Options for opposing Connecticut Avenue changes?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm a commuter from MD so you can hate on me, but in our newly hybrid world, I will come into my DC office much less when these changes go into effect. I will spend a lot less money in DC than I have over the past 20yrs. And I will be driving all over DC neighborhoods when I do have to drive downtown. Especially if Beach Drive remains closed. I'm sure the 10 families and 20 Lance Armstrong wanna-bes who use the bikes lanes will be super happy, but having traversed this route over decades, I can assure you that there will be total gridlock and more accidents.

I live on a busy street in MD that gets a lot of NIH commuter traffic, so I understand why residents want to find ways to incentivize options other than car travel. But realistically all the bike lane plan will accomplish is diverting traffic to neighborhood streets, creating huge traffic jams, and reducing interest in working in downtown offices. I know the NWDC crowd thinks that's awesome, but the people who run small businesses and their employees may be less enamored of a city leadership that is actively encouraging smaller numbers of daily visitors.

Maybe you should take this energy and use it to advocate for traffic calming and transit in MoCo. It’s pretty hellish there, and one reason that I am likely staying in DC instead of moving to MoCo. In fact, the Ct Ave project is specifically one reason I might stay.

PS: you can drive to a metro station and metro in to DC. And no, you’re not going to be driving on side streets deep with Cleveland Park. That’s not actually how traffic works.

It's from Calvert Street to Chevy Chase Circle, not just Cleveland Park. There are a lot of side streets along that route and yes that is exactly how traffic works. If there's congestion then an alternate route is found.

Please read the traffic study. Traffic is largely REDUCED on ew side streets and INCREASED on other
major NS routes. https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/page_content/attachments/02_Conn%20Ave_Public%20Meeting_LR%232-Traff-Parking_FINAL_04012021.pdf. On EW side street where it does increase, the increase is something like 15% which will likely not even be noticeable.

And if you care so much, take the metro.

I did and I noticed a few things. It claims there will be a 1000% increase in bike commuters and that 7,000 cars will disappear. It used pandemic traffic numbers as its base. It looked at what happens if more people than anticipated use bikes but not what happens if less people use them. It says traffic will be diverted to GW Parkway and Georgia but not 16th, Reno, and Beach (the most logical alternative routes) let alone how people would get to Reno and Beach (ie: side streets). It is obvious that the study was done with an end goal in mind and was massaged accordingly.

False. The traffic numbers are from 2019.

Try again.

I’m not sure there is a credible urban planner anywhere on the planet that would use pre COVID traffic statistics to make post-pandemic regional transportation infrastructure decisions. The world has fundamentally changed. How, when, and where people work and live has changed. Can’t we at least get updated transportation studies so we can make an informed decisions?

If anything, that makes the 2019 numbers more conservative since fewer people are going downtown and more people are working from home and will want to run errands in their neighborhoods during the day. So you are basically saying that the bike lanes are a good thing to help support businesses in a post-COVID world.

I agree.

Ummm, no. Transit ridership is 50% lower. So traffic may be through the roof. Maybe we should find out?

So you think post-COVID, there is more car traffic than pre-COVID?

There is NOTHING to support that assertion in any jurisdiction.

This you? We need fresh so we don’t totally screw this up for a generation and kill uptown and downtown businesses along the way.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/16/hybrid-work-schedules-pandemic-commuting/

Please show a study that shows that bike lanes kill businesses.

The businesses that get get out of their leases are already leaving. What other proof do you need?

Businesses leaving three years before this is implemented are not leaving because of the bike lanes.

Most commercial leases are for 5 years. Some even for ten. When our ANC commissioners and the bike mafia hears “lease” they think it’s like the 1 year lease on their rental apartments. There is a reason we have age limits to run for federal offices. Stating to think we need that at the ANC level.

So when can we expect you to throw your hat in the ring?

Wish I could but we have three kids in two separate schools. They play travel sports in three different states depending on the weekend. Also trying to get two of them religious education. We both work and have a mortgage. And we care for two aging parents. In our spare time we take of our yard.

And you have….a bike.

DP. Sounds like you have a very strong set of values and priorities - that’s great! You can understand that a majority of other people value something differently, which is why this change is happening

It’s not a majority of people. Ward 3 Bikes had a candidate forum tonight and 20 people showed up. Which is about as many people who want these bikes lanes. The majority of people are too busy to even know this is happening.

