What are the odds OOB feeder rights will end?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I see the boundary review is gonna be the same as it was last time. Property values and self centered arguments masquerading as concern for poor kids. If you’d put others at the center of your life you wouldn’t argue this way. I guess that was never really a popular perspective on moral issues, in the end.

There is little they can do. The crowded areas are so crowded that they cannot be fixed by boundary reviews. Most of the schools (EOTP) are too small. This would never happen but I wonder what the city would look like with half as many schools but that were twice as big. I think bigger schools would be able to flex more with the changes in the city. I think you could also have more diverse schools. Instead we have small schools that are overflowing when 50 new kids show up over 5 years.

Here is what I would do. Re-open Emery (in Eckington) and give it the east end of Seaton's zone and the northern part of Walker-Jones' zone, and the southern part of Langley. Seaton's zone can then expand west and north, taking from Ross and Garrison. That relieves pressure on Ross. Garrison can shift north and west to take a bit from HD Cooke, Marie Reed, and Tubman. That could in turn relieve Bancroft.

Meanwhile, the elementary schools in the Coolidge feeder group can grow their boundaries a little to relieve Barnard and West, and Shepherd if they will stand for it. Also, the expanded capacity at Stevens school building should relieve SWW@FS.

Not sure what to do for Ward 3 if nobody is willing to be put out of Wilson and/or commute across the park. But there is relief available EOTP if people are willing to accept being re-zoned. Which they hate but it does sometimes happen.

Why does Shepherd need to be relieved? It can handle the number of its in boundary kids.

Because this is about the long term capacity, 10 or more years out. Building new schools takes time.

Maybe I don't have all the data. Is there a reason why Shepherd is expected to go far over capacity in the next 10 years? Many IB families don't send their kids there.

+1. I also don't know why this argument applies more to Shepherd than some of the larger feeders, which are overcrowded even while being majority IB. It seems eliminating Shepherd wouldn't make much of a difference in the longterm.

The MFP says that Shepherd will be over capacity by 96 kids in 10 years. Of course the schools in the Wilson pyramid are overcrowded but it is hard to figure out much of a solution for the areas west of the park if people don't want to commute across the park. Shepherd stands out to me because it abuts Takoma and the Coolidge feeder group. Takoma is projected to be overcrowded, but Brightwood and Whittier are not. And Wells MS is not. So it seems to me that boundaries could be shuffled north a bit to give a few more blocks to Brightwood and Whittier and less to Takoma and Shepherd.

Of course, this would infuriate people, but isn't that always what happens when boundaries change? I don't have any special expertise or knowledge here, I just notice that it's potentially an option.

Does anyone know if the Stevens School modernization is reflected in the MFP?

They're coming for Floral Street! Watch your back, Geranium!

[Anonymous]

Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

I think there aren't a lot of good solutions here. But it isn't just about crowding at Deal, it's about Wilson too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It depends what you mean by selective. If your child is working at grade level or above, and this can be documented/demonstrated, they get into a particular honors class. If they aren't working at or above grade level in a particular subject, they don't.

That's selective enough for me, given that almost all the other DCPS middle schools (including Deal and Hardy) lump kids who lack basic skills in with kids working at or above grade level, other than for math instruction. We supplement with academic summer programs and tutoring to add rigor, which is a whole lot cheaper than paying for private school.

The fact that Stuart Hobson's student body is 75% OOB/low SES isn't a problem with half a dozen honors classes on offer, in a huge deal for us. We wouldn't have touched the school without the honors classes, presumably like most of the other middle-class families who enroll their children.

Hardy has had honors classes for subjects other than math for several years. Deal has it for foreign language and math.

That's nice. Deal admins have long insisted on shoving OOB kids who read, write and speak at an elementary school level into English, social studies and science classes with 8th grade students who work at a high school level.

We hire an English lit tutor with two other in-boundary families.

