US soccer rumors of changing back age groups?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I never really get all the "grade year" arguments. We did not have a "grade year" cutoff in soccer before. August 1st was not grade year - it is two months off of the Virginia school cutoff date. So in Virginia soccer we went from 2 months off the school cutoff with Aug 1st to 3 months off the cutoff with birth year. But this 5 month move completely changed who received the relative age advantage which I think is the root of all these discussions not "grade year".

And now the ones with the advantage are in a panic it will be whipped out from under them, of course.

This is an over-competitive parent thing. Very few, if any, of the kids would want this changed again. My son is in the latter part of the birth year. He was "disadvantaged" by the birth year change. He would not want his team broken up to re-obtain his "advantage".

+1. My daughter is the same. She is one of the few who are Late part of the year, but would be so upset to leave her friends. That said I’m not looking forward to the trapped year in current system when most of the team is in high school and she is in 8th grade.

It’s my kid this year. It sucks, fwiw.

Happened to my kid too, and it really does suck.

[Anonymous]

if it doesn't come from US Soccer, then a rumor is just a rumor for 1 blog.

[Anonymous]

^ this isn’t talent, idiot. This is a kid not having a team for a season because they are “trapped”. Tell your kid he can’t play spring season—see what he thinks about that.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I really hope they do switch back to the age groupings aligning with school year. This current system of birth year is not pretty when they are in HS and have a fall birthday. My daughter's team is mostly a grade ahead, she will be playing with a completely different team her senior year as the rest of the team will have graduated.

Translation, my kid is a September born kid.

I love people who throw this out there as though parents of kids with fall birth dates are looking for an advantage. I'm not the PP, but my daughter is a late October birthday. She plays ECNL at a top club and has totally benefited from playing with "older" players the past few years. That being said, it sucks for these kids when they are in 8th grade and there is no fall club season (our state plays HS in the fall) because the majority of their teammates are playing HS. Moving to grad year lets every kid have a team to play on every year. What is the negative? And if your kid is good enough for YNT camp invites, changing to grad year won't hurt them--they are already known.

Aww poor 8th grade.

Blame HS soccer. The passion to play crappy HS soccer is your problem not the age cutoff.

Facts. HS soccer is dead weight for top players.

Tell that to some of the GDA YNT players that still play HS. Doesn't seem to be hurting their standing with US Soccer.... Leading scorer in U18/19 GDA last year played HS.

Wrong again. 95% of YNT players are coming from the DA. The U16 team is entirely DA. US Soccer will continue to phase out those types of players. Every year, they select less and less. This is no accident either.

You clearly did not read the comment... There are YNT players that are playing in GDA but are on waivers every season to allow them to play HS. They are not phasing those kids out. The leading scorer from last year in GDA (18/19) is from NEFC. She plays HS soccer in the fall and has every year. She was called in to the U20's in December. She's not being phased out.

What I didn't add is what I said after that. It starts with phasing out the ECNL. Then they go for the part timers. And nobody is talking about U20s. Legacy YNT players that came up through the ECNL are what was the top at the time. They will do it through the younger age groups.

Sorry, but you are completely wrong. The kids that are top players will continue to receive waivers. This does not apply to players 6-20 on a GDA roster. Those kids are not getting a look for YNT camps anyway. South Shore Select has a U16 player that plays up 2 years on the U18 YNT--some would argue that the club is in GDA because of this player. She plays HS and will continue to receive a waiver for as long as she wants. And US Soccer will continue to call her in. The top players can do whatever they want.

It doesn't apply to the top 1-2 players. On that I agree. It will apply to everyone else, which is the vast majority. If you are Tobin Heath outstanding, then you are in. But even in YNT players, those are few and very far between. In fact, most YNT players don't make it to U23 and beyond. I know several players, good players, who were going to YNT events, camps, going out to California, and then slowly found themselves phased out.

Your argument is weak. Anyone below top 5 on a GDA roster isn't getting a look for YNT call ups. And if the kids that are top 1-2 are the ones that are getting called in AND can still play in HS if they choose (and many do), then US Soccer is not taking the stand that you claim. So players 5-20 on the GDA roster follow the rules in order to preserve a potential YNT camp invite that will never happen anyway. Makes total sense.

I was talking top 1-2 of a YNT roster, not a GDA roster.

So what is your point? The top 1-2 on a YNT roster accounts for about .000001% of kids playing soccer. If your argument is that only those GDA kids are granted waivers and/or using the roster loophole to play HS, you'd be wrong.

The replaceable kids follow the rules, the top 3-4 at any GDA club can do whatever they want. US Soccer allows it, so GDA will never have every player give up HS.

My point was pretty obvious. The top 1-2 players of a YNT roster may be exceptional and US Soccer overlooks them playing high school and other non-save. But the general expectation is that YNT players play DA and don't play High school.

