Remarried -- how best to structure my will/trust for my adult children.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My FIL never remarried because of things like this. Put it all in a trust and be very clear who gets what. I know adults who lost entire inheritances (and at least one was old money) to step parents and step siblings. My own FIL made sure no spouse could never touch the inherence and it goes straight to grandkids. A second person (non-spouse) has to sign off on anything trust related. I am comfortable financially and I am glad my children are taken care of. I would advise you to do something similar.

This happened to me. Everything left to my stepfather and stepbrother. And yes, it was “old money”. Money that have been passed down several generations, so it’s not like my mother earned it or something. It should have remained in our family. I spoke with an attorney who had done a previous trust for my mother, a trust that left everything to me, and he suggested that my mother was not in her right mind when the new trust — the one benefiting my step brother— was drawn up. In fact, she had discussed with that attorney that she didn’t want anything at all going to her husband or any member of his family, because he had not treated her very well (which was true). Ultimately, though, it was not something we were going to be able to prove in court. One of the things that annoys me the most is that my stepfather had plenty of his own money, and left a couple million of his own to his son. They had plenty of money. They didn’t need my mother’s. But this happened anyway.

It's too bad the old money trust wasn't set up so your mother couldn't access the principal. Most of them are. When my parents were recently working on their estate plan, I specifically asked them to set up their trust so that it goes from me to my kids. A current or future spouse can't access it. And I am not the trustee.

How does one do this? I asked the lawyer setting ours up and he was unclear or said husband and I need to do separate trusts to ensure that if one of us remarries someday (if one of us dies) that separate trusts are the only way to make sure assets go to kids? I find this hard to believe.

Lawyer said most people separate trusts but that seems complicated if we own house and other property together? Anyone else happily married and did separate trusts? That is what lawyer is recommending for us. We are married and have kids in college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Talk to your lawyer. You have to leave her at least ~ 33% of your estate, or she can contest it and claim a spousal elective share, unless this was waived explicitly in the prenup.

This is inaccurate. She can claim 1/3, but he does not have to leave her 1/3. My dad didn't leave his second wife anything, and she didn't claim her elective share by the six-month deadline. As a result, she only received the $10,000 mandatory spousal allowance. Had she claimed the elective share, she would've received it by law, but it is not automatic.

Are assets placed in the trust in danger being added to spousal elective share? I don't think so if its irrevocable trust. I wouldn't add OP's wife to the title of the house that's in trust. It might be not possible to implement in general, and allows her to claim more of the house equity than she's eligible for. I would sell the house and buy a smaller place on joint 50/50 downpayment, if OP's wife insists on being on a title of a home where she lives. As an example, my exH never added me to the title of the house that he purchased before marriage, even after 19 years of marriage and despite us having 2 kids. I don't see why OP would want to create any conflict of interests between his spouse and kids over the house

Does she have her own children? My trust attorney recommended to omit older generations relatives in my trust altogether and just pay my mom, my future potential spouse "allowance" from the trust so they can rent an apartment, get some money on healthcare etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why not help your kids be set for life by the time they are 40. No need to leave them anything after that.

Depending on what his assets are, it may be advisable for him to keep them to earn interest to live on while he is alive to make sure there is enough to last his lifetime and there is nothing wrong with that. It’s his money

[Anonymous]

Do NOT add that woman to the title of the house you want to leave to your children. What you want to leave her is called a life estate which is the right to reside at a house un disturbed for the duration of her lifetime. No matter what she is smiling and telling you to your face now, assume all that will change and she will not even acknowledge your children after your death. Plan accordingly

[Anonymous]

My parents divorced when I was a teenager and my mom remarried shortly after. Her new husband was also divorced and had four children. They set up separate trusts. Whichever spouse passed first, the other spouse was only entitled to the income that the deceased spouse's trust generated. The surviving spouse could not touch the principal unless all of their assets were depleted. When the surviving spouse died, then the heirs would inherit their parent's trust. The idea was to protect the surviving spouse - make sure they had enough money to live on while also protecting the two separate families.

My mom and her husband were very intentional. They also stipulated that any furniture/personal items that they brought into the marriage would stay in the appropriate family. But if an item was needed to "maintain the home" it had to stay in the house until the surviving spouse either died or agreed to let the item go.

I don't remember how they setup the house. But once it was sold, the proceeds were split equally among the six children (me, my brother and my four step siblings.).

My mom died first and my step-father died four years later. Everything went very smoothly and my brother and I inherited my mom's trust when her husband died - just as they had planned. My mom had $200K in her trust and at the time of her death, my step-father's had $1M. I have no idea how much was left in his once he died.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why not help your kids be set for life by the time they are 40. No need to leave them anything after that.

