Parents...let Harvard go.

[Anonymous]

All this is part of our modern child-centric society, which did not exist as such a generation ago.

It takes work to take a step back and gain a little perspective.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I think the Harvard angst is just a proxy for generalized parental anxiety disorder that afflicts Gen X parents.

Our parents fucked us up with all that latch key/free range parenting stuff, so we're determined to not make the same mistakes.


Disagree. Being a latchkey kid made kids more independent and responsible, mostly, not all. I think the obsession with Ivies is a reflection of people's obsession with materialism and status.


It is that, and a general sense that the U.S. is turning into an economic caste system, kind of like Brazil.

It's more like the Asian model. Kids cramming for exams, only the top have a chances at getting into the schools.

Haven't you heard? Ivies don't just look at scores, so even if you get perfect scores, that's no guarantee. Didn't you read that link? And for Asians, this is even more true - top scores alone won't get you in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
All this is part of our modern child-centric society, which did not exist as such a generation ago.

It takes work to take a step back and gain a little perspective.

A generation or two (depending on your definition of generation) ago the children were called "me" generation. Child centric has been around for more than one generation.

[Anonymous]

Harvard is a quirky place. So do one thing very well or be one label plus nail your GPA and SATs. But you need the hook, the strong transcript is usually a given.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It's a reflection of people's feeling that the pie is shrinking, and if your child doesn't have the right credentials, your child won't get a piece.

But, it's society's perception of how much of that pie is enough issue. It's not enough these days, especially in this area, to live in a modest home, drive a modest car, don't take flying vacations and not own a table/smart phone/2 or 3 flat screens. It's the "keeping up with Joneses" mentality that makes people feel this way.

Except that the pie actually is shrinking. A lot of people who used to be securely in the middle class (in their modest homes, with their modest cars) are holding on by the fingernails, or have fallen out of it altogether. Understandably, people don't want that insecurity for their children.

There is some of that. But, for the most part, parents who are obsessed with Ivies are about status/prestige, and making sure their kid will be financially secure. Don't get me wrong. I want my kids to be financially secure, too. But, I don't think going to an Ivy is the only way to secure it. You can go to a non Ivy school and still land a great job that pays well (or even go to a trade school and do well). You can also go to an Ivy, be up to your eyeballs in student loans, and not be able to afford a lifestyle in the 10/20 yrs that you thought you bought with that Ivy degree.

Ultimately, it's how hard you work - whether in Es/MS/HS to get into the Ivy, or in a non-Ivy college and in your job, you can still find financial success.

I hope to god you don't think going to an ivy insures financial success. I know many many ivy grads who don't make that much money. After that first job, you are kinda grouped all together unless you go to an investment bank. Hell, even then, they recruit at non-ivies. I think if you really need financial security for your kid have them go ivy for law or grad school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
I think the Harvard angst is just a proxy for generalized parental anxiety disorder that afflicts Gen X parents.

Our parents fucked us up with all that latch key/free range parenting stuff, so we're determined to not make the same mistakes.


Disagree. Being a latchkey kid made kids more independent and responsible, mostly, not all. I think the obsession with Ivies is a reflection of people's obsession with materialism and status.


It is that, and a general sense that the U.S. is turning into an economic caste system, kind of like Brazil.

It's more like the Asian model. Kids cramming for exams, only the top have a chances at getting into the schools.

That's dysfunctional.

[Anonymous]

Half of the world has moved here yet our ivies have not kept up with the population growth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Half of the world has moved here yet our ivies have not kept up with the population growth.

I'm not sure you understand the concept

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It's a reflection of people's feeling that the pie is shrinking, and if your child doesn't have the right credentials, your child won't get a piece.

But, it's society's perception of how much of that pie is enough issue. It's not enough these days, especially in this area, to live in a modest home, drive a modest car, don't take flying vacations and not own a table/smart phone/2 or 3 flat screens. It's the "keeping up with Joneses" mentality that makes people feel this way.

Except that the pie actually is shrinking. A lot of people who used to be securely in the middle class (in their modest homes, with their modest cars) are holding on by the fingernails, or have fallen out of it altogether. Understandably, people don't want that insecurity for their children.

