Can someone explain RIF process?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:then, the possibility is the division will be left with a few older folks, losing younger high performers. is that what the managers want? is government efficiency achieved?

We got plenty of young low performers and older high performers. Age alone is not the only factor. And that’s how the process works. If you want older workers out, the Fork offer is as good as it gets.

It’s not though. The older workers get more severance with a RIF due to more time in service and being older.

Out of 8 taking the fork in my office, all 8 would have survived if we had a RIF instead because they are older workers with many years of experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The process is outlined below but they’ll do whatever they want.

https://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/workforce-restructuring/reductions-in-force/

Until they get enjoined…again.

[Anonymous]

I have my doubts that they’ll do an actual RIF, when Elon can just fire who he wants like they’ve been doing already. Real RIFs are too bureaucratic and slow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:then, the possibility is the division will be left with a few older folks, losing younger high performers. is that what the managers want? is government efficiency achieved?

We got plenty of young low performers and older high performers. Age alone is not the only factor. And that’s how the process works. If you want older workers out, the Fork offer is as good as it gets.

It’s not though. The older workers get more severance with a RIF due to more time in service and being older.

Out of 8 taking the fork in my office, all 8 would have survived if we had a RIF instead because they are older workers with many years of experience.

Ok and...are you one of Mao's band of college students that want to eat (literally, yes they did) the older and experienced?

But anyway...would even these 8 survive if a RIF eliminated an entire dept? Can't an agency just say RIF a particular area and say all the people in it are gone, given that agency didn't designate a number of people to retain?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:then, the possibility is the division will be left with a few older folks, losing younger high performers. is that what the managers want? is government efficiency achieved?

We got plenty of young low performers and older high performers. Age alone is not the only factor. And that’s how the process works. If you want older workers out, the Fork offer is as good as it gets.

It’s not though. The older workers get more severance with a RIF due to more time in service and being older.

Out of 8 taking the fork in my office, all 8 would have survived if we had a RIF instead because they are older workers with many years of experience.

Ok and...are you one of Mao's band of college students that want to eat (literally, yes they did) the older and experienced?

But anyway...would even these 8 survive if a RIF eliminated an entire dept? Can't an agency just say RIF a particular area and say all the people in it are gone, given that agency didn't designate a number of people to retain?

I don’t know what you mean. I am one of 8. I survived one RIF many years ago. Your bottom question was answered up thread- they have bumping rights so they will bump out younger workers providing folks have the same job series.

[Anonymous]

What happens if you are Schedule F’d? No RIF rules and no severance? All the more reason to take the fork deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:then, the possibility is the division will be left with a few older folks, losing younger high performers. is that what the managers want? is government efficiency achieved?

We got plenty of young low performers and older high performers. Age alone is not the only factor. And that’s how the process works. If you want older workers out, the Fork offer is as good as it gets.

It’s not though. The older workers get more severance with a RIF due to more time in service and being older.

Out of 8 taking the fork in my office, all 8 would have survived if we had a RIF instead because they are older workers with many years of experience.

Ok and...are you one of Mao's band of college students that want to eat (literally, yes they did) the older and experienced?

But anyway...would even these 8 survive if a RIF eliminated an entire dept? Can't an agency just say RIF a particular area and say all the people in it are gone, given that agency didn't designate a number of people to retain?

Yes, agencies can do an abolishment of position for a group of employees and avoid using the RIF process. But then they need to offer VERA and/or VSIP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have my doubts that they’ll do an actual RIF, when Elon can just fire who he wants like they’ve been doing already. Real RIFs are too bureaucratic and slow.

They need courts or congress to stop it and enforce it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:then, the possibility is the division will be left with a few older folks, losing younger high performers. is that what the managers want? is government efficiency achieved?

We got plenty of young low performers and older high performers. Age alone is not the only factor. And that’s how the process works. If you want older workers out, the Fork offer is as good as it gets.

