Male teachers and diapering/toileting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It just reinforces the fact that childcare is women's work. And regardless of what an insurance company says, they're opening themselves up for an employment lawsuit, just as if a bank said that black employees can't be trusted to handle deposits into the vault "to protect them from false accusations."

It doesn't mean that childcare is women's work to say that a male teacher, in a preschool or elementary, middle, or high school should be very careful about being alone with a student. It's sensible. I've known several male teachers who have had their careers affected or destroyed by crazy parents or crazy students.

Would you say that black bank employees should be very careful about handling money alone, because false accusations of stealing can destroy their careers?

[Anonymous]

Former center director here again--There is a difference between the abstract concept of what's right and the reality of what's real. The bottom line is that all it takes is one parents voicing loud concerns about a male staff member diapering a toddler to destroy someone's life. It's ugly and wrong but it's true. Not once did I ever have a male teacher who A) liked this policy and B) argued that they thought it should be lifted. They resented that it was necessary but understood why it was.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It just reinforces the fact that childcare is women's work. And regardless of what an insurance company says, they're opening themselves up for an employment lawsuit, just as if a bank said that black employees can't be trusted to handle deposits into the vault "to protect them from false accusations."

It doesn't mean that childcare is women's work to say that a male teacher, in a preschool or elementary, middle, or high school should be very careful about being alone with a student. It's sensible. I've known several male teachers who have had their careers affected or destroyed by crazy parents or crazy students.

Would you say that black bank employees should be very careful about handling money alone, because false accusations of stealing can destroy their careers?

I think it's smart of male teachers and of preschools and daycares for them not to change diapers or take girls/children to the bathroom. I suppose we can agree to disagree, if you don't think that's smart.

[Anonymous]

I co-op at a preschool and neither gender of parent/worker is allowed to be in the bathroom with the door closed. but there is not a rule that only females take kids to the bathroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It just reinforces the fact that childcare is women's work. And regardless of what an insurance company says, they're opening themselves up for an employment lawsuit, just as if a bank said that black employees can't be trusted to handle deposits into the vault "to protect them from false accusations."

It doesn't mean that childcare is women's work to say that a male teacher, in a preschool or elementary, middle, or high school should be very careful about being alone with a student. It's sensible. I've known several male teachers who have had their careers affected or destroyed by crazy parents or crazy students.

Would you say that black bank employees should be very careful about handling money alone, because false accusations of stealing can destroy their careers?

I think it's smart of male teachers and of preschools and daycares for them not to change diapers or take girls/children to the bathroom. I suppose we can agree to disagree, if you don't think that's smart.

Did you even read the question?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It just reinforces the fact that childcare is women's work. And regardless of what an insurance company says, they're opening themselves up for an employment lawsuit, just as if a bank said that black employees can't be trusted to handle deposits into the vault "to protect them from false accusations."

It doesn't mean that childcare is women's work to say that a male teacher, in a preschool or elementary, middle, or high school should be very careful about being alone with a student. It's sensible. I've known several male teachers who have had their careers affected or destroyed by crazy parents or crazy students.

Would you say that black bank employees should be very careful about handling money alone, because false accusations of stealing can destroy their careers?

I think it's smart of male teachers and of preschools and daycares for them not to change diapers or take girls/children to the bathroom. I suppose we can agree to disagree, if you don't think that's smart.

Not PP, but it can be smart and sexist/unfortunate at the same time. In the racism analogy--parents of black kids teach their kids different rules for dealing with police, which is smart for their protection, but also a manifestation of racism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It just reinforces the fact that childcare is women's work. And regardless of what an insurance company says, they're opening themselves up for an employment lawsuit, just as if a bank said that black employees can't be trusted to handle deposits into the vault "to protect them from false accusations."

It doesn't mean that childcare is women's work to say that a male teacher, in a preschool or elementary, middle, or high school should be very careful about being alone with a student. It's sensible. I've known several male teachers who have had their careers affected or destroyed by crazy parents or crazy students.

Would you say that black bank employees should be very careful about handling money alone, because false accusations of stealing can destroy their careers?

I think it's smart of male teachers and of preschools and daycares for them not to change diapers or take girls/children to the bathroom. I suppose we can agree to disagree, if you don't think that's smart.

Did you even read the question?

I did, and I think PP is implying that male teachers should behave exactly the same as female teachers, just as black employees should behave the same as white employees. Or perhaps PP is employing that black employees should never be alone with money to guard against false accusations, which would either be racist or smart, depending upon where you're coming from.

