Is calling someone “chinaman” racist?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

N.P. Why did you feel the need to say that people are too sensitive about race in a thread which is really about whether the term "Chinaman" should have been used to describe an Asian American boy? This was clearly racist and a jerk thing to do. There is absolutely no need to complain about people being overly sensitive here.

It helps if you read the entire thread. This particular post came about because someone posted saying "tall Asian dude" vs "Chinamen", then someone said "tall Asian dude" was also racist. If I said "tall white guy" would that be racist?

So, yes, some people have a knee jerk reaction to any sentence that has someone's race in it. That was the point.

Consensus is that "chinaman" is clearly racist. But, "tall Asian dude" is not in any way racist.

-signed an Asian American

Ok, thank you for clarifying.

-also an Asian American

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm quite woke, thanks, and realize that in certain situations, using a race label is racist. However, I still think too many people are way too sensitive about race and do indeed have a knee jerk reaction to anything that has some race term.

Imagine that - people being too sensitive about the use of an actual racial slur! Maybe people are too sensitive about nooses and hoods too.

"that Asian guy" is not a racist slur, and neither is "that Black guy" or "that white guy". Good gracious.

Again, knee jerk reaction of "racism" to any sentence that has a word that references someone's race.

Asian is not a race! Some of us Asian-Americans don't like it used that way, because it raises the questions about our nationality in addition to how we look.

omg.. if talking about racial construct (which I realize is a cultural/societal construct), Asian is a race. My nationality is American. My ethnicity is some East Asian, and my race is Asian.

Yes, there are some white people who will never look at an Asian as a "real" American, but that's their problem, and I refuse to pretend that I'm not Asian in terms of my physical appearance because some white people are too racist and not "woke" to accept that you can both look Asian and be a real American at the same time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm quite woke, thanks, and realize that in certain situations, using a race label is racist. However, I still think too many people are way too sensitive about race and do indeed have a knee jerk reaction to anything that has some race term.

Imagine that - people being too sensitive about the use of an actual racial slur! Maybe people are too sensitive about nooses and hoods too.

"that Asian guy" is not a racist slur, and neither is "that Black guy" or "that white guy". Good gracious.

Again, knee jerk reaction of "racism" to any sentence that has a word that references someone's race.

N.P. Why did you feel the need to say that people are too sensitive about race in a thread which is really about whether the term "Chinaman" should have been used to describe an Asian American boy? This was clearly racist and a jerk thing to do. There is absolutely no need to complain about people being overly sensitive here.

It helps if you read the entire thread. This particular post came about because someone posted saying "tall Asian dude" vs "Chinamen", then someone said "tall Asian dude" was also racist. If I said "tall white guy" would that be racist?

So, yes, some people have a knee jerk reaction to any sentence that has someone's race in it. That was the point.

Consensus is that "chinaman" is clearly racist. But, "tall Asian dude" is not in any way racist.

-signed an Asian American

Jeremy Lin would think "tall Asian dude" when used in the basketball context would be somewhat racist. But it's all relative and if we're talking about elementary school (I assume) basketball, it wouldn't matter.

I doubt Lin would find that racist. If he didn't think the reporter who stated "chink in the armor" was being racist, I seriously doubt someone referring to him on the court as "that tall Asian dude" is racist. In a sea of mostly black players, calling him "the tall Asian dude" would be fine.

My DH is white. I'm Asian. When I tell someone who has never met us to look for us, I tell them to look for the tall white dude with a short Asian woman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Asian is not a race! Some of us Asian-Americans don't like it used that way, because it raises the questions about our nationality in addition to how we look.

omg.. if talking about racial construct (which I realize is a cultural/societal construct), Asian is a race. My nationality is American. My ethnicity is some East Asian, and my race is Asian.

Yes, there are some white people who will never look at an Asian as a "real" American, but that's their problem, and I refuse to pretend that I'm not Asian in terms of my physical appearance because some white people are too racist and not "woke" to accept that you can both look Asian and be a real American at the same time.

It's fine that you feel the way you do. Others of us feel differently. I don't know why you think it's so important to discount our feelings. Not every black person agrees on what is/isn't racist or acceptable either. You, random internet Asian-American person, don't get to decide for all Asian-Americans what matters and what is being over-sensitive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow, I haven’t heard that term since my dad died a few years ago.

At age 90.

It’s a term from a far more bigoted time.

Yeah, even my 90 year old grandparents say Oriental. Chinaman predates even that! What is this, 1875?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Asian is not a race! Some of us Asian-Americans don't like it used that way, because it raises the questions about our nationality in addition to how we look.

omg.. if talking about racial construct (which I realize is a cultural/societal construct), Asian is a race. My nationality is American. My ethnicity is some East Asian, and my race is Asian.