Was more like 45, but we all know your side has problems with counting and numbers, so I'll let that slide.

Yeah, but 18 were candidates. So 20 supporters is about right. Where were the other 80,000 residents of Ward 3? Oh yeah, they didn’t know about this either.

It was supposed to be rainign with a lightning warning in effect. of course that would depress attendence. No one was expecting hordes of attendees.

Oh, so people won’t use bikes in bad weather? Well that’s totally obvious. Let’s explore this point some more.

No, it was also Rosh Hashonnah. It was clearly a hastily put together event, but from the pictures on social media, it looked like a nice time.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It's in everyone's interest -- drivers, pedestrians, cyclists -- to have any much car traffic moving as efficiently as possible on major roads, ie any street named after a state. That's what they were designed for and that's where everyone expects there to be lots of traffic. When we force drivers to start cutting through neighborhoods on side streets because the main arteries are clogged, that's when we're asking for trouble.

It is also in everyone's interest to have roads where pedestrians, cyclists and drivers, can move about their business in a safe manner. When a road is designed such that someone operating a car can move fast enough that they overturn it, as happened on Connecticut Avenue earlier this month, that is problematic. I am not sure why anyone would defend the status quo, which is clearly unsafe.

We'd all be better off if the handful of dudes super into bikes would just take the subway.

If I want to go from Chevy Chase to Vace, the Metro isn't really going to help me.

You're in luck! It turns out there is also a city bus system!

It is faster for me to bike. I would just like to do it safely.

Call me crazy but the city shouldnt have to spend billions of dollars and screw up traffic for hundreds of thousands of people because you and a handful of other Bernie bros don't like the bus

Don't worry, they also plan to dramtically cut back local bus service. Buses will now strictly be for commuters from Maryland.

I agree with this - the buses on CT ave have already been cut back in favor of an express line type service from MD - people from MD complained that the bus t hat went down 18th street took to long so that was done away with, the bikes can go on the bus but people with injuries, balance issues, elderly, people with babies who don't want to pop their kids in conn ave, people with many reasons are safer and more comfortable on the metro bus which is now being subordinated to the bike lanes - what are the stats re: bus ridership v.s. bikes on conn ave?

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

I think most people agree that the L service on Connecticut Avenue is inadaquate. As such, there should be a bike lane and a bus lane on the Avenue. There can also be a car lane too.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm a commuter from MD so you can hate on me, but in our newly hybrid world, I will come into my DC office much less when these changes go into effect. I will spend a lot less money in DC than I have over the past 20yrs. And I will be driving all over DC neighborhoods when I do have to drive downtown. Especially if Beach Drive remains closed. I'm sure the 10 families and 20 Lance Armstrong wanna-bes who use the bikes lanes will be super happy, but having traversed this route over decades, I can assure you that there will be total gridlock and more accidents.

I live on a busy street in MD that gets a lot of NIH commuter traffic, so I understand why residents want to find ways to incentivize options other than car travel. But realistically all the bike lane plan will accomplish is diverting traffic to neighborhood streets, creating huge traffic jams, and reducing interest in working in downtown offices. I know the NWDC crowd thinks that's awesome, but the people who run small businesses and their employees may be less enamored of a city leadership that is actively encouraging smaller numbers of daily visitors.

Maybe you should take this energy and use it to advocate for traffic calming and transit in MoCo. It’s pretty hellish there, and one reason that I am likely staying in DC instead of moving to MoCo. In fact, the Ct Ave project is specifically one reason I might stay.

PS: you can drive to a metro station and metro in to DC. And no, you’re not going to be driving on side streets deep with Cleveland Park. That’s not actually how traffic works.

It's from Calvert Street to Chevy Chase Circle, not just Cleveland Park. There are a lot of side streets along that route and yes that is exactly how traffic works. If there's congestion then an alternate route is found.

Please read the traffic study. Traffic is largely REDUCED on ew side streets and INCREASED on other
major NS routes. https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/page_content/attachments/02_Conn%20Ave_Public%20Meeting_LR%232-Traff-Parking_FINAL_04012021.pdf. On EW side street where it does increase, the increase is something like 15% which will likely not even be noticeable.

