Autism and Overdiagnosis: Rampant, in psychologist's opinion

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

It's not an uncommon problem. My son was first DXd with mild to moderate MERLD. His other problems weren't apparent until his language improved. Then his perservative interests became REALLY apparent, as did his social skills deficits.

Nothing this guy is saying is new. The debate over the rate at which ASDs are diagnosed is more than a decade old. The argument over whether some kids with a DX of ASD should actually be dxd with MERLD is also not knew. Sowell's book "Late Talking Children" came out in 1998.

+1, this happened to us and even the developmental ped who initially diagnosed my child with ASD agrees it is a language disorder but insists on keeping the diagnosis as he is insistent that you can have autism based solely on history. So, it remains in my child's medical records and he is treated very poorly by some doctors and others who view all autism a specific way. (then it is funny to watch them be confused at the diagnosis)

Here's a hint: see a different developmental pediatrician. Pay out of pocket and stop bitching about this.

Here's a second hint: don't see doctors who treat your child "very poorly" regardless of whatever diagnosis he has.

I don't think these doctors are confused by the diagnosis; probably more annoyed at the parental approach.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

It's not an uncommon problem. My son was first DXd with mild to moderate MERLD. His other problems weren't apparent until his language improved. Then his perservative interests became REALLY apparent, as did his social skills deficits.

Nothing this guy is saying is new. The debate over the rate at which ASDs are diagnosed is more than a decade old. The argument over whether some kids with a DX of ASD should actually be dxd with MERLD is also not knew. Sowell's book "Late Talking Children" came out in 1998.

+1, this happened to us and even the developmental ped who initially diagnosed my child with ASD agrees it is a language disorder but insists on keeping the diagnosis as he is insistent that you can have autism based solely on history. So, it remains in my child's medical records and he is treated very poorly by some doctors and others who view all autism a specific way. (then it is funny to watch them be confused at the diagnosis)

Here's a hint: see a different developmental pediatrician. Pay out of pocket and stop bitching about this.

Here's a second hint: don't see doctors who treat your child "very poorly" regardless of whatever diagnosis he has.

I don't think these doctors are confused by the diagnosis; probably more annoyed at the parental approach.

No blame for the developmental ped who labels a child autistic when they actually have a language disorder? And it's the parent that has the bad attitude?

Geez.

[Anonymous]

He's out to lunch. FWIW, I don't care if my kid will never be a pilot or truckdriver. Many kids actually lose the diagnosis by adulthood anyway-which I know many would say means they don't have autism, but that's another post. It gets kids services and anyone in education can tell you the diagnosis does not set off red flags. There are plenty of kids with MERLD and ADHD who need a self-contained classroom to reach their potential and plenty of kids with autism thriving in the mainstream environment The label only tells them what general things you might see and it points teacher in the right direction for strategies. You learn a lot more when you meet the child, see the child in the classroom environment and at recess and you review all the assessments, etc.

I went to a talk by a prominent physician who also believed ASD was overdiagnosed. He went on about how even his own grandchildren were misdiagnosed and the guy was so indignant. He also had poor eye contact, social skills issues and a voice that reminds me of my son. Just sayin...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

It's not an uncommon problem. My son was first DXd with mild to moderate MERLD. His other problems weren't apparent until his language improved. Then his perservative interests became REALLY apparent, as did his social skills deficits.

Nothing this guy is saying is new. The debate over the rate at which ASDs are diagnosed is more than a decade old. The argument over whether some kids with a DX of ASD should actually be dxd with MERLD is also not knew. Sowell's book "Late Talking Children" came out in 1998.

+1, this happened to us and even the developmental ped who initially diagnosed my child with ASD agrees it is a language disorder but insists on keeping the diagnosis as he is insistent that you can have autism based solely on history. So, it remains in my child's medical records and he is treated very poorly by some doctors and others who view all autism a specific way. (then it is funny to watch them be confused at the diagnosis)

Here's a hint: see a different developmental pediatrician. Pay out of pocket and stop bitching about this.

Here's a second hint: don't see doctors who treat your child "very poorly" regardless of whatever diagnosis he has.

I don't think these doctors are confused by the diagnosis; probably more annoyed at the parental approach.

