Division 2 Freestyle: 5/12 are 9 years old. 9 year olds placed 2nd, 3rd, and 5th
Division 3 Freestyle: 3/12 are 9 years old. 9 year old finished 3rd

Division 1 Backstroke: 4/12 are 9 years old. 9 yard old finished 1st!
Division 2 Backstroke: 4/12 are 9 years old. 9 year old finished 2nd and 4th
Division 3 Backstroke: 2/12 are 9 years old. 9 year old finished 2nd

Division 1 Breaststroke: 4/12 are 9 year olds
Division 2 Breaststroke: 7/12 are 9 years old. 9 year olds finished 1st, 3rd, 6th!
Division 3 Breaststroke: 1/12 is 9 years old

Division 1 Fly: 3/12 are 9 years old. 9 year old finished 5th
Division 2 Fly: 5/12 are 9 years old. 9 year olds finished 1st and 5th!
Division 3 Fly: 5/12 are 9 years old. 9 year old finished 1st!

Division 1 IM: 6/12 are 9 years old. 9 year olds finished 1st and 3rd!
Division 2 IM: 7/12 are 9 years old. 9 year olds finished 1st, 3rd, and 5th!
Division 3 IM: 3/12 are 9 years old. 9 year old finished 3rd

Doesn't seem like "over age" (which is not the right term anyway) are dominating 9/10 boys. 9 year olds won 4/15 events.

Seems like this is a non issue.

Not sure this assessment is completely accurate. Looking at the 9 year olds (a few of whom are actually 10, but are considered 9 because of the summer cutoff), these kids are actually swimming in the RIGHT age group. What would be a better assessment is looking at the 10 year olds in the 9-10 age group, some of which are actually competing when their true age is 11.

An example of this is looking at club swimmers who do long course over the summer (which makes you swim your true age). There are some club swimmers whose times are just okay, but are impressive for summer league because of the age advantage.

What are you talking about? If they were born between June 2nd 2013 and June 1 2015 they are the right age. The fact that they had a birthday after the cut off doesn't make them not the right age. They are the age that the league has decided is allowed to swim in that meet. That makes them the "right" age.

Summer swim is a team sport. Name another team sport where kids age up on their birthday. I can't think of any. The fact that the relatively small segment of swim that is club age group swimming does is irrelevant. They're the outliers, and are doing something entirely different from summer swim.

And your focus on kids swimming LC is absurd, because any kid who does club and rec in the same sport, at least any other sport, knows that rec is about having fun with your friends. Trying to make rec into club so you can beat the rec kids is really really really terrible sportsmanship.

This is the best and most logical response in my opinion.

[Anonymous]

Agree with PP, even riding (equestrian sports) which is absolutely an individual sport utilizes a specific date to determine age. No one complains.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Agree with PP, even riding (equestrian sports) which is absolutely an individual sport utilizes a specific date to determine age. No one complains.

Do 11 year olds dominate the individual 10&u events at the year end riding championships?

[Anonymous]

My 10-years-and-361-days-old kid did pretty well at divisionals, but the events that they didn’t come in first in were lost to a 9-year-old, alas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My 10-years-and-361-days-old kid did pretty well at divisionals, but the events that they didn’t come in first in were lost to a 9-year-old, alas.

My kid won divisionals as a 9 year old too. Mostly because there wasn’t a single team in the division that had a good 9-10 swimmer that year.

[Anonymous]

Like PP. My 9 year old really 10 won divionals this year. And would have won last year. And will win next year. Because she is good at the stroke. Who the F cares. Just have fun with summer swim. I'm so sick of hearing my kid is good because of the cutoff. No she actually works her a#s off all ear to get good. Stop with this nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Look at the D1 relays and see how many “bottom of the age group” kids are on relays. Sooooo many!!! Age is not the determining factor. Then look to see how many swim club and, for most, are great club swimmers. *That* is the determining factor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look at the D1 relays and see how many “bottom of the age group” kids are on relays. Sooooo many!!! Age is not the determining factor. Then look to see how many swim club and, for most, are great club swimmers. *That* is the determining factor.

+1, I have a May birthday club swimmer and she still crushes summer swim because she’s a talented year round swimmer. Would she get more records if she had been born a few weeks later, absolutely, but it’s summer swim and she doesn’t care. She would much rather have the good SC champs/Zones/NCSAs birthday.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Look at the D1 relays and see how many “bottom of the age group” kids are on relays. Sooooo many!!! Age is not the determining factor. Then look to see how many swim club and, for most, are great club swimmers. *That* is the determining factor.

And yet the teams winning the 9-10 age group at ASR just happen to be loaded with 11 year olds year after year.

[Anonymous]

Life isn't fair. Summer birthday kids have an advantage in summer swim. Get over it. Having a summer birthday general sucks for pretty much everything else so its nice to have one perk.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look at the D1 relays and see how many “bottom of the age group” kids are on relays. Sooooo many!!! Age is not the determining factor. Then look to see how many swim club and, for most, are great club swimmers. *That* is the determining factor.

And yet the teams winning the 9-10 age group at ASR just happen to be loaded with 11 year olds year after year.

2024
9-10 Girls Free Relay ASRs
1st - one younger 9 y.o.; one 10 y.o. who turned 10 in late Apr/May; one who turned 10 in Jan; and one older 10 y.o. (maybe Aug/Sept)
2nd place - two very young 9 y.o.s; one who turned 10 in Jan; one who is 10 (Oct/Nov bday)
3rd place - one young 9 y.o.; one who turned 10 in May; one older 10 y.o. (Sept/Oct bday); and one who turned 11 in June
4th place - two 9 y.o.s with Fall bdays; one 10 y.o. with late March bday; one older 10 y.o. (Aug/Sept bday)
—> All D1 teams; these relays have swum each other 3 times; only one 11 year old across the 16 swimmers

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I guess older kids really flourish in breaststroke. Age of NVSL All Star qualifiers in 9-10 boys 50 breaststroke ..

1. 11.0
2. 11.0
3. 11.1
4. 10.7
5. 11.1
6. 10.8

.. the average age of the top heat is 11.

That's nuts!

[Anonymous]

The June 1 date has been used by summer rec leagues for decades. Either get over it and let your kid have fun or don’t participate.

It’s not fair that the majority of swimmers are 5-8 inches taller than my kid at this point but it is what it is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The June 1 date has been used by summer rec leagues for decades. Either get over it and let your kid have fun or don’t participate.

It’s not fair that the majority of swimmers are 5-8 inches taller than my kid at this point but it is what it is.

What if my kid is short and has a 5/31 birthday?? 😭 😭 😭

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kids also aren't clueless. Two kids with a May 15, 2014 birthday and a June 15, 2012 birthday will likely never swim in the same age group at the same time in a PVS meet but in NVSL they are competing head to head every other year. They notice these weird anomalies.

Kids also notice when their parents think things are unfair and grow up to think life is unfair. Your parenting matters far more than the birthday rule. Do better.