"I No Longer Think GLP-1s Are the Answer — The drugs "work" but may be working against us long-term"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:There are so many drugs I plan to use for life. I’ll never get off Zyrtec. I don’t expect Advil taken for today’s headache to work on one next week. I’ll be on birth control until I’m on hormone replacement. I don’t see myself ever stopping using Tretinoin. Both my parents will be on cholesterol drugs for life, so I expect at some point I will be too.

Why is it that when it comes to weight loss medications people are clutching their pearls at the idea that people won’t eventually stop?

Because they want people to stop. And then gain the wait back. Because they hate fat people, because they need someone to feel superior to. This "People will gain it back if they stop!!" stuff is all about driving the narrative that it is somehow "cheating" to use medical intervention for obesity. It's similar to people a generation ago clutching their pearls at the idea that certain folks were "acting uppity."

Consider that we want a healthy society where this type of behavior is not normalized. I want my kids to grow up surrounded by healthy diets and exercise - not people who can’t control themselves and try to take a short cut. There was zero obesity at the turn of the century. There’s no good reason for it now other than people cannot control themselves around junk food that is push through ever media possible - weak minds, weak impulse control, equates to weak society. I don’t want that for my kids to live in. I’m sure you blame your obesity on hormones or something out of your control, but it’s not that or we would see fat mammals in the wild and people would have been obese throughout history.

Are you kidding me? Are you truly this stupid? You think there was "zero obesity at the turn of the century"? And you are claiming people were not "obese throughout history"? What in the fresh hell level of ignorance is this??? It's actually funny enough that I should probably ignore this as not real/trolling.

But if it's not made up, know that you are also clearly a horrible person. You don't want your kids around "weak minds"? Well, you'd better move out of the house and away from them and never see them again.

Sure it existed, but not at 40% of the population. Most people were turned away from military service, even during WWII for being too slim. It’s an inconvenient truth for you.

And you don’t need to be so triggered googlable facts - it doesn’t help your case.

That's because people had suffered through the great depression at that time (1940). They were malnourished. People had scurvy, people had babies who weren't growing. You think that was an example of excellent physical health? Lord.

Oh you’re right the 1000s of years before the Great Depression and the fact that there is a whole world outside the US that also has people wouldn’t provide other data points.

I'm literally responding to your post about how young men were being turned away from the army when they enlisted for WW2 for being too thin.

Th e Great Depression and WW2 are different points in history. Conflating them as a singular event is strange. The Great Depression was also coupled with a dust bowl and completely different economic factors than WW2. Yes a lot happened between 1929 and 1941 in the US. However the point was we are not constrained by US data alone nor are we constrained by the last 100 years of data. We can look at nutrition of Japan, who have longer life expectancies or we can look at Greek lifestyles and diets. We don’t have to look too far to see the rise of obesity epidemics in china and India with the introduction of processed foods either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A ton of my friends and a few family members have done various GLPs. They seem to work better long term if the person is committed to healthy habits once they go off the drugs. My friends who won't exercise or watch their diet gain the weight back, because maintaining weight in your 40's and 50's is hard if you're not disciplined.

You are not supposed to "go off the drugs" with a GLP1 any more than you are supposed to go off of your thyroid medication or your congestive heart failure medication. Obesity is a chronic condition, you stay on the med for life.

I plan to be on a GLP-1 for life. Been on Mounjaro for 3 years without issue. Feeling the best I have in a long time and yes, I have overhauled my diet and committed to exercise (cardio, mobility work and strength training).

[Anonymous]

^^ same, have been on Wegovy for 3 years, now on the lowest dose for maintenance, and will stay on it forever. On the bright side, my cholesterol and blood pressure are now completely normal, so I no longer need those meds

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^^ same, have been on Wegovy for 3 years, now on the lowest dose for maintenance, and will stay on it forever. On the bright side, my cholesterol and blood pressure are now completely normal, so I no longer need those meds

This is amazing, congrats.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:There are so many drugs I plan to use for life. I’ll never get off Zyrtec. I don’t expect Advil taken for today’s headache to work on one next week. I’ll be on birth control until I’m on hormone replacement. I don’t see myself ever stopping using Tretinoin. Both my parents will be on cholesterol drugs for life, so I expect at some point I will be too.

