Biden Admin to Remove Statue of William Penn from Philadelphia Park

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Penn

Wasn’t Penn a Quaker who lived peacefully with native Americans? And quakers were antislavery. In fact, Pennsylvania was a haven for freed slaves thanks to the Underground Railroad essentially run by quakers.

I'm sure of you talked to the native Americans who experienced white settlers encroaching on their land, they would have a different story. For instance, they might say that they were forced to live peacefully next to their captors and oppressors.:. But sure let's Romanticize history.

Eh, I’m not romanticizing. Colonizers colonize. That’s been the case since the dawn of time. But Penn wasn’t rounding up native Americans and marching them west or killing them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Penn

Wasn’t Penn a Quaker who lived peacefully with native Americans? And quakers were antislavery. In fact, Pennsylvania was a haven for freed slaves thanks to the Underground Railroad essentially run by quakers.

Penn owned and traded slaves.

Not many. And he gave them up when he returned to England—freeing some, selling others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Penn

Wasn’t Penn a Quaker who lived peacefully with native Americans? And quakers were antislavery. In fact, Pennsylvania was a haven for freed slaves thanks to the Underground Railroad essentially run by quakers.

I'm sure of you talked to the native Americans who experienced white settlers encroaching on their land, they would have a different story. For instance, they might say that they were forced to live peacefully next to their captors and oppressors.:. But sure let's Romanticize history.

Eh, I’m not romanticizing. Colonizers colonize. That’s been the case since the dawn of time. But Penn wasn’t rounding up native Americans and marching them west or killing them.

NP. Colonizers colonize. How astute you are. He was also an enslaver but I guess that is okay for you. Enslavers enslave, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nobody should be surprised when Americans no longer take pride in the western democracy and values we established thanks to the continued denigration of our history. Was it a perfect history? No. But it resulted in a democracy built on the rule of law and eventual equality unmatched around the globe…and yet here we are promoting a narrative that we should only feel shame.

Instead of tearing down a statue and erasing history, why not add a component recognizing the Native American past?

We are heading down the wrong path when we rewrite history and tarnish our accomplishments with shame.

Stop dividing; start reunifying.

We are Americans…regardless of when your ancestors arrived and regardless of where you came from. Unify under our american values and celebrate the diversity of all who came here for a better life.

Lastly: stop pretending that America is a miserable failure. It isn’t.

There can be no unity without repentance. I'm glad the Biden admin is taking this steps. Western civilization was built on disease, death & destruction of others. There is no pride in that kind of society. There has been no other society as destructive and unkind to humans as Western civilization. So if the goal is to move ahead, we need to leave the past behind. Start over.

Start over based on what foundation?

Democracy, equality, western values, rule of law, etc.?

These are American values developed and perfected in the USA over time. Many, many countries still lag faaaaar behind.

Do you suggest we rebuild based on the current hyper-divisive climate where we are meant to feel nothing but shame rather than acknowledge our imperfect past and tremendous evolution?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Penn

Wasn’t Penn a Quaker who lived peacefully with native Americans? And quakers were antislavery. In fact, Pennsylvania was a haven for freed slaves thanks to the Underground Railroad essentially run by quakers.

Penn owned and traded slaves.

Not many. And he gave them up when he returned to England—freeing some, selling others.

He didn’t enslave many human beings. He didn’t engage in trading that many slaves. The lengths you people will go to in order to protect evil.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nobody should be surprised when Americans no longer take pride in the western democracy and values we established thanks to the continued denigration of our history. Was it a perfect history? No. But it resulted in a democracy built on the rule of law and eventual equality unmatched around the globe…and yet here we are promoting a narrative that we should only feel shame.

Instead of tearing down a statue and erasing history, why not add a component recognizing the Native American past?

We are heading down the wrong path when we rewrite history and tarnish our accomplishments with shame.

Stop dividing; start reunifying.

We are Americans…regardless of when your ancestors arrived and regardless of where you came from. Unify under our american values and celebrate the diversity of all who came here for a better life.

Lastly: stop pretending that America is a miserable failure. It isn’t.

There can be no unity without repentance. I'm glad the Biden admin is taking this steps. Western civilization was built on disease, death & destruction of others. There is no pride in that kind of society. There has been no other society as destructive and unkind to humans as Western civilization. So if the goal is to move ahead, we need to leave the past behind. Start over.

