College Football--Big Ten Expansion

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m thinking the billions in research money outweighs the millions in TV money.

The B1G schools don't share/pool their research money.

Right, but they do work together. Google Big Ben Academic Alliance (used to be CIC-Committee on institutional Cooperation).

It seems like a way for schools run by football teams to pretend academics matter

Sure, Michigan is run by a football team. You just can’t stand the fact that some universities are great at many things.

Compare Harbaugh’s salary to any academic. Compare athletic facilities to anything normal students have access to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m thinking the billions in research money outweighs the millions in TV money.

The B1G schools don't share/pool their research money.

Right, but they do work together. Google Big Ben Academic Alliance (used to be CIC-Committee on institutional Cooperation).

It seems like a way for schools run by football teams to pretend academics matter

Sure, Michigan is run by a football team. You just can’t stand the fact that some universities are great at many things.

Funny fact . UMD with 1.5 modern ncaa football championships has more than Michigan which only has .5

Michigan is definitely NOT run by football.

[Anonymous]

The Big Ten Conference schools spend substantially more on research & development per year than each school receives from athletic revenue. Under the current media rights contract, Big Ten Conference member schools will receive from $65 million to $100 million per year. ( U Washington & U Oregon will receive half share payouts until the current TV media rights deal expires in 2030.)

Big Ten Conference Schools annual R&D expenditures (figures are for R&D expenditures in 2021):

1) U Michigan = $1,640,000,000
2) U Washington-Seattle = $1,500,000,000
3) UCLA = $1,450,000,000
4) Wisconsin-Madison = $1,380,000,000
5) Stanford = $1,275,000,000

6) Harvard = $1,254,000,000
7) Duke = $1,238,000,000
8) Ohio State = $1,236,000,000
9) UNC = $1,206,000,000
10) Cornell = $1,184,000,000

11) Yale = $1,165,000,000
12) Texas A&M = $1,148,000,000
13) U Maryland = $1,142,000,000
14) Georgia Tech = $1,114,000,000
15) Columbia = $1,100,000,000

16) U Minnesota = $1,073,000,000
17) Vanderbilt = $1,109,000,000
18) Penn State = $971,000,000
19) U Florida = $960,000,000
20) USC = $956,000,000

21) MIT = $949,000,000
22) Northwestern = $913,000,000
23) UCal-Berkeley = $847,000,000
24) U Texas at Austin = $779,000,000
25) Illinois (main campus) = $731,000,000

26) Michigan State = $710,000,000
27) Indiana = $695,000,000
28) Purdue = $680,000,000
29) ASU (Arizona State) = $677,000,000
30) Rutgers = $644,000,000

31) U Virgina = $611,000,000
32) U Iowa = $554,000,000
33) NC State = $547,000,000
34) Virginia Tech = $542,000,000
35) U Chicago = $498,000,000

36) U Georgia = $494,000,000
37) U Illinois-(Chicago campus only) = $430,000,000
38) U Kentucky = $429,000,000
39) Princeton = $405,000,000
40) Carnegie Mellon (CMU) = $402,000,000

41) Dartmouth College = $330,000,000
42) FSU (Fla. State) = $329,000,000
43) Nebraska = $307,000,000
44) Georgetown = $280,000,000
45) Brown = $276,000,000

46) Auburn = $266,000,000
47) GWU = $266,000,000
48) Wake Forest = $264,000,000
49) Notre Dame = $240,000,000
50) N'eastern = $211,000,000

51) Rice = $207,000,000
52) Nebraska Medical Center = $201,000,000
53) U Oregon = $139,000,000
54) U Alabama = $130,000,000
55) U Mississippi (Ole Miss) = $116,000,000

Non-Big Ten Conference schools were included as points of reference.

Johns Hopkins University is the leader year-after-year in R&D expenditures. U Michigan is #3 among all universities; U Washington-Seattle is #5 among all universities. UCLA = #6. Wisconsin-Madison = #8. Stanford is #9 overall, while Harvard is #10 overall.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m thinking the billions in research money outweighs the millions in TV money.

The B1G schools don't share/pool their research money.

