Parents...let Harvard go.

[Anonymous]

Let's rename it "Harvard sucks" and see if that helps!

[Anonymous]

http://theivycoach.com/2018-ivy-league-admissions-statistics/

Harvard applicants..

For high schools that rank its students, 3,400 of those who applied were ranked first in their classes.

It's better to get a well rounded education and encourage your child's passion.. That is where he/she will shine.. Not just test scores..

[Anonymous]

I went to a top Ivy, and if I had to do it again, I'd do the community-college-to-state-school thing. I'd have saved money to spend on grad school (which might really matter more to our own children). I think it's a great deal, and if you're a good enough student to have a chance at an Ivy, you will be able to shine. Of course, I'm open to people telling me that I can only say this because I don't realize how fortunate I was to have a high quality of education...and of course, I would not have brought the same pride upon my parents.

(I had a WONDERFUL education, my professors were top-notch, I was SO lucky, but I feel like it all was squandered on a young person who just wanted to get away from home for the first time...sometimes when you spend your whole life working to get into Harvard, by the time you are done with Harvard you're just too darn tired to keep it all up...I will not push my own kids so hard because of the number of my own college friends who have suffered from depression or mental health issues as adults.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the Harvard angst is just a proxy for generalized parental anxiety disorder that afflicts Gen X parents.

Our parents fucked us up with all that latch key/free range parenting stuff, so we're determined to not make the same mistakes.

Disagree. Being a latchkey kid made kids more independent and responsible, mostly, not all. I think the obsession with Ivies is a reflection of people's obsession with materialism and status.

It's a reflection of people's feeling that the pie is shrinking, and if your child doesn't have the right credentials, your child won't get a piece.

But, it's society's perception of how much of that pie is enough issue. It's not enough these days, especially in this area, to live in a modest home, drive a modest car, don't take flying vacations and not own a table/smart phone/2 or 3 flat screens. It's the "keeping up with Joneses" mentality that makes people feel this way.

Thing is, people either have the smart phone flat screens vacations etc, or they're struggling to pay the rent and it's only getting worse. So it's REALLY important to get out of the sinking middle class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

It's a reflection of people's feeling that the pie is shrinking, and if your child doesn't have the right credentials, your child won't get a piece.

But, it's society's perception of how much of that pie is enough issue. It's not enough these days, especially in this area, to live in a modest home, drive a modest car, don't take flying vacations and not own a table/smart phone/2 or 3 flat screens. It's the "keeping up with Joneses" mentality that makes people feel this way.

Except that the pie actually is shrinking. A lot of people who used to be securely in the middle class (in their modest homes, with their modest cars) are holding on by the fingernails, or have fallen out of it altogether. Understandably, people don't want that insecurity for their children.

There is some of that. But, for the most part, parents who are obsessed with Ivies are about status/prestige, and making sure their kid will be financially secure. Don't get me wrong. I want my kids to be financially secure, too. But, I don't think going to an Ivy is the only way to secure it. You can go to a non Ivy school and still land a great job that pays well (or even go to a trade school and do well). You can also go to an Ivy, be up to your eyeballs in student loans, and not be able to afford a lifestyle in the 10/20 yrs that you thought you bought with that Ivy degree.

Ultimately, it's how hard you work - whether in Es/MS/HS to get into the Ivy, or in a non-Ivy college and in your job, you can still find financial success.

I hope to god you don't think going to an ivy insures financial success. I know many many ivy grads who don't make that much money. After that first job, you are kinda grouped all together unless you go to an investment bank. Hell, even then, they recruit at non-ivies. I think if you really need financial security for your kid have them go ivy for law or grad school.

Ivy Grad here. This is very true. I'm fairly close to a group of about a dozen of my classmates (all of us females). We were all good students in college and went on to grad school. None of us went on to rock the world. A few of us got on the law school/business school treadmill and did reasonably well for a while, and then decided at some point or other that we were sick of working so hard all the time at jobs that were on the whole really mundane, sick of office politics, and sick of having so little time with our families. A few others spent years getting PhDs and living on misery wages, to then realize that the opportunities at the end of it all still mostly offered misery wages and little job security (eg. an adjunct or associate professorship somewhere).
And we attended Ivies back when a top student living a relatively normal life still had a shot at getting in. I'm sure none of us would get in nowadays with the stuff these kids have to put themselves through to make it.

A second Ivy grad here. Ditto to all of this. I could have written the post. My closer classmates from our Ivy league school include two medical doctors (one in a very low-paying specialty), one corporate executive (highly paid), one yoga instructor, two high school teachers, one government public health employee, one SAHM, one hospital administrator, two PhD researchers, and one non-profit consultant. 2 out of 12 just listed have true 'financial success' in the traditional terms. Those two were focused on that financial success from a young age and achieved it. Others strove for financial success initially and then decided it wasn't worth it. Others of us observed financial success from a young age in our parents or friends' parents and decided it wasn't worth it from the get-go. All of us have a minimal level of financial security but it is not always easy.

An additional comment: the Ivies are pressure cookers. Every single one of my friends was shocked when they arrived at our Ivy League college and found out that they were pretty stupid compared to everyone there. You put together a group of uber-competitive, highly achieving young people and they will create a mega uber-competitive atmosphere. I'm not sure I want my son to have to go through that.

[Anonymous]

Thank you to the previous Ivy posters for being honest.
It would be nice to see parents around here calm down.

[Anonymous]

I just don't buy the top 20 university thing. The vast majority of Americans never obtain even a bachelors degree. In a country of 330 million people not every management/leadership position can be occupied by elite university graduates.

I'm absolutely in favor of giving ones children every advantage in life including an Ivy League education if is easily attainable for that child. However, I'm categorically opposed to placing undue pressure on a child throughout their lives for the sole purpose of attaining acceptance to an elite university.

Individuals succeed in life to the degree in which their talents and ambitions take them. Success and long-term happiness are not determined by the under-graduate universities individuals attend.

[Anonymous]

The Ivy undergrad alums I know are largely successful, but not necessarily any more successful than my friends who studied at state schools or non-Ivy privates. Now the people who went to business school (or law school) at an Ivy - those folks are generally making bank, especially in finance or consulting. Certain firms will still look at that as a screening device.

I'd be psyched if my kid got into an Ivy, but then there would definitely be pressure to pay for it, because I'd want her to be able to go. Ultimately, I just want her to have a good college experience and be employable when she comes out 4 years later.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just don't buy the top 20 university thing. The vast majority of Americans never obtain even a bachelors degree. In a country of 330 million people not every management/leadership position can be occupied by elite university graduates.

I'm absolutely in favor of giving ones children every advantage in life including an Ivy League education if is easily attainable for that child. However, I'm categorically opposed to placing undue pressure on a child throughout their lives for the sole purpose of attaining acceptance to an elite university.

Individuals succeed in life to the degree in which their talents and ambitions take them. Success and long-term happiness are not determined by the under-graduate universities individuals attend.

+1,000
Completely agree.