Eastern civilization was … peacefully built?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Penn

Wasn’t Penn a Quaker who lived peacefully with native Americans? And quakers were antislavery. In fact, Pennsylvania was a haven for freed slaves thanks to the Underground Railroad essentially run by quakers.

Penn owned and traded slaves.

Not many. And he gave them up when he returned to England—freeing some, selling others.

He didn’t enslave many human beings. He didn’t engage in trading that many slaves. The lengths you people will go to in order to protect evil.

Not trying to protect evil.

Just trying to put it in context.

The guy wasn’t as evil as modern day judgment would suggest.

Generally speaking, Pennsylvania wasn’t heavily involved in slavery and the state was among the first to outlaw slavery thanks to abolition efforts led by the quakers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nobody should be surprised when Americans no longer take pride in the western democracy and values we established thanks to the continued denigration of our history. Was it a perfect history? No. But it resulted in a democracy built on the rule of law and eventual equality unmatched around the globe…and yet here we are promoting a narrative that we should only feel shame.

Instead of tearing down a statue and erasing history, why not add a component recognizing the Native American past?

We are heading down the wrong path when we rewrite history and tarnish our accomplishments with shame.

Stop dividing; start reunifying.

We are Americans…regardless of when your ancestors arrived and regardless of where you came from. Unify under our american values and celebrate the diversity of all who came here for a better life.

Lastly: stop pretending that America is a miserable failure. It isn’t.

There can be no unity without repentance. I'm glad the Biden admin is taking this steps. Western civilization was built on disease, death & destruction of others. There is no pride in that kind of society. There has been no other society as destructive and unkind to humans as Western civilization. So if the goal is to move ahead, we need to leave the past behind. Start over.

Eastern civilization was … peacefully built?

+ 1

I think we can all rattle off a list of non-western countries where women still don’t enjoy equality, gays are thrown off buildings, etc. Forget their colonizing history…just look at how they behave today in 2024…how they treat “others” largely defined by ethnicity and/or religion.

It’s preposterous to assert our imperfect history and subsequent evolution are somehow worse than how other countries behave today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Penn

Wasn’t Penn a Quaker who lived peacefully with native Americans? And quakers were antislavery. In fact, Pennsylvania was a haven for freed slaves thanks to the Underground Railroad essentially run by quakers.

Penn owned and traded slaves.

Not many. And he gave them up when he returned to England—freeing some, selling others.

He didn’t enslave many human beings. He didn’t engage in trading that many slaves. The lengths you people will go to in order to protect evil.

Not trying to protect evil.

Just trying to put it in context.

The guy wasn’t as evil as modern day judgment would suggest.

Generally speaking, Pennsylvania wasn’t heavily involved in slavery and the state was among the first to outlaw slavery thanks to abolition efforts led by the quakers.

Well obviously William Penn as an enslaver wasn’t involved in abolition led by people who were his better. Maybe they deserve commemoration rather than an enslaver like William Penn?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Penn

Wasn’t Penn a Quaker who lived peacefully with native Americans? And quakers were antislavery. In fact, Pennsylvania was a haven for freed slaves thanks to the Underground Railroad essentially run by quakers.

Penn owned and traded slaves.

Doesn't matter, selling a person is unethical and inhumane. Natural laws says that no person can own another person or be in charge of his destiny.
#downwithPennstatute

Not many. And he gave them up when he returned to England—freeing some, selling others.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Have you been to that "park"? (It's not really a park, it's a plaza between buildings) It's been in need of work by the National Park Service for years, and the addition of exhibits describing the importance of the location to both the native people and the Europeans who settled there is a good thing.

And about the statue - it's a small copy of the 37-foot statue of Penn which is on top of Philadelphia's City Hall building. So calm yourself, no one is being "canceled."

https://www.associationforpublicart.org/artwork/william-penn/

Thanks for the context. Sounds like OP is trying to mislead people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nobody should be surprised when Americans no longer take pride in the western democracy and values we established thanks to the continued denigration of our history. Was it a perfect history? No. But it resulted in a democracy built on the rule of law and eventual equality unmatched around the globe…and yet here we are promoting a narrative that we should only feel shame.