Thanks, but if you could give actual helpful advice, I'd appreciate it. With our insurance, he is our only option. We have paid privately and gotten 2nd opinion. He agrees there is no current signs of autism but it is now based off history. If we do not go to him, insurance will not pay for the services we need. Unfortunately, we are stuck. We cannot afford to lose our services.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: He's out to lunch. FWIW, I don't care if my kid will never be a pilot or truckdriver. Many kids actually lose the diagnosis by adulthood anyway-which I know many would say means they don't have autism, but that's another post. It gets kids services and anyone in education can tell you the diagnosis does not set off red flags. There are plenty of kids with MERLD and ADHD who need a self-contained classroom to reach their potential and plenty of kids with autism thriving in the mainstream environment The label only tells them what general things you might see and it points teacher in the right direction for strategies. You learn a lot more when you meet the child, see the child in the classroom environment and at recess and you review all the assessments, etc.

I went to a talk by a prominent physician who also believed ASD was overdiagnosed. He went on about how even his own grandchildren were misdiagnosed and the guy was so indignant. He also had poor eye contact, social skills issues and a voice that reminds me of my son. Just sayin...

It absolutely is over diagnosed and not all MERLD kids are ADHD. That is another common misdiagnosis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well this twit doesn't know what he's talking about diagnoses of "Mixed Receptive-Expressive Language Disorder, a Communication Disorder Not Otherwise Specified, and a Developmental Coordination Disorder, and an Adjustment Disorder" are not necessarily "milder" and can need as much intervention and have long term consequences as ASD. Much easier to get insurance coverage with an ASD diagnosis.

Also, he's obviously not keeping up with the latest literature b/c MERLD and NOS are out of the current DSM, so his book is already out of date.

I'm also sick to death of the autism stigma. A child who presents with many autistic traits when young and gets that diagnosis should get the help they need instead of parents who balk at the diagnosis.

In our MERLD Facebook groups, we have new parents coming in every almost day with the MERLD diagnosis. It's still widely being given out and it remains in the diagnosing codes for another year or two even if the DSM 5 put it all under Language Disorder. It's too bad they got rid of MERLD; it's such an exact descriptor for so many kids.

Also, I would say about 90-95 percent of the kids in our groups grow out of MERLD and learn coping skills to deal with the disorder. Many of our kids' receptive language comes in much later than typical kids, and once their receptive catches up, their autistic traits disappear. But when they are young, they have a lot of similar behavior tendencies and get misdiagnosed frequently.

They didn't really get rid of it. They combined MERLD with Expressive Language Disorder and gave it the name "language disorder."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

It's not an uncommon problem. My son was first DXd with mild to moderate MERLD. His other problems weren't apparent until his language improved. Then his perservative interests became REALLY apparent, as did his social skills deficits.

Nothing this guy is saying is new. The debate over the rate at which ASDs are diagnosed is more than a decade old. The argument over whether some kids with a DX of ASD should actually be dxd with MERLD is also not knew. Sowell's book "Late Talking Children" came out in 1998.

+1, this happened to us and even the developmental ped who initially diagnosed my child with ASD agrees it is a language disorder but insists on keeping the diagnosis as he is insistent that you can have autism based solely on history. So, it remains in my child's medical records and he is treated very poorly by some doctors and others who view all autism a specific way. (then it is funny to watch them be confused at the diagnosis)

Here's a hint: see a different developmental pediatrician. Pay out of pocket and stop bitching about this.

Here's a second hint: don't see doctors who treat your child "very poorly" regardless of whatever diagnosis he has.

I don't think these doctors are confused by the diagnosis; probably more annoyed at the parental approach.

No blame for the developmental ped who labels a child autistic when they actually have a language disorder? And it's the parent that has the bad attitude?

Geez.

Agree with PP that you should find another developmental pediatrician. Not sure why you would stay with a doctor with whom you have a fundamental disagreement on your child's diagnosis and treatment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

Being highly verbal is a feature of Aspergers (which no longer exists as they have lumped all kids regardless of their functioning together in a "spectrum.") A MERLD or language disorder child would be high functioning autism, not Aspergers. Many language kids are diagnosed autism, when it is not correct. The problem with misdiagnosis is ABA does not work well on MERLD or language disorders and kids need intensive speech therapy. Any behavior problems are generally associated with their frustration/lack of being able to understand or verbalize their needs and it generally gets better as the speech comes in.