Why is it that when it comes to weight loss medications people are clutching their pearls at the idea that people won’t eventually stop?

Because they want people to stop. And then gain the wait back. Because they hate fat people, because they need someone to feel superior to. This "People will gain it back if they stop!!" stuff is all about driving the narrative that it is somehow "cheating" to use medical intervention for obesity. It's similar to people a generation ago clutching their pearls at the idea that certain folks were "acting uppity."

Consider that we want a healthy society where this type of behavior is not normalized. I want my kids to grow up surrounded by healthy diets and exercise - not people who can’t control themselves and try to take a short cut. There was zero obesity at the turn of the century. There’s no good reason for it now other than people cannot control themselves around junk food that is push through ever media possible - weak minds, weak impulse control, equates to weak society. I don’t want that for my kids to live in. I’m sure you blame your obesity on hormones or something out of your control, but it’s not that or we would see fat mammals in the wild and people would have been obese throughout history.

What do you think people on Ozempic eat?

Before ozempic forced them to a diet rich in nutrients and protein, they ate lots of junk. That’s how they got there! So if they went on the diet without th drug they’d have the same results.

Your ignorance is stunning. There are many people who become overweight without eating a lot of "junk". Having an illness or injury or being on a medication that causes weight gain is very common. Yes, some people get fat from eating a lot of junk, but not everyone. Also, some people do not have an income that allows them to avoid "junk" or live in food deserts that make it hard to eat healthy.

Also, the numerous studies on GLP medications show that the control groups on the same food or exercise regimes did not in fact lose weight to the same degree as the GLP groups - proving exactly contrary to your assertion that, "if they went on the diet without the drug, they'd have the same results." That is why these medications are considered so revolutionary. They accomplish something that cannot be accomplished by diet and exercise alone, especially when considered across a group. For example, maybe the mean weight loss in a control group was 5% bodyweight loss, but the GLP mean bodyweight loss was around 20%.

The population that can afford these drugs out of pocket or have exceptional insurance nearly ALWAYS got to where they are by eating piles of junk. Not SOME
- that’s a total cop out. It’s inexcusable. McLean is not a food dessert.

The victim mentality on this forum is such a joke. Nobody wants to admit they absolutely have the privilege of being in a position to prioritize their health and make better choices. They just don’t do it and instead get butt hurt when somebody points out the obvious that taking a drug to artificially alter biochemistry is not a long term solution.

My thyroid medication for my Hashimoto's artificially alters my biochemistry and is a long-term solution. Why is obesity special?

Because your thyroid malfunctioned and you can’t control that.

Obesity in UMC adults in the US is absolutely controllable in the vast majority of people. They just don’t want to do the work. Or they don’t want to prioritize it.

There are two options. 1) you can be a healthy weight by doing the actual work that causes the body to naturally respond and be functional and strong. Or 2) you can take a short cut and get none of those benefits.

Healthspan of 1) is wildly better than 2).

Don’t you get tired of being so stupid all the time? Eff off with your dumb, uneducated opinions.

DP
Oh you sound so smart and kind! Can we be friends? You’re just the person I want to invite to alienate everyone at my next party.

I see you’re just as ignorant and uninformed as the PP. it’s a choice. I don’t choose to associate with people like you.

[Anonymous]

A lot of drugs are for life. Why is it good to be on statins or insulin for life, after developing health issues, but bad to be on. Drug for life that can prevent these health issues?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A lot of drugs are for life. Why is it good to be on statins or insulin for life, after developing health issues, but bad to be on. Drug for life that can prevent these health issues?

