What's wrong with me that I seem to have problem working with female supervisor
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Anonymous
I think the last bit may have a lot to do with it. In my many years at a supervisory level, I have seen the same patterns play out over and over again. No matter how accommodating/forgiving male supervisors are, subordinates still tend to jump to and get their best work done on deadline for them. But as soon as a female supervisor is at all accommodating, the same subordinates will take that inch and run a mile. My own personal experience has been that I have to be pretty strict with subordinates until we have a well-established working relationship, and then I can relax with them. |
Anonymous
OP, I'm also a married woman in my 40s who is not super attractive and I have had a similar experience. However, I would not say I never click with female bosses. I've had a few over the years who I get along really well with. Right now I work for two women and I get along well with one and not well with the other one. I've also had good relationships with all the male bosses I've had. But I've had several female bosses over the years with whom I did not get along. Very similar to what you are describing -- just hard to build a friendly rapport, they seem antagonistic at times, I don't feel like they are rooting for me to do well even on projects they assigned to me where, in theory, my success should reflect well on them. Also, all of my micromanaging bosses have been women. I should also note that I've worked for way more women than men. Like probably 70% female bosses, 30% male. So it's not that weird to me that all my "bad" bosses have been women. I've thought a lot about it because I'm uncomfortable with the idea that I have issues with female leadership -- I think of me as a champion of professional women and I've gravitated towards organizations with a lot of women in leadership. I do have to admit, though, that I think there is something gendered going on here. I do think that SOME female bosses struggle with a certain kind of female subordinate. Specifically, I think some women do not know how to manage a woman who is very self-directed. I am not someone who wants, or needs, a ton of hand holding in my work, and I think the women I have not gotten along with have viewed this independence negatively, like if I am not asking more questions or running more things by them, it must be because I don't respect them. But I don't view it this way -- the reason I am self-directed is because I try to respect my boss's time, plus I understand how I learn best is by doing and then getting feedback, not by simply being told what to do. The bosses I've done well with have all tended to value this in me, but the ones that don't value it can get frustrated with me. Maybe part of this is internalized misogyny on my part. Maybe I subconsciously ask female bosses fewer questions. But I also think it could be internalize misogyny on their part. In at least one case, it was very clear that my boss trusted the men on staff to work independently more, and tended to micromanage the women on staff more -- it was something both the men and women on staff noticed. That said, I've had some great female bosses, including one of the women I work for now. So I don't think it's that I just can't handle female leadership at all. I think it's more that there might be a greater likelihood of this specific personality mismatch with women. |
Anonymous
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The women I've encountered who prefer male bosses, seem to actually prefer hands off bosses who give general praise and don't dig into the weeds. They encounter more hands off bosses who are men, because as others have said, women bosses have usually needed to be hands on and directive to succeed.
Then when these women have a female boss who demands more and gets into the details, they read it as that woman being uptight and controlling. If they encounter a male boss who is the same way (rare but it happens) they read him as tough and demanding but not uptight or mean. |
Anonymous
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This is op. I agree with some PP's viewpoints. I am a quiet person, and I don't ask a lot of questions or help. Male supervisors probably tend to be more laid back and like that I don't bother them but I have work done.
One senior female staff has accused me one time that I look down on her and I don't even know what I have done. I think it is due to I have never asked her for any help for consult her for expertise. Our work does not cross path, and I sometimes go to chit chat with her over silly or happy things. I have seen a tall female coworker kneel on her knees when asking for help/guidance at female supervisor's office, and I find it unnecessary for her to do that even supervisor is sitting at her chair. But I think that makes female supervisor feel more respectful and have authority when her subordinates ask for help at work or wisdom for family matters. I am not part of the group, could be because I am the only women with small kids and other women have high school kids or older on the same team. I also would not call it tacism, but it just happen my team are all white and I am the only minority. Maybe many things just do not click culturally or socially. In the future, should I bother women supervisor more or ask them wisdom their career path/history plus life wisdom? |
Anonymous
Agree Just confirmed the one I report to lies all the time to look better or attempt to get what she wants. Yuck. That plus the passive, long emails asking someone else to make her decisions. Ugh! It’s like she thinks she can hang on to this job for a few more years by getting others in the hook for her decisions. Playing not to lose. |
Anonymous
Not me, I hate to have a male boss. |
Anonymous
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OP, I am going to play devil's advocate here: Are you being blamed for the boss's mistakes or does your boss see you as a threat in any way? Is your boss insecure and barely getting by in their own job, but claiming to "save the world (or in this case, the office)"?