This. What if it ends up not being enough to have a degree from a good state university? And by not enough, I mean not enough to get a job that pays more than a living wage, so that my kid has medical care and good housing and isn't living in insecurity? I honestly don't give two hoots about whether her career is prestigious or she drives an expensive car or lives in a big house. We live in an apartment and don't even own a car. But I want her to be financially secure. I want her not to live one illness away from disaster. I want her to be able to live in a safe neighborhood. I don't want her to graduate from school with crushing debt and no good job prospects. I'm not nearly as Ivy-obsessed as many people are, but I am concerned about college quality and its effect on whether she'll have good options later in life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It's a reflection of people's feeling that the pie is shrinking, and if your child doesn't have the right credentials, your child won't get a piece.

But, it's society's perception of how much of that pie is enough issue. It's not enough these days, especially in this area, to live in a modest home, drive a modest car, don't take flying vacations and not own a table/smart phone/2 or 3 flat screens. It's the "keeping up with Joneses" mentality that makes people feel this way.

Except that the pie actually is shrinking. A lot of people who used to be securely in the middle class (in their modest homes, with their modest cars) are holding on by the fingernails, or have fallen out of it altogether. Understandably, people don't want that insecurity for their children.

This. What if it ends up not being enough to have a degree from a good state university? And by not enough, I mean not enough to get a job that pays more than a living wage, so that my kid has medical care and good housing and isn't living in insecurity? I honestly don't give two hoots about whether her career is prestigious or she drives an expensive car or lives in a big house. We live in an apartment and don't even own a car. But I want her to be financially secure. I want her not to live one illness away from disaster. I want her to be able to live in a safe neighborhood. I don't want her to graduate from school with crushing debt and no good job prospects. I'm not nearly as Ivy-obsessed as many people are, but I am concerned about college quality and its effect on whether she'll have good options later in life.

You're being a bit paranoid. Do you really think that at some point only Ivy graduates will be able to afford a comfortable, secure lifestyle?

[Anonymous]

Harvard is not even on our radar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It's a reflection of people's feeling that the pie is shrinking, and if your child doesn't have the right credentials, your child won't get a piece.

But, it's society's perception of how much of that pie is enough issue. It's not enough these days, especially in this area, to live in a modest home, drive a modest car, don't take flying vacations and not own a table/smart phone/2 or 3 flat screens. It's the "keeping up with Joneses" mentality that makes people feel this way.

Except that the pie actually is shrinking. A lot of people who used to be securely in the middle class (in their modest homes, with their modest cars) are holding on by the fingernails, or have fallen out of it altogether. Understandably, people don't want that insecurity for their children.

This. What if it ends up not being enough to have a degree from a good state university? And by not enough, I mean not enough to get a job that pays more than a living wage, so that my kid has medical care and good housing and isn't living in insecurity? I honestly don't give two hoots about whether her career is prestigious or she drives an expensive car or lives in a big house. We live in an apartment and don't even own a car. But I want her to be financially secure. I want her not to live one illness away from disaster. I want her to be able to live in a safe neighborhood. I don't want her to graduate from school with crushing debt and no good job prospects. I'm not nearly as Ivy-obsessed as many people are, but I am concerned about college quality and its effect on whether she'll have good options later in life.

You're being a bit paranoid. Do you really think that at some point only Ivy graduates will be able to afford a comfortable, secure lifestyle?

Frankly I think the plumbers and electricians will rule the world. Not the Ivy graduates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It's a reflection of people's feeling that the pie is shrinking, and if your child doesn't have the right credentials, your child won't get a piece.

But, it's society's perception of how much of that pie is enough issue. It's not enough these days, especially in this area, to live in a modest home, drive a modest car, don't take flying vacations and not own a table/smart phone/2 or 3 flat screens. It's the "keeping up with Joneses" mentality that makes people feel this way.

Except that the pie actually is shrinking. A lot of people who used to be securely in the middle class (in their modest homes, with their modest cars) are holding on by the fingernails, or have fallen out of it altogether. Understandably, people don't want that insecurity for their children.

