The Other VA publics: CNU, GM, JMU, Radford, ODU, UMW, VCU

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Big companies still go to all of these schools

After your first job no one cares where you went to school anyway

I went to JMU 10 years ago and I had a lot of fun

Now I make over 6 figures and I would have done just as well as any of the other colleges on this list

+1000

Times are different...where you go to grad school/professional school may matter more these days...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DD is considering all because:

1. UVA and W&M are a bit more difficult as her SAT is only 1300 , but GPA is above 4.0. 8 APs and 8 Honors

2. Pre-med/or another professional health interest (Dentistry, PA) so VCU, GMU, and JMU are part of that mix. Not sure how VT stands in comparison as I know UVA is strong in health professions.

Your daughter has a good record and UVA will give her a serious look. William & Mary won't, because she's a girl. They'll use her SATs an an excuse to ding her in favor of a less qualified boy.

I'd strongly recommend that she take a hard look at VCU for pre-med. They have some sort of guaranteed admission to their med school, and they're very good at health professions across the board. And they'd love to have her. She'd be much better off going there over JMU or GMU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Big companies still go to all of these schools

After your first job no one cares where you went to school anyway

I went to JMU 10 years ago and I had a lot of fun

Now I make over 6 figures and I would have done just as well as any of the other colleges on this list

Again, we know that. There's nothing wrong with JMU. I'm just saying that if you're from NOVA and truly are a borderline UVA admit, as was my daughter, it can be a let down to have to go there. Her high school probably sent two or three dozen kids there, including some good friends, none of whom performed as well as she did academically.

2017-2018 Freshman Enrollment from Fairfax County

GMU - 1,031
VT - 959
UVA - 680
JMU - 600

More likely to run into kids from your same high school at UVA than JMU.

I'm not the poster who said JMU is high school 2.0. The point is that our daughter was a better student than the two or three dozen of her classmates who went to JMU, and she wanted something better for her efforts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would send my kid to MSU for supply chain Econ, Chinese Studies or any Ag major/concentration. Zero hesitation.

Molestation State U?

Might as well include Pedophile State U too...

Real mature.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:The trashing that invariably happens on these threads is sick. How about some gratitude for the fantastic in-state options Virginia offers?

People always talk about the "fantastic" colleges available in Virginia, but beyond W&M, UVA, Tech, and JMU the other schools are on par with other states' public universitites.

Is JMU fantastic? By what measure? Just trying to be honest (and non-provincial) as ‘great’ and ‘fantastic’ get thrown around a lot. Test and gpa numbers, graduation rate, pretty much any ranking. Are comparably-ranked Stetson and Appy State great schools? In our school the top 10th/25th percentile students shoot for UVA/W&M/VPI(engineering) and the next tier shoot for JMU.

Agree. Our daughter made clear that after working her butt off in her NOVA public high school that it was UVA or out of state. There would be no “settling” for JMU, where kids from her class with a fraction of her AP courseload and GPA and test scores were going. It’s a top 1/3 kind of place. That’s it.

While that might be true, I honestly don't know, it sounds SO incredibly snotty and elitest. Also, new flash - just going to UVA does not automatically translate into EITHER a more successful career or, more importantly, a happy or fulfilled life. GET OVER YOURSELF. And even if your kid is a great fit for UVA, that does NOT make other choices bad or inappropriate for all the kids you clearly look down upon - ya know, the kids who are only in the top 1/3. You're nauseating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Big companies still go to all of these schools

After your first job no one cares where you went to school anyway

I went to JMU 10 years ago and I had a lot of fun

Now I make over 6 figures and I would have done just as well as any of the other colleges on this list

Again, we know that. There's nothing wrong with JMU. I'm just saying that if you're from NOVA and truly are a borderline UVA admit, as was my daughter, it can be a let down to have to go there. Her high school probably sent two or three dozen kids there, including some good friends, none of whom performed as well as she did academically.

2017-2018 Freshman Enrollment from Fairfax County

GMU - 1,031
VT - 959
UVA - 680
JMU - 600

More likely to run into kids from your same high school at UVA than JMU.

I'm not the poster who said JMU is high school 2.0. The point is that our daughter was a better student than the two or three dozen of her classmates who went to JMU, and she wanted something better for her efforts.

What an... interesting mindset.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Big companies still go to all of these schools

After your first job no one cares where you went to school anyway

I went to JMU 10 years ago and I had a lot of fun

Now I make over 6 figures and I would have done just as well as any of the other colleges on this list

Again, we know that. There's nothing wrong with JMU. I'm just saying that if you're from NOVA and truly are a borderline UVA admit, as was my daughter, it can be a let down to have to go there. Her high school probably sent two or three dozen kids there, including some good friends, none of whom performed as well as she did academically.

2017-2018 Freshman Enrollment from Fairfax County

GMU - 1,031
VT - 959
UVA - 680
JMU - 600

More likely to run into kids from your same high school at UVA than JMU.

