DEI at Michigan--NYT article

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

DEI is breeding resentment and making this country evenmore divisive.

No, the very fine republicans are butthurt that we are no longer automatically putting people on a pedestal just because they are old, white Christian wealthy males.

You are completely out of touch.

When you roll back the hysterics over DEI, that is what you will find.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

+1

I’ll take them doing something imperfectly over doing nothing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You lost me at "Heritage Foundation study."

Talk about a group that has an agenda.

So this is what has become of the Times.
Thanks, OP. You seem to be busy this morning with your outrage theater.

OP here.

As posted earlier, I'm a "lib" with 2 biracial kids.

And I think this is effing ridiculous.

Did you read the article? What did you think?

After Kamala is president, we can have this conversation and it might be beneficial. Until then, it’s just part of or an echo of Trump’s campaign and it has no value. There is nothing fruitcake DEI people can do that’s as damaging as what Trump has explicitly said he would do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Agree but the point of this article is that these expensive DEI programs are not it. I personally HATE these types of programs- and honestly I feel they primarily benefit the people who run them- but I very much support diversity. I just don’t think this is the way to get there.

This. Intervention should be aimed at K8. The earlier the intervention, the better. College should be, primarily, a meritocracy.

It’s never too late for people to learn about being inclusive. Definitely some DCUM posters would be benefit from some DEI awareness.

+100 The irony of bashing DEI programs while not fully understanding the issues is profound.

And some of the DEI bashers clearly have no idea what it means.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

DEI is breeding resentment and making this country evenmore divisive.

No, the very fine republicans are butthurt that we are no longer automatically putting people on a pedestal just because they are old, white Christian wealthy males.

You are completely out of touch.

When you roll back the hysterics over DEI, that is what you will find.

When you come back to Earth you will see while well intentioned, it doesn’t work. You’ll get there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It’s sad because it seems like the effect of it has been to promote blame and division. Done properly, it’s about promoting understanding and growth. The professor asking for students to let him know if he was accidentally offending them was showing his willingness to grow and learn — the student who filed a complaint was unreasonable. I do wonder, though. if they overstate the problem by focusing on the most extreme crazies. Like if you polled that professors class, would 99 students say “gee, I really appreciated him saying that…”?
It’s hard to say. Part of the problem here is that over the past 10 years, the country has become much more divided and tribalist (in part due to people like Trump and Russian troll farms who foment these divisions very explicitly). So it’s hard to conclude that this is the result of the UM DEI program, unless we know whether polls of students nationwide would show the same increased sense of embattlement.

Too many problems end up like this.

Step 1: Get emotional about an issue.

Step 2: Throw a bunch of money at a problem & try to solve it emotionally (eg, sympathy rather than tough love).

Step 3: when the impractical emotional approach doesn’t magically solve the problem, double-down on the money & bureaucracy.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s sad because it seems like the effect of it has been to promote blame and division. Done properly, it’s about promoting understanding and growth. The professor asking for students to let him know if he was accidentally offending them was showing his willingness to grow and learn — the student who filed a complaint was unreasonable. I do wonder, though. if they overstate the problem by focusing on the most extreme crazies. Like if you polled that professors class, would 99 students say “gee, I really appreciated him saying that…”?
It’s hard to say. Part of the problem here is that over the past 10 years, the country has become much more divided and tribalist (in part due to people like Trump and Russian troll farms who foment these divisions very explicitly). So it’s hard to conclude that this is the result of the UM DEI program, unless we know whether polls of students nationwide would show the same increased sense of embattlement.

Too many problems end up like this.

Step 1: Get emotional about an issue.

Step 2: Throw a bunch of money at a problem & try to solve it emotionally (eg, sympathy rather than tough love).

Step 3: when the impractical emotional approach doesn’t magically solve the problem, double-down on the money & bureaucracy.

Sadly, Step 4 is often this: call the whole effort a failure and then give up entirely on the actual issue. 😢

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

+1

I’ll take them doing something imperfectly over doing nothing.

But it makes things worse rather than better. Anybody surprised that trying to cultivate equality by giving preference to certain groups doesn’t work?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

+1

I’ll take them doing something imperfectly over doing nothing.