Yes, there are some white people who will never look at an Asian as a "real" American, but that's their problem, and I refuse to pretend that I'm not Asian in terms of my physical appearance because some white people are too racist and not "woke" to accept that you can both look Asian and be a real American at the same time.

It's fine that you feel the way you do. Others of us feel differently. I don't know why you think it's so important to discount our feelings. Not every black person agrees on what is/isn't racist or acceptable either. You, random internet Asian-American person, don't get to decide for all Asian-Americans what matters and what is being over-sensitive.

I got news for you - people aren't blind. Once they look at you they will know your race is Asian. So, if you get put out for someone stating that you are Asian, you're just making life harder for yourself.

My kids are biracial. I tell them to be proud of who they are, which includes both their races.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Asian is not a race! Some of us Asian-Americans don't like it used that way, because it raises the questions about our nationality in addition to how we look.

omg.. if talking about racial construct (which I realize is a cultural/societal construct), Asian is a race. My nationality is American. My ethnicity is some East Asian, and my race is Asian.

Yes, there are some white people who will never look at an Asian as a "real" American, but that's their problem, and I refuse to pretend that I'm not Asian in terms of my physical appearance because some white people are too racist and not "woke" to accept that you can both look Asian and be a real American at the same time.

It's fine that you feel the way you do. Others of us feel differently. I don't know why you think it's so important to discount our feelings. Not every black person agrees on what is/isn't racist or acceptable either. You, random internet Asian-American person, don't get to decide for all Asian-Americans what matters and what is being over-sensitive.

I'm not the Asian person above but another Asian American. I'm trying to understand where you're coming from but I'm just really confused. Is your position that any mention of "Asian" is racist? I think it would be sad for our family not to celebrate our Asian ancestry in any way. I'm proud of my Asian heritage and celebrate it and make sure my kids know about their family origins. This does not make me un-American in any way. Similarly, I feel that other non-Asian people should be both able to recognize my ethnicity/race and also accept the fact that I am as American as they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm quite woke, thanks, and realize that in certain situations, using a race label is racist. However, I still think too many people are way too sensitive about race and do indeed have a knee jerk reaction to anything that has some race term.

Imagine that - people being too sensitive about the use of an actual racial slur! Maybe people are too sensitive about nooses and hoods too.

"that Asian guy" is not a racist slur, and neither is "that Black guy" or "that white guy". Good gracious.

Again, knee jerk reaction of "racism" to any sentence that has a word that references someone's race.

N.P. Why did you feel the need to say that people are too sensitive about race in a thread which is really about whether the term "Chinaman" should have been used to describe an Asian American boy? This was clearly racist and a jerk thing to do. There is absolutely no need to complain about people being overly sensitive here.

It helps if you read the entire thread. This particular post came about because someone posted saying "tall Asian dude" vs "Chinamen", then someone said "tall Asian dude" was also racist. If I said "tall white guy" would that be racist?

So, yes, some people have a knee jerk reaction to any sentence that has someone's race in it. That was the point.

Consensus is that "chinaman" is clearly racist. But, "tall Asian dude" is not in any way racist.

-signed an Asian American

Jeremy Lin would think "tall Asian dude" when used in the basketball context would be somewhat racist. But it's all relative and if we're talking about elementary school (I assume) basketball, it wouldn't matter.

I doubt Lin would find that racist. If he didn't think the reporter who stated "chink in the armor" was being racist, I seriously doubt someone referring to him on the court as "that tall Asian dude" is racist. In a sea of mostly black players, calling him "the tall Asian dude" would be fine.

My DH is white. I'm Asian. When I tell someone who has never met us to look for us, I tell them to look for the tall white dude with a short Asian woman.

Well I believe Lin said that it was no big deal because he thought that it was an honest mistake or it wasn't intentional. Huge basketball fan here, but I can tell you this about JLin. During the NBA draft combine, he had clocked superior vertical and speed; in fact his 3/4 court spring was faster than John Wall, Derrick Rose, and Kyrie Irving (if you don't know who they are look them up). However here is how the media compared John Wall (which is known as one of the fastest, if not the fastest, players currently) and Jlin--John was "freakishly athletic" and JLin "deceptively athletic". Look it up. Now tell me, did being identified as Asian play a role in the basketball context?

I myself also have a lot of negative experiences with basketball just because I am Asian. I am by far not in the same league as Lin, but I definitely held my own in my predominantly white HS and all the varsity players thought I was a guarantee lock on the roster. You know the rest of the story.

[Anonymous]

I've been trying to get my dad (born in '53) to stop using this term my whole life. He picked the word up from the old cowboy movies/tv shows he compulsively watches. Looking very forward to reading some of this thread to him this holiday season. I probably won't change his mind but at least there's evidence that I'm not the only person who thinks it's wrong and am just making up something to argue about.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Asian is not a race! Some of us Asian-Americans don't like it used that way, because it raises the questions about our nationality in addition to how we look.

omg.. if talking about racial construct (which I realize is a cultural/societal construct), Asian is a race. My nationality is American. My ethnicity is some East Asian, and my race is Asian.

