DC council to hold hearings on decriminalizing fare evasion on the Metro.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You still get a ticket for fare evasion, it's just not a misdemeanor or felony.

Why can't officers be allowed to search a fare evader just as they currently would (because they'd be cuffing them)? Then the guns would still be found.

I'm for decriminalizing. It was done in SF and did not create an increase in fare evasion. That's the only data point I know of.

When something is decriminalized, it's basically sending a message to law enforcement that the misconduct is not important. Fare evasion is important, for two reasons. As we see, enforcement is a net that seems to ensnare bad guys. Second, Metro is turning over the sofa cushions looking for spare change. Why send a signal that fare evasion is a sound economic proposition, because the "penalty" is one is caught is likely to be no more than the cost of a cost of a couple of $20 smart cards?

So send a different message to LEOs. Are you saying cops are incapable of enforcing illegal activities that are mere violations? Because I sure as hell see a lot of cops making traffic stops.

How many traffic stops do you see MPD making in Washington, DC? Capitol Police, the Park Police and sometimes the Secret Service will make them, but MPD doesn't think they're important (and they don't like to get out of their cruisers).

Well obviously what you regularly see depends on where you regularly are in the District.
If you're regularly near the Capitol then yeah...odds are you're going to see Capitol Police pulling folks over.
If you're near major monuments/parks/Arlington Cemetary then yeah...odds are you're going to see the Park Police making stops quite often.
But if you ain't prone to cruising around Sheriff Road, Benning Road, West Virginia Avenue, Alabama Avenue, etc then no...you ain't gonna see a lotta MPD traffic stops.

The only time we've seen MPD officers outside their cruisers is when they're cruisin' the aisles of Best Buy, when they should be out walking a beat!

Lol well there’s your explanation right there. If you primarily hanging out by the Best Buy in Tenleytown you’re not going to see much that’s not exactly a preferred area for cops to get out of their cruisers and exercise their authority by interrogating loiterers, rousting vagrants, or bullying teenagers. They tend to like walking around flexing their muscles in “darker” parts of the city.

The ones at the Best Buy appear to be shopping while on duty, not "interrogating loiterers, rousting vagrants, or bullying teenagers." (Anyone who is familiar with Tenleytown knows that this never happens.). At least the Best Buy strollers are more active that some other cops from the Second District, some n of whom like to sleep in their police cruisers in the far part of the parking lot behind National Presbyterian.

+1. I’ve see some cops napping there also, on quiet afternoon when the parking lot is almost empty. It’s like s throwback to the DC of the Eighties.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are they engaging in violent behavior? Are they attacking pedestrians, robbing commuters, destroying property, stealing cars? Haven’t seen any such incidents reported - do local journalists and media outlets need to be more aggressive in covering these crimes?
Or is it more so a case of the mere presence of adolescents seems to be just too stressful for some people?

In fairness, those teens behave very poorly....shouting and screaming and generally making for an uncomfortable situation.

Ahhh...so that’s what it is.
They’re not attacking pedestrians, robbing commuters, destroying property, or stealing cars - you know, committing actual crimes - no they’re just being too boisterous for poor Ward and June Cleaver’s tender ears.
Well shit someone call the police!!!

Please. If these OOB mayhem makers aren’t going to behave civilly, they should be removed from the Wilson context.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why are they engaging in violent behavior? Are they attacking pedestrians, robbing commuters, destroying property, stealing cars? Haven’t seen any such incidents reported - do local journalists and media outlets need to be more aggressive in covering these crimes?
Or is it more so a case of the mere presence of adolescents seems to be just too stressful for some people?

In fairness, those teens behave very poorly....shouting and screaming and generally making for an uncomfortable situation.

Ahhh...so that’s what it is.
They’re not attacking pedestrians, robbing commuters, destroying property, or stealing cars - you know, committing actual crimes - no they’re just being too boisterous for poor Ward and June Cleaver’s tender ears.
Well shit someone call the police!!!

Please. If these OOB mayhem makers aren’t going to behave civilly, they should be removed from the Wilson context.

Awww poor baby are your tender ears irritated too?
Well I got bad news for ya Whiny, it’s not gonna happen cause if the school tried that bullshit they’d be getting hit with lawsuits left and right.
Seems incredulous, I know, but believe it or not your personal perception of “mayhem making” doesn’t fly as a criminal offense in a court of law.
When they leave campus after dismissal if they’re not breaking any laws the school doesn’t have the right to “remove them from the Wilson context” just cause that stick in your ass prohibits you from tolerating adolescents.

[Anonymous]

I've seen them throw rocks at cars and buses, stand against the flow of traffic and yell profanities at drivers. They also have beaten and knives each other (thankfully did not see that), just the police cars. I'm guessing that's the kind of law breaking/removal PP is referring to. Do you have a problem of some kind with civil society?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've seen them throw rocks at cars and buses, stand against the flow of traffic and yell profanities at drivers. They also have beaten and knives each other (thankfully did not see that), just the police cars. I'm guessing that's the kind of law breaking/removal PP is referring to. Do you have a problem of some kind with civil society?

Hey Ward/June Cleaver can you video these incidents for me?
You say they’re recurring and happen with relative frequency wherever Wilson kids are present so it shouldn’t be hard to get some footage, right?
I’d love to see.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've seen them throw rocks at cars and buses, stand against the flow of traffic and yell profanities at drivers. They also have beaten and knives each other (thankfully did not see that), just the police cars. I'm guessing that's the kind of law breaking/removal PP is referring to. Do you have a problem of some kind with civil society?

Hey Ward/June Cleaver can you video these incidents for me?
You say they’re recurring and happen with relative frequency wherever Wilson kids are present so it shouldn’t be hard to get some footage, right?
I’d love to see.

