What are the odds OOB feeder rights will end?

[Anonymous]

I’m a parent at an EotP elementary school (rising 4th grader). I hate OOB discussions on DCUM. Posters frame OOB kids with the nastiest stereotypes. Many of my kid’s friends are OOB and they are wonderful kids with great parents. These are actual people you are maligning.

[Anonymous]

Big picture perspectives needed here. When your public middle school has a dozen trailers, triple lunch shifts and absurdly crowded hallways, ending OOB feeder rights starts to seem reasonable. Michelle Rhee introduced these rights just a decade back for political reasons. Placing in-boundary preference on a par with OOB feeder elementary or middle school preference is not in fact a longstanding DC tradition.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I say chances are low. I know DCUM forgets they exist, but there are other middle/high schools beyond Hardy Deal and Wilson. There is no benefit for those schools to discontinue OOB feeder rights.

But my question is, if we eliminated out-of-boundary rights for middle school and high school, with the exception of at-risk students, how many would actually lose out? I have a strong sense that only Hardy, Deal, and Wilson would be affected.

Your strong sense is wrong. Stuart-Hobson is 45% economically disadvantaged (a broader category than at-risk) but 75% OOB.

But it is also wrong to say there's no benefit for middle/high schools outside of Wilson feeders to ending OOB feeder rights. The current issue is that families like OP are leaving their IB elementary schools not so much because they dislike those schools but so they can get a more desired middle and high school. If OP and people like her didn't have that option, they would have stronger (in terms of numbers, test scores, and fundraising) upper elementary programs in their own neighborhoods, and some of those kids would continue on to their IB middle and high schools as well.

[Anonymous]

It could lead to another wave of charter creation. Not that I want that but it could have that effect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I say chances are low. I know DCUM forgets they exist, but there are other middle/high schools beyond Hardy Deal and Wilson. There is no benefit for those schools to discontinue OOB feeder rights.

But my question is, if we eliminated out-of-boundary rights for middle school and high school, with the exception of at-risk students, how many would actually lose out? I have a strong sense that only Hardy, Deal, and Wilson would be affected.

Your strong sense is wrong. Stuart-Hobson is 45% economically disadvantaged (a broader category than at-risk) but 75% OOB.

But it is also wrong to say there's no benefit for middle/high schools outside of Wilson feeders to ending OOB feeder rights. The current issue is that families like OP are leaving their IB elementary schools not so much because they dislike those schools but so they can get a more desired middle and high school. If OP and people like her didn't have that option, they would have stronger (in terms of numbers, test scores, and fundraising) upper elementary programs in their own neighborhoods, and some of those kids would continue on to their IB middle and high schools as well.

I'm not convinced many OOB students would lose out if OOB feeder rights ended, not here in 2019. There are many good charters in the City's lower-income neighborhoods now, e.g. KIPP, along with rising DCPS programs. Going to school close to home confers many advantages as long as the school is decent.

BTW, SH is roughly 5% less OOB and at-risk with each passing year. Those percentages really add up as more neighborhood families enroll. As it should be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Big picture perspectives needed here. When your public middle school has a dozen trailers, triple lunch shifts and absurdly crowded hallways, ending OOB feeder rights starts to seem reasonable. Michelle Rhee introduced these rights just a decade back for political reasons. Placing in-boundary preference on a par with OOB feeder elementary or middle school preference is not in fact a longstanding DC tradition.

Attending a school outside one's boundary is, in fact, a longstanding DC tradition. Before the last 20 years' of population growth, lotteries and waitlists, and upper middle-class families who live IB for Wilson deciding to attend their inbound school.... all a yone who wanted to attend a school outside their neighborhood would go and ask to enroll. Those with connections to the principal or front office staff would usually get in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I say chances are low. I know DCUM forgets they exist, but there are other middle/high schools beyond Hardy Deal and Wilson. There is no benefit for those schools to discontinue OOB feeder rights.

But my question is, if we eliminated out-of-boundary rights for middle school and high school, with the exception of at-risk students, how many would actually lose out? I have a strong sense that only Hardy, Deal, and Wilson would be affected.

Your strong sense is wrong. Stuart-Hobson is 45% economically disadvantaged (a broader category than at-risk) but 75% OOB.