Right, but they do work together. Google Big Ben Academic Alliance (used to be CIC-Committee on institutional Cooperation).

It seems like a way for schools run by football teams to pretend academics matter

Sure, Michigan is run by a football team. You just can’t stand the fact that some universities are great at many things.

Funny fact . UMD with 1.5 modern ncaa football championships has more than Michigan which only has .5

Michigan is definitely NOT run by football.

Honest fact. Michigan is better at academics, football, and just about everything else in comparison to UMD.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The Big Ten Conference schools spend substantially more on research & development per year than each school receives from athletic revenue. Under the current media rights contract, Big Ten Conference member schools will receive from $65 million to $100 million per year. ( U Washington & U Oregon will receive half share payouts until the current TV media rights deal expires in 2030.)

Big Ten Conference Schools annual R&D expenditures (figures are for R&D expenditures in 2021):

1) U Michigan = $1,640,000,000
2) U Washington-Seattle = $1,500,000,000
3) UCLA = $1,450,000,000
4) Wisconsin-Madison = $1,380,000,000
5) Stanford = $1,275,000,000

6) Harvard = $1,254,000,000
7) Duke = $1,238,000,000
8) Ohio State = $1,236,000,000
9) UNC = $1,206,000,000
10) Cornell = $1,184,000,000

11) Yale = $1,165,000,000
12) Texas A&M = $1,148,000,000
13) U Maryland = $1,142,000,000
14) Georgia Tech = $1,114,000,000
15) Columbia = $1,100,000,000

16) U Minnesota = $1,073,000,000
17) Vanderbilt = $1,109,000,000
18) Penn State = $971,000,000
19) U Florida = $960,000,000
20) USC = $956,000,000

21) MIT = $949,000,000
22) Northwestern = $913,000,000
23) UCal-Berkeley = $847,000,000
24) U Texas at Austin = $779,000,000
25) Illinois (main campus) = $731,000,000

26) Michigan State = $710,000,000
27) Indiana = $695,000,000
28) Purdue = $680,000,000
29) ASU (Arizona State) = $677,000,000
30) Rutgers = $644,000,000

31) U Virgina = $611,000,000
32) U Iowa = $554,000,000
33) NC State = $547,000,000
34) Virginia Tech = $542,000,000
35) U Chicago = $498,000,000

36) U Georgia = $494,000,000
37) U Illinois-(Chicago campus only) = $430,000,000
38) U Kentucky = $429,000,000
39) Princeton = $405,000,000
40) Carnegie Mellon (CMU) = $402,000,000

41) Dartmouth College = $330,000,000
42) FSU (Fla. State) = $329,000,000
43) Nebraska = $307,000,000
44) Georgetown = $280,000,000
45) Brown = $276,000,000

46) Auburn = $266,000,000
47) GWU = $266,000,000
48) Wake Forest = $264,000,000
49) Notre Dame = $240,000,000
50) N'eastern = $211,000,000

51) Rice = $207,000,000
52) Nebraska Medical Center = $201,000,000
53) U Oregon = $139,000,000
54) U Alabama = $130,000,000
55) U Mississippi (Ole Miss) = $116,000,000

Non-Big Ten Conference schools were included as points of reference.

Johns Hopkins University is the leader year-after-year in R&D expenditures. U Michigan is #3 among all universities; U Washington-Seattle is #5 among all universities. UCLA = #6. Wisconsin-Madison = #8. Stanford is #9 overall, while Harvard is #10 overall.

How many labs are returning money to the school or paying for new buildings? Research funding pays for salaries and labs, it does not flow to the school as a whole.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Big Ten Conference schools spend substantially more on research & development per year than each school receives from athletic revenue. Under the current media rights contract, Big Ten Conference member schools will receive from $65 million to $100 million per year. ( U Washington & U Oregon will receive half share payouts until the current TV media rights deal expires in 2030.)