There is some of that. But, for the most part, parents who are obsessed with Ivies are about status/prestige, and making sure their kid will be financially secure. Don't get me wrong. I want my kids to be financially secure, too. But, I don't think going to an Ivy is the only way to secure it. You can go to a non Ivy school and still land a great job that pays well (or even go to a trade school and do well). You can also go to an Ivy, be up to your eyeballs in student loans, and not be able to afford a lifestyle in the 10/20 yrs that you thought you bought with that Ivy degree.

Ultimately, it's how hard you work - whether in Es/MS/HS to get into the Ivy, or in a non-Ivy college and in your job, you can still find financial success.

I hope to god you don't think going to an ivy insures financial success. I know many many ivy grads who don't make that much money. After that first job, you are kinda grouped all together unless you go to an investment bank. Hell, even then, they recruit at non-ivies. I think if you really need financial security for your kid have them go ivy for law or grad school.

Ivy Grad here. This is very true. I'm fairly close to a group of about a dozen of my classmates (all of us females). We were all good students in college and went on to grad school. None of us went on to rock the world. A few of us got on the law school/business school treadmill and did reasonably well for a while, and then decided at some point or other that we were sick of working so hard all the time at jobs that were on the whole really mundane, sick of office politics, and sick of having so little time with our families. A few others spent years getting PhDs and living on misery wages, to then realize that the opportunities at the end of it all still mostly offered misery wages and little job security (eg. an adjunct or associate professorship somewhere).
And we attended Ivies back when a top student living a relatively normal life still had a shot at getting in. I'm sure none of us would get in nowadays with the stuff these kids have to put themselves through to make it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It's a reflection of people's feeling that the pie is shrinking, and if your child doesn't have the right credentials, your child won't get a piece.

But, it's society's perception of how much of that pie is enough issue. It's not enough these days, especially in this area, to live in a modest home, drive a modest car, don't take flying vacations and not own a table/smart phone/2 or 3 flat screens. It's the "keeping up with Joneses" mentality that makes people feel this way.

Except that the pie actually is shrinking. A lot of people who used to be securely in the middle class (in their modest homes, with their modest cars) are holding on by the fingernails, or have fallen out of it altogether. Understandably, people don't want that insecurity for their children.

There is some of that. But, for the most part, parents who are obsessed with Ivies are about status/prestige, and making sure their kid will be financially secure. Don't get me wrong. I want my kids to be financially secure, too. But, I don't think going to an Ivy is the only way to secure it. You can go to a non Ivy school and still land a great job that pays well (or even go to a trade school and do well). You can also go to an Ivy, be up to your eyeballs in student loans, and not be able to afford a lifestyle in the 10/20 yrs that you thought you bought with that Ivy degree.

Ultimately, it's how hard you work - whether in Es/MS/HS to get into the Ivy, or in a non-Ivy college and in your job, you can still find financial success.

I hope to god you don't think going to an ivy insures financial success. I know many many ivy grads who don't make that much money. After that first job, you are kinda grouped all together unless you go to an investment bank. Hell, even then, they recruit at non-ivies. I think if you really need financial security for your kid have them go ivy for law or grad school.

Ivy Grad here. This is very true. I'm fairly close to a group of about a dozen of my classmates (all of us females). We were all good students in college and went on to grad school. None of us went on to rock the world. A few of us got on the law school/business school treadmill and did reasonably well for a while, and then decided at some point or other that we were sick of working so hard all the time at jobs that were on the whole really mundane, sick of office politics, and sick of having so little time with our families. A few others spent years getting PhDs and living on misery wages, to then realize that the opportunities at the end of it all still mostly offered misery wages and little job security (eg. an adjunct or associate professorship somewhere).
And we attended Ivies back when a top student living a relatively normal life still had a shot at getting in. I'm sure none of us would get in nowadays with the stuff these kids have to put themselves through to make it.

So, then, the only reason why parents still are obsessed with Harvard is the prestige, so they can show off and say, "I have a child who goes/went to Harvard." I'm Asian. They love this kind of shite.

[Anonymous]

I can't believe this thread hasn't taken off!!!