Its very nice to see someone publish this and give it the attention it deserves. Then, maybe people will focus more on language disorders and kids will get the help they need vs. being given a generic diagnosis that does not represent their concerns.

Behavior analysis can be used by parents to encourage speech behaviors. We'd pretty much give my kid anything he wanted (within reason) if he asked for it. We did a lot of modeling of good speech behavior and asking him to imitate the model.

Example: "Do you want some juice?" (Nods) "OKay, you need to say 'May I have some juice, please?" Kid says "Juice, please." Give him the juice. Getting what he wants is the positive reinforcer for using speech. Rinse, lather, repeat 100 times a day.

Example 2: Kid wants something, doesn't use words and tantrums when he doesn't get it. (I'm not a psychic.) We intervene to stop the tantrum. As soon as the tantrum is over, we say "Okay, you wanted to watch 'Phineas and Ferb.' The way to ask for TV time is to say "May I please watch 'Phineas and Ferb?" Kid says "May I please watch 'Phineas and Ferb?" I say "Absolutely," and put his show on. There are no negative consequences for tantrums other than being removed from the living room and placed in time out (negative reinforcement) and there is immediate redirection to appropriate speech and rewards for using appropriate speech (positive reinforcement).

That's a behavior program. It works on speech just as well as it works on any other behavior. Combing those techniques with speech therapy worked really well for my kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

Being highly verbal is a feature of Aspergers (which no longer exists as they have lumped all kids regardless of their functioning together in a "spectrum.") A MERLD or language disorder child would be high functioning autism, not Aspergers. Many language kids are diagnosed autism, when it is not correct. The problem with misdiagnosis is ABA does not work well on MERLD or language disorders and kids need intensive speech therapy. Any behavior problems are generally associated with their frustration/lack of being able to understand or verbalize their needs and it generally gets better as the speech comes in.

Its very nice to see someone publish this and give it the attention it deserves. Then, maybe people will focus more on language disorders and kids will get the help they need vs. being given a generic diagnosis that does not represent their concerns.

Behavior analysis can be used by parents to encourage speech behaviors. We'd pretty much give my kid anything he wanted (within reason) if he asked for it. We did a lot of modeling of good speech behavior and asking him to imitate the model.

Example: "Do you want some juice?" (Nods) "OKay, you need to say 'May I have some juice, please?" Kid says "Juice, please." Give him the juice. Getting what he wants is the positive reinforcer for using speech. Rinse, lather, repeat 100 times a day.

Example 2: Kid wants something, doesn't use words and tantrums when he doesn't get it. (I'm not a psychic.) We intervene to stop the tantrum. As soon as the tantrum is over, we say "Okay, you wanted to watch 'Phineas and Ferb.' The way to ask for TV time is to say "May I please watch 'Phineas and Ferb?" Kid says "May I please watch 'Phineas and Ferb?" I say "Absolutely," and put his show on. There are no negative consequences for tantrums other than being removed from the living room and placed in time out (negative reinforcement) and there is immediate redirection to appropriate speech and rewards for using appropriate speech (positive reinforcement).

That's a behavior program. It works on speech just as well as it works on any other behavior. Combing those techniques with speech therapy worked really well for my kid.

This might be good for autism, but not MERLD. It's also not good for speech in general as it teaches scripted speech instead of naturalistic speech. ABA is all about compliance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

Being highly verbal is a feature of Aspergers (which no longer exists as they have lumped all kids regardless of their functioning together in a "spectrum.") A MERLD or language disorder child would be high functioning autism, not Aspergers. Many language kids are diagnosed autism, when it is not correct. The problem with misdiagnosis is ABA does not work well on MERLD or language disorders and kids need intensive speech therapy. Any behavior problems are generally associated with their frustration/lack of being able to understand or verbalize their needs and it generally gets better as the speech comes in.

Its very nice to see someone publish this and give it the attention it deserves. Then, maybe people will focus more on language disorders and kids will get the help they need vs. being given a generic diagnosis that does not represent their concerns.

Behavior analysis can be used by parents to encourage speech behaviors. We'd pretty much give my kid anything he wanted (within reason) if he asked for it. We did a lot of modeling of good speech behavior and asking him to imitate the model.