It shouldn't be too hard to identity the repeat troublemakers at Wilson and send them to a juvenile detention facility for a truly different kind of educational experience. I'd be all in favor of that. Why should a relatively small group disrupt Wilson for the other students, not to mention have a license to go wilding in Teneleytown in the afternoon? Wilson should expel them. There are plenty of deserving students who are willing to work hard, obey the rules (and the law) and would be glad to have the chance to go to Wilson.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've seen them throw rocks at cars and buses, stand against the flow of traffic and yell profanities at drivers. They also have beaten and knives each other (thankfully did not see that), just the police cars. I'm guessing that's the kind of law breaking/removal PP is referring to. Do you have a problem of some kind with civil society?

Hey Ward/June Cleaver can you video these incidents for me?
You say they’re recurring and happen with relative frequency wherever Wilson kids are present so it shouldn’t be hard to get some footage, right?
I’d love to see.

It shouldn't be too hard to identity the repeat troublemakers at Wilson and send them to a juvenile detention facility for a truly different kind of educational experience. I'd be all in favor of that. Why should a relatively small group disrupt Wilson for the other students, not to mention have a license to go wilding in Teneleytown in the afternoon? Wilson should expel them. There are plenty of deserving students who are willing to work hard, obey the rules (and the law) and would be glad to have the chance to go to Wilson.

Obviously you haven't been keeping up with the ongoing discussion about Wilson students. Frequent DCUM posters estimate the troublemakers constitute about 80-90% of the student body.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You still get a ticket for fare evasion, it's just not a misdemeanor or felony.

Why can't officers be allowed to search a fare evader just as they currently would (because they'd be cuffing them)? Then the guns would still be found.

I'm for decriminalizing. It was done in SF and did not create an increase in fare evasion. That's the only data point I know of.

When something is decriminalized, it's basically sending a message to law enforcement that the misconduct is not important. Fare evasion is important, for two reasons. As we see, enforcement is a net that seems to ensnare bad guys. Second, Metro is turning over the sofa cushions looking for spare change. Why send a signal that fare evasion is a sound economic proposition, because the "penalty" is one is caught is likely to be no more than the cost of a cost of a couple of $20 smart cards?

So send a different message to LEOs. Are you saying cops are incapable of enforcing illegal activities that are mere violations? Because I sure as hell see a lot of cops making traffic stops.

How many traffic stops do you see MPD making in Washington, DC? Capitol Police, the Park Police and sometimes the Secret Service will make them, but MPD doesn't think they're important (and they don't like to get out of their cruisers).

Well obviously what you regularly see depends on where you regularly are in the District.
If you're regularly near the Capitol then yeah...odds are you're going to see Capitol Police pulling folks over.
If you're near major monuments/parks/Arlington Cemetary then yeah...odds are you're going to see the Park Police making stops quite often.
But if you ain't prone to cruising around Sheriff Road, Benning Road, West Virginia Avenue, Alabama Avenue, etc then no...you ain't gonna see a lotta MPD traffic stops.

I work by the capitol and have never seen the capitol police doing ordinary police work, like pulling people over. They seem to focus pretty exclusively on security for the capitol, which may be good or bad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've seen them throw rocks at cars and buses, stand against the flow of traffic and yell profanities at drivers. They also have beaten and knives each other (thankfully did not see that), just the police cars. I'm guessing that's the kind of law breaking/removal PP is referring to. Do you have a problem of some kind with civil society?

Hey Ward/June Cleaver can you video these incidents for me?
You say they’re recurring and happen with relative frequency wherever Wilson kids are present so it shouldn’t be hard to get some footage, right?
I’d love to see.

DP Why are you in denial that incidents like these don't take place? They obviously do and your pushback makes you seem crazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've seen them throw rocks at cars and buses, stand against the flow of traffic and yell profanities at drivers. They also have beaten and knives each other (thankfully did not see that), just the police cars. I'm guessing that's the kind of law breaking/removal PP is referring to. Do you have a problem of some kind with civil society?

Hey Ward/June Cleaver can you video these incidents for me?
You say they’re recurring and happen with relative frequency wherever Wilson kids are present so it shouldn’t be hard to get some footage, right?
I’d love to see.

DP Why are you in denial that incidents like these don't take place? They obviously do and your pushback makes you seem crazy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've seen them throw rocks at cars and buses, stand against the flow of traffic and yell profanities at drivers. They also have beaten and knives each other (thankfully did not see that), just the police cars. I'm guessing that's the kind of law breaking/removal PP is referring to. Do you have a problem of some kind with civil society?

Hey Ward/June Cleaver can you video these incidents for me?
You say they’re recurring and happen with relative frequency wherever Wilson kids are present so it shouldn’t be hard to get some footage, right?
I’d love to see.

I've actually thought of it once when there was a group that were really out of hand. Fortunately I was able to flag down a police officer and point them out. I would worry for my own safety if I tried to film them with my phone. I usually am on my way home, with lots of bags, these things unfold quickly and it would be hard to do unobtrusively. I also have mixed feelings about our society's tendency to film everything in general. Personally, I think parents and school encouraging students to be good citizens on and off campus, and active police presence--would go further than my filming. I loved hanging out with groups of friends after school. I have zero issue with kids getting pizza, fast food or just standing and talking and laughing. Loud cursing, throwing projectiles, blocking the elevator/escalator, fighting, littering. These are no-nos. I think it would be a great idea for a reporter to come and stake it out for more than one day. What an interesting multi perspective story that would be if done with integrity. That would be journalism and could spur true reflection, rather than my "gotcha" filming.