And if you care so much, take the metro.

I did and I noticed a few things. It claims there will be a 1000% increase in bike commuters and that 7,000 cars will disappear. It used pandemic traffic numbers as its base. It looked at what happens if more people than anticipated use bikes but not what happens if less people use them. It says traffic will be diverted to GW Parkway and Georgia but not 16th, Reno, and Beach (the most logical alternative routes) let alone how people would get to Reno and Beach (ie: side streets). It is obvious that the study was done with an end goal in mind and was massaged accordingly.

False. The traffic numbers are from 2019.

Try again.

I’m not sure there is a credible urban planner anywhere on the planet that would use pre COVID traffic statistics to make post-pandemic regional transportation infrastructure decisions. The world has fundamentally changed. How, when, and where people work and live has changed. Can’t we at least get updated transportation studies so we can make an informed decisions?

If anything, that makes the 2019 numbers more conservative since fewer people are going downtown and more people are working from home and will want to run errands in their neighborhoods during the day. So you are basically saying that the bike lanes are a good thing to help support businesses in a post-COVID world.

I agree.

Ummm, no. Transit ridership is 50% lower. So traffic may be through the roof. Maybe we should find out?

So you think post-COVID, there is more car traffic than pre-COVID?

There is NOTHING to support that assertion in any jurisdiction.

This you? We need fresh so we don’t totally screw this up for a generation and kill uptown and downtown businesses along the way.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/16/hybrid-work-schedules-pandemic-commuting/

Please show a study that shows that bike lanes kill businesses.

The businesses that get get out of their leases are already leaving. What other proof do you need?

Businesses leaving three years before this is implemented are not leaving because of the bike lanes.

Most commercial leases are for 5 years. Some even for ten. When our ANC commissioners and the bike mafia hears “lease” they think it’s like the 1 year lease on their rental apartments. There is a reason we have age limits to run for federal offices. Stating to think we need that at the ANC level.

So when can we expect you to throw your hat in the ring?

Wish I could but we have three kids in two separate schools. They play travel sports in three different states depending on the weekend. Also trying to get two of them religious education. We both work and have a mortgage. And we care for two aging parents. In our spare time we take of our yard.

And you have….a bike.

DP. Sounds like you have a very strong set of values and priorities - that’s great! You can understand that a majority of other people value something differently, which is why this change is happening

It’s not a majority of people. Ward 3 Bikes had a candidate forum tonight and 20 people showed up. Which is about as many people who want these bikes lanes. The majority of people are too busy to even know this is happening.

Was more like 45, but we all know your side has problems with counting and numbers, so I'll let that slide.

Yeah, but 18 were candidates. So 20 supporters is about right. Where were the other 80,000 residents of Ward 3? Oh yeah, they didn’t know about this either.

It was supposed to be rainign with a lightning warning in effect. of course that would depress attendence. No one was expecting hordes of attendees.

Oh, so people won’t use bikes in bad weather? Well that’s totally obvious. Let’s explore this point some more.

No, it was also Rosh Hashonnah. It was clearly a hastily put together event, but from the pictures on social media, it looked like a nice time.

getting 45 people from on interest group to a last-minute event for a single ward on Rosh Hashanah is actually not bad turnout?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It's in everyone's interest -- drivers, pedestrians, cyclists -- to have any much car traffic moving as efficiently as possible on major roads, ie any street named after a state. That's what they were designed for and that's where everyone expects there to be lots of traffic. When we force drivers to start cutting through neighborhoods on side streets because the main arteries are clogged, that's when we're asking for trouble.

It is also in everyone's interest to have roads where pedestrians, cyclists and drivers, can move about their business in a safe manner. When a road is designed such that someone operating a car can move fast enough that they overturn it, as happened on Connecticut Avenue earlier this month, that is problematic. I am not sure why anyone would defend the status quo, which is clearly unsafe.

We'd all be better off if the handful of dudes super into bikes would just take the subway.

If I want to go from Chevy Chase to Vace, the Metro isn't really going to help me.

You're in luck! It turns out there is also a city bus system!

It is faster for me to bike. I would just like to do it safely.