Please feel free to quote the post on this thread that claimed being on a GLP-1 for life is bad for your health.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are so many drugs I plan to use for life. I’ll never get off Zyrtec. I don’t expect Advil taken for today’s headache to work on one next week. I’ll be on birth control until I’m on hormone replacement. I don’t see myself ever stopping using Tretinoin. Both my parents will be on cholesterol drugs for life, so I expect at some point I will be too.

Why is it that when it comes to weight loss medications people are clutching their pearls at the idea that people won’t eventually stop?

Because they want people to stop. And then gain the wait back. Because they hate fat people, because they need someone to feel superior to. This "People will gain it back if they stop!!" stuff is all about driving the narrative that it is somehow "cheating" to use medical intervention for obesity. It's similar to people a generation ago clutching their pearls at the idea that certain folks were "acting uppity."

Consider that we want a healthy society where this type of behavior is not normalized. I want my kids to grow up surrounded by healthy diets and exercise - not people who can’t control themselves and try to take a short cut. There was zero obesity at the turn of the century. There’s no good reason for it now other than people cannot control themselves around junk food that is push through ever media possible - weak minds, weak impulse control, equates to weak society. I don’t want that for my kids to live in. I’m sure you blame your obesity on hormones or something out of your control, but it’s not that or we would see fat mammals in the wild and people would have been obese throughout history.

What do you think people on Ozempic eat?

Before ozempic forced them to a diet rich in nutrients and protein, they ate lots of junk. That’s how they got there! So if they went on the diet without th drug they’d have the same results.

Your ignorance is stunning. There are many people who become overweight without eating a lot of "junk". Having an illness or injury or being on a medication that causes weight gain is very common. Yes, some people get fat from eating a lot of junk, but not everyone. Also, some people do not have an income that allows them to avoid "junk" or live in food deserts that make it hard to eat healthy.

Also, the numerous studies on GLP medications show that the control groups on the same food or exercise regimes did not in fact lose weight to the same degree as the GLP groups - proving exactly contrary to your assertion that, "if they went on the diet without the drug, they'd have the same results." That is why these medications are considered so revolutionary. They accomplish something that cannot be accomplished by diet and exercise alone, especially when considered across a group. For example, maybe the mean weight loss in a control group was 5% bodyweight loss, but the GLP mean bodyweight loss was around 20%.

The population that can afford these drugs out of pocket or have exceptional insurance nearly ALWAYS got to where they are by eating piles of junk. Not SOME
- that’s a total cop out. It’s inexcusable. McLean is not a food dessert.

The victim mentality on this forum is such a joke. Nobody wants to admit they absolutely have the privilege of being in a position to prioritize their health and make better choices. They just don’t do it and instead get butt hurt when somebody points out the obvious that taking a drug to artificially alter biochemistry is not a long term solution.

My thyroid medication for my Hashimoto's artificially alters my biochemistry and is a long-term solution. Why is obesity special?

Because your thyroid malfunctioned and you can’t control that.

Obesity in UMC adults in the US is absolutely controllable in the vast majority of people. They just don’t want to do the work. Or they don’t want to prioritize it.

There are two options. 1) you can be a healthy weight by doing the actual work that causes the body to naturally respond and be functional and strong. Or 2) you can take a short cut and get none of those benefits.

Healthspan of 1) is wildly better than 2).

OP here. This is dumb. GLP-1s have been shown to have numerous health benefits, the problem is these benefits don't last if you don't continue taking the medicine, and many people don't. But for those that do, it absolutely has real health benefits.

None of this is even responsive to what I wrote. What I wrote isn’t even debatable.

There are two options. 1) you can be a healthy weight by doing the actual work that causes the body to naturally respond and be functional and strong. Or 2) you can take a short cut and get none of those benefits.

Healthspan of 1) is wildly better than 2).

Pathway 1) is a mirage. In the overwhelming majority of cases, after doing the “actual work” of weight loss, patients end up on a path to metabolic dysfunction of yo-yo weight, which is unhealthy. We all know this from the Biggest Loser studies, among many other sources. Weight loss itself is damaging to our systems in a way that makes re-gain the overwhelming most likely outcome.

