Why are young people old?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe people don't want to buy into the ridiculous grinder culture anymore because it's not worth it?

My grandfather (WWII generation) was the second in command in a Cabinet agency in the 1970s and 80s. He worked 40 hours a week and said he always wondered why people who stayed late couldn't get their work done more efficiently. In the mid-1970s, average billables at large law firms were 1300.

This obsession with facetime and long hours as a moral virtue started with Boomers. The rest of us see no value in it.

Maybe the obsession with facetime and long hours started as a way to set apart men from women in the workforce, as more women started working and competing with men, and to justify promoting men over women? The messaging became "Ok sure you ladies can work now, but if you want to move up you have to do everything us men do." And the expectation to work long hours and put in facetime started, so women who also had family obligations couldn't keep up, thus justifying the promotion of men over women. Its the proverbial moving the yardstick.

I have noticed some of this. I have a female coworker who works 6am- 3pm. She busts her butt and gets everything done. But people talk about her behind her back because she leaves at 3. Whereas my male colleagues work 10-7pm or 9-6 and everyone praises them for staying late. They openly state that they want to avoid dinner and bath time with their small kids because it's a stressful part of the night. There's no reason they need to be staying so late, they're just fooling their wives.

I'm the previous poster who you responded to. I've experienced this myself. I am an attorney and a mom with two kids. I work a full time job and get all my work done, but I typically work 8-4. I get in earlier than all of my colleagues and get all my work done, and I definitely feel judged for leaving before everyone. It was the worst when I worked in an earlier in-house job where there were a lot of men who were previously biglaw attorneys. They all came in around 10 and worked until about 6, and were praised for working such long hours. It was pretty pointless though because the company was a global organization headquartered in Asia, so most of the people we worked with and supported were long gone in the late afternoon, early evening our time. The culture of putting in facetime was very ingrained in them, even if they weren't doing much of anything in the late afternoon.

My issue is I am a last minute Charlie. So was a lot of my bosses. I get work to do between 3-6 pm. You run out the I get help from whoever. You may have worked your butt off 8-4 and other guy came in late and took a two hour lunch. Who cares.

Great example back in 2005 I was doing project at Chase. Big ass issue happened and Jamie Dimon himself comes barging into audit dept at 845 pm for help. Only one guy there working late and handled the request. That guy could have strolled on at lunch time hung over and catching up but he got the credit. Unfair

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maybe people don't want to buy into the ridiculous grinder culture anymore because it's not worth it?

My grandfather (WWII generation) was the second in command in a Cabinet agency in the 1970s and 80s. He worked 40 hours a week and said he always wondered why people who stayed late couldn't get their work done more efficiently. In the mid-1970s, average billables at large law firms were 1300.

This obsession with facetime and long hours as a moral virtue started with Boomers. The rest of us see no value in it.

Maybe the obsession with facetime and long hours started as a way to set apart men from women in the workforce, as more women started working and competing with men, and to justify promoting men over women? The messaging became "Ok sure you ladies can work now, but if you want to move up you have to do everything us men do." And the expectation to work long hours and put in facetime started, so women who also had family obligations couldn't keep up, thus justifying the promotion of men over women. Its the proverbial moving the yardstick.

I have noticed some of this. I have a female coworker who works 6am- 3pm. She busts her butt and gets everything done. But people talk about her behind her back because she leaves at 3. Whereas my male colleagues work 10-7pm or 9-6 and everyone praises them for staying late. They openly state that they want to avoid dinner and bath time with their small kids because it's a stressful part of the night. There's no reason they need to be staying so late, they're just fooling their wives.

I'm the previous poster who you responded to. I've experienced this myself. I am an attorney and a mom with two kids. I work a full time job and get all my work done, but I typically work 8-4. I get in earlier than all of my colleagues and get all my work done, and I definitely feel judged for leaving before everyone. It was the worst when I worked in a earlier in-house job where there were a lot of men who were previously biglaw attorneys. They all came in around 10 and worked until about 6, and were praised for working such long hours. It was pretty pointless though because the company was a global organization headquartered in Asia, so most of the people we worked with and supported were long gone in the late afternoon, early evening our time. The culture of putting in facetime was very ingrained in them, even if they weren't doing much of anything in the late afternoon.

Of course there are times when we all need to work late, but if last minute disasters are coming up on a regular basis that require working late into the night to fix them, the cause is usually poor management practices. If you manage your work better, there are FAR fewer late night emergencies.

[Anonymous]

OP I track arrivals and departure time daily so does CEO.

Last week I clocked a ton M, T, W and and off site meeting from Thursday through Sunday and back at work Monday. I am on day 9 of work! With board meetings and off sites, regulators, external auditors. I clock a lot.

One year I was physically at work 3,000 hours back in financial crisis. And no I was not showing off while team was there. I was a spring chicken then in my 40s so still did all my stuff my three kids, maintain house, go out to parties. but man waking up at 5 am after going to bed at 1 am was a chore. But only one year. I was like a young child at 42 wet behind the ears.

I knew that 42 year old kid needed to kick it up. Going to ride him today. I have been up since 545 am and ready to go!! Maybe will throw a python query or some financial modeling at him around 430 pm to keep his mind sharp. He only has 8 years to learn