Is anyone’s sleepaway camp requiring the bivalent booster?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

Too bad they are dumb if they think a shot more than a month out is helping with prevention of outbreaks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes our camp in Maine requires it.

My sisters kids go to a camp in a very red state. They are not.
She is not sending them this year.

She must not understand science.

+1

OP there is no way I'd send a child to this camp.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

Scientific journals are now saying those getting the bivalent booster ARE MORE LIKELY to get infected with Covid so they are picking the worse solution.

Don't believe me? Google it yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kids’ day camp in DC is requiring it. It’s absolutely absurd (and no they didn’t post the requirement until after I forked over a non-refundable deposit).

what camp? are they requiring records? I would just lie at this point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

Scientific journals are now saying those getting the bivalent booster ARE MORE LIKELY to get infected with Covid so they are picking the worse solution.

Don't believe me? Google it yourself.

Cites?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kids’ day camp in DC is requiring it. It’s absolutely absurd (and no they didn’t post the requirement until after I forked over a non-refundable deposit).

what camp? are they requiring records? I would just lie at this point.

It’s at a private k-8. You have to upload your vax card. No idea if they look at them all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

This. Even if the booster is less effective by the time the kid goes to camp, requiring boosters means that the kids at the camp will overall be more protected against covid generally. Also, people who are fully vaccinated are more likely to take reasonable precautions against covid generally and therefore are less likely to send their kids to camp with covid. Finally, the policy has the effect of weeding out anti-vax covid-deniers who are more likely to bring covid into the camp.

If anyone is inclined to respond that some source now says none of this thinking is correct, include a link to the studies supporting your position or I’m not going to bother responding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

This. Even if the booster is less effective by the time the kid goes to camp, requiring boosters means that the kids at the camp will overall be more protected against covid generally. Also, people who are fully vaccinated are more likely to take reasonable precautions against covid generally and therefore are less likely to send their kids to camp with covid. Finally, the policy has the effect of weeding out anti-vax covid-deniers who are more likely to bring covid into the camp.

If anyone is inclined to respond that some source now says none of this thinking is correct, include a link to the studies supporting your position or I’m not going to bother responding.

https://yournews.com/2023/02/10/2507676/cleveland-clinic-confirms-that-immune-system-function-decreases-with-each/

From the Cleveland Clinic, no less.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

This. Even if the booster is less effective by the time the kid goes to camp, requiring boosters means that the kids at the camp will overall be more protected against covid generally. Also, people who are fully vaccinated are more likely to take reasonable precautions against covid generally and therefore are less likely to send their kids to camp with covid. Finally, the policy has the effect of weeding out anti-vax covid-deniers who are more likely to bring covid into the camp.

If anyone is inclined to respond that some source now says none of this thinking is correct, include a link to the studies supporting your position or I’m not going to bother responding.

These are all completely speculative benefits. Given the real risks of the vaccine to adolescent boys, it’s a terrible policy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

This. Even if the booster is less effective by the time the kid goes to camp, requiring boosters means that the kids at the camp will overall be more protected against covid generally. Also, people who are fully vaccinated are more likely to take reasonable precautions against covid generally and therefore are less likely to send their kids to camp with covid. Finally, the policy has the effect of weeding out anti-vax covid-deniers who are more likely to bring covid into the camp.

If anyone is inclined to respond that some source now says none of this thinking is correct, include a link to the studies supporting your position or I’m not going to bother responding.

You can achieve all of those goals with requiring pre camp testing rather than vaccines with limited risk / benefit data.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

This. Even if the booster is less effective by the time the kid goes to camp, requiring boosters means that the kids at the camp will overall be more protected against covid generally. Also, people who are fully vaccinated are more likely to take reasonable precautions against covid generally and therefore are less likely to send their kids to camp with covid. Finally, the policy has the effect of weeding out anti-vax covid-deniers who are more likely to bring covid into the camp.

If anyone is inclined to respond that some source now says none of this thinking is correct, include a link to the studies supporting your position or I’m not going to bother responding.