Call me crazy but the city shouldnt have to spend billions of dollars and screw up traffic for hundreds of thousands of people because you and a handful of other Bernie bros don't like the bus

PP either has a terrible grasp of numbers or a terrible grasp of the truth but DC does not spend billions on bike and pedestrian infrastructure - in fact it is less than 5% of DDOT's massive budget which is astonishing because most people in DC get around every day in some manner without using a vehicle.

Obviously the city doesnt spend billions in one year, but over the years? Yes, of course it has spend billions. We've had bike lanes in this city for almost 15 years.

No really DC has not spent billions.

I would be shocked if DC has even spent 50 million on bike lanes over the last 10 years.

DC doesn't even have 20 miles of protected bike lanes in the entire city.

Connecticut Avenue is estimated to cost about 8 million for 3 miles but that estimate includes a couple of hawk signals and some pedestrian islands and lots of design work. I'm pretty sure the CP streetscape improvement project is costing more by itself.

Most of the bike lanes we have in DC are just paint and some signs which is to say they are very inexpensive projects - as in like $10-$15000 for an entire project.

Just as an FYI DDOTs FY 2023 capital budget is $650 million, most of which goes towards repaving roads. DDOT has over 200 full time traffic engineers but just 2 staffers who work on bike lanes full time so on the personnel side as well spending on roads just swamps what is spent on bikes.

Uh, well here's a sampling from this year's budget alone:

$36 million to expand bike lanes
$15 million to expand Capital Bikeshare
$1.3 million to hire a full-time team to clean bike lanes
$57 million to make K Street more bike/bus friendly
$21 million to build bike/pedestrian bridge
$18.5 million to build bike/pedestrian bridge
$120,000 to buy electric bikes

so basically a very small percentage for non-car transportation.

A pretty incredible amount of money given how few people use the bike lanes. Those lanes cost taxpayers hundreds of thousands of dollars per user.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm a commuter from MD so you can hate on me, but in our newly hybrid world, I will come into my DC office much less when these changes go into effect. I will spend a lot less money in DC than I have over the past 20yrs. And I will be driving all over DC neighborhoods when I do have to drive downtown. Especially if Beach Drive remains closed. I'm sure the 10 families and 20 Lance Armstrong wanna-bes who use the bikes lanes will be super happy, but having traversed this route over decades, I can assure you that there will be total gridlock and more accidents.

I live on a busy street in MD that gets a lot of NIH commuter traffic, so I understand why residents want to find ways to incentivize options other than car travel. But realistically all the bike lane plan will accomplish is diverting traffic to neighborhood streets, creating huge traffic jams, and reducing interest in working in downtown offices. I know the NWDC crowd thinks that's awesome, but the people who run small businesses and their employees may be less enamored of a city leadership that is actively encouraging smaller numbers of daily visitors.

Maybe you should take this energy and use it to advocate for traffic calming and transit in MoCo. It’s pretty hellish there, and one reason that I am likely staying in DC instead of moving to MoCo. In fact, the Ct Ave project is specifically one reason I might stay.

PS: you can drive to a metro station and metro in to DC. And no, you’re not going to be driving on side streets deep with Cleveland Park. That’s not actually how traffic works.

It's from Calvert Street to Chevy Chase Circle, not just Cleveland Park. There are a lot of side streets along that route and yes that is exactly how traffic works. If there's congestion then an alternate route is found.

Please read the traffic study. Traffic is largely REDUCED on ew side streets and INCREASED on other
major NS routes. https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/page_content/attachments/02_Conn%20Ave_Public%20Meeting_LR%232-Traff-Parking_FINAL_04012021.pdf. On EW side street where it does increase, the increase is something like 15% which will likely not even be noticeable.

And if you care so much, take the metro.

I did and I noticed a few things. It claims there will be a 1000% increase in bike commuters and that 7,000 cars will disappear. It used pandemic traffic numbers as its base. It looked at what happens if more people than anticipated use bikes but not what happens if less people use them. It says traffic will be diverted to GW Parkway and Georgia but not 16th, Reno, and Beach (the most logical alternative routes) let alone how people would get to Reno and Beach (ie: side streets). It is obvious that the study was done with an end goal in mind and was massaged accordingly.

False. The traffic numbers are from 2019.

Try again.