Big Ten Conference Schools annual R&D expenditures (figures are for R&D expenditures in 2021):

1) U Michigan = $1,640,000,000
2) U Washington-Seattle = $1,500,000,000
3) UCLA = $1,450,000,000
4) Wisconsin-Madison = $1,380,000,000
5) Stanford = $1,275,000,000

6) Harvard = $1,254,000,000
7) Duke = $1,238,000,000
8) Ohio State = $1,236,000,000
9) UNC = $1,206,000,000
10) Cornell = $1,184,000,000

11) Yale = $1,165,000,000
12) Texas A&M = $1,148,000,000
13) U Maryland = $1,142,000,000
14) Georgia Tech = $1,114,000,000
15) Columbia = $1,100,000,000

16) U Minnesota = $1,073,000,000
17) Vanderbilt = $1,109,000,000
18) Penn State = $971,000,000
19) U Florida = $960,000,000
20) USC = $956,000,000

21) MIT = $949,000,000
22) Northwestern = $913,000,000
23) UCal-Berkeley = $847,000,000
24) U Texas at Austin = $779,000,000
25) Illinois (main campus) = $731,000,000

26) Michigan State = $710,000,000
27) Indiana = $695,000,000
28) Purdue = $680,000,000
29) ASU (Arizona State) = $677,000,000
30) Rutgers = $644,000,000

31) U Virgina = $611,000,000
32) U Iowa = $554,000,000
33) NC State = $547,000,000
34) Virginia Tech = $542,000,000
35) U Chicago = $498,000,000

36) U Georgia = $494,000,000
37) U Illinois-(Chicago campus only) = $430,000,000
38) U Kentucky = $429,000,000
39) Princeton = $405,000,000
40) Carnegie Mellon (CMU) = $402,000,000

41) Dartmouth College = $330,000,000
42) FSU (Fla. State) = $329,000,000
43) Nebraska = $307,000,000
44) Georgetown = $280,000,000
45) Brown = $276,000,000

46) Auburn = $266,000,000
47) GWU = $266,000,000
48) Wake Forest = $264,000,000
49) Notre Dame = $240,000,000
50) N'eastern = $211,000,000

51) Rice = $207,000,000
52) Nebraska Medical Center = $201,000,000
53) U Oregon = $139,000,000
54) U Alabama = $130,000,000
55) U Mississippi (Ole Miss) = $116,000,000

Non-Big Ten Conference schools were included as points of reference.

Johns Hopkins University is the leader year-after-year in R&D expenditures. U Michigan is #3 among all universities; U Washington-Seattle is #5 among all universities. UCLA = #6. Wisconsin-Madison = #8. Stanford is #9 overall, while Harvard is #10 overall.

How many labs are returning money to the school or paying for new buildings? Research funding pays for salaries and labs, it does not flow to the school as a whole.

Jobs & facilities--but will vary by institution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Big Ten Conference schools spend substantially more on research & development per year than each school receives from athletic revenue. Under the current media rights contract, Big Ten Conference member schools will receive from $65 million to $100 million per year. ( U Washington & U Oregon will receive half share payouts until the current TV media rights deal expires in 2030.)

Big Ten Conference Schools annual R&D expenditures (figures are for R&D expenditures in 2021):

1) U Michigan = $1,640,000,000
2) U Washington-Seattle = $1,500,000,000
3) UCLA = $1,450,000,000
4) Wisconsin-Madison = $1,380,000,000
5) Stanford = $1,275,000,000

6) Harvard = $1,254,000,000
7) Duke = $1,238,000,000
8) Ohio State = $1,236,000,000
9) UNC = $1,206,000,000
10) Cornell = $1,184,000,000

11) Yale = $1,165,000,000
12) Texas A&M = $1,148,000,000
13) U Maryland = $1,142,000,000
14) Georgia Tech = $1,114,000,000
15) Columbia = $1,100,000,000

16) U Minnesota = $1,073,000,000
17) Vanderbilt = $1,109,000,000
18) Penn State = $971,000,000
19) U Florida = $960,000,000
20) USC = $956,000,000

21) MIT = $949,000,000
22) Northwestern = $913,000,000
23) UCal-Berkeley = $847,000,000
24) U Texas at Austin = $779,000,000
25) Illinois (main campus) = $731,000,000