Instead of tearing down a statue and erasing history, why not add a component recognizing the Native American past?

We are heading down the wrong path when we rewrite history and tarnish our accomplishments with shame.

Stop dividing; start reunifying.

We are Americans…regardless of when your ancestors arrived and regardless of where you came from. Unify under our american values and celebrate the diversity of all who came here for a better life.

Lastly: stop pretending that America is a miserable failure. It isn’t.

There can be no unity without repentance. I'm glad the Biden admin is taking this steps. Western civilization was built on disease, death & destruction of others. There is no pride in that kind of society. There has been no other society as destructive and unkind to humans as Western civilization. So if the goal is to move ahead, we need to leave the past behind. Start over.

Eastern civilization was … peacefully built?

+ 1

I think we can all rattle off a list of non-western countries where women still don’t enjoy equality, gays are thrown off buildings, etc. Forget their colonizing history…just look at how they behave today in 2024…how they treat “others” largely defined by ethnicity and/or religion.

It’s preposterous to assert our imperfect history and subsequent evolution are somehow worse than how other countries behave today.

This is the issue with revisionist and excusers of Western society. Instead of accepting responsibility, they say see ... others did it too! Negating that we are only discussing Western society & values and currentness here in America. We don't live in Eastern society, their values should not be ours nor should we point out what the other side of the world did or did not do. Hold yourselves accountable, let's stop pointing out what is going on elsewhere because that is irrelevant.
Tear it all down and start over.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Nobody should be surprised when Americans no longer take pride in the western democracy and values we established thanks to the continued denigration of our history. Was it a perfect history? No. But it resulted in a democracy built on the rule of law and eventual equality unmatched around the globe…and yet here we are promoting a narrative that we should only feel shame.

Instead of tearing down a statue and erasing history, why not add a component recognizing the Native American past?

We are heading down the wrong path when we rewrite history and tarnish our accomplishments with shame.

Stop dividing; start reunifying.

We are Americans…regardless of when your ancestors arrived and regardless of where you came from. Unify under our american values and celebrate the diversity of all who came here for a better life.

Lastly: stop pretending that America is a miserable failure. It isn’t.

There can be no unity without repentance. I'm glad the Biden admin is taking this steps. Western civilization was built on disease, death & destruction of others. There is no pride in that kind of society. There has been no other society as destructive and unkind to humans as Western civilization. So if the goal is to move ahead, we need to leave the past behind. Start over.

Start over based on what foundation?

Democracy, equality, western values, rule of law, etc.?

These are American values developed and perfected in the USA over time. Many, many countries still lag faaaaar behind.

Do you suggest we rebuild based on the current hyper-divisive climate where we are meant to feel nothing but shame rather than acknowledge our imperfect past and tremendous evolution?

It’s divisive in-part because people like you continue to elevate colonizers and enslavers like Penn (and a myriad of others) that allow you to maintain a privileged place in society.

[Anonymous]

The statue hysteria never gets old.

No one is “cancelling” Penn. There’s a rather large school named in his honor, the state is named in his honor, as others have pointed out the statue in question is a replica of another one…calm down. Penn is fine.

Adding monuments to people who never had the opportunity in the past is only a good thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Penn

Wasn’t Penn a Quaker who lived peacefully with native Americans? And quakers were antislavery. In fact, Pennsylvania was a haven for freed slaves thanks to the Underground Railroad essentially run by quakers.

Penn owned and traded slaves.

Not many. And he gave them up when he returned to England—freeing some, selling others.

He didn’t enslave many human beings. He didn’t engage in trading that many slaves. The lengths you people will go to in order to protect evil.

Not trying to protect evil.

Just trying to put it in context.

The guy wasn’t as evil as modern day judgment would suggest.

Generally speaking, Pennsylvania wasn’t heavily involved in slavery and the state was among the first to outlaw slavery thanks to abolition efforts led by the quakers.

Well obviously William Penn as an enslaver wasn’t involved in abolition led by people who were his better. Maybe they deserve commemoration rather than an enslaver like William Penn?

How do you feel about the Constitution?

Because Penn’s leadership in Philly and the state essentially inspired the US Constitution.

He was a big deal, and his overall legacy—while imperfect—matter.

I’m guessing you are big on freedom of assembly? You can thank Penn for that.