I’m not sure there is a credible urban planner anywhere on the planet that would use pre COVID traffic statistics to make post-pandemic regional transportation infrastructure decisions. The world has fundamentally changed. How, when, and where people work and live has changed. Can’t we at least get updated transportation studies so we can make an informed decisions?

If anything, that makes the 2019 numbers more conservative since fewer people are going downtown and more people are working from home and will want to run errands in their neighborhoods during the day. So you are basically saying that the bike lanes are a good thing to help support businesses in a post-COVID world.

I agree.

Ummm, no. Transit ridership is 50% lower. So traffic may be through the roof. Maybe we should find out?

So you think post-COVID, there is more car traffic than pre-COVID?

There is NOTHING to support that assertion in any jurisdiction.

This you? We need fresh so we don’t totally screw this up for a generation and kill uptown and downtown businesses along the way.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/16/hybrid-work-schedules-pandemic-commuting/

Please show a study that shows that bike lanes kill businesses.

The businesses that get get out of their leases are already leaving. What other proof do you need?

Businesses leaving three years before this is implemented are not leaving because of the bike lanes.

Most commercial leases are for 5 years. Some even for ten. When our ANC commissioners and the bike mafia hears “lease” they think it’s like the 1 year lease on their rental apartments. There is a reason we have age limits to run for federal offices. Stating to think we need that at the ANC level.

So when can we expect you to throw your hat in the ring?

Wish I could but we have three kids in two separate schools. They play travel sports in three different states depending on the weekend. Also trying to get two of them religious education. We both work and have a mortgage. And we care for two aging parents. In our spare time we take of our yard.

And you have….a bike.

DP. Sounds like you have a very strong set of values and priorities - that’s great! You can understand that a majority of other people value something differently, which is why this change is happening

It’s not a majority of people. Ward 3 Bikes had a candidate forum tonight and 20 people showed up. Which is about as many people who want these bikes lanes. The majority of people are too busy to even know this is happening.

Was more like 45, but we all know your side has problems with counting and numbers, so I'll let that slide.

Yeah, but 18 were candidates. So 20 supporters is about right. Where were the other 80,000 residents of Ward 3? Oh yeah, they didn’t know about this either.

This is literally one of the longest threads on this site I’ve ever seen. People clearly know about this and don’t care about enough to do something about it.

Seriously, about 50 pages ago, I was thinking of announcing that I'd donate $1 to WABA for every additional page that this thread goes. The OP is clearly not posting in good faith, and just repeats themselves over and over hoping that others don't notice that the same points have been made and rebutted numerous times.

So, anyone else want to join me? I'll be sending $1 to the Washington Area Bicyclist Association for every page over 100 on this thread. What a fun way to support new cycling infrastructure!

[Anonymous]

I had the opportunity over the weekend to talk to a few of my neighbors about the bike lanes (and the had spoken to other neighbors previously) - we live close to Connecticut Avenue. After about a 20 minute discussion, we determined that on our block, there are two households vehemently opposed, and everyone is for. No one sees it as that big of a deal and appears to be a way of significantly improve the quality of life on the corridor.

The people opposed post all the time on our neighborhood email list.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's in everyone's interest -- drivers, pedestrians, cyclists -- to have any much car traffic moving as efficiently as possible on major roads, ie any street named after a state. That's what they were designed for and that's where everyone expects there to be lots of traffic. When we force drivers to start cutting through neighborhoods on side streets because the main arteries are clogged, that's when we're asking for trouble.

+1. And it could be even worse on the weekends when tourists heading to the Zoo get routed by Waze onto Reno and into the neighborhoods. It’s completely foreseeable, sadly. Homeowners on side streets adjacent to Connecticut will get no relief.

Maybe this will encourage more people to use the metro that is conveniently located near the Zoo!
I think the 89 pages of this thread show pretty clearly that it is not in cyclists and pedestrian interest to keep things as they are, but you can keep chatting into the void.

Don't we all know how this movie is going to end? This plan is never going to take effect and, if it does, it will quickly be rescinded. It would be career suicide for city council members to create traffic Armageddon that pisses off hundreds of thousands of people for the sake of, like, nine guys who are really into bikes.