DP
You desperately need a nutrition class. I can’t begin to respond to this.

I’m sure it’s very hard to respond to complex topics when you’re ignorant about the data and biology.

Insults and name calling. Sign of true maturity and intelligence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are so many drugs I plan to use for life. I’ll never get off Zyrtec. I don’t expect Advil taken for today’s headache to work on one next week. I’ll be on birth control until I’m on hormone replacement. I don’t see myself ever stopping using Tretinoin. Both my parents will be on cholesterol drugs for life, so I expect at some point I will be too.

Why is it that when it comes to weight loss medications people are clutching their pearls at the idea that people won’t eventually stop?

Because they want people to stop. And then gain the wait back. Because they hate fat people, because they need someone to feel superior to. This "People will gain it back if they stop!!" stuff is all about driving the narrative that it is somehow "cheating" to use medical intervention for obesity. It's similar to people a generation ago clutching their pearls at the idea that certain folks were "acting uppity."

Consider that we want a healthy society where this type of behavior is not normalized. I want my kids to grow up surrounded by healthy diets and exercise - not people who can’t control themselves and try to take a short cut. There was zero obesity at the turn of the century. There’s no good reason for it now other than people cannot control themselves around junk food that is push through ever media possible - weak minds, weak impulse control, equates to weak society. I don’t want that for my kids to live in. I’m sure you blame your obesity on hormones or something out of your control, but it’s not that or we would see fat mammals in the wild and people would have been obese throughout history.

What do you think people on Ozempic eat?

Before ozempic forced them to a diet rich in nutrients and protein, they ate lots of junk. That’s how they got there! So if they went on the diet without th drug they’d have the same results.

Your ignorance is stunning. There are many people who become overweight without eating a lot of "junk". Having an illness or injury or being on a medication that causes weight gain is very common. Yes, some people get fat from eating a lot of junk, but not everyone. Also, some people do not have an income that allows them to avoid "junk" or live in food deserts that make it hard to eat healthy.

Also, the numerous studies on GLP medications show that the control groups on the same food or exercise regimes did not in fact lose weight to the same degree as the GLP groups - proving exactly contrary to your assertion that, "if they went on the diet without the drug, they'd have the same results." That is why these medications are considered so revolutionary. They accomplish something that cannot be accomplished by diet and exercise alone, especially when considered across a group. For example, maybe the mean weight loss in a control group was 5% bodyweight loss, but the GLP mean bodyweight loss was around 20%.

The population that can afford these drugs out of pocket or have exceptional insurance nearly ALWAYS got to where they are by eating piles of junk. Not SOME
- that’s a total cop out. It’s inexcusable. McLean is not a food dessert.

The victim mentality on this forum is such a joke. Nobody wants to admit they absolutely have the privilege of being in a position to prioritize their health and make better choices. They just don’t do it and instead get butt hurt when somebody points out the obvious that taking a drug to artificially alter biochemistry is not a long term solution.

My thyroid medication for my Hashimoto's artificially alters my biochemistry and is a long-term solution. Why is obesity special?

Because your thyroid malfunctioned and you can’t control that.

Obesity in UMC adults in the US is absolutely controllable in the vast majority of people. They just don’t want to do the work. Or they don’t want to prioritize it.

There are two options. 1) you can be a healthy weight by doing the actual work that causes the body to naturally respond and be functional and strong. Or 2) you can take a short cut and get none of those benefits.

Healthspan of 1) is wildly better than 2).

Don’t you get tired of being so stupid all the time? Eff off with your dumb, uneducated opinions.

DP
Oh you sound so smart and kind! Can we be friends? You’re just the person I want to invite to alienate everyone at my next party.

I see you’re just as ignorant and uninformed as the PP. it’s a choice. I don’t choose to associate with people like you.

Insults and name calling. Sign of true maturity and intelligence.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of drugs are for life. Why is it good to be on statins or insulin for life, after developing health issues, but bad to be on. Drug for life that can prevent these health issues?

Please feel free to quote the post on this thread that claimed being on a GLP-1 for life is bad for your health.