Under this logic, op need not set aside anything for his new wife. After all, she is 50 and under your rationale should have had her financial life in order since she was 40. Why should she get a windfall just for marrying op at the tail end of his earning years? She’s had a whole lifetime of earnings to plan for herself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do NOT add that woman to the title of the house you want to leave to your children. What you want to leave her is called a life estate which is the right to reside at a house un disturbed for the duration of her lifetime. No matter what she is smiling and telling you to your face now, assume all that will change and she will not even acknowledge your children after your death. Plan accordingly

Both of these things happened to my Dad. The life estate, which was a good idea, and my stepmother’s lawyer quickly declined so we could sell it. And her lawyer declined it because she had stopped speaking to us merely months after he died for reasons that she never explained.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why not help your kids be set for life by the time they are 40. No need to leave them anything after that.

Under this logic, op need not set aside anything for his new wife. After all, she is 50 and under your rationale should have had her financial life in order since she was 40. Why should she get a windfall just for marrying op at the tail end of his earning years? She’s had a whole lifetime of earnings to plan for herself.

I generally agree with this - let her live in the house until she dies if she wants but otherwise, why leave her anything? But then again if I were OP I would not remarry. My SIL and her partner did not (re)marry. Their home is jointly owned by two trusts, one in each of their names.

[Anonymous]

I would consider not getting married. You can still make arrangements to provide for her in the event of your death.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do NOT add that woman to the title of the house you want to leave to your children. What you want to leave her is called a life estate which is the right to reside at a house un disturbed for the duration of her lifetime. No matter what she is smiling and telling you to your face now, assume all that will change and she will not even acknowledge your children after your death. Plan accordingly

OP said she contributes to the mortgage, so this will get messy.

OP is an idiot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do NOT add that woman to the title of the house you want to leave to your children. What you want to leave her is called a life estate which is the right to reside at a house un disturbed for the duration of her lifetime. No matter what she is smiling and telling you to your face now, assume all that will change and she will not even acknowledge your children after your death. Plan accordingly

Both of these things happened to my Dad. The life estate, which was a good idea, and my stepmother’s lawyer quickly declined so we could sell it. And her lawyer declined it because she had stopped speaking to us merely months after he died for reasons that she never explained.

What did the lawyer decline? To follow the living trust rules ? Or declined creating the living trust

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Do NOT add that woman to the title of the house you want to leave to your children. What you want to leave her is called a life estate which is the right to reside at a house un disturbed for the duration of her lifetime. No matter what she is smiling and telling you to your face now, assume all that will change and she will not even acknowledge your children after your death. Plan accordingly

OP said she contributes to the mortgage, so this will get messy.

OP is an idiot.

Maybe her employment income is higher than OPs. In a situation when he brings more assets but she brings more income, she certainly would want to be compensated for co-financing their lifestyle

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would consider not getting married. You can still make arrangements to provide for her in the event of your death.

He already married so most likely attorney would advise him that they need a postnup where she waives her elective share. Before even creating the trust.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Do NOT add that woman to the title of the house you want to leave to your children. What you want to leave her is called a life estate which is the right to reside at a house un disturbed for the duration of her lifetime. No matter what she is smiling and telling you to your face now, assume all that will change and she will not even acknowledge your children after your death. Plan accordingly

This is the answer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My parents divorced when I was a teenager and my mom remarried shortly after. Her new husband was also divorced and had four children. They set up separate trusts. Whichever spouse passed first, the other spouse was only entitled to the income that the deceased spouse's trust generated. The surviving spouse could not touch the principal unless all of their assets were depleted. When the surviving spouse died, then the heirs would inherit their parent's trust. The idea was to protect the surviving spouse - make sure they had enough money to live on while also protecting the two separate families.

My mom and her husband were very intentional. They also stipulated that any furniture/personal items that they brought into the marriage would stay in the appropriate family. But if an item was needed to "maintain the home" it had to stay in the house until the surviving spouse either died or agreed to let the item go.

I don't remember how they setup the house. But once it was sold, the proceeds were split equally among the six children (me, my brother and my four step siblings.).

My mom died first and my step-father died four years later. Everything went very smoothly and my brother and I inherited my mom's trust when her husband died - just as they had planned. My mom had $200K in her trust and at the time of her death, my step-father's had $1M. I have no idea how much was left in his once he died.

This situation can end up with the kids getting very little. My stepfather way outlived my mother and by the time he died the there was little in there thanks to horrible investment decisions.