+1

+2. Go on Twitter. Follow Bike Lane Squaters of DC. Behold daily pictures of blocked bike lanes all over the city, INCLUDING the beloved concrete “protected” bike lanes. And you want to bring this junk to Connecticut Ave? Stop hiding behind studies. People can see with their own eyes that it’s not going to work.

That's hilarious. Love the government vehicles parked in bike lanes.

Spending a bajillion dollars on bike lanes only to have people use them to park their cars and the city does nothing about it is the most DC thing ever.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I had the opportunity over the weekend to talk to a few of my neighbors about the bike lanes (and the had spoken to other neighbors previously) - we live close to Connecticut Avenue. After about a 20 minute discussion, we determined that on our block, there are two households vehemently opposed, and everyone is for. No one sees it as that big of a deal and appears to be a way of significantly improve the quality of life on the corridor.

The people opposed post all the time on our neighborhood email list.

Did you ask them whether they were in favor of bike lanes or whether they were in favor of permanently closing two lanes of traffic on Connecticut Avenue?

It's the shutting down two lanes of traffic that people are complaining about.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I'm a commuter from MD so you can hate on me, but in our newly hybrid world, I will come into my DC office much less when these changes go into effect. I will spend a lot less money in DC than I have over the past 20yrs. And I will be driving all over DC neighborhoods when I do have to drive downtown. Especially if Beach Drive remains closed. I'm sure the 10 families and 20 Lance Armstrong wanna-bes who use the bikes lanes will be super happy, but having traversed this route over decades, I can assure you that there will be total gridlock and more accidents.

I live on a busy street in MD that gets a lot of NIH commuter traffic, so I understand why residents want to find ways to incentivize options other than car travel. But realistically all the bike lane plan will accomplish is diverting traffic to neighborhood streets, creating huge traffic jams, and reducing interest in working in downtown offices. I know the NWDC crowd thinks that's awesome, but the people who run small businesses and their employees may be less enamored of a city leadership that is actively encouraging smaller numbers of daily visitors.

Maybe you should take this energy and use it to advocate for traffic calming and transit in MoCo. It’s pretty hellish there, and one reason that I am likely staying in DC instead of moving to MoCo. In fact, the Ct Ave project is specifically one reason I might stay.

PS: you can drive to a metro station and metro in to DC. And no, you’re not going to be driving on side streets deep with Cleveland Park. That’s not actually how traffic works.

It's from Calvert Street to Chevy Chase Circle, not just Cleveland Park. There are a lot of side streets along that route and yes that is exactly how traffic works. If there's congestion then an alternate route is found.

Please read the traffic study. Traffic is largely REDUCED on ew side streets and INCREASED on other
major NS routes. https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/page_content/attachments/02_Conn%20Ave_Public%20Meeting_LR%232-Traff-Parking_FINAL_04012021.pdf. On EW side street where it does increase, the increase is something like 15% which will likely not even be noticeable.

And if you care so much, take the metro.

I did and I noticed a few things. It claims there will be a 1000% increase in bike commuters and that 7,000 cars will disappear. It used pandemic traffic numbers as its base. It looked at what happens if more people than anticipated use bikes but not what happens if less people use them. It says traffic will be diverted to GW Parkway and Georgia but not 16th, Reno, and Beach (the most logical alternative routes) let alone how people would get to Reno and Beach (ie: side streets). It is obvious that the study was done with an end goal in mind and was massaged accordingly.

False. The traffic numbers are from 2019.

Try again.

I’m not sure there is a credible urban planner anywhere on the planet that would use pre COVID traffic statistics to make post-pandemic regional transportation infrastructure decisions. The world has fundamentally changed. How, when, and where people work and live has changed. Can’t we at least get updated transportation studies so we can make an informed decisions?

If anything, that makes the 2019 numbers more conservative since fewer people are going downtown and more people are working from home and will want to run errands in their neighborhoods during the day. So you are basically saying that the bike lanes are a good thing to help support businesses in a post-COVID world.

I agree.

Ummm, no. Transit ridership is 50% lower. So traffic may be through the roof. Maybe we should find out?

So you think post-COVID, there is more car traffic than pre-COVID?

There is NOTHING to support that assertion in any jurisdiction.

This you? We need fresh so we don’t totally screw this up for a generation and kill uptown and downtown businesses along the way.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/16/hybrid-work-schedules-pandemic-commuting/

Please show a study that shows that bike lanes kill businesses.