I don't have much personal experience with false accusations related to money handling, although I do know a couple white men who were caught and sentenced for embezzling. But I do have personal experience with teachers subject to false accusations by crazy female students, and I see why a male preschool teacher would be smart to not bring girls/children to the bathroom.

[Anonymous]

OP here. FWIW, I asked the male teacher this morning what he thought of this policy and he said its offensive, sexist, and insulting. He said he is also not allowed to apply sunscreen or have any kids sit on his lap. What?! The kids are three years old for goodness sake. Sometime they are upset and need a lap to sit on.

He noted that he has been a preschool teacher for over 20 years and this is the first place he has worked with such strict policies. And he and I both agreed that it was sending a terrible message to the kids

I do appreciate everyone's comments and now feel that I understand better why some schools might feel they need this policy, but I feel awful for this teacher and really do wonder if it violates any kind of workplace discrimination laws. That was a great hypo about the bank employees....

[Anonymous]

The lap rule is insane. I work at a school with a male K teacher and kids are constantly in his lap - he's an amazing teacher with a stellar reputation. The assistant in my daughter's preK class (other school) is male and kids are constantly in his lap at closing circle, as they are in the female lead teacher's lap. It never occurred to me to ask about male/female bathroom assistance - bathroom doors are kept open and all staff seems to pitch in.

[Anonymous]

I am a male teacher who works with children who are not yet toilet trained and have also worked with children in the process of toilet training and I have never had a parent take issue with this, nor have I ever worked for a center with that kind of policy. I would likely not accept a position at a center with this policy because, as a couple others have said, it sends the wrong message and children, even very young ones, do notice these things. I would also just feel very guilty, because me not doing my share of the diapering responsibilities means that my co-teachers would be picking up that slack and that would hardly be fair on them. I get why a center might make this policy, but I think to do so is only perpetuating the idea that any male who chooses to work with young children must have bad intentions. Every center should have their centers designed as well as policies in place to protect all workers from any sort of accusation. For instance, at my center, all staff members must be fully background checked and fingerprinted before handling or diapering children, classrooms have an open design so that anyone passing by can easily see what is happening inside, the bathrooms are attached to the classroom and are also open, and there must be at least two staff in the center when children are present.

I work with young children because I love to learn about early childhood education and child development, I love to be active, I find it to be a great creative outlet, I love having the ability to form meaningful connections and become a positive force in the lives of the children I care for, and I just find it incredibly fun. And just like any job, it comes with the less exciting stuff like diapering, cleaning and other housekeeping tasks, and paperwork and although these aren't my favorite tasks, I am still happy to do them because they are part of my job. I also happen to subscribe to many of the ideas in the RIE school of thought, which, among many other things, views "mundane" tasks like diaper changes as an opportunity for learning and relationship-building (Nice article about that here.). And while I have encountered exactly zero cases of harassment in my early childhood career (this is just my personal experience, I am not trying to claim that sexual abuse in early childhood settings absolutely never happens, I know it does, albeit very rarely and I would guess primarily at centers who have not been diligent in their hiring practices), I've certainly seen teachers who rip children away from an activity they were focused on with no explanation or warning and change their diaper without so much as a word to them, other than perhaps to reprimand them for not cooperating, or any explanation of what they were doing.

I believe it would do everyone better to give up on the scare tactics and trust centers to properly screen and hire employees, both male and female, who are trustworthy, appropriately experienced, and understand child development. Perhaps then more males would choose to pursue early childhood and children would be able to see that not only can females take on roles that have been traditionally male, but males can take on more traditionally female roles and be competent, caring caregivers.

[Anonymous]

New center director here - we have a fairly small staff and have ad a few male teachers over the years. No diapering or toilet responsibilities for the male teachers. In the teacher's own best interest and for insurance reasons.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We encourage/require the males at our school, just like at our church, to never be alone with a student of either sex. It's simply a policy necessary today for their own protection from false accusations.

But the point is not about students of the opposite sex. In fact, it's the opposite. It's fine for the female teachers to diaper a boy or take a boy to the bathroom, but the male teachers can't take a girl or boy to the bathroom. Personally, I think it would make a lot more sense for my DS to go to the bathroom with the male teacher, not the female one!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a male teacher who works with children who are not yet toilet trained and have also worked with children in the process of toilet training and I have never had a parent take issue with this, nor have I ever worked for a center with that kind of policy. I would likely not accept a position at a center with this policy because, as a couple others have said, it sends the wrong message and children, even very young ones, do notice these things. I would also just feel very guilty, because me not doing my share of the diapering responsibilities means that my co-teachers would be picking up that slack and that would hardly be fair on them. I get why a center might make this policy, but I think to do so is only perpetuating the idea that any male who chooses to work with young children must have bad intentions. Every center should have their centers designed as well as policies in place to protect all workers from any sort of accusation. For instance, at my center, all staff members must be fully background checked and fingerprinted before handling or diapering children, classrooms have an open design so that anyone passing by can easily see what is happening inside, the bathrooms are attached to the classroom and are also open, and there must be at least two staff in the center when children are present.