But it is also wrong to say there's no benefit for middle/high schools outside of Wilson feeders to ending OOB feeder rights. The current issue is that families like OP are leaving their IB elementary schools not so much because they dislike those schools but so they can get a more desired middle and high school. If OP and people like her didn't have that option, they would have stronger (in terms of numbers, test scores, and fundraising) upper elementary programs in their own neighborhoods, and some of those kids would continue on to their IB middle and high schools as well.

I'm not convinced many OOB students would lose out if OOB feeder rights ended, not here in 2019. There are many good charters in the City's lower-income neighborhoods now, e.g. KIPP, along with rising DCPS programs. Going to school close to home confers many advantages as long as the school is decent.

BTW, SH is roughly 5% less OOB and at-risk with each passing year. Those percentages really add up as more neighborhood families enroll. As it should be.

And who are you to say that a school with 20% proficiency on PARCC, or 40%, is "decent" if there's a school with 70% proficiency and a few extra seats in a classroom? If you want your kids to go to undercrowded schools, you can enter the OOB lottery and send your kids east to a school with plenty of space.

[Anonymous]

Ending OOB feeder rights wouldn’t mean that OOB kids couldn’t attend - it would mean that schools could admit a sane number of OOB kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I say chances are low. I know DCUM forgets they exist, but there are other middle/high schools beyond Hardy Deal and Wilson. There is no benefit for those schools to discontinue OOB feeder rights.

But my question is, if we eliminated out-of-boundary rights for middle school and high school, with the exception of at-risk students, how many would actually lose out? I have a strong sense that only Hardy, Deal, and Wilson would be affected.

Your strong sense is wrong. Stuart-Hobson is 45% economically disadvantaged (a broader category than at-risk) but 75% OOB.

But it is also wrong to say there's no benefit for middle/high schools outside of Wilson feeders to ending OOB feeder rights. The current issue is that families like OP are leaving their IB elementary schools not so much because they dislike those schools but so they can get a more desired middle and high school. If OP and people like her didn't have that option, they would have stronger (in terms of numbers, test scores, and fundraising) upper elementary programs in their own neighborhoods, and some of those kids would continue on to their IB middle and high schools as well.

I'm not convinced many OOB students would lose out if OOB feeder rights ended, not here in 2019. There are many good charters in the City's lower-income neighborhoods now, e.g. KIPP, along with rising DCPS programs. Going to school close to home confers many advantages as long as the school is decent.

BTW, SH is roughly 5% less OOB and at-risk with each passing year. Those percentages really add up as more neighborhood families enroll. As it should be.

Removing OOB won’t make Deal much smaller.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ending OOB feeder rights wouldn’t mean that OOB kids couldn’t attend - it would mean that schools could admit a sane number of OOB kids.

Exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I say chances are low. I know DCUM forgets they exist, but there are other middle/high schools beyond Hardy Deal and Wilson. There is no benefit for those schools to discontinue OOB feeder rights.

But my question is, if we eliminated out-of-boundary rights for middle school and high school, with the exception of at-risk students, how many would actually lose out? I have a strong sense that only Hardy, Deal, and Wilson would be affected.

Your strong sense is wrong. Stuart-Hobson is 45% economically disadvantaged (a broader category than at-risk) but 75% OOB.

But it is also wrong to say there's no benefit for middle/high schools outside of Wilson feeders to ending OOB feeder rights. The current issue is that families like OP are leaving their IB elementary schools not so much because they dislike those schools but so they can get a more desired middle and high school. If OP and people like her didn't have that option, they would have stronger (in terms of numbers, test scores, and fundraising) upper elementary programs in their own neighborhoods, and some of those kids would continue on to their IB middle and high schools as well.

I'm not convinced many OOB students would lose out if OOB feeder rights ended, not here in 2019. There are many good charters in the City's lower-income neighborhoods now, e.g. KIPP, along with rising DCPS programs. Going to school close to home confers many advantages as long as the school is decent.

BTW, SH is roughly 5% less OOB and at-risk with each passing year. Those percentages really add up as more neighborhood families enroll. As it should be.

Removing OOB won’t make Deal much smaller.

Looks like it’s currently 30% OOB? Seems this would make a significant impact.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I say chances are low. I know DCUM forgets they exist, but there are other middle/high schools beyond Hardy Deal and Wilson. There is no benefit for those schools to discontinue OOB feeder rights.