For people who are so obese and have health problems because they cannot control themselves around food - lifelong medication one way or another is their only path. I don’t think anyone disputes that. Most people just say it’s better not to have to rely on drugs forever. But I get cholesterol, diabetes, and fat medication are for life

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of drugs are for life. Why is it good to be on statins or insulin for life, after developing health issues, but bad to be on. Drug for life that can prevent these health issues?

Please feel free to quote the post on this thread that claimed being on a GLP-1 for life is bad for your health.

For people who are so obese and have health problems because they cannot control themselves around food - lifelong medication one way or another is their only path. I don’t think anyone disputes that. Most people just say it’s better not to have to rely on drugs forever. But I get cholesterol, diabetes, and fat medication are for life

So you aren't responding to any posts on this thread, just responding to what you perceive other people think?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of drugs are for life. Why is it good to be on statins or insulin for life, after developing health issues, but bad to be on. Drug for life that can prevent these health issues?

Please feel free to quote the post on this thread that claimed being on a GLP-1 for life is bad for your health.

For people who are so obese and have health problems because they cannot control themselves around food - lifelong medication one way or another is their only path. I don’t think anyone disputes that. Most people just say it’s better not to have to rely on drugs forever. But I get cholesterol, diabetes, and fat medication are for life

So you aren't responding to any posts on this thread, just responding to what you perceive other people think?

Of course! I’m general consensus. Being anonymous I can give you the benefit of knowing what people who can control their weight think. You’re welcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:His claim that people who use the drugs lose muscle and don’t gain it back when they stop the drug therapy is concerning.

Has only to do with the speed of weight loss, which can be managed with proper dosing and nutrient intake. The issue is not with the medication.

In theory, yes. In practice, no. I’ve never seen anyone not lose massive amounts of muscle. Sure, it’s possible but it’s just as hard as losing weight and building muscle in a lifelong way - so the old fashioned way is better/safer.

Everyone loses muscle when they lose weight. You can reduce muscle mass loss by lifting and losing at a 1-2 lb per week rate. Nothing to do with the GLP-1…

You are naive and will fight to the end. Continue on your path.

GLP has everything to do with rate, which is what causes the large muscle loss. Gradual lifestyle changes are far more sustainable and healthier on your body.

Sure come back and say they’re not. I really don’t care. Then again I don’t need GLPs. I’m an athlete with a long history of muscle building and lifestyle sustainability. So just like you think popping a pill is magic with no long term data - I think healthy diet and exercise is magic with long term data and sustainability.

Do you have any citations? Because I do. There’s no evidence that muscle mass loss in GLP-1s is any worse than muscle mass loss from other means.

“There's concern in the general public about how weight loss drugs affect muscle mass, but the presenters emphasize that the data doesn't show GLP-1 analogs have a unique, high level of lean body mass loss compared to other weight loss paradigms.”

https://advances.massgeneral.org/endocrinology/article.aspx?id=1601

I trust Mass General a lot more than I trust an unsubstantiated, anonymous claim on the internet.

Seriously?! You want citations for something so well known it dates back 100s of years of conventional wisdom? You are one of those “dumb” people PP mentioned.

Citations won’t convince me. We haven’t had these drugs long enough to even have the data. Remember the miracle drug fen-phen - this is the same. It’s a miracle until it’s not and we see the long term damage. The FDA approved fen-phen and the hype was the same as it is now. Maybe you are too young to remember that.

I should mention I’m in my 50s so I’ve seen the hype before. I’m also knowingly very bias. I’m 5’3” and 130 lbs - although I wear a size 0-2 - so I’m solid muscle, like really solid.

We have a couple decades of data but you don’t want to believe it because it makes you mad.

Same with fen-phen. And as I said - I don’t care what you do to your individual body. You could take prescription Adderall or non prescription speed and get the same effect - I also don’t want those normalized in society, just as this drug shouldn’t be normalized. I also don’t believe in normalizing pot, lsd, oxy, coke, fentanyl - most of which were legal at some point in history - and there is a reason they are no longer legal.

