Possible AAP changes at ES

[Anonymous]

Can we all agree that in the next few school years that this is where the county is moving? Getting rid of centers and only having LLIV? It makes so much sense, bussing kids around… sometimes across pyramids… makes it harder to allocate resources and creates a giant mess of bureaucracy and logistics when most schools could fill a class at the school with IV and III kids and move at a super fast clip.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Can we all agree that in the next few school years that this is where the county is moving? Getting rid of centers and only having LLIV? It makes so much sense, bussing kids around… sometimes across pyramids… makes it harder to allocate resources and creates a giant mess of bureaucracy and logistics when most schools could fill a class at the school with IV and III kids and move at a super fast clip.

I'm all for this, as I think the "center" idea is ridiculous if the local school is offering Level IV services, as this school currently is. However, they appear to be moving to a model where "level IV" is available to all, and there will no longer be any dedicated Level IV classrooms. I'm all for availing other students to higher levels of learning if they are capable but didn't meeting the "AAP" acceptance criteria; just as long as it doesn't impede the pace and progress of those Level IV students who are on an accelerated track. The school will need to figure out how this is going to work, and I'm not sure they're there yet.

[Anonymous]

They need to move to Advanced Math and Advanced LA. Kids move to different classes for Math and LA. Mix for Science and Social Studies with extra work available for kids who move through the class work quickly. It would be easier to move kids in and out of the Advanced Classes so that kids can be more easily placed where they belong.

One of the problems with AAP is that kids cannot be moved out of it while Advanced Math sees kids moved in and out as needed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They need to move to Advanced Math and Advanced LA. Kids move to different classes for Math and LA. Mix for Science and Social Studies with extra work available for kids who move through the class work quickly. It would be easier to move kids in and out of the Advanced Classes so that kids can be more easily placed where they belong.

One of the problems with AAP is that kids cannot be moved out of it while Advanced Math sees kids moved in and out as needed.

It sounds like you are unaware of the differences between Level IV science and social studies and gen ed science and social studies. Or else your center school does not teach Level IV science/social studies with fidelity?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we all agree that in the next few school years that this is where the county is moving? Getting rid of centers and only having LLIV? It makes so much sense, bussing kids around… sometimes across pyramids… makes it harder to allocate resources and creates a giant mess of bureaucracy and logistics when most schools could fill a class at the school with IV and III kids and move at a super fast clip.

I'm all for this, as I think the "center" idea is ridiculous if the local school is offering Level IV services, as this school currently is. However, they appear to be moving to a model where "level IV" is available to all, and there will no longer be any dedicated Level IV classrooms. I'm all for availing other students to higher levels of learning if they are capable but didn't meeting the "AAP" acceptance criteria; just as long as it doesn't impede the pace and progress of those Level IV students who are on an accelerated track. The school will need to figure out how this is going to work, and I'm not sure they're there yet.

What makes you say that? From my understanding, there are a significant number of Level III students that could even the playing field in the two Level IV classes. What's baffling is how they're going to overcome the idea that there are two strong classes and two weaker ones? Will it mean more Level III kids will be in those classes? So then who fills the 2 Level IV classes? I didn't attend the meeting so if anyone has intel, I'd be curious to hear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we all agree that in the next few school years that this is where the county is moving? Getting rid of centers and only having LLIV? It makes so much sense, bussing kids around… sometimes across pyramids… makes it harder to allocate resources and creates a giant mess of bureaucracy and logistics when most schools could fill a class at the school with IV and III kids and move at a super fast clip.

I'm all for this, as I think the "center" idea is ridiculous if the local school is offering Level IV services, as this school currently is. However, they appear to be moving to a model where "level IV" is available to all, and there will no longer be any dedicated Level IV classrooms. I'm all for availing other students to higher levels of learning if they are capable but didn't meeting the "AAP" acceptance criteria; just as long as it doesn't impede the pace and progress of those Level IV students who are on an accelerated track. The school will need to figure out how this is going to work, and I'm not sure they're there yet.

What makes you say that? From my understanding, there are a significant number of Level III students that could even the playing field in the two Level IV classes. What's baffling is how they're going to overcome the idea that there are two strong classes and two weaker ones? Will it mean more Level III kids will be in those classes? So then who fills the 2 Level IV classes? I didn't attend the meeting so if anyone has intel, I'd be curious to hear.