Example: "Do you want some juice?" (Nods) "OKay, you need to say 'May I have some juice, please?" Kid says "Juice, please." Give him the juice. Getting what he wants is the positive reinforcer for using speech. Rinse, lather, repeat 100 times a day.

Example 2: Kid wants something, doesn't use words and tantrums when he doesn't get it. (I'm not a psychic.) We intervene to stop the tantrum. As soon as the tantrum is over, we say "Okay, you wanted to watch 'Phineas and Ferb.' The way to ask for TV time is to say "May I please watch 'Phineas and Ferb?" Kid says "May I please watch 'Phineas and Ferb?" I say "Absolutely," and put his show on. There are no negative consequences for tantrums other than being removed from the living room and placed in time out (negative reinforcement) and there is immediate redirection to appropriate speech and rewards for using appropriate speech (positive reinforcement).

That's a behavior program. It works on speech just as well as it works on any other behavior. Combing those techniques with speech therapy worked really well for my kid.

This might be good for autism, but not MERLD. It's also not good for speech in general as it teaches scripted speech instead of naturalistic speech. ABA is all about compliance.

+1, a child with a receptive delay is not understanding the question. So, yes, repetition helps in terms of working on speech, but it is not appropriate to withhold food, etc. as a reward if the child isn't grasping what he is being asked to do (i.e. asking a child to say something). Those work well for ADHD, autism and other issues, but you are setting yourself up for disaster with a MERLD kid. This is why it is such an issue to lump in all the special needs together. Most people don't get MERLD. Behavioral programs cannot work without basic comprehension.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

It's not an uncommon problem. My son was first DXd with mild to moderate MERLD. His other problems weren't apparent until his language improved. Then his perservative interests became REALLY apparent, as did his social skills deficits.

Nothing this guy is saying is new. The debate over the rate at which ASDs are diagnosed is more than a decade old. The argument over whether some kids with a DX of ASD should actually be dxd with MERLD is also not knew. Sowell's book "Late Talking Children" came out in 1998.

+1, this happened to us and even the developmental ped who initially diagnosed my child with ASD agrees it is a language disorder but insists on keeping the diagnosis as he is insistent that you can have autism based solely on history. So, it remains in my child's medical records and he is treated very poorly by some doctors and others who view all autism a specific way. (then it is funny to watch them be confused at the diagnosis)

Here's a hint: see a different developmental pediatrician. Pay out of pocket and stop bitching about this.

Here's a second hint: don't see doctors who treat your child "very poorly" regardless of whatever diagnosis he has.

I don't think these doctors are confused by the diagnosis; probably more annoyed at the parental approach.

Thanks, but if you could give actual helpful advice, I'd appreciate it. With our insurance, he is our only option. We have paid privately and gotten 2nd opinion. He agrees there is no current signs of autism but it is now based off history. If we do not go to him, insurance will not pay for the services we need. Unfortunately, we are stuck. We cannot afford to lose our services.

So? I have a kid who I believe has a correct ASD diagnosis. Nothing is covered; we pay out of pocket for everything. You are getting stuff paid for. I would take that deal.

[Anonymous]

NP here. Please try to be a little more sympathetic, PP. This is the special needs board and we try to be nice. Many-- most -- people can't afford to pay out of pocket for the many services their kids may need. I know we need to look for the in-network providers.

S/he IS taking that deal.

[Anonymous]

Why did I just know OP would get slammed to death here?
This forum should be called "Special Needs Parents."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

It's not an uncommon problem. My son was first DXd with mild to moderate MERLD. His other problems weren't apparent until his language improved. Then his perservative interests became REALLY apparent, as did his social skills deficits.

Nothing this guy is saying is new. The debate over the rate at which ASDs are diagnosed is more than a decade old. The argument over whether some kids with a DX of ASD should actually be dxd with MERLD is also not knew. Sowell's book "Late Talking Children" came out in 1998.

+1, this happened to us and even the developmental ped who initially diagnosed my child with ASD agrees it is a language disorder but insists on keeping the diagnosis as he is insistent that you can have autism based solely on history. So, it remains in my child's medical records and he is treated very poorly by some doctors and others who view all autism a specific way. (then it is funny to watch them be confused at the diagnosis)

Here's a hint: see a different developmental pediatrician. Pay out of pocket and stop bitching about this.