You've made too many stupid comments to catalog in this thread (and I'm only halfway through it) but "fentanyl is illegal" is so idiotic it is worth calling out. Same for OxyContin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A lot of drugs are for life. Why is it good to be on statins or insulin for life, after developing health issues, but bad to be on. Drug for life that can prevent these health issues?

Please feel free to quote the post on this thread that claimed being on a GLP-1 for life is bad for your health.

For people who are so obese and have health problems because they cannot control themselves around food - lifelong medication one way or another is their only path. I don’t think anyone disputes that. Most people just say it’s better not to have to rely on drugs forever. But I get cholesterol, diabetes, and fat medication are for life

So you aren't responding to any posts on this thread, just responding to what you perceive other people think?

Of course! I’m general consensus. Being anonymous I can give you the benefit of knowing what people who can control their weight think. You’re welcome.

NP. I control my weight without medication and you in no way represent what I think. I don’t want to be associated with such ignorance. Speak for yourself. At best, you might represent some dim people but you certainly do not represent anyone educated.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:His claim that people who use the drugs lose muscle and don’t gain it back when they stop the drug therapy is concerning.

Has only to do with the speed of weight loss, which can be managed with proper dosing and nutrient intake. The issue is not with the medication.

In theory, yes. In practice, no. I’ve never seen anyone not lose massive amounts of muscle. Sure, it’s possible but it’s just as hard as losing weight and building muscle in a lifelong way - so the old fashioned way is better/safer.

Everyone loses muscle when they lose weight. You can reduce muscle mass loss by lifting and losing at a 1-2 lb per week rate. Nothing to do with the GLP-1…

You are naive and will fight to the end. Continue on your path.

GLP has everything to do with rate, which is what causes the large muscle loss. Gradual lifestyle changes are far more sustainable and healthier on your body.

Sure come back and say they’re not. I really don’t care. Then again I don’t need GLPs. I’m an athlete with a long history of muscle building and lifestyle sustainability. So just like you think popping a pill is magic with no long term data - I think healthy diet and exercise is magic with long term data and sustainability.

Do you have any citations? Because I do. There’s no evidence that muscle mass loss in GLP-1s is any worse than muscle mass loss from other means.

“There's concern in the general public about how weight loss drugs affect muscle mass, but the presenters emphasize that the data doesn't show GLP-1 analogs have a unique, high level of lean body mass loss compared to other weight loss paradigms.”

https://advances.massgeneral.org/endocrinology/article.aspx?id=1601

I trust Mass General a lot more than I trust an unsubstantiated, anonymous claim on the internet.

Seriously?! You want citations for something so well known it dates back 100s of years of conventional wisdom? You are one of those “dumb” people PP mentioned.

Citations won’t convince me. We haven’t had these drugs long enough to even have the data. Remember the miracle drug fen-phen - this is the same. It’s a miracle until it’s not and we see the long term damage. The FDA approved fen-phen and the hype was the same as it is now. Maybe you are too young to remember that.

I should mention I’m in my 50s so I’ve seen the hype before. I’m also knowingly very bias. I’m 5’3” and 130 lbs - although I wear a size 0-2 - so I’m solid muscle, like really solid.

We have a couple decades of data but you don’t want to believe it because it makes you mad.

Same with fen-phen. And as I said - I don’t care what you do to your individual body. You could take prescription Adderall or non prescription speed and get the same effect - I also don’t want those normalized in society, just as this drug shouldn’t be normalized. I also don’t believe in normalizing pot, lsd, oxy, coke, fentanyl - most of which were legal at some point in history - and there is a reason they are no longer legal.

You've made too many stupid comments to catalog in this thread (and I'm only halfway through it) but "fentanyl is illegal" is so idiotic it is worth calling out. Same for OxyContin.

Is it though? Oxy - heroin - fentanyl is a well established pattern. It’s even in Revenge of the Tipping Point, but you’d have to be able to read above 5th grade level to get that reference.