End feeder rights already and/or create a full menu of remedial classes at Deal that aren't for English Language Learners. Admins, parents and pols really need to stop pretending that the current arrangement is working well. Honors for all at Wilson emanates from Honors for All at Deal, other than for math and foreign language.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

I think there aren't a lot of good solutions here. But it isn't just about crowding at Deal, it's about Wilson too.

The north end of Lafayette could be sent to Shepherd, and the Shepherd/Takoma boundary adjusted. People would hate it. But I can't think of anything people wouldn't hate, so...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

The problem with Hardy is that it's a very small site. It's already built out to the max. They could cannibalize the tennis courts and maybe add 4 trailers, but that doesn't get you any meaningful breathing room.

The fact of the matter is that WOTP needs another by-right middle school and by-right high school. But that doesn't jive with Bowser equity-driven plan. So, instead, Bowser will make WOTP schools so over-crowded that families either drop out to go private (less and less likely given that privates have not increased seats) or flee to charters in far-flung parts of the city. Still, all the empty schools in Wards 6, 7, 8 will remain empty; no one is driving their kids from AU Park to Ward 7 for a school with a decent student-teacher ratio.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

The problem with Hardy is that it's a very small site. It's already built out to the max. They could cannibalize the tennis courts and maybe add 4 trailers, but that doesn't get you any meaningful breathing room.

The fact of the matter is that WOTP needs another by-right middle school and by-right high school. But that doesn't jive with Bowser equity-driven plan. So, instead, Bowser will make WOTP schools so over-crowded that families either drop out to go private (less and less likely given that privates have not increased seats) or flee to charters in far-flung parts of the city. Still, all the empty schools in Wards 6, 7, 8 will remain empty; no one is driving their kids from AU Park to Ward 7 for a school with a decent student-teacher ratio.

Hardy will have a bit more room to grow when Fillmore Arts is finally moved out of the building. It will likely happen in the next 3-5 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

I think there aren't a lot of good solutions here. But it isn't just about crowding at Deal, it's about Wilson too.

The north end of Lafayette could be sent to Shepherd, and the Shepherd/Takoma boundary adjusted. People would hate it. But I can't think of anything people wouldn't hate, so...

I think PP's suggestion was trying to re-balance the feeder population as an approach to relieve up the chain in MS and HS. While you could reduce some Lafayette crowding with a rezone to Shepherd, ultimately this wouldn't help the Deal/Wilson problem, just shuffling the deck chairs. Plus the WOTP pearl clutchers would lose it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

I think there aren't a lot of good solutions here. But it isn't just about crowding at Deal, it's about Wilson too.

The north end of Lafayette could be sent to Shepherd, and the Shepherd/Takoma boundary adjusted. People would hate it. But I can't think of anything people wouldn't hate, so...

I think PP's suggestion was trying to re-balance the feeder population as an approach to relieve up the chain in MS and HS. While you could reduce some Lafayette crowding with a rezone to Shepherd, ultimately this wouldn't help the Deal/Wilson problem, just shuffling the deck chairs. Plus the WOTP pearl clutchers would lose it.

No, the idea is that part of Shepherd would be rezoned to Takoma, and part of Takoma re-zoned to Brightwood and Whittier, and that would produce a reduction in the land mass of the Wilson boundary on the southern and eastern edges of Shepherd's zone. I agree people would flip out. But there are not a lot of good options here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

The old “What difference would 50-60 kids make” argument. Well, it would make a meaningful difference in a building that is 300 kids too crowded.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

The old “What difference would 50-60 kids make” argument. Well, it would make a meaningful difference in a building that is 300 kids too crowded.

Only way any of this will fly is if at least 6-7 schools were rezoned in some way. Shared sacrifice both east and west of the park. Can't have just 1-2 sacrificial lambs, so to speak.

Also if Shepherd/Bancroft go (everyone's first choice, always) so should Adams (from Wilson).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

The old “What difference would 50-60 kids make” argument. Well, it would make a meaningful difference in a building that is 300 kids too crowded.

