Do the Truly Great Ever Raise Kids?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:9:27 - sorry to say that you are NOT raising your kids. I worked full time with my first, she went to daycare. I stayed home with my second and cannot believe I ever convinced myself that daycare = raising your child.

Don't start throwing flames at me. I totally understand the need for two incomes, especially in the DC area. But don't let that convince you or excuse you from the fact that truly raising your kids does not include putting them in daycare.

9:27 here - I don't need to justify anything to you, but I am very confident that I am, in fact, raising my kid, even though he goes to daycare. I wonder if you think people are done raising their kids by the time they are 5 and are in school for most of the day? What about when your kids are in middle/high school and stay in school until 5pm for sports practice, play rehearsals, etc. Are those parents done raising their kids at that point? Do you have to homeschool your child to truly raise your kid?

[Anonymous]

I'm an only parent. I'll take "not raising my kid" over living in the projects and on welfare.

[Anonymous]

Jeez, you guys, I meant primary caretaker, defined as physically present and responsible for your kids most of the time. DD is in school 6 hours a day but I am it the rest of the time -- after school, cooking, cleaning, doctor visits, night wakings for the youngest, all day long when they are sick. I am talking about whoever really does the heavy lifting, whether he or she works outside the home or not or has a nanny or not. A single parent like Toni Morrison was is automatically the one raising her kid.

[Anonymous]

Ooh, actually Toni Morrison is a great example of a Truly Great who is also a full time mom. Wasn't Maya Angelou also in that situation? That would be another example.

[Anonymous]

Diana Ross raised five children and had an awesome career. Yes, and to the previous poster who thinks that a mom is not raising children if they utilize the services of a nanny or daycare, Shame on You!

[Anonymous]

Meryl Streep but then again I heard her speak several years ago and she said she would have done more theater and perhaps more films if she hadn't had a family; theater took the biggest hit, it's such a grueling schedule.

I'm thinking of writers I admire ... Alice Munro has a daughter.

[Anonymous]

I like a PP's observation that with women, it tends to be more of a slow, behind-the-scenes rise (paraphrasing, apologies if I'm misinterpreting). And with men and woman who aren't the primary caretakers of kids, they have the opportunity for a meteoric rise. When you have more flexibility with your time, you have more immediate opportunities for success.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think it's possible but not usually at the same time. Look at Madeleine Albright. She was a SAHM while doing lots of volunteer work, then going to grad school. Her professional life didn't really kick off until her children were older.

So I think it's possible but not easy and also requires some luck. In addition to her own intelligence, initiative, fortitude, and ambition, she was also lucky enough to have a husband with enough income that she could do undertake meaningful volunteer activities and go to school. (I'm assuming she hired some domestic help. Much tougher if you're the sole person responsible for all housework, etc.) Although I do remember reading in her memoir about how she got up at 4 or 5 in the morning everyday to write her dissertation.

There are other examples, especially of women, who achieve a lot but not all at once. I think it takes both extraordinary effort, natural talent, and luck. I think historically, most high achieving women didn't have children or perhaps just had one.

Good question, OP. FYI, I love reading biographies/memoirs of high achieving women. So interesting and inspiring. Albright's is one of the best I've read, full of lots of funny moments, too. Other good ones are by Jill Ker Conway (Road from Coorain about her childhood and True North about her adult life in the U.S.), Margaret Mead, Madeleine Kunin (first female gov of Vermont). I've been meaning to read Katherine Graham's.

So funny -- these are the exact two things I was about to share. Madeline Albright as an example and the reminder that often big career sucess and deep family involvement are sequential (in either order or both) rather than concurrent. It's very hard to do it all at the same time, but careers are long and if you look around there are some inspiring examples of women who made a second professional surge once the children were older.

I can think of quite a few women in DC and NYC who doubled-down on their professional efforts and truly came into their own in their fifties and early sixties, once their children wer older. The examples I know happen to be very successful women law firm partners, and while their success is certainly not akin to being Secretary of State (!!!), I still find them insspiring because I know how hard they worked to make it happen and how much they appreciate/cherish it. I think it's sweeter for them in a way than it is for their male peers or even their younger women counterparts. Maybe it's the fact that it's the result of a concerted choice or maybe just that they are free from the guilt and the competing commitments that stress out so many younger women who are trying to juggle a stellar career with true family involvement.

[Anonymous]

I can think of quite a few in my own life. The head of my department who I worked for in grad school, who taught a few classes I took as well as being my thesis advisor and boss, has accomplished an incredible amount in terms of teaching accolades, success in academia, and bringing in $$$ for the school through grant funding, as well as publications and research. She is a HUGE role model for me - she has raised three kids and they have turned out great, they are all three in college now and we've kept in touch.

How she did it - super close commute, academics tend to have more flexibility in scheduling, and a supportive husband.

I also work with a few women who have grown children and they achieved a lot during their career.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Meryl Streep but then again I heard her speak several years ago and she said she would have done more theater and perhaps more films if she hadn't had a family; theater took the biggest hit, it's such a grueling schedule.

I'm thinking of writers I admire ... Alice Munro has a daughter.

This reminded me of Jennifer Weiner, who's written Good in Bed and a bunch of other obscenely popular fiction books over the years. Sure she's not Toni Morrison or Alice Munro. But she has two young daughters and a working husband, and she is very candid on her blog and in interviews about what she does to juggle a demanding career with being an involved parent. Jodi Picoult is similar -- successful, prolific and a parent a few times over.

On one level, they're completely different than the "rest of us" in that being a writer is more flexible than many (most!) other professions. But then again, the publishing industry is VERY demanding and commercial writers answer to many bosses these days, not just themselves. Either way, I find their perspectives very interesting, and I was thrilled to see them both weigh in recently on the renewed conversation about gender inequality in the literary world and the divide between commerical and literary fiction. I just kept thinking, "Good for them!" -- they're moms, successful authors, and important public voices in their profession. Go girls!!

[Anonymous]

ME!!

[Anonymous]

Funny, this topic was covered in WSJ a few days ago.

Of the current female CEO's of Fortune 500 companies, 11 of the 12 have children. So it almost seems to be a prerequisite.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704763904575549842261018652.html

I'm sure that some of them have supportive husbands, and at some point in their careers some of them probably had nannies. I don't see a problem with either.

[Anonymous]

Both Diana Gabaldon (bestselling writer of Outlander series) and Elizabeth Kostova (fastest selling bestselling writer of The Historian) held jobs and were primary caregivers for their children while they were writing their first books. Not sure their "iconic" but they certainly are successful and were active in the quotidian aspects of childrearing.

[Anonymous]

Not on the supreme court: (Talking about the female justices here, not the male ones.)

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/23/magazine/23FOB-wwln-t.html

[Anonymous]

Interesting, OP. I have always wondered about someone like Aung Sun Suu Kyi who spends her life under house arrest, separated from her children for what seems like a remote cause. I couldn't do it -- even if it meant I Bono wrote songs about me.

But to answer your question, no, I don't think the truly "great" stick around for the everyday drudgery of childcare.