But that completely crushes your argument that HS is "dead weight" for top players and that US Soccer will "phase out" players that don't comply. If the top 1-2 players on a YNT can play HS and not be adversely affected, and US Soccer allows it because they continue to be called in, played up an age group, etc., then why hold "lesser" players to a rule that you don't require the top players to follow? Same at the club level. The players that play HS are the top players at their GDA club. Lower level players are required to follow the rules, yet the top players manage to play HS and are still the top players when they join the team 6-7 games into the season.

I didn't say they weren't adversely affected. They are just so talented in these rare exceptions that they get away with it both as players and in front of US Soccer. I don't even know how many unicorns there really are. Someone said that SSS has a U16 girl. I'm not from that area or club, so I'm just taking it on faith. All the YNT players I know of don't play High school, girls and boys. Quite frankly, top players often find high school soccer Annoying.

But just because we can find some exception to the rule doesn't mean they aren't an exception, or that there isn't a rule.

The point is the US Soccer looks the other way on the rule. Often. They rail against HS soccer, yet several GDA players play HS soccer. If you are going to “draw a line in the sand”, then you have to enforce the rule 100% of the time. That’s not happening with GDA and I doubt it ever will.

No, it doesn't often look the other way. SSS is a special case anyways because they just recently joined the DA and don't have a full DA anyways. But it doesn't look the other way and doesn't have to. The vast majority are in DA and playing the full year. You found a union. That's fine. Exceptions are just that, and nothing more.

So, it’s becoming clear that you don’t know what you’re talking about. Look at any team in the Northeast division as an example. You will see at least one kid (often times 2,3 or 4) PER TEAM that don’t play in any games until after the fall HS season is over. I’d be shocked if you can find a single team without at least one waivered player. This is not a situation of one unicorn player at SSS. NEFC has full GDA and is probably the top club in the NE. They have multiple kids on every team on waivers. Again, US Soccer allows it so that clubs can keep players and GDA can stay afloat. Maybe “looking the other way” is the wrong way to describe it. US Soccer allows it.

That may be the case in up north. There has always been a big private school country, and it's been that way since the colonial days. Look across the nation though and it's not. The YNTs do not have multiple waiver players, and it's not an issue in California or Texas.

There are plenty of GDAs, sometimes entire states, with no waiver players, and when it comes to the YNTs, those players are typically not wavered players. You just don't have enough large scale information on your hands. But right now, they haven't even focused on that. They are phasing out the ECNL first. They will get to the waiver/part time players. They've done this before with the boys, and they will do it again.

[Anonymous]

My kid is a late December '05, one of those "trapped" kids whose team will largely be playing HS soccer this spring while he is still in 8th grade. That said, we just went through the age group change three years ago and it totally messed up his team then. I wouldn't want to have to go through that again.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ this isn’t talent, idiot. This is a kid not having a team for a season because they are “trapped”. Tell your kid he can’t play spring season—see what he thinks about that.

I really don’t understand the “trap” thing. A Fall birthday player can keep playing with his/her team be it playing up. The only issue is when kids leave their clubs at U18/19 due to college when your DC will be a Senior in HS. Otherwise, they can stay on the team assuming their performance is on par with the rest of the team.

My DD, late October BDAY, is still in elementary school while 98% of her team is in MS.

Please tell me what I’m missing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ this isn’t talent, idiot. This is a kid not having a team for a season because they are “trapped”. Tell your kid he can’t play spring season—see what he thinks about that.

I really don’t understand the “trap” thing. A Fall birthday player can keep playing with his/her team be it playing up. The only issue is when kids leave their clubs at U18/19 due to college when your DC will be a Senior in HS. Otherwise, they can stay on the team assuming their performance is on par with the rest of the team.

My DD, late October BDAY, is still in elementary school while 98% of her team is in MS.

Please tell me what I’m missing.

What you're missing is that some '05 teams will sit out the spring season, or scale back, because most of the kids are in ninth grade and are playing high school or JV soccer, but this leaves the eighth graders in the lurch. And I think you recognize the issue of when your kid is a senior and most of her team has already gone to college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ this isn’t talent, idiot. This is a kid not having a team for a season because they are “trapped”. Tell your kid he can’t play spring season—see what he thinks about that.

I really don’t understand the “trap” thing. A Fall birthday player can keep playing with his/her team be it playing up. The only issue is when kids leave their clubs at U18/19 due to college when your DC will be a Senior in HS. Otherwise, they can stay on the team assuming their performance is on par with the rest of the team.

My DD, late October BDAY, is still in elementary school while 98% of her team is in MS.

Please tell me what I’m missing.

What you're missing is that some '05 teams will sit out the spring season, or scale back, because most of the kids are in ninth grade and are playing high school or JV soccer, but this leaves the eighth graders in the lurch. And I think you recognize the issue of when your kid is a senior and most of her team has already gone to college.

This. There is no spring season/almost zero games for sons 2005 8th graders. It will continue to be like this unless they go back to align with school calendar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ this isn’t talent, idiot. This is a kid not having a team for a season because they are “trapped”. Tell your kid he can’t play spring season—see what he thinks about that.