Yes, there are some white people who will never look at an Asian as a "real" American, but that's their problem, and I refuse to pretend that I'm not Asian in terms of my physical appearance because some white people are too racist and not "woke" to accept that you can both look Asian and be a real American at the same time.

It's fine that you feel the way you do. Others of us feel differently. I don't know why you think it's so important to discount our feelings. Not every black person agrees on what is/isn't racist or acceptable either. You, random internet Asian-American person, don't get to decide for all Asian-Americans what matters and what is being over-sensitive.

I got news for you - people aren't blind. Once they look at you they will know your race is Asian. So, if you get put out for someone stating that you are Asian, you're just making life harder for yourself.

My kids are biracial. I tell them to be proud of who they are, which includes both their races.

This discussion isn't about being proud or not proud of being Asian. It's that calling an Asian American "Asian" in casual conversation can at times be awkward and inappropriate. It "others" that person in certain contexts. People are responding to the person who said "don't be so sensitive" and it's never wrong or insulting to simply and solely identify and describe an Asian American as "Asian".

[Anonymous]

Easy racism test: If you wouldn't say it to their face it is racist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:racist. Even my 90 year old grandaparents call "them" "Orientals".

My Dad still calls Japanese, Tojo's. He is a WWII vet and good luck changing him.

Just because your Dad is ignorant doesn't mean everyone else is.

My father is a WW2 vet who fought in the European theater. My grandfather (maternal) is a WW2, former Wehrmacht officer. They got along great.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow, I haven’t heard that term since my dad died a few years ago.

At age 90.

It’s a term from a far more bigoted time.

That was my thought too..."Chinaman" is a term I'd expect to hear from someone born before 1920. How old is OP's dh?

Uh, no. My father was born in 1918 and I (born in 1966) *never* heard him use this word. Maybe he did back in the 30s, I have no idea. But not by the time I was around.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow, I haven’t heard that term since my dad died a few years ago.

At age 90.

It’s a term from a far more bigoted time.

That was my thought too..."Chinaman" is a term I'd expect to hear from someone born before 1920. How old is OP's dh?

Yeah, "Chinaman" is up there with "Oriental," which is what my grandmother said.

If the person was actually Chinese, that *might* be one thing, but I doubt your husband knew that, and most likely, the person was an American of Chinese descent--or Korean descent, or Thai descent, or whatever. So definitely racist and inappropriate.

Also, in general, making fun of someone to make yourself feel better is pretty awful, so that's not a coping strategy I'd be on board with.

Not exactly. Oriental just means of, from, or characteristic of East Asia. Just like Occidental means of, from, or characteristic of the Occident. Problem is that not enough people have any idea what or where the Occident is, and don't use the term. So people have now decided "Oriental" is offensive even though it literally means from East Asia.

ps. The Occident is the countries of the West, especially Europe and the Americas

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Asian is not a race! Some of us Asian-Americans don't like it used that way, because it raises the questions about our nationality in addition to how we look.

omg.. if talking about racial construct (which I realize is a cultural/societal construct), Asian is a race. My nationality is American. My ethnicity is some East Asian, and my race is Asian.

Yes, there are some white people who will never look at an Asian as a "real" American, but that's their problem, and I refuse to pretend that I'm not Asian in terms of my physical appearance because some white people are too racist and not "woke" to accept that you can both look Asian and be a real American at the same time.

It's fine that you feel the way you do. Others of us feel differently. I don't know why you think it's so important to discount our feelings. Not every black person agrees on what is/isn't racist or acceptable either. You, random internet Asian-American person, don't get to decide for all Asian-Americans what matters and what is being over-sensitive.

I got news for you - people aren't blind. Once they look at you they will know your race is Asian. So, if you get put out for someone stating that you are Asian, you're just making life harder for yourself.

My kids are biracial. I tell them to be proud of who they are, which includes both their races.

This discussion isn't about being proud or not proud of being Asian. It's that calling an Asian American "Asian" in casual conversation can at times be awkward and inappropriate. It "others" that person in certain contexts. People are responding to the person who said "don't be so sensitive" and it's never wrong or insulting to simply and solely identify and describe an Asian American as "Asian".

I'm that PP. I never said it was never wrong to call someone "Asian". I stated that some people are overly sensitive about race, and I stand by that statement. I was also responding to the person who stated that his/her race wasn't Asian ( though that person is ) because that person doesn't like it that some people don't consider Asian Americans as "real" Americans, as if not acknowledging your race is somehow going to magically make those people acknowledge that you are a "real" American.

Of course, context matters, but some people are just way too sensitive about race. That's not helping the dialogue, either.

If you get into an argument with your spouse, and you get too sensitive over some issue, the argument/conversation becomes counterproductive.