Having kids makes you mean and nasty...

[Anonymous]

I am glad that this discussion is coming up. I just started reading/posting on this forum and I've been amazed at some of the comments, particularly the "f--- you, go away" variety.

One thing that has really struck me that I think might contribute to the nastiness is how devoted many people are to certain practices and choices. I get a sense that there are parents on here who fervently believe that (a) there is only one right way to do a certain thing; and (b) whatever the thing is-- breastfeeding, staying at home, choosing a stroller--- will be monumentally important to their child's wellbeing. With the stakes so high, a parent might feel outraged that anyone else would think otherwise.

I'm of the opinion that there are many answers to any question, and that children are more flexible than their parents. As someone who babysat infants and children of all ages since I was 12, and who has known many wonderful caregivers with less education and access to books/internet/professional advice than anyone on this board, I take a lot of this "urgent" advice with a grain of salt, and I like to think that it makes me more open to different viewpoints. Love, affection, safety, comfortable clothes, nutritious food, and understanding go a very long way in my book; the rest is icing.

Many of us are professionals or people trained for intense and competitive professions. We are used to being excellent, and in particular we're used to getting the edge in school or the workplace by applying our intellectual abilities and education to complex situations. Those are useful tools for any task. But I think that when that mind set pervades the parenting sphere too much, you get an unrealistic sense that your choices about mundane things are "bet the company" decisions. And when you feel that way, it's easier to become doctrinaire and aggressive.

I also believe that in any group, even when the a$$holes are the most visible, the majority of people are decent, kind, and appalled with the jerks.

[Anonymous]

Nice post, 11:38. I think you've captured a lot of the dynamics on here very well.

[zumbamama]

could be anything. kids. unsupportive spouse. unsupportive family. sleep deprivation. work stress. a million things can bring out the worst in us!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No, anonymity makes unhappy people nasty.

Excellent point.

[Anonymous]

If you live in DC and lurk on these boards, you are likely a well-meaning parent who understands that to raise a successful child in the hyper-competitive overachieiving DC area, you better sharpen those elbows, exercise those vocal chords, and work on those hip checks. It's an awful, awful state of affairs. But I, for one, am not ready to move to Idaho or Alaska or thereabouts. We're not really mean and nasty. We are just trying to be the best momma bears for our baby bears.

[Anonymous]

Some days all I can think is if a superior alien race came to the Earth and all they had to judge humans by was the nasty dialog on DCUM, what would they think of us? I really hope all these forums that allow such nasty exchange to go on aren't representative of human kind as it stands.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you live in DC and lurk on these boards, you are likely a well-meaning parent who understands that to raise a successful child in the hyper-competitive overachieiving DC area, you better sharpen those elbows, exercise those vocal chords, and work on those hip checks. It's an awful, awful state of affairs. But I, for one, am not ready to move to Idaho or Alaska or thereabouts. We're not really mean and nasty. We are just trying to be the best momma bears for our baby bears.

You can't be serious?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you live in DC and lurk on these boards, you are likely a well-meaning parent who understands that to raise a successful child in the hyper-competitive overachieiving DC area, you better sharpen those elbows, exercise those vocal chords, and work on those hip checks. It's an awful, awful state of affairs. But I, for one, am not ready to move to Idaho or Alaska or thereabouts. We're not really mean and nasty. We are just trying to be the best momma bears for our baby bears.

I live in DC and visit these boards, and I do not understand why I would need to do those things. What exactly do our kids have to "compete" for? Are kids supposed to be competing, or are their parents? Is there a plausible relationship between the things people get so energized about on here and getting accepted to Cornell? Take the full-time=caregiver vs. working parent conversation that we all know and cherish. Is it really necessary to become a zealous advocate for one choice in order to help a child on her way to the college boards and the boardroom? And are any of the things some people find worth competing for actually relevant to a child's happiness?

I hope that this didn't sound nasty in itself. But I can't figure out what on Earth this nastiness accomplishes in fosterig successful children (never mind that definitions of success can vary wildly).