Here's a second hint: don't see doctors who treat your child "very poorly" regardless of whatever diagnosis he has.

I don't think these doctors are confused by the diagnosis; probably more annoyed at the parental approach.

Thanks, but if you could give actual helpful advice, I'd appreciate it. With our insurance, he is our only option. We have paid privately and gotten 2nd opinion. He agrees there is no current signs of autism but it is now based off history. If we do not go to him, insurance will not pay for the services we need. Unfortunately, we are stuck. We cannot afford to lose our services.

So? I have a kid who I believe has a correct ASD diagnosis. Nothing is covered; we pay out of pocket for everything. You are getting stuff paid for. I would take that deal.

Then, get better insurance if you need ASD coverage. We have paid for everything out of pocket for over a year and still pay for many things private, such as school as the public isn't a good fit for our child. Don't think we are getting off that easy. If you have the correct diagnosis with ASD then why are you arguing with MERLD parents and ignoring their concerns for wrong diagnosis and how it impacts their children. That's like us saying, hey, a doc said your kid was XXX, he's not so deal. I'm sure you wouldn't appreciate that.

I do care about the fact that it follows a child. Military, if he desires to basics like getting a drivers license. I just renewed my license and a question was if I was ever diagnosed with autism.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How in the world would high-functioning Aspies be mistaken for MERLD? The kids I know with MERLD are virtually unable/completely unable to talk.

Most of the kids I know who people doubt are autistic, or the autistic kids I know who people go around saying "He just needs a good spanking" are highly verbal. Some may also have an adjustment disorder. Perhaps all do. Probably all their parents do to.

It's not an uncommon problem. My son was first DXd with mild to moderate MERLD. His other problems weren't apparent until his language improved. Then his perservative interests became REALLY apparent, as did his social skills deficits.

Nothing this guy is saying is new. The debate over the rate at which ASDs are diagnosed is more than a decade old. The argument over whether some kids with a DX of ASD should actually be dxd with MERLD is also not knew. Sowell's book "Late Talking Children" came out in 1998.

+1, this happened to us and even the developmental ped who initially diagnosed my child with ASD agrees it is a language disorder but insists on keeping the diagnosis as he is insistent that you can have autism based solely on history. So, it remains in my child's medical records and he is treated very poorly by some doctors and others who view all autism a specific way. (then it is funny to watch them be confused at the diagnosis)

Here's a hint: see a different developmental pediatrician. Pay out of pocket and stop bitching about this.

Here's a second hint: don't see doctors who treat your child "very poorly" regardless of whatever diagnosis he has.

I don't think these doctors are confused by the diagnosis; probably more annoyed at the parental approach.

Thanks, but if you could give actual helpful advice, I'd appreciate it. With our insurance, he is our only option. We have paid privately and gotten 2nd opinion. He agrees there is no current signs of autism but it is now based off history. If we do not go to him, insurance will not pay for the services we need. Unfortunately, we are stuck. We cannot afford to lose our services.

So? I have a kid who I believe has a correct ASD diagnosis. Nothing is covered; we pay out of pocket for everything. You are getting stuff paid for. I would take that deal.

Then, get better insurance if you need ASD coverage. We have paid for everything out of pocket for over a year and still pay for many things private, such as school as the public isn't a good fit for our child. Don't think we are getting off that easy. If you have the correct diagnosis with ASD then why are you arguing with MERLD parents and ignoring their concerns for wrong diagnosis and how it impacts their children. That's like us saying, hey, a doc said your kid was XXX, he's not so deal. I'm sure you wouldn't appreciate that.

I do care about the fact that it follows a child. Military, if he desires to basics like getting a drivers license. I just renewed my license and a question was if I was ever diagnosed with autism.

New poster here. PP, you sound very bitter and upset. I can appreciate that, but telling someone to "get better insurance" is simply not helpful. And if PP chooses to vent about her situation with her insurance and providers, that's okay and that's her right and it can upset her even if your situation is much worse. Even if you feel her situation is better than yours. I see vents all the time all over DCUM by people who have what I would consider "high class complaints" about ordinary children with blissful lives and tons of money. Their complaints may be petty in my book, but they are real to them. That's life.