The businesses that get get out of their leases are already leaving. What other proof do you need?

Businesses leaving three years before this is implemented are not leaving because of the bike lanes.

Most commercial leases are for 5 years. Some even for ten. When our ANC commissioners and the bike mafia hears “lease” they think it’s like the 1 year lease on their rental apartments. There is a reason we have age limits to run for federal offices. Stating to think we need that at the ANC level.

So when can we expect you to throw your hat in the ring?

Wish I could but we have three kids in two separate schools. They play travel sports in three different states depending on the weekend. Also trying to get two of them religious education. We both work and have a mortgage. And we care for two aging parents. In our spare time we take of our yard.

And you have….a bike.

DP. Sounds like you have a very strong set of values and priorities - that’s great! You can understand that a majority of other people value something differently, which is why this change is happening

It’s not a majority of people. Ward 3 Bikes had a candidate forum tonight and 20 people showed up. Which is about as many people who want these bikes lanes. The majority of people are too busy to even know this is happening.

Was more like 45, but we all know your side has problems with counting and numbers, so I'll let that slide.

Yeah, but 18 were candidates. So 20 supporters is about right. Where were the other 80,000 residents of Ward 3? Oh yeah, they didn’t know about this either.

This is literally one of the longest threads on this site I’ve ever seen. People clearly know about this and don’t care about enough to do something about it.

Seriously, about 50 pages ago, I was thinking of announcing that I'd donate $1 to WABA for every additional page that this thread goes. The OP is clearly not posting in good faith, and just repeats themselves over and over hoping that others don't notice that the same points have been made and rebutted numerous times.

So, anyone else want to join me? I'll be sending $1 to the Washington Area Bicyclist Association for every page over 100 on this thread. What a fun way to support new cycling infrastructure!

Now you're fundraising? That's full Trump

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Anonymous wrote:I'm a commuter from MD so you can hate on me, but in our newly hybrid world, I will come into my DC office much less when these changes go into effect. I will spend a lot less money in DC than I have over the past 20yrs. And I will be driving all over DC neighborhoods when I do have to drive downtown. Especially if Beach Drive remains closed. I'm sure the 10 families and 20 Lance Armstrong wanna-bes who use the bikes lanes will be super happy, but having traversed this route over decades, I can assure you that there will be total gridlock and more accidents.

I live on a busy street in MD that gets a lot of NIH commuter traffic, so I understand why residents want to find ways to incentivize options other than car travel. But realistically all the bike lane plan will accomplish is diverting traffic to neighborhood streets, creating huge traffic jams, and reducing interest in working in downtown offices. I know the NWDC crowd thinks that's awesome, but the people who run small businesses and their employees may be less enamored of a city leadership that is actively encouraging smaller numbers of daily visitors.

Maybe you should take this energy and use it to advocate for traffic calming and transit in MoCo. It’s pretty hellish there, and one reason that I am likely staying in DC instead of moving to MoCo. In fact, the Ct Ave project is specifically one reason I might stay.

PS: you can drive to a metro station and metro in to DC. And no, you’re not going to be driving on side streets deep with Cleveland Park. That’s not actually how traffic works.

It's from Calvert Street to Chevy Chase Circle, not just Cleveland Park. There are a lot of side streets along that route and yes that is exactly how traffic works. If there's congestion then an alternate route is found.

Please read the traffic study. Traffic is largely REDUCED on ew side streets and INCREASED on other
major NS routes. https://ddot.dc.gov/sites/default/files/dc/sites/ddot/page_content/attachments/02_Conn%20Ave_Public%20Meeting_LR%232-Traff-Parking_FINAL_04012021.pdf. On EW side street where it does increase, the increase is something like 15% which will likely not even be noticeable.

And if you care so much, take the metro.

I did and I noticed a few things. It claims there will be a 1000% increase in bike commuters and that 7,000 cars will disappear. It used pandemic traffic numbers as its base. It looked at what happens if more people than anticipated use bikes but not what happens if less people use them. It says traffic will be diverted to GW Parkway and Georgia but not 16th, Reno, and Beach (the most logical alternative routes) let alone how people would get to Reno and Beach (ie: side streets). It is obvious that the study was done with an end goal in mind and was massaged accordingly.