PP here - by "they" I'm referring to the school and their ability to administer this model; not the students. Next year is going to be largely by trial and error.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we all agree that in the next few school years that this is where the county is moving? Getting rid of centers and only having LLIV? It makes so much sense, bussing kids around… sometimes across pyramids… makes it harder to allocate resources and creates a giant mess of bureaucracy and logistics when most schools could fill a class at the school with IV and III kids and move at a super fast clip.

I'm all for this, as I think the "center" idea is ridiculous if the local school is offering Level IV services, as this school currently is. However, they appear to be moving to a model where "level IV" is available to all, and there will no longer be any dedicated Level IV classrooms. I'm all for availing other students to higher levels of learning if they are capable but didn't meeting the "AAP" acceptance criteria; just as long as it doesn't impede the pace and progress of those Level IV students who are on an accelerated track. The school will need to figure out how this is going to work, and I'm not sure they're there yet.

What makes you say that? From my understanding, there are a significant number of Level III students that could even the playing field in the two Level IV classes. What's baffling is how they're going to overcome the idea that there are two strong classes and two weaker ones? Will it mean more Level III kids will be in those classes? So then who fills the 2 Level IV classes? I didn't attend the meeting so if anyone has intel, I'd be curious to hear.

PP here - by "they" I'm referring to the school and their ability to administer this model; not the students. Next year is going to be largely by trial and error.

Would also add that the principal and AART are taking questions and welcoming phone calls to discuss further.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we all agree that in the next few school years that this is where the county is moving? Getting rid of centers and only having LLIV? It makes so much sense, bussing kids around… sometimes across pyramids… makes it harder to allocate resources and creates a giant mess of bureaucracy and logistics when most schools could fill a class at the school with IV and III kids and move at a super fast clip.

I'm all for this, as I think the "center" idea is ridiculous if the local school is offering Level IV services, as this school currently is. However, they appear to be moving to a model where "level IV" is available to all, and there will no longer be any dedicated Level IV classrooms. I'm all for availing other students to higher levels of learning if they are capable but didn't meeting the "AAP" acceptance criteria; just as long as it doesn't impede the pace and progress of those Level IV students who are on an accelerated track. The school will need to figure out how this is going to work, and I'm not sure they're there yet.

The solution to that is to continue to use Centers for dedicated classes of Level IV students of highest ability...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we all agree that in the next few school years that this is where the county is moving? Getting rid of centers and only having LLIV? It makes so much sense, bussing kids around… sometimes across pyramids… makes it harder to allocate resources and creates a giant mess of bureaucracy and logistics when most schools could fill a class at the school with IV and III kids and move at a super fast clip.

I'm all for this, as I think the "center" idea is ridiculous if the local school is offering Level IV services, as this school currently is. However, they appear to be moving to a model where "level IV" is available to all, and there will no longer be any dedicated Level IV classrooms. I'm all for availing other students to higher levels of learning if they are capable but didn't meeting the "AAP" acceptance criteria; just as long as it doesn't impede the pace and progress of those Level IV students who are on an accelerated track. The school will need to figure out how this is going to work, and I'm not sure they're there yet.

This really seems to be school dependent. I am a L4 teacher and our school has 1 Level 4 class and isn’t planning on changing anything.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Can we all agree that in the next few school years that this is where the county is moving? Getting rid of centers and only having LLIV? It makes so much sense, bussing kids around… sometimes across pyramids… makes it harder to allocate resources and creates a giant mess of bureaucracy and logistics when most schools could fill a class at the school with IV and III kids and move at a super fast clip.

I'm all for this, as I think the "center" idea is ridiculous if the local school is offering Level IV services, as this school currently is. However, they appear to be moving to a model where "level IV" is available to all, and there will no longer be any dedicated Level IV classrooms. I'm all for availing other students to higher levels of learning if they are capable but didn't meeting the "AAP" acceptance criteria; just as long as it doesn't impede the pace and progress of those Level IV students who are on an accelerated track. The school will need to figure out how this is going to work, and I'm not sure they're there yet.

The solution to that is to continue to use Centers for dedicated classes of Level IV students of highest ability...

