Family of Four on 90k - An Upper Middle Class Existence
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Anonymous
Yes, when I read OP's post, I thought, "THis is middle class, barely. Nothing "upper" about it." |
Anonymous
I don't commute to DC. So that's our saving grace. But we are still within reasonable commute time to dc |
Anonymous
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OP,
There are many people who won the housing lottery and own wonderful homes on low HHI, that they could not be able to afford on today's prices. We have also lived an upper class life on our HHI because of = winning house lottery, kids going in magnets, no student debt, no childcare costs - and of course by being aggressive savers. Many people are upset in this thread because housing costs are crazy in this area and that is eating into people's finances. When your HHI is above 100K in other parts of the country, eating out frequently does not make you poor - in DMV, it does. Childcare costs, private school costs, housing cost, student debts - these are big expenses that many families are facing here, and even though they make 300 K or more - they are feeling the pinch. I believe you when you say that you live well on 90K. I also understand that why this irks people. Your good fortune came because of some great choices in buying housing (and other financial situations - no student debt, no childcare cost, homeschooling), however, it is not something most people can replicate and come out ahead on 90K in this region. Op, you were lucky. Not necessarily financially savvy - but just very lucky. |
Anonymous
You think there are not other families living on 90-100k that didn't win the real estate lottery? There are. OP may not be a great example but we are out here and it's hard to hear that a family making three times as much complaining. That is all. |
Anonymous
I don't know what happened to your friends, but it was only a very tiny gamble. I was confident that the part of DC I was buying in (very central) with very strong housing stock and an increasing demand (and increasing prices) for areas directly adjacent, was very under priced. This wasn't luck. This was an understanding of the market. For a capital city DC real estate still has areas that are very underpriced (see my recommendations of Mount Rainier and Hyattsville, there are others too). There was a capacity to take a risk, yes, and to live in an area that I could see other white long tem DC residents FLINCH when I mentioned where I lived. But the bottom line is that I needed somewhere to live. I didn't buy to make an investment or to "gamble" I bought so that I would have a home to live in that wouldn't be subject to the whims of a landlord and I bought in the location I could because 1) it was what I could afford and 2) I liked it. You need to stop thinking the world owes you everything on a silver platter. You don't get your dream home straight away. You look for what you can afford and what makes sense. If you insist that you need a brand new home, a great school district and a low mortgage payment and you need it right now straight out of the gate, then welcome to the exhurbs. You don't have to have the garage and the 4 bedrooms and the brand new kitchen with all new appliances. And if you do, that's your CHOICE, don't come here whinging about how you can scrape by on $400k. Those of us who bought ten years ago aren't just "lucky" because of some kind of timing miracle, we've had ten more years than you to pay down our debts and get established and fix up those houses. In ten years time, when you are as old as we are and have let go of some of that millennial entitlement you are fostering you'll be having some similar conversations with those a decade younger than you who will be insisting that they'll never get their foot on the ladder and you're so lucky you bought your house in 2015. |
Anonymous
+1. And it's not a "lottery". Some of it is timing, some of it is about making wise decisions and some of it is just a reflection of the passage of time and its impact on paying down debts as well as appreciation. |
Anonymous
WTF? Are you serious??? Housing prices have tripled in the last decade? This is not about paying down debts, it's about being born early enough (or having parents help you at young age) to buy a house before the bubble arrived in DC. Buying in a shady neighborhood is not a wise decision, it was a gamble you could take, probably b/c you knew if it didn't pan out you could still live with mom and dad in MoCo. Many of us have to make everything work, but start out with housing prices 8x what we make, and our moms and dads, yeah we are supporting *them*. Expensive housing, expensive childcare, parents needing help. that is what is most DCUMs are complaining about, no matter what their salary. No one has shown a way to get by on less income other than buying before the bubble of buying out in the exurbs. Still waiting for real advice from people with perspective. |
Anonymous
Haha, no, those of us buying in 2015 are going be pretty screwed -- didn't you see the report on DC GDP dropping? Not to mention nationally, housing is suffering hence why Obama stepped in with the FHA. In the long long term, the bubble will pop and prices will return to normal, but in the meantime it's screwing people starting out just trying to find a place to live. |
Anonymous
I think it is luck. We were young parents who moved from an apartment to a SFH because our toddler needed room, 18 years ago. The <300K price tag on the SFH was a HUGE amount for us 18 years ago and we did feel the pinch for some time, until we were able to refinance at a lower rate after a few years. However, it was the bottom of the housing market. If our child would have been born, just 2 years later, we would NOT have been able to buy that house. The timing was a matter of luck - we were not particularly wise in financial matters. We were clueless in all aspects of financial management except we knew to max out our retirement savings so that we could get the company match. We also paid off our credit card debts every month. We knew nothing of stocks and bonds so our instrument of savings was index funds. We did not have anything in our names (immigrants) when we came here, but thankfully it also meant that we did not have student debts. We also did not have childcare costs because of help from family. We realized that the schools were not particularly good very late in the game, but it did not impact us because kids were going to magnets after 3rd grade. So, a lot of this was luck because we were pretty oblivious about a lot of things. (fingers crossed) To claim that we are very smart financially would be incorrect and I would imagine that majority of people would not be able to have our exact lifestyle (very balanced) on our salary. So, we are lucky, but we are not a recipe for financial success for most people. It is like those people who have trust funds and low paying jobs and live in posh neighborhoods. My point is that OP is talking of her own fortunate situation of being able to live well on 90K - but it is not attainable for everyone who is making 90K and have two kids. |
Anonymous
The way we get by is by living in an older townhome. I posted before and another poster said a townhouse is a shithole. Well that is the choice we had to make on our HHI of approx 90k. No one really wants to listen to how those if us who make less do it because god forbid they would have to make the same choices we have. |
Anonymous
Hey I am that pp. I said box not hole  ! And I live in one too. My point is that giving up a yard for your kid is a big sacrifice folks have to make when getting by on our incomes here. Where I come from 90k would buy TWO houses (out right I mean, not As payments on a mortgage). Getting by here and having a 'normal' middle class life with house and yard and occasional vacations takes a *lot* of money.
For the record those older town homes are built very well (probably 9 hr firewall right?) but are still a compromise. |
Anonymous
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It seems like the main issue is that $90,000 is a great salary and actually on the high end for most of America. Yet all that affords is a fixer upper in a dangerous neighborhood with bad schools. And that's the problem. Call me entitled, but $90,000 (more than double the national average income, I believe) SHOULD go further than it does or not only is DC for just the 1%, America is just for the 1%.
Kudos to you for your courage and luck but as a single person, I would not have had one decent night's sleep listening to drug deals and gun shots. And again, call me entitled, but for $300,000, I'd like to at least feel like my neighborhood isn't violent. |
Anonymous
I hear you. I know we'd have a single family in another city. But honestly this is where the jobs are so we make due. An older townhome has its pros and cons. Its actually well built and bigger than some of the new townhomes. But we would really like something newer (probably a townhouse!) with a few bells and whistles. Not sure if that is ever going to happen or not. |
Anonymous
If you folks who make less than 100k can please post your budget, your expenses, and how you just make it work, it would be really helpful. Don't just post that you live so well on 100k and not expect people to try to do the math. If you have a super low mortgage, how did you do that? |
Anonymous
I already posted all this info a few pages back. I'm happy to answer your questions if you have any. |