Only way any of this will fly is if at least 6-7 schools were rezoned in some way. Shared sacrifice both east and west of the park. Can't have just 1-2 sacrificial lambs, so to speak.

Also if Shepherd/Bancroft go (everyone's first choice, always) so should Adams (from Wilson).

Bancroft could probably be adjusted. And maybe some of Oyster could go to SWWFS when the Stevens building comes online. Maybe some of Hyde-Addison too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

I think there aren't a lot of good solutions here. But it isn't just about crowding at Deal, it's about Wilson too.

The north end of Lafayette could be sent to Shepherd, and the Shepherd/Takoma boundary adjusted. People would hate it. But I can't think of anything people wouldn't hate, so...

I think PP's suggestion was trying to re-balance the feeder population as an approach to relieve up the chain in MS and HS. While you could reduce some Lafayette crowding with a rezone to Shepherd, ultimately this wouldn't help the Deal/Wilson problem, just shuffling the deck chairs. Plus the WOTP pearl clutchers would lose it.

No, the idea is that part of Shepherd would be rezoned to Takoma, and part of Takoma re-zoned to Brightwood and Whittier, and that would produce a reduction in the land mass of the Wilson boundary on the southern and eastern edges of Shepherd's zone. I agree people would flip out. But there are not a lot of good options here.

This doesn't make sense. Also, pp never answered my question regarding why they believe Shepherd will be overcrowded in 10 years. I don't see any evidence to support this. What's the big change that's planned to occur to trigger this?

Sounds more like a fabricated claim to justify moving boundaries to reduce the amount of Shepherd Park kids going to Deal and Wilson.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

I think there aren't a lot of good solutions here. But it isn't just about crowding at Deal, it's about Wilson too.

The north end of Lafayette could be sent to Shepherd, and the Shepherd/Takoma boundary adjusted. People would hate it. But I can't think of anything people wouldn't hate, so...

I think PP's suggestion was trying to re-balance the feeder population as an approach to relieve up the chain in MS and HS. While you could reduce some Lafayette crowding with a rezone to Shepherd, ultimately this wouldn't help the Deal/Wilson problem, just shuffling the deck chairs. Plus the WOTP pearl clutchers would lose it.

No, the idea is that part of Shepherd would be rezoned to Takoma, and part of Takoma re-zoned to Brightwood and Whittier, and that would produce a reduction in the land mass of the Wilson boundary on the southern and eastern edges of Shepherd's zone. I agree people would flip out. But there are not a lot of good options here.

This doesn't make sense. Also, pp never answered my question regarding why they believe Shepherd will be overcrowded in 10 years. I don't see any evidence to support this. What's the big change that's planned to occur to trigger this?

Sounds more like a fabricated claim to justify moving boundaries to reduce the amount of Shepherd Park kids going to Deal and Wilson.

The evidence is the projection in the MFP. Maybe that is not accurate, but I didn't just make it up. See table A-20.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lol! The above suggestion wouldn't make much of a difference. Shepherd Park is a very low density neighborhood, so sending a few blocks to another school would reduce the number headed to Deal by what, 5 kids?

Currently, I believe about 40 kids head from Shepherd to Deal every year. Even if that increased to say, 50-60 in 10 years, eliminating those students would be a drop in the bucket towards solving Deal's overcrowding.

And there's also the question of what to do about crowding at the WOTP Deal feeders. I think boundaries for those schools also need to be readjusted so that some kids can be shifted to Hardy. I think this would be more impactful than simply cutting one school that contributes very little to Deal's numbers.

The old “What difference would 50-60 kids make” argument. Well, it would make a meaningful difference in a building that is 300 kids too crowded.

Only way any of this will fly is if at least 6-7 schools were rezoned in some way. Shared sacrifice both east and west of the park. Can't have just 1-2 sacrificial lambs, so to speak.

Also if Shepherd/Bancroft go (everyone's first choice, always) so should Adams (from Wilson).

A better solution would be to REOPEN WESTERN HIGH SCHOOL in Georgetown. Ellington can move to SE or SW near the Metro.