I'm not the poster who said JMU is high school 2.0. The point is that our daughter was a better student than the two or three dozen of her classmates who went to JMU, and she wanted something better for her efforts.

Then she should have worked harder to get it. No participation trophies in college admissions. Stop whining and move on. The problem was that she and likely you as well were so hell bent on UVA that everywhere else was a runner up.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I've been watching GMU's progress over the past decade or so (I live nearby, use the gym, go to various events, took some graduate courses there for work, and have worked with some new hires from there) and it's been incredible to see the changes. It used to feel very much like a graduate heavy school--lots of master's and PhD programs--and a lot of commuter undergrads. There are now over 6000 students living on campus, so it's bustling all the time--even though a lot of students still commute (there's over 20K students) The diversity--and interaction between students from diverse groups--is impressive--not just racial/ethnic but also viewpoints. The new president Angel Cabrera is dynamic. They have a strong entrepreneurial push with lots of students starting up projects. Their pep band led by Doc Nix is very fun. There's a large group of international students. If feels different than just 5 years ago.
It has recently got R1 status (I think it's the one of the youngest institutions to do so)--which means it's one of the 115 most research intensive schools in the country, and many of its graduates earn quite a bit. The students strike me as serious. We've hired some CS/IT grads in our firm (a govt--IT consulting group) and they are quite good--hard workers, competent, able to pick up things. They aren't quite as articulate/polished as some of our recent hires from higher ranked schools (VTech and UVA), but they also don't seem as pampered. More pragmatic and able to get along and get things done.

+1

+2. I think GMU gets looked down on in NOVA because it is our “local” college and people are thinking circa 2005. Being a metro ride from DC and all the internship options, and in a highly educated diverse area, I think kids from NOVA below the top 10% but in the top 1/3 of FCPS would love to go— if it wasn’t so close to home and where they grew up. It’s CS school has a great reputation.

Eh. No thanks.

Agree. IT's a commuter school with no real campus or identity.

You're a little behind the times. The Carnegie Foundation for Teaching changed GMU's designation to residential in 2011. It also made is a R-1 (top research) university two years ago.

Where 3/4 live off-campus. So, commuter school.

You do realize most students (beyond freshmen) live off-campus at large universities, right? That doesn't make them "commuter schools."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Where 3/4 live off-campus. So, commuter school.

I would say a better definition of a commuter school would be one where a large number of the students live in the home where they grew up and/or a large number vacate the campus to go home on weekends.

Exactly. Big difference.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The trashing that invariably happens on these threads is sick. How about some gratitude for the fantastic in-state options Virginia offers?

People always talk about the "fantastic" colleges available in Virginia, but beyond W&M, UVA, Tech, and JMU the other schools are on par with other states' public universitites.

Is JMU fantastic? By what measure? Just trying to be honest (and non-provincial) as ‘great’ and ‘fantastic’ get thrown around a lot. Test and gpa numbers, graduation rate, pretty much any ranking. Are comparably-ranked Stetson and Appy State great schools? In our school the top 10th/25th percentile students shoot for UVA/W&M/VPI(engineering) and the next tier shoot for JMU.

Agree. Our daughter made clear that after working her butt off in her NOVA public high school that it was UVA or out of state. There would be no “settling” for JMU, where kids from her class with a fraction of her AP courseload and GPA and test scores were going. It’s a top 1/3 kind of place. That’s it.

So how is she doing at her out of state school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD is a senior applying early action to JMU and CNU. She's undecided/arts/humanities. I'm hopeful she'll be accepted to both (4.2 weighted 1300 SAT), but she may have a tough decision to make. She likes both a lot but for different reasons. I'm reading this thread with interest...

Your daughter should apply to UVA. She'd be in the running.

What if she prefers JMU and/or CNU?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DD is a senior applying early action to JMU and CNU. She's undecided/arts/humanities. I'm hopeful she'll be accepted to both (4.2 weighted 1300 SAT), but she may have a tough decision to make. She likes both a lot but for different reasons. I'm reading this thread with interest...

Your daughter should apply to UVA. She'd be in the running.

I feel like it wouldn't be impossible, but it might be tough. Plus, she didn't even want to look at the school. We toured W&M though and she didn't like the vibe or the campus at all. Oh well!

Same with my kids. Similar stats as your DD, but uninterested in either UVA or W&M.

[Anonymous]

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Yes, but it's amazing that we have three public schools that cover top-notch flagship, SLAC and tech. And then a whole crop of other schools that are as good as or better than the 1 flagship in another state. I think the one challenging thing is that UVA + W&M in numbers total less than the numbers at another state flagship so it gets very competitive.