26) Michigan State = $710,000,000
27) Indiana = $695,000,000
28) Purdue = $680,000,000
29) ASU (Arizona State) = $677,000,000
30) Rutgers = $644,000,000

31) U Virgina = $611,000,000
32) U Iowa = $554,000,000
33) NC State = $547,000,000
34) Virginia Tech = $542,000,000
35) U Chicago = $498,000,000

36) U Georgia = $494,000,000
37) U Illinois-(Chicago campus only) = $430,000,000
38) U Kentucky = $429,000,000
39) Princeton = $405,000,000
40) Carnegie Mellon (CMU) = $402,000,000

41) Dartmouth College = $330,000,000
42) FSU (Fla. State) = $329,000,000
43) Nebraska = $307,000,000
44) Georgetown = $280,000,000
45) Brown = $276,000,000

46) Auburn = $266,000,000
47) GWU = $266,000,000
48) Wake Forest = $264,000,000
49) Notre Dame = $240,000,000
50) N'eastern = $211,000,000

51) Rice = $207,000,000
52) Nebraska Medical Center = $201,000,000
53) U Oregon = $139,000,000
54) U Alabama = $130,000,000
55) U Mississippi (Ole Miss) = $116,000,000

Non-Big Ten Conference schools were included as points of reference.

Johns Hopkins University is the leader year-after-year in R&D expenditures. U Michigan is #3 among all universities; U Washington-Seattle is #5 among all universities. UCLA = #6. Wisconsin-Madison = #8. Stanford is #9 overall, while Harvard is #10 overall.

How many labs are returning money to the school or paying for new buildings? Research funding pays for salaries and labs, it does not flow to the school as a whole.

(OP here)

I compiled the R&D Expenditures from National Science Foundation data contained in a very easy to read report.

R&D Expenditures can be very lucrative to universities if the university owns a portion of the patent of any new device or medicine, etc.

If given the choice between keeping football or research, only U Oregon & U Nebraska might opt to keep football over research assuming that each school was receiving $100 million or more each year from football & football related activities & products.

Ownership or partial ownership of a patent can be rewarding for many years and even forever (in perpetuity) even beyond the life of the patent depending upon the particular arrangement such as a royalty in perpetuity.

[Anonymous]

For what it is worth, Johns Hopkins is a member of the B1G lacrosse league and is a member if the CIC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Big Ten Conference schools spend substantially more on research & development per year than each school receives from athletic revenue. Under the current media rights contract, Big Ten Conference member schools will receive from $65 million to $100 million per year. ( U Washington & U Oregon will receive half share payouts until the current TV media rights deal expires in 2030.)

Big Ten Conference Schools annual R&D expenditures (figures are for R&D expenditures in 2021):

1) U Michigan = $1,640,000,000
2) U Washington-Seattle = $1,500,000,000
3) UCLA = $1,450,000,000
4) Wisconsin-Madison = $1,380,000,000
5) Stanford = $1,275,000,000

6) Harvard = $1,254,000,000
7) Duke = $1,238,000,000
8) Ohio State = $1,236,000,000
9) UNC = $1,206,000,000
10) Cornell = $1,184,000,000

11) Yale = $1,165,000,000
12) Texas A&M = $1,148,000,000
13) U Maryland = $1,142,000,000
14) Georgia Tech = $1,114,000,000
15) Columbia = $1,100,000,000

16) U Minnesota = $1,073,000,000
17) Vanderbilt = $1,109,000,000
18) Penn State = $971,000,000
19) U Florida = $960,000,000
20) USC = $956,000,000

21) MIT = $949,000,000
22) Northwestern = $913,000,000
23) UCal-Berkeley = $847,000,000
24) U Texas at Austin = $779,000,000
25) Illinois (main campus) = $731,000,000

26) Michigan State = $710,000,000
27) Indiana = $695,000,000
28) Purdue = $680,000,000
29) ASU (Arizona State) = $677,000,000
30) Rutgers = $644,000,000

31) U Virgina = $611,000,000
32) U Iowa = $554,000,000
33) NC State = $547,000,000
34) Virginia Tech = $542,000,000
35) U Chicago = $498,000,000