I really don’t understand the “trap” thing. A Fall birthday player can keep playing with his/her team be it playing up. The only issue is when kids leave their clubs at U18/19 due to college when your DC will be a Senior in HS. Otherwise, they can stay on the team assuming their performance is on par with the rest of the team.

My DD, late October BDAY, is still in elementary school while 98% of her team is in MS.

Please tell me what I’m missing.

What you're missing is that some '05 teams will sit out the spring season, or scale back, because most of the kids are in ninth grade and are playing high school or JV soccer, but this leaves the eighth graders in the lurch. And I think you recognize the issue of when your kid is a senior and most of her team has already gone to college.

This. There is no spring season/almost zero games for sons 2005 8th graders. It will continue to be like this unless they go back to align with school calendar.

Or the fall, if you are in Maryland (where high school soccer is a fall sport). If your club tries to have a team play a regular schedule during the high school soccer season, it is exhausting and unhealthy for high school players who are already playing at least 5 days per week. In addition, the full team, including the 8th graders can't practice together.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ this isn’t talent, idiot. This is a kid not having a team for a season because they are “trapped”. Tell your kid he can’t play spring season—see what he thinks about that.

I really don’t understand the “trap” thing. A Fall birthday player can keep playing with his/her team be it playing up. The only issue is when kids leave their clubs at U18/19 due to college when your DC will be a Senior in HS. Otherwise, they can stay on the team assuming their performance is on par with the rest of the team.

My DD, late October BDAY, is still in elementary school while 98% of her team is in MS.

Please tell me what I’m missing.

What you're missing is that some '05 teams will sit out the spring season, or scale back, because most of the kids are in ninth grade and are playing high school or JV soccer, but this leaves the eighth graders in the lurch. And I think you recognize the issue of when your kid is a senior and most of her team has already gone to college.

This. There is no spring season/almost zero games for sons 2005 8th graders. It will continue to be like this unless they go back to align with school calendar.

Let's change everything for the 8th graders. smh

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:^ this isn’t talent, idiot. This is a kid not having a team for a season because they are “trapped”. Tell your kid he can’t play spring season—see what he thinks about that.

I really don’t understand the “trap” thing. A Fall birthday player can keep playing with his/her team be it playing up. The only issue is when kids leave their clubs at U18/19 due to college when your DC will be a Senior in HS. Otherwise, they can stay on the team assuming their performance is on par with the rest of the team.

My DD, late October BDAY, is still in elementary school while 98% of her team is in MS.

Please tell me what I’m missing.

What you're missing is that some '05 teams will sit out the spring season, or scale back, because most of the kids are in ninth grade and are playing high school or JV soccer, but this leaves the eighth graders in the lurch. And I think you recognize the issue of when your kid is a senior and most of her team has already gone to college.

This. There is no spring season/almost zero games for sons 2005 8th graders. It will continue to be like this unless they go back to align with school calendar.

Let's change everything for the 8th graders. smh

Let’s change everything for high school soccer.

[Anonymous]

What would the new age bracket be? (Would July end up being the youngest, or oldest, on the team?

[Anonymous]

It is still a rumor, but the old age groups started August 1, so July would be the youngest.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is still a rumor, but the old age groups started August 1, so July would be the youngest.

It’s not even a rumor. There is no buzz, rumors or talk of this. I talk to a few friends who are connect to US soccer. Nothing. They are having trouble filling out the the youth coaching staff because of the requirement to move to Chicago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:[
Well said! Sampson’s with brains
quote=Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Where exactly have you been hearing this? I cannot imagine US Soccer would put everyone through a change again so soon, esp given that the rest of the world uses the current system.

Until I see it from the source, this just a rumor.

While I tend to agree it is probably a rumor, I have heard it from a number of different places in the last month or two. I am not sure where there is smoke there may not be a bit of fire. A decision may not be made, but I definitely believe it is being spoken about.

Birth year grouping creates "trapped players" in 8th grade and again in junior year of high school for players that are born Sept-Dec. My daughter plays at a big ECNL club (not in the DC area) and a coach recently alluded to a possible change to grad year. I would not be surprised to see this happen, and it might be driven by ECNL. Dealing with trapped players and creating composite teams for juniors and seniors is something that I'm sure they'd love to do away with. Additionally, it makes college recruiting much easier--coaches at showcases can watch a game where every kid has the same grad year.

DA/GDA kids don't play high school (except those on waivers), so they don't deal with the trapped player issue. However, if college coaches preferred showcases where players are grouped by grad year, that would certainly be something to think abouAs for the fact that the rest of the world follows birth year--the rest of the world isn't a crazy pay to play system and for academies in other countries, college placement is not a priority like it is for clubs here.

That is a plausible theory. Thanks.

Managing those 8th graders is a big problem for non-DA teams, even those who are not at the elite level.


Our club just combines all thr younger kids across several teams to form one eighth grade team for fall, and players go back to their regular team for winter/spring. Really not an insurmountable problem.