False. The traffic numbers are from 2019.

Try again.

I’m not sure there is a credible urban planner anywhere on the planet that would use pre COVID traffic statistics to make post-pandemic regional transportation infrastructure decisions. The world has fundamentally changed. How, when, and where people work and live has changed. Can’t we at least get updated transportation studies so we can make an informed decisions?

If anything, that makes the 2019 numbers more conservative since fewer people are going downtown and more people are working from home and will want to run errands in their neighborhoods during the day. So you are basically saying that the bike lanes are a good thing to help support businesses in a post-COVID world.

I agree.

Ummm, no. Transit ridership is 50% lower. So traffic may be through the roof. Maybe we should find out?

So you think post-COVID, there is more car traffic than pre-COVID?

There is NOTHING to support that assertion in any jurisdiction.

This you? We need fresh so we don’t totally screw this up for a generation and kill uptown and downtown businesses along the way.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/09/16/hybrid-work-schedules-pandemic-commuting/

Please show a study that shows that bike lanes kill businesses.

The businesses that get get out of their leases are already leaving. What other proof do you need?

Businesses leaving three years before this is implemented are not leaving because of the bike lanes.

Most commercial leases are for 5 years. Some even for ten. When our ANC commissioners and the bike mafia hears “lease” they think it’s like the 1 year lease on their rental apartments. There is a reason we have age limits to run for federal offices. Stating to think we need that at the ANC level.

So when can we expect you to throw your hat in the ring?

Wish I could but we have three kids in two separate schools. They play travel sports in three different states depending on the weekend. Also trying to get two of them religious education. We both work and have a mortgage. And we care for two aging parents. In our spare time we take of our yard.

And you have….a bike.

DP. Sounds like you have a very strong set of values and priorities - that’s great! You can understand that a majority of other people value something differently, which is why this change is happening

It’s not a majority of people. Ward 3 Bikes had a candidate forum tonight and 20 people showed up. Which is about as many people who want these bikes lanes. The majority of people are too busy to even know this is happening.

Was more like 45, but we all know your side has problems with counting and numbers, so I'll let that slide.

Yeah, but 18 were candidates. So 20 supporters is about right. Where were the other 80,000 residents of Ward 3? Oh yeah, they didn’t know about this either.

This is literally one of the longest threads on this site I’ve ever seen. People clearly know about this and don’t care about enough to do something about it.

Seriously, about 50 pages ago, I was thinking of announcing that I'd donate $1 to WABA for every additional page that this thread goes. The OP is clearly not posting in good faith, and just repeats themselves over and over hoping that others don't notice that the same points have been made and rebutted numerous times.

So, anyone else want to join me? I'll be sending $1 to the Washington Area Bicyclist Association for every page over 100 on this thread. What a fun way to support new cycling infrastructure!

You are wrong.

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Anonymous wrote:I had the opportunity over the weekend to talk to a few of my neighbors about the bike lanes (and the had spoken to other neighbors previously) - we live close to Connecticut Avenue. After about a 20 minute discussion, we determined that on our block, there are two households vehemently opposed, and everyone is for. No one sees it as that big of a deal and appears to be a way of significantly improve the quality of life on the corridor.

The people opposed post all the time on our neighborhood email list.

Did you ask them whether they were in favor of bike lanes or whether they were in favor of permanently closing two lanes of traffic on Connecticut Avenue?

It's the shutting down two lanes of traffic that people are complaining about.

+1 A lot of us are for bike lanes and more riders (for those who can) but against screwing up Connecticut Ave and routing more frustrated drivers into the neighborhood and specifically onto Reno.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I had the opportunity over the weekend to talk to a few of my neighbors about the bike lanes (and the had spoken to other neighbors previously) - we live close to Connecticut Avenue. After about a 20 minute discussion, we determined that on our block, there are two households vehemently opposed, and everyone is for. No one sees it as that big of a deal and appears to be a way of significantly improve the quality of life on the corridor.

The people opposed post all the time on our neighborhood email list.

7000+ a day cars through the neighborhood streets isn’t a big deal?

[Anonymous]

According to DDOT 300 bicycle trips a day are made on the 3 mile stretch of Connecticut in question.

According to DDOT 30,000 car trips a day are made on that same stretch.