OP back again. I would have written almost this exact same thing 18 months ago. I was all for Covid vaccine mandates for awhile. The problem is that the data no longer supports these arguments. Within a couple months, the vaccine provides virtually no protection from infection or transmission, so it's not protecting communities, except from lots of hospitalizations in vulnerable people. It does continue to provide great protection from severe disease--but very few kids are at risk of severe disease, and data also suggests that for them, the protection from a vaccine dose or infection--and especially from both--lasts a long time. Healthy kids don't need boosters every 6 months (maybe not even every year) to protect them from being hospitalized. And we know now that stretching out vaccine doses means that each dose gives you better protection.

I don't have time right now to dig up links but there are tons out there if you google, both scientific papers and news article citing research to support all of this.

Ridiculing people who aren't giving their kids the bivalent vaccine right now is silly. It's a huge proportion of the population, over 90%, even in blue states, and many many of those families gave their kids the primary series. These aren't all "anti-vax covid-denier" people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

This. Even if the booster is less effective by the time the kid goes to camp, requiring boosters means that the kids at the camp will overall be more protected against covid generally. Also, people who are fully vaccinated are more likely to take reasonable precautions against covid generally and therefore are less likely to send their kids to camp with covid. Finally, the policy has the effect of weeding out anti-vax covid-deniers who are more likely to bring covid into the camp.

If anyone is inclined to respond that some source now says none of this thinking is correct, include a link to the studies supporting your position or I’m not going to bother responding.

https://yournews.com/2023/02/10/2507676/cleveland-clinic-confirms-that-immune-system-function-decreases-with-each/

From the Cleveland Clinic, no less.

If you can cite to the Cleveland Clinic study directly, I will take a look. But links to rando sites purporting to summarize studies they may not properly represent do not qualify.

[Anonymous]

Myocarditis is an awful thing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP back. Thank you to those who responded. For those whose camps are requiring it, have they said why? Unless everyone gets boosted a month before camp, it is not going to do anything to protect the camp community from transmission (and even a month before the effect is limited).

They don't have to.

Don't send your kid.

It's a weed out, use your brain. These are businesses. They need kids to attend. They want to minimize the outbreaks. Parents who care about whether their kid gets and spreads covid will attend the others will go else where.

Is this a perfect solution of course not and they know that.

If you don't like it go to another camp.

This. Even if the booster is less effective by the time the kid goes to camp, requiring boosters means that the kids at the camp will overall be more protected against covid generally. Also, people who are fully vaccinated are more likely to take reasonable precautions against covid generally and therefore are less likely to send their kids to camp with covid. Finally, the policy has the effect of weeding out anti-vax covid-deniers who are more likely to bring covid into the camp.

If anyone is inclined to respond that some source now says none of this thinking is correct, include a link to the studies supporting your position or I’m not going to bother responding.

OP back again. I would have written almost this exact same thing 18 months ago. I was all for Covid vaccine mandates for awhile. The problem is that the data no longer supports these arguments. Within a couple months, the vaccine provides virtually no protection from infection or transmission, so it's not protecting communities, except from lots of hospitalizations in vulnerable people. It does continue to provide great protection from severe disease--but very few kids are at risk of severe disease, and data also suggests that for them, the protection from a vaccine dose or infection--and especially from both--lasts a long time. Healthy kids don't need boosters every 6 months (maybe not even every year) to protect them from being hospitalized. And we know now that stretching out vaccine doses means that each dose gives you better protection.

I don't have time right now to dig up links but there are tons out there if you google, both scientific papers and news article citing research to support all of this.

Ridiculing people who aren't giving their kids the bivalent vaccine right now is silly. It's a huge proportion of the population, over 90%, even in blue states, and many many of those families gave their kids the primary series. These aren't all "anti-vax covid-denier" people.

I am also not an anti-vax covid denier - I am so pro-vaxx I think you have risk / benefit data so you don’t lose everyone’s faith in all vaccines. I don’t think informed consent and pro-vaxx are mutually exclusive.

Anyway - I tried to file for a religious exemption that was denied but maybe you could get one.

[Anonymous]

I don’t see the big deal. If you don’t want to fulfill the requirement, pick another camp.