But my question is, if we eliminated out-of-boundary rights for middle school and high school, with the exception of at-risk students, how many would actually lose out? I have a strong sense that only Hardy, Deal, and Wilson would be affected.

Your strong sense is wrong. Stuart-Hobson is 45% economically disadvantaged (a broader category than at-risk) but 75% OOB.

But it is also wrong to say there's no benefit for middle/high schools outside of Wilson feeders to ending OOB feeder rights. The current issue is that families like OP are leaving their IB elementary schools not so much because they dislike those schools but so they can get a more desired middle and high school. If OP and people like her didn't have that option, they would have stronger (in terms of numbers, test scores, and fundraising) upper elementary programs in their own neighborhoods, and some of those kids would continue on to their IB middle and high schools as well.

I'm not convinced many OOB students would lose out if OOB feeder rights ended, not here in 2019. There are many good charters in the City's lower-income neighborhoods now, e.g. KIPP, along with rising DCPS programs. Going to school close to home confers many advantages as long as the school is decent.

BTW, SH is roughly 5% less OOB and at-risk with each passing year. Those percentages really add up as more neighborhood families enroll. As it should be.

Removing OOB won’t make Deal much smaller.

Huh? It would mean 400+ fewer kids in the building. It would reduce the number of staff also. It would be a tremendous improvement. And it could happen overnight. For free.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Big picture perspectives needed here. When your public middle school has a dozen trailers, triple lunch shifts and absurdly crowded hallways, ending OOB feeder rights starts to seem reasonable. Michelle Rhee introduced these rights just a decade back for political reasons. Placing in-boundary preference on a par with OOB feeder elementary or middle school preference is not in fact a longstanding DC tradition.

Attending a school outside one's boundary is, in fact, a longstanding DC tradition. Before the last 20 years' of population growth, lotteries and waitlists, and upper middle-class families who live IB for Wilson deciding to attend their inbound school.... all a yone who wanted to attend a school outside their neighborhood would go and ask to enroll. Those with connections to the principal or front office staff would usually get in.

That's not what PP is saying. PP clearly indicated at OOB feeder rights isn't a longstanding DC tradition. This is very different from what you're suggesting which is just OOB enrollment with corruption but without the entitlement policy to attend.

The best option would be to end OOB feeder rights, but make it a preference in the lottery. So if Deal has 35 spots available, then those who attended a feeder school OOB would have a preference in the lottery and 35 would get in.

The real issue is that DCPS needs to offer amazing carrots to entice families to other schools. We're IB for Deal and Wilson, but I would fully support extra funding to go to other middle and high schools to encourage those IB families to attend.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ending OOB feeder rights wouldn’t mean that OOB kids couldn’t attend - it would mean that schools could admit a sane number of OOB kids.

Exactly.

+2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I say chances are low. I know DCUM forgets they exist, but there are other middle/high schools beyond Hardy Deal and Wilson. There is no benefit for those schools to discontinue OOB feeder rights.

But my question is, if we eliminated out-of-boundary rights for middle school and high school, with the exception of at-risk students, how many would actually lose out? I have a strong sense that only Hardy, Deal, and Wilson would be affected.

Your strong sense is wrong. Stuart-Hobson is 45% economically disadvantaged (a broader category than at-risk) but 75% OOB.

But it is also wrong to say there's no benefit for middle/high schools outside of Wilson feeders to ending OOB feeder rights. The current issue is that families like OP are leaving their IB elementary schools not so much because they dislike those schools but so they can get a more desired middle and high school. If OP and people like her didn't have that option, they would have stronger (in terms of numbers, test scores, and fundraising) upper elementary programs in their own neighborhoods, and some of those kids would continue on to their IB middle and high schools as well.

I'm not convinced many OOB students would lose out if OOB feeder rights ended, not here in 2019. There are many good charters in the City's lower-income neighborhoods now, e.g. KIPP, along with rising DCPS programs. Going to school close to home confers many advantages as long as the school is decent.

BTW, SH is roughly 5% less OOB and at-risk with each passing year. Those percentages really add up as more neighborhood families enroll. As it should be.

SH OOB outlook is pretty easy to predict. Look at OOB #s from its feeders, especially in 4th and 5th. If you could compare that to previous years numbers it would not be hard to correlate.