36) U Georgia = $494,000,000
37) U Illinois-(Chicago campus only) = $430,000,000
38) U Kentucky = $429,000,000
39) Princeton = $405,000,000
40) Carnegie Mellon (CMU) = $402,000,000

41) Dartmouth College = $330,000,000
42) FSU (Fla. State) = $329,000,000
43) Nebraska = $307,000,000
44) Georgetown = $280,000,000
45) Brown = $276,000,000

46) Auburn = $266,000,000
47) GWU = $266,000,000
48) Wake Forest = $264,000,000
49) Notre Dame = $240,000,000
50) N'eastern = $211,000,000

51) Rice = $207,000,000
52) Nebraska Medical Center = $201,000,000
53) U Oregon = $139,000,000
54) U Alabama = $130,000,000
55) U Mississippi (Ole Miss) = $116,000,000

Non-Big Ten Conference schools were included as points of reference.

Johns Hopkins University is the leader year-after-year in R&D expenditures. U Michigan is #3 among all universities; U Washington-Seattle is #5 among all universities. UCLA = #6. Wisconsin-Madison = #8. Stanford is #9 overall, while Harvard is #10 overall.

How many labs are returning money to the school or paying for new buildings? Research funding pays for salaries and labs, it does not flow to the school as a whole.

(OP here)

I compiled the R&D Expenditures from National Science Foundation data contained in a very easy to read report.

R&D Expenditures can be very lucrative to universities if the university owns a portion of the patent of any new device or medicine, etc.

If given the choice between keeping football or research, only U Oregon & U Nebraska might opt to keep football over research assuming that each school was receiving $100 million or more each year from football & football related activities & products.

Ownership or partial ownership of a patent can be rewarding for many years and even forever (in perpetuity) even beyond the life of the patent depending upon the particular arrangement such as a royalty in perpetuity.

Private ownership of patents resulting from publicly funded research is on area of patent reform that most people agree on

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:For what it is worth, Johns Hopkins is a member of the B1G lacrosse league and is a member if the CIC.

Johns Hopkins University is continually the leader in R&D expenditures while U Michigan seems to always be #3 behind UC-San Francisco medical research.

JHU's 2021 R&D expenditures were an incredible $3,181,385,000--almost twice as much as third place research powerhouse University of Washington at Seattle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The Big Ten Conference schools spend substantially more on research & development per year than each school receives from athletic revenue. Under the current media rights contract, Big Ten Conference member schools will receive from $65 million to $100 million per year. ( U Washington & U Oregon will receive half share payouts until the current TV media rights deal expires in 2030.)

Big Ten Conference Schools annual R&D expenditures (figures are for R&D expenditures in 2021):

1) U Michigan = $1,640,000,000
2) U Washington-Seattle = $1,500,000,000
3) UCLA = $1,450,000,000
4) Wisconsin-Madison = $1,380,000,000
5) Stanford = $1,275,000,000

6) Harvard = $1,254,000,000
7) Duke = $1,238,000,000
8) Ohio State = $1,236,000,000
9) UNC = $1,206,000,000
10) Cornell = $1,184,000,000

11) Yale = $1,165,000,000
12) Texas A&M = $1,148,000,000
13) U Maryland = $1,142,000,000
14) Georgia Tech = $1,114,000,000
15) Columbia = $1,100,000,000

16) U Minnesota = $1,073,000,000
17) Vanderbilt = $1,109,000,000
18) Penn State = $971,000,000
19) U Florida = $960,000,000
20) USC = $956,000,000

21) MIT = $949,000,000
22) Northwestern = $913,000,000
23) UCal-Berkeley = $847,000,000
24) U Texas at Austin = $779,000,000
25) Illinois (main campus) = $731,000,000

26) Michigan State = $710,000,000
27) Indiana = $695,000,000
28) Purdue = $680,000,000
29) ASU (Arizona State) = $677,000,000
30) Rutgers = $644,000,000

31) U Virgina = $611,000,000
32) U Iowa = $554,000,000
33) NC State = $547,000,000
34) Virginia Tech = $542,000,000
35) U Chicago = $498,000,000