[Anonymous]

I must say the meanest thing I've seen here so far was said to a single Mom who was looking for a little support at the end of a long week....basically she was told to suck it up and its her own fault for bearing children! Yikes! Sometimes I wonder if people do it just to get a rise....not so much they hate single Moms for example, but they are just frustrated or bored in their own lives. Still....at the end of the day, that's mean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you live in DC and lurk on these boards, you are likely a well-meaning parent who understands that to raise a successful child in the hyper-competitive overachieiving DC area, you better sharpen those elbows, exercise those vocal chords, and work on those hip checks. It's an awful, awful state of affairs. But I, for one, am not ready to move to Idaho or Alaska or thereabouts. We're not really mean and nasty. We are just trying to be the best momma bears for our baby bears.

I guess it's no coincidence that the parents with the nasty voices and the sharpest elbows are the same ones with the pushy, ill mannered kid that throws sand in your child's face at the park. Being aggressive and nasty might make that clerk pay attention to you at Starbucks. It might even get your child into St Albans. But I'd rather have the child that adds positivity to his universe and contributes to society in a good way. Give me a child that grows up to take care or the sick or homeless over some self important Havard attorney any day. I guess it's all about your values.

[Anonymous]

That's IT ! I am moving to DC metro mommies, thanks for the tip pp.

This forum sucks! Really, the negativity is awful.l Some women here are SO judgemental!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you live in DC and lurk on these boards, you are likely a well-meaning parent who understands that to raise a successful child in the hyper-competitive overachieiving DC area, you better sharpen those elbows, exercise those vocal chords, and work on those hip checks. It's an awful, awful state of affairs. But I, for one, am not ready to move to Idaho or Alaska or thereabouts. We're not really mean and nasty. We are just trying to be the best momma bears for our baby bears.

This is disgusting. Taking down other children will do nothing to help your own child, except maybe get him some sympathy for his awful mother.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you live in DC and lurk on these boards, you are likely a well-meaning parent who understands that to raise a successful child in the hyper-competitive overachieiving DC area, you better sharpen those elbows, exercise those vocal chords, and work on those hip checks. It's an awful, awful state of affairs. But I, for one, am not ready to move to Idaho or Alaska or thereabouts. We're not really mean and nasty. We are just trying to be the best momma bears for our baby bears.

I guess it's no coincidence that the parents with the nasty voices and the sharpest elbows are the same ones with the pushy, ill mannered kid that throws sand in your child's face at the park. Being aggressive and nasty might make that clerk pay attention to you at Starbucks. It might even get your child into St Albans. But I'd rather have the child that adds positivity to his universe and contributes to society in a good way. Give me a child that grows up to take care or the sick or homeless over some self important Havard attorney any day. I guess it's all about your values.

This is a good point. If my daughter becomes a person that the clerk at Starbucks is happy to see because she smiles, greets, them, and treats them well, then I will have succeeded. And so will my daughter. If she wakes up every morning happy to do the job or attend the school where she is, and feels lucky in her choice of mate, city, vocation, and life, I will have succeeded. If she understands how lucky we are and chooses to help someone else attain greater success, we'll have succeeded. We compete only against an ideal that is ever-present: the happy, decent person of character.

I would just add that some people-- myself included-- go to Harvard (or any other snooty-tooty school) in order to help people in the best way we can. I've spent most of my career fighting for civil rights, and I'm quite sure, given DC's robust NGO/non-profit/government/faith-based sector, there are hundreds of women on this board who are applying their fancy parchment to promote the greater good. Like others, I find it ridiculous when people cite their degrees as an "i'm an authority so shut up" move. But you can do the fancy degree without being a total jerk. Or even competitive.

[Anonymous]

OP, it's funny to me that you posted this this week. Earlier in the week I posted something on Urban Baby, the NYC message board, asking (what I thought was) an innocent question about where to find a particular gift for my sister in NYC and in the only repsonse I received I was called a moron! I will never post there again...

[Anonymous]

Count me in as another poster who feels no need to have "sharpened elbows" in order to make my children "successful." I have a feeling that poster and I have different ideas about what constitutes "success," anyway. Like many others, my family values kindness and compassion above merely getting ahead.