We are lucky in VA, but I do think there are better (and still affordable) options for the kids that just miss out on UVA/W&M. I can see why someone would want their kid with maybe a 4.1 and 1460 SAT (who might be rejected from UVA/W&M) to go to an OOS school with a national reputation over JMU or GMU. It wouldn't necessarily have a higher cost than W&M with its $35K price tag.

I'm the poster with the strong student who made clear she'd be very unhappy going below UVA in state. That was exactly her thinking, and fortunately we had the money to pay for her to go anywhere. We weren't willing to pay full freight for a private school (to us, that made no sense for anything lower than top 10-15), so we said we'd pay for a strong OOS flagship. She got into a good one, paid the deposit, and would have been happy to go. But she ended up getting into UVA off the waitlist so it all ended well.

Well, that's the thing, isn't it? Not everyone has the money to pay OOS, and frankly, it's often even harder to get admitted as an OOS. My kid is a very strong student, they technically have the numbers that would put them in range at UVA or WM, but that's not a guarantee with all of the other high achieving students applying. I really hate the attitude that you and you your daughter are fostering that if a bright student doesn't get the golden ticket or possess $$$ they're doomed.

I'm not suggesting that you're "doomed" if you can't get into William & Mary or UVA in state and have to settle for another in state school. There's nothing wrong with JMU, GMU, etc., it's just that the gap between UVA/W&M and the other VA schools in terms of admission is so great -- JMU truly doesn't mean "Just Missed UVA" -- that there are many, many great schools falling somewhere in between. For example, other than Northwestern a borderline UVA admit from in state is a likely admit to every Big 10 school, most of which are great, fun, and have national reputations. If you can afford them, why not? They're certainly less expensive than private schools.

That is absolutely not certain. Many privates are a heckuva lot cheaper than OOS B10 schools.

After merit aid, maybe, but the best privates typically don't offer merit aid. I'm talking about full price for a top ranked private versus full price for OOS Big Ten. Big Ten is always cheaper.

Ugh. I feel like you are being deliberately obtuse.

First off, getting into a top ranked private is probably as difficult to get into as getting into UVA or harder, so it's not worth including them in this example.
Second, even if we go with your assumption that the OOS Big Ten will always be cheaper than the top private... that OOS Big Ten is STILL more expensive than in state VA.
I have found a few exceptions...
University of Missouri: if you have a certain GPA + SAT/ACT score, they will essentially make up the difference in cost for OOS student and will admit the student.
University of Alabama has similar type of offer.
Unless you are talking about the OOS options that bring the level back down to in-state cost, it is frustrating to hear you keep hammering away at OOS option, like it the obvious choice and anyone should automatically do it if they don't get into UVA.
As multiple people on this thread have explained, many solidly middle class people are not going to qualify for need-based aid, and are also not going to be able to afford OOS options.

Um . . . neither Missouri nor Alabama are in the Big Ten -- or as good as virtually any Big Ten school.

I also never said that OOS Big Ten cost the same as UVA in state. I said they're more expensive than in state UVA but less expensive than private but may still be worth the extra money over the other in state VA options because the Big Ten schools are better (generally) than those options.

Not being obtuse, deliberate or otherwise. I understand that some folks don't have the money to go OOS Big Ten and settle instead for JMU etc. That's fine.

DP. You are truly missing the point if you think students "settle" for JMU, etc. Many kids CHOOSE JMU over other, more widely recognized schools. Why? Because it's a great fit for them. JMU offers something for everyone. It's clear you can't imagine someone choosing JMU (or VT, or GMU, etc.) over your "Big Ten" wish list, but that's just ridiculous. My kids wouldn't want anything to do with a Big Ten school. Your first choice (or rather, your CHILD's first choice - hopefully) isn't at all what my kids' would be. Some people go for the right fit, period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP here. I should add that the total cost of JMU in state is only 27k, less than UVA. So really the question is whether 27 for JMU makes more sense than OOS Big Ten for 40 something. For many families it does. But the Big Ten schools are still better, obviously.

You are truly delusional. Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Michigan State, Nebraska, Ohio State, etc. are "better"?? What's with your weird Big 10 obsession? It's kind of sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Big companies still go to all of these schools

After your first job no one cares where you went to school anyway

I went to JMU 10 years ago and I had a lot of fun

Now I make over 6 figures and I would have done just as well as any of the other colleges on this list

Again, we know that. There's nothing wrong with JMU. I'm just saying that if you're from NOVA and truly are a borderline UVA admit, as was my daughter, it can be a let down to have to go there. Her high school probably sent two or three dozen kids there, including some good friends, none of whom performed as well as she did academically.

2017-2018 Freshman Enrollment from Fairfax County

GMU - 1,031
VT - 959
UVA - 680
JMU - 600

More likely to run into kids from your same high school at UVA than JMU.

I've never understood that line of thinking. I have three kids, all in VA state universities. They've all confirmed that it's a myth you'll run into people from high school all the time (or ever). Two of them at larger schools have never run into their former high school classmates.