And how are you going to determine that?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Getting back on topic - OP, this means that there will be two dumbed down AAP classes with Level II, III, IV kids in them and two "smartened up" GenEd classes with everyone else. We spoke with the principal and AART about it and are moving to Lemon Road next year. We have two in AAP and they need a challenging curriculum with their peers, not one dumbed down for kids whose parents complained they weren't in AAP. I can tell you that we are not the only ones making the switch.

Don't be surprised if those level III kids end up being as good as the level IV kids at class work.

Of course. My concern is the Level II kids that will be placed with Level IV.

That was not me, but yes, I am concerned about the grouping/mixing and not being able to meet my children at their very advanced levels. It's hard enough when there are children principal placed into the classroom that are having a hard time keeping up but whose parents won't send them back to GenEd because of the "prestige" of being in AAP. It's not about prestige, its about academics and challenge.

I hear you. DC's class went from 17 last year to 25 this year (with two of the original 17 moving), and some of the "newer" AAP students are struggling to keep up. I know the Principal or perhaps one of the AAP teachers mentioned that the 3rd grade class only had 14 kids in it. I think they're getting pressure to equalize the class sizes.

Right. Isn’t this a move to remedy this concern? There needs to be equal sized classes and if there aren’t enough level IV students to make an entire class, they need to get divided into the two classrooms. Those kids that were placed in there will get redistributed. Though it is interesting that your perspective on how they’re doing directly conflicts with the evidence presented.

Not sure I'm following you. They're filling an advanced academic class with non-advanced students for the purpose of filling the class? This doesn't solve the problem of those kids not being able to keep up. My DC's teacher complains about this daily.

BULLSHIT. Your child's teacher complains to you every single day that there are kids in her class that can't keep up? Really? If that's true, then she's extremely unprofessional and the issue is more likely that she doesn't know how to do her job. But in reality, we all know you're making that up.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Getting back on topic - OP, this means that there will be two dumbed down AAP classes with Level II, III, IV kids in them and two "smartened up" GenEd classes with everyone else. We spoke with the principal and AART about it and are moving to Lemon Road next year. We have two in AAP and they need a challenging curriculum with their peers, not one dumbed down for kids whose parents complained they weren't in AAP. I can tell you that we are not the only ones making the switch.

Don't be surprised if those level III kids end up being as good as the level IV kids at class work.

Of course. My concern is the Level II kids that will be placed with Level IV.

That was not me, but yes, I am concerned about the grouping/mixing and not being able to meet my children at their very advanced levels. It's hard enough when there are children principal placed into the classroom that are having a hard time keeping up but whose parents won't send them back to GenEd because of the "prestige" of being in AAP. It's not about prestige, its about academics and challenge.

I hear you. DC's class went from 17 last year to 25 this year (with two of the original 17 moving), and some of the "newer" AAP students are struggling to keep up. I know the Principal or perhaps one of the AAP teachers mentioned that the 3rd grade class only had 14 kids in it. I think they're getting pressure to equalize the class sizes.

All of the third grade classes were small at the beginning of the year, but then the teacher of the largest class quit in the second week of school without giving notice and instead of hiring a new teacher, they just redistributed those kids to all of the other classes - except AAP. So the AAP class remained small while the other classes are huge. It's a really bad look.

I would assume hiring an AAP teacher would be slightly more difficult than a gen ed teacher. Presumably AAP instructors have some additional accreditation /county-based certification, which could be less common.

It was NOT an AAP class whose teacher quit, it was a normal class. And the administration was too lazy to identify the high performers from that class to place into AAP or to shift other kids around so they just shoved them in the other classes that were thriving with small class sizes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Getting back on topic - OP, this means that there will be two dumbed down AAP classes with Level II, III, IV kids in them and two "smartened up" GenEd classes with everyone else. We spoke with the principal and AART about it and are moving to Lemon Road next year. We have two in AAP and they need a challenging curriculum with their peers, not one dumbed down for kids whose parents complained they weren't in AAP. I can tell you that we are not the only ones making the switch.

Don't be surprised if those level III kids end up being as good as the level IV kids at class work.

Of course. My concern is the Level II kids that will be placed with Level IV.

That was not me, but yes, I am concerned about the grouping/mixing and not being able to meet my children at their very advanced levels. It's hard enough when there are children principal placed into the classroom that are having a hard time keeping up but whose parents won't send them back to GenEd because of the "prestige" of being in AAP. It's not about prestige, its about academics and challenge.