I work with young children because I love to learn about early childhood education and child development, I love to be active, I find it to be a great creative outlet, I love having the ability to form meaningful connections and become a positive force in the lives of the children I care for, and I just find it incredibly fun. And just like any job, it comes with the less exciting stuff like diapering, cleaning and other housekeeping tasks, and paperwork and although these aren't my favorite tasks, I am still happy to do them because they are part of my job. I also happen to subscribe to many of the ideas in the RIE school of thought, which, among many other things, views "mundane" tasks like diaper changes as an opportunity for learning and relationship-building (Nice article about that here.). And while I have encountered exactly zero cases of harassment in my early childhood career (this is just my personal experience, I am not trying to claim that sexual abuse in early childhood settings absolutely never happens, I know it does, albeit very rarely and I would guess primarily at centers who have not been diligent in their hiring practices), I've certainly seen teachers who rip children away from an activity they were focused on with no explanation or warning and change their diaper without so much as a word to them, other than perhaps to reprimand them for not cooperating, or any explanation of what they were doing.

I believe it would do everyone better to give up on the scare tactics and trust centers to properly screen and hire employees, both male and female, who are trustworthy, appropriately experienced, and understand child development. Perhaps then more males would choose to pursue early childhood and children would be able to see that not only can females take on roles that have been traditionally male, but males can take on more traditionally female roles and be competent, caring caregivers.

OMG. I wish you were my kid's teacher. Where do you work, if you don't mind me asking?

[Anonymous]

I did home daycare together with my husband. All families were fine with him and I sharing bathroom times (I ended up doing it the huge majority of the time because I'm just better at it though ) but we did have a Muslim family who asked for no male seeing their girls naked and we respected their religious reasons and assured them I would be the only one. It's sad males need this kind of protection these days. I understand though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am a male teacher who works with children who are not yet toilet trained and have also worked with children in the process of toilet training and I have never had a parent take issue with this, nor have I ever worked for a center with that kind of policy. I would likely not accept a position at a center with this policy because, as a couple others have said, it sends the wrong message and children, even very young ones, do notice these things. I would also just feel very guilty, because me not doing my share of the diapering responsibilities means that my co-teachers would be picking up that slack and that would hardly be fair on them. I get why a center might make this policy, but I think to do so is only perpetuating the idea that any male who chooses to work with young children must have bad intentions. Every center should have their centers designed as well as policies in place to protect all workers from any sort of accusation. For instance, at my center, all staff members must be fully background checked and fingerprinted before handling or diapering children, classrooms have an open design so that anyone passing by can easily see what is happening inside, the bathrooms are attached to the classroom and are also open, and there must be at least two staff in the center when children are present.

I work with young children because I love to learn about early childhood education and child development, I love to be active, I find it to be a great creative outlet, I love having the ability to form meaningful connections and become a positive force in the lives of the children I care for, and I just find it incredibly fun. And just like any job, it comes with the less exciting stuff like diapering, cleaning and other housekeeping tasks, and paperwork and although these aren't my favorite tasks, I am still happy to do them because they are part of my job. I also happen to subscribe to many of the ideas in the RIE school of thought, which, among many other things, views "mundane" tasks like diaper changes as an opportunity for learning and relationship-building (Nice article about that here.). And while I have encountered exactly zero cases of harassment in my early childhood career (this is just my personal experience, I am not trying to claim that sexual abuse in early childhood settings absolutely never happens, I know it does, albeit very rarely and I would guess primarily at centers who have not been diligent in their hiring practices), I've certainly seen teachers who rip children away from an activity they were focused on with no explanation or warning and change their diaper without so much as a word to them, other than perhaps to reprimand them for not cooperating, or any explanation of what they were doing.

I believe it would do everyone better to give up on the scare tactics and trust centers to properly screen and hire employees, both male and female, who are trustworthy, appropriately experienced, and understand child development. Perhaps then more males would choose to pursue early childhood and children would be able to see that not only can females take on roles that have been traditionally male, but males can take on more traditionally female roles and be competent, caring caregivers.

OMG. I wish you were my kid's teacher. Where do you work, if you don't mind me asking?

And I was thinking, oh my gosh, I want to hire you! I'm a center director... if you are ever interested in a job....