But it makes things worse rather than better. Anybody surprised that trying to cultivate equality by giving preference to certain groups doesn’t work?

Will everything be better all of the time? No, of course not. Are we moving the ship in the right direction? Yes.

Given how so many different groups have been silenced and oppressed since forever it’s great that we opening up these conversations and listening to groups who historically haven’t had a voice.

We are in the “storming” stage of a new “group”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

DEI is breeding resentment and making this country evenmore divisive.

No, the very fine republicans are butthurt that we are no longer automatically putting people on a pedestal just because they are old, white Christian wealthy males.

You are completely out of touch.

When you roll back the hysterics over DEI, that is what you will find.

When you come back to Earth you will see while well intentioned, it doesn’t work. You’ll get there.

The fact that anyone is talking about it and trying to figure out how to do it better is showing that it’s working.

We’ve had fcked up systems for centuries. It’s unreasonable to expect perfection from DEI programs on day 1. Give it time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

DEI is breeding resentment and making this country evenmore divisive.

No, the very fine republicans are butthurt that we are no longer automatically putting people on a pedestal just because they are old, white Christian wealthy males.

You are completely out of touch.

When you roll back the hysterics over DEI, that is what you will find.

When you come back to Earth you will see while well intentioned, it doesn’t work. You’ll get there.

The fact that anyone is talking about it and trying to figure out how to do it better is showing that it’s working.

We’ve had fcked up systems for centuries. It’s unreasonable to expect perfection from DEI programs on day 1. Give it time.

You might need to find a new career, this one doesn’t seem to be working for you. It’s clear what’s really behind the defense of a failing program that can point to no real success. The people who stand to gain the most off their grift have a death grip on it. But it’s unraveling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

+1

I’ll take them doing something imperfectly over doing nothing.

But it makes things worse rather than better. Anybody surprised that trying to cultivate equality by giving preference to certain groups doesn’t work?

Will everything be better all of the time? No, of course not. Are we moving the ship in the right direction? Yes.

Given how so many different groups have been silenced and oppressed since forever it’s great that we opening up these conversations and listening to groups who historically haven’t had a voice.

We are in the “storming” stage of a new “group”.

But if you read the article you would know that conversation is being stifled not opened up. Read the article and stop spouting platitudes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

You are confusing admissions with on-campus programs.

As someone who actually hires people, I prefer people who aren't afraid of inclusiveness or critical thinking.

DP.

I actually hire people as well.

Inclusiveness is important, but DEI programs don't seem to do a very good job of creating inclusiveness (see the article).

Another important trait is the ability to deal with small issues without having a meltdown. 'Cause life and your coworkers are not going to be perfect.

Big issue = let us know and we'll fix it.

Small issue = just move on or fix it yourself.

DEI (and the associated focus on the importance of subjective feelings vs. objective professional standards) is creating a generation of people who believe that how they "feel" about something is always the most important issue.

Doesn't make for a productive (or pleasant) work environment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

+1

I’ll take them doing something imperfectly over doing nothing.

-1

Count me as someone who believes that they seem to be making things WORSE.

DEI is a dead end because its premises are fundamentally flawed.

We need a completely new approach to making things better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Okay so takeaway is:

Michigan = bad
Don't let your kids apply to it.




Please

Right? As a Michigan parent, this is not going to matter. Michigan is still (like all the other top schools) going to be a huge prize. My kid is having the time of his life and getting a great education. People are always thrilled for him that he got in and is there. This article isn't changing anything.

He may be assumed to be a "DEI" grad by potential employers.

Yes, we lie awake nights concerned about our white, top grades, econ major kid being pigeon-holed in this manor.
But seriously, as others have posted, we have no regrets about part of the tuition money we've spent going to fund this experiment (if it even has - didn't see where the funds came from). Race relations in this country are fraught and complicated and Michigan is at least trying.

DEI is breeding resentment and making this country evenmore divisive.

No, the very fine republicans are butthurt that we are no longer automatically putting people on a pedestal just because they are old, white Christian wealthy males.

This is about republicans. It was an article in the New York Times about liberal Michigan students for goodness sake.