I hear you. DC's class went from 17 last year to 25 this year (with two of the original 17 moving), and some of the "newer" AAP students are struggling to keep up. I know the Principal or perhaps one of the AAP teachers mentioned that the 3rd grade class only had 14 kids in it. I think they're getting pressure to equalize the class sizes.

All of the third grade classes were small at the beginning of the year, but then the teacher of the largest class quit in the second week of school without giving notice and instead of hiring a new teacher, they just redistributed those kids to all of the other classes - except AAP. So the AAP class remained small while the other classes are huge. It's a really bad look.

I would assume hiring an AAP teacher would be slightly more difficult than a gen ed teacher. Presumably AAP instructors have some additional accreditation /county-based certification, which could be less common.

It was NOT an AAP class whose teacher quit, it was a normal class. And the administration was too lazy to identify the high performers from that class to place into AAP or to shift other kids around so they just shoved them in the other classes that were thriving with small class sizes.

What do you mean thriving? Didn’t the teacher quit in the second week?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Getting back on topic - OP, this means that there will be two dumbed down AAP classes with Level II, III, IV kids in them and two "smartened up" GenEd classes with everyone else. We spoke with the principal and AART about it and are moving to Lemon Road next year. We have two in AAP and they need a challenging curriculum with their peers, not one dumbed down for kids whose parents complained they weren't in AAP. I can tell you that we are not the only ones making the switch.

Don't be surprised if those level III kids end up being as good as the level IV kids at class work.

Of course. My concern is the Level II kids that will be placed with Level IV.

That was not me, but yes, I am concerned about the grouping/mixing and not being able to meet my children at their very advanced levels. It's hard enough when there are children principal placed into the classroom that are having a hard time keeping up but whose parents won't send them back to GenEd because of the "prestige" of being in AAP. It's not about prestige, its about academics and challenge.

I hear you. DC's class went from 17 last year to 25 this year (with two of the original 17 moving), and some of the "newer" AAP students are struggling to keep up. I know the Principal or perhaps one of the AAP teachers mentioned that the 3rd grade class only had 14 kids in it. I think they're getting pressure to equalize the class sizes.

All of the third grade classes were small at the beginning of the year, but then the teacher of the largest class quit in the second week of school without giving notice and instead of hiring a new teacher, they just redistributed those kids to all of the other classes - except AAP. So the AAP class remained small while the other classes are huge. It's a really bad look.

I would assume hiring an AAP teacher would be slightly more difficult than a gen ed teacher. Presumably AAP instructors have some additional accreditation /county-based certification, which could be less common.

It was NOT an AAP class whose teacher quit, it was a normal class. And the administration was too lazy to identify the high performers from that class to place into AAP or to shift other kids around so they just shoved them in the other classes that were thriving with small class sizes.

What do you mean thriving? Didn’t the teacher quit in the second week?

No chance a principal is going to reshuffle the entire grade the second week of school. Terrible timing but redistributing one class was the smart choice. There must have been room or else they would have hired a long term sub.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lots of folks are accusing FCPS of going in this "new direction" for advanced academics with politically charged implications. What else is FCPS supposed to do with changing demographics and dropping socio-economic levels? FCPS is a public school system charged with educating everyone. Fairfax County is at a point of development far beyond the old days of a predominantly wealthy, white population where public education was easy.

There's no easy answer to mixing students vs. separating them, having Centers vs. local AAP. It's a lose-lose situation but the core issue is far beyond what FCPS can address. The issue is class size, space availability, and need for hundreds more specialized teachers and assistants to educate children that have more needs than ever.

Draw lines to more equally distribute kids who require those extra resources

Do you mean busing? Or rehoming families? Boundary lines aren't really the problem.

The county is choosing where to build subsidized and low income housing. Some areas have more than schools can handle and some areas have none.

The county and the school district are two separate entities. They work together or align, sometimes. But they're not the same.

They are both controlled by the same political party.

Voters need to remember this fact before the next election.

Right, because Republicans have a real progressive view on housing policy and will push for more affordable housing to be located in/near high-income enclaves.

It's low income housing we are really talking about. Affordable, like middle class housing, is not it. But really, what kid would want to be the low income kid at McLean or Langley High? I wouldn't.