It’s not though. The older workers get more severance with a RIF due to more time in service and being older.

Out of 8 taking the fork in my office, all 8 would have survived if we had a RIF instead because they are older workers with many years of experience.

Ok and...are you one of Mao's band of college students that want to eat (literally, yes they did) the older and experienced?

But anyway...would even these 8 survive if a RIF eliminated an entire dept? Can't an agency just say RIF a particular area and say all the people in it are gone, given that agency didn't designate a number of people to retain?

I don’t know what you mean. I am one of 8. I survived one RIF many years ago. Your bottom question was answered up thread- they have bumping rights so they will bump out younger workers providing folks have the same job series.

Yes...my point was, what if the agency gets rid of the entire job series?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What happens if you are Schedule F’d? No RIF rules and no severance? All the more reason to take the fork deal.

Schedule F is a totally different animal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:then, the possibility is the division will be left with a few older folks, losing younger high performers. is that what the managers want? is government efficiency achieved?

We got plenty of young low performers and older high performers. Age alone is not the only factor. And that’s how the process works. If you want older workers out, the Fork offer is as good as it gets.

It’s not though. The older workers get more severance with a RIF due to more time in service and being older.

Out of 8 taking the fork in my office, all 8 would have survived if we had a RIF instead because they are older workers with many years of experience.

Ok and...are you one of Mao's band of college students that want to eat (literally, yes they did) the older and experienced?

But anyway...would even these 8 survive if a RIF eliminated an entire dept? Can't an agency just say RIF a particular area and say all the people in it are gone, given that agency didn't designate a number of people to retain?

I don’t know what you mean. I am one of 8. I survived one RIF many years ago. Your bottom question was answered up thread- they have bumping rights so they will bump out younger workers providing folks have the same job series.

Yes...my point was, what if the agency gets rid of the entire job series?

Then they are RIF unless they have prior experience in other job series. Like I said with all the bumping and retreating rights, it gets confusing and complicated. Good luck

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What happens if you are Schedule F’d? No RIF rules and no severance? All the more reason to take the fork deal.

Schedule F is a totally different animal.

They’ve asked people to identify staff who would be in this category. So then, they can convert people to that and then it’s much easier to get rid of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The RIP regs will give more retention credits for those who've been in federal service longer, so seniority almost always wins in general

I thought veteran status weighs heavily. Will a veteran with a year or two as a fed civilian still be likely to get RIFed?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:then, the possibility is the division will be left with a few older folks, losing younger high performers. is that what the managers want? is government efficiency achieved?

We got plenty of young low performers and older high performers. Age alone is not the only factor. And that’s how the process works. If you want older workers out, the Fork offer is as good as it gets.

It’s not though. The older workers get more severance with a RIF due to more time in service and being older.

Out of 8 taking the fork in my office, all 8 would have survived if we had a RIF instead because they are older workers with many years of experience.

Ok and...are you one of Mao's band of college students that want to eat (literally, yes they did) the older and experienced?

But anyway...would even these 8 survive if a RIF eliminated an entire dept? Can't an agency just say RIF a particular area and say all the people in it are gone, given that agency didn't designate a number of people to retain?

I don’t know what you mean. I am one of 8. I survived one RIF many years ago. Your bottom question was answered up thread- they have bumping rights so they will bump out younger workers providing folks have the same job series.

Yes...my point was, what if the agency gets rid of the entire job series?

Then they are RIF unless they have prior experience in other job series. Like I said with all the bumping and retreating rights, it gets confusing and complicated. Good luck

But with a hiring freeze, where are they supposed to go?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What happens if you are Schedule F’d? No RIF rules and no severance? All the more reason to take the fork deal.

Schedule F is a totally different animal.

They’ve asked people to identify staff who would be in this category. So then, they can convert people to that and then it’s much easier to get rid of them.

But Schedule F has already been enjoined (?) (is that the right word?). They've already been sued on that.