I am asking because I had a female boss who monopolized our meetings and tooted their own horn constantly. It rubbed a lot of people the wrong way. This may be what you are feeling. |
Anonymous
| I just think some people work better with the opposite gender. I don't think you have to overanalyze or play psychiatrist about the situation, OP. |
Anonymous
+1. It’s biological. Submitting to male authority is the norm the world over, submitting to female authority doesn’t seem natural. Caveman brain vs. enlightened brain, I guess. |
Anonymous
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I think this is a you thing. You said she gets along well with many other women, but you don’t click. You are coming across as needy to me, and that’s a turn off to a lot of people.
Have you ever done one of those personality assessments, like Myers-Briggs? While they are not the most scientific, I have found them immensely useful as a manager to try to understand where my subordinates are coming from and that they’re not making me crazy on purpose but it’s just how they process information and interact with others, and it’s the opposite of how I process people and information. Since you say this is not the first time you e found yourself in this situation, you may be in an industry where one personality type predominates, and you are an outlier. You could also be on the spectrum and don’t pick up non-verbal cues very well. |
Anonymous
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This is a really interesting question.
First, I think it is really hard to compare - how many supervisors have you had in total over 15 years? 10 maybe? So not a huge sampling, it could just be 10 different personalities. Some you click with, some you don’t. I have like my female supervisors on the whole. I work in a male dominated industry. The women who get to management are very direct & focused. They have families/lives outside of work, but don’t talk about it much. They are busy, they give me direction but also expect good work - no micromanaging if they trust you, they have other stuff to do. I find they are very efficient, get shit done, brief small talk - I love that. They expect me to handle my crap & if I can’t, come to them. I find the male managers are more chatty in one on ones, ask how you are after sick time (I think bc they have been coached to do this to be a good manager). Male managers seem to have more time…do more monologuing in team meetings. I much prefer the women managers I have had who are more focused on the task at hand. |
Anonymous
| Had a female boss who won awards for her female mentoring in our field, but treated her female workers like indentured servants. Sometimes OP it is not you. |
Anonymous
What?? Your workplace sounds nuts. |
Anonymous
Agree with all of this. I think there are two things to pull out from this: 1) I think there is a difference of opinion as to whether women managers need to be more "hands on" in order to get respect/credit in their roles. I think this is sometimes true, but I also think it's true that there are many more women who WANT to be more hands on as a manager. I think there's a lot going on there, but one thing I've experienced is women who have been promoted to a managerial role after serving as a team contributor and who seem to struggle, more than men I've worked with, at shifting from a director contributor role to being a manager/facilitator. I don't know why this is exactly, but I think sometimes women feel that if they aren't doing the work directly, either it won't get done correctly or they won't be sufficiently credited with a success. And I think this is a misperception some women managers have because as a general matter, most teams don't like micromanaging and will resent a manager who insists on doing their jobs. Men and women. This is not a good management tactic and it does seem to be more common among female managers (I am a woman, by the way). 2) Personality fit seems to matter more with women, whether managers or not. I think this can contribute to feeling like you don't get along with your boss OR that your subordinate doesn't like or respect to, if both parties are women. I think if it's mixed gender people don't assume you need to get along on a personal level beyond just professional respect and having a functional work relationship. There's less pressure. I've had both female bosses and female subordinates who seem to push socializing more, who are more interested in talking about personal lives, etc., than the men I've worked with in either role. Once you pull in the personal, there are more chances of conflict. The most conflict I've ever had with a boss happened in large part because she was constantly asking me about and then commenting on my personal life. It was incredibly unprofessional but more than that, it just created things for us to disagree over. If we'd been able to just focus on work, I think we'd have found that we were largely in alignment and there would have been fewer issues. But she would even say that she viewed me "as a daughter" (no thank you, I already have a mother) and gave me tons of unsolicited advice and I hated it, which did mean I was less eager to take direction from her on substantive work. I actually think there may be some lessons here for female manager if they are willing to take them. The posts in this thread that are like "people don't like female leadership, it's a subordinate problem" are ignoring some real issues here that can undermine women in management roles. As someone who has had both fantastic female bosses and really terrible ones, I just really disagree that it's impossible to command respect as a woman in leadership. It is harder than for women because, yes misogyny exists. But also some women make it much worse for themselves (and for the women who work for them) than it needs to be. |
Anonymous
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You’re giving off a vibe. I’m sure of it.
Since it’s obviously unintentional, I think you can overcome it. At some point you developed a bias toward female supervisors and you’re unable to shake it. Seriously, see if you can see an EAP therapist and dig into where it comes from. You’ll figure it out. |