36) U Georgia = $494,000,000
37) U Illinois-(Chicago campus only) = $430,000,000
38) U Kentucky = $429,000,000
39) Princeton = $405,000,000
40) Carnegie Mellon (CMU) = $402,000,000

41) Dartmouth College = $330,000,000
42) FSU (Fla. State) = $329,000,000
43) Nebraska = $307,000,000
44) Georgetown = $280,000,000
45) Brown = $276,000,000

46) Auburn = $266,000,000
47) GWU = $266,000,000
48) Wake Forest = $264,000,000
49) Notre Dame = $240,000,000
50) N'eastern = $211,000,000

51) Rice = $207,000,000
52) Nebraska Medical Center = $201,000,000
53) U Oregon = $139,000,000
54) U Alabama = $130,000,000
55) U Mississippi (Ole Miss) = $116,000,000

Non-Big Ten Conference schools were included as points of reference.

Johns Hopkins University is the leader year-after-year in R&D expenditures. U Michigan is #3 among all universities; U Washington-Seattle is #5 among all universities. UCLA = #6. Wisconsin-Madison = #8. Stanford is #9 overall, while Harvard is #10 overall.

How many labs are returning money to the school or paying for new buildings? Research funding pays for salaries and labs, it does not flow to the school as a whole.

(OP here)

I compiled the R&D Expenditures from National Science Foundation data contained in a very easy to read report.

R&D Expenditures can be very lucrative to universities if the university owns a portion of the patent of any new device or medicine, etc.

If given the choice between keeping football or research, only U Oregon & U Nebraska might opt to keep football over research assuming that each school was receiving $100 million or more each year from football & football related activities & products.

Ownership or partial ownership of a patent can be rewarding for many years and even forever (in perpetuity) even beyond the life of the patent depending upon the particular arrangement such as a royalty in perpetuity.

Private ownership of patents resulting from publicly funded research is on area of patent reform that most people agree on

(OP again)

You might find this document to be of interest:

https://policies.northwestern.edu/docs/patent-and-invention-policy-FINAL.pdf

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For what it is worth, Johns Hopkins is a member of the B1G lacrosse league and is a member if the CIC.

Johns Hopkins University is continually the leader in R&D expenditures while U Michigan seems to always be #3 behind UC-San Francisco medical research.

JHU's 2021 R&D expenditures were an incredible $3,181,385,000--almost twice as much as third place research powerhouse University of Washington at Seattle.

Between JHU and UMD.. Maryland dominates the research money. Good job Senators !!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For what it is worth, Johns Hopkins is a member of the B1G lacrosse league and is a member if the CIC.

Johns Hopkins University is continually the leader in R&D expenditures while U Michigan seems to always be #3 behind UC-San Francisco medical research.

JHU's 2021 R&D expenditures were an incredible $3,181,385,000--almost twice as much as third place research powerhouse University of Washington at Seattle.

Between JHU and UMD.. Maryland dominates the research money. Good job Senators !!

Not sure that I understand this post. JHU's annual R&D expenditures are triple that of U Maryland.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For what it is worth, Johns Hopkins is a member of the B1G lacrosse league and is a member if the CIC.

Johns Hopkins University is continually the leader in R&D expenditures while U Michigan seems to always be #3 behind UC-San Francisco medical research.

JHU's 2021 R&D expenditures were an incredible $3,181,385,000--almost twice as much as third place research powerhouse University of Washington at Seattle.

Between JHU and UMD.. Maryland dominates the research money. Good job Senators !!

Not sure that I understand this post. JHU's annual R&D expenditures are triple that of U Maryland.

UMD is top 20 with 1.1+ billion (top 9 in public ) so the Md Senators are pulling in massive research numbers in a 30 mile radius for the state.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
For what it is worth, Johns Hopkins is a member of the B1G lacrosse league and is a member if the CIC.


“Johns Hopkins University is continually the leader in R&D expenditures while U Michigan seems to always be #3 behind UC-San Francisco medical research.”

Your statement is incorrect. Michigan had been #2 in R&D for many years behind Hopkins. This is the first time I’ve seen UCSF overtake it.