Help me be a VP- guide me on my choice

[Anonymous]

I am a senior director for a fortune 500. A recruiter reached out for a midsize company for a senior director/avp role. I took the call and at the end of the call, the recruiter tells me she will put my CV forward for the senior director role. I explained that I am looking to grow in scope for my next role and she said that the scope is definitely increasing but the avp in the jd was only to reiterate that the role reports to an svp and that the midsize company cannot change the title from a senior director role.

I dont want the senior director title. I do want to keep the door open. Should I proceed with interviews and wow them to get an avp change and turn them down if they wont? Better to turn them down now and ask them to keep me in mind if an avp role is open? I work in a niche field with only so many players.

[Anonymous]

If they can't change the title, they can't change the title. You wanting them to do so isn't going to change that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If they can't change the title, they can't change the title. You wanting them to do so isn't going to change that.

so if my end goal is to eventually be considered for a vp role, would it be better to refuse to apply now or if they really wont budge, turn down the offer for sr director? I dont want to waste their time vs treat it like networking

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am a senior director for a fortune 500. A recruiter reached out for a midsize company for a senior director/avp role. I took the call and at the end of the call, the recruiter tells me she will put my CV forward for the senior director role. I explained that I am looking to grow in scope for my next role and she said that the scope is definitely increasing but the avp in the jd was only to reiterate that the role reports to an svp and that the midsize company cannot change the title from a senior director role.

I dont want the senior director title. I do want to keep the door open. Should I proceed with interviews and wow them to get an avp change and turn them down if they wont? Better to turn them down now and ask them to keep me in mind if an avp role is open? I work in a niche field with only so many players.

Sr Director at a Fortune 500 is already higher than a VP at medium sized firm so why do you want to demote yourself? may be SVP is the way to go.

[Anonymous]

Thanks so much-- dont want to demote myself, will not move for sr director level, will move for VP level (I actually like this company's portfolio and feel like I can grow it). Am I naive that I think I can wow them in the interview and convince them to level up the role?

[Anonymous]

In your industry are the titles so uniform across companies? They aren’t in mine, so it would be more important for me to understand the scope, role, who the position reports to, and the comp in order to evaluate whether it’s a good move

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thanks so much-- dont want to demote myself, will not move for sr director level, will move for VP level (I actually like this company's portfolio and feel like I can grow it). Am I naive that I think I can wow them in the interview and convince them to level up the role?

That does seem naive because the company already decided what they want the role to be, and presumably budgeted for that. But if the universe of candidates really is small and you are very impressive maybe that is possible? It seems equally (or more) likely that they’d be impressed by you and think you’re too senior for the role they have.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thanks so much-- dont want to demote myself, will not move for sr director level, will move for VP level (I actually like this company's portfolio and feel like I can grow it). Am I naive that I think I can wow them in the interview and convince them to level up the role?

You have a minuscule chance. It’s not out of the realm of possibility. It would require that you are stellar head and shoulders against the other candidates that they will see. Personally I think an AVP title is meaningless in a mid size firm. It’s essentially just another senior middle management role which is what you are in now. I get the game you want to play. I’d only be willing to play it for a VP title.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thanks so much-- dont want to demote myself, will not move for sr director level, will move for VP level (I actually like this company's portfolio and feel like I can grow it). Am I naive that I think I can wow them in the interview and convince them to level up the role?

Yes, you are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks so much-- dont want to demote myself, will not move for sr director level, will move for VP level (I actually like this company's portfolio and feel like I can grow it). Am I naive that I think I can wow them in the interview and convince them to level up the role?

You have a minuscule chance. It’s not out of the realm of possibility. It would require that you are stellar head and shoulders against the other candidates that they will see. Personally I think an AVP title is meaningless in a mid size firm. It’s essentially just another senior middle management role which is what you are in now. I get the game you want to play. I’d only be willing to play it for a VP title.

thank you-- this was what i was thinking too. i've been with my company 10 years so i think im also itching to try something new so i thought avp might be good enough but now that even that is off the table, I think i'll graciously bow out

[Anonymous]

So you only care about the title? An AVP title doesn’t mean you’re growing in scope.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thanks so much-- dont want to demote myself, will not move for sr director level, will move for VP level (I actually like this company's portfolio and feel like I can grow it). Am I naive that I think I can wow them in the interview and convince them to level up the role?

That does seem naive because the company already decided what they want the role to be, and presumably budgeted for that. But if the universe of candidates really is small and you are very impressive maybe that is possible? It seems equally (or more) likely that they’d be impressed by you and think you’re too senior for the role they have.

Someone would have to really want you and go to bat for you for the higher level title--at the risk of making others at that level unhappy, and potentially have to use political capital to get it done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In your industry are the titles so uniform across companies? They aren’t in mine, so it would be more important for me to understand the scope, role, who the position reports to, and the comp in order to evaluate whether it’s a good move

+1

But OP doesn’t get that.

[Anonymous]

Not naive.

We hire for various roles at one of two title levels. If you're talking to a recruiter, they typically don't know what the inclination of the hiring manager will be, so they'll low ball you. I have absolutely had candidates come through and wow me so that I offered the more senior position.

Granted that is at the dir/sr dir level, but if they're advertising as a sdr/vp split, the same applies.

[Anonymous]

As a hiring manager, this drives me crazy. I have roles open that are scoped in a particular way, with specific titles, leveling and comp. I cannot change that for an exceptional candidate because budgets are tight and going up a title/level requires a corresponding bump in comp.

I've had candidates do this and it ends up being a huge waste of time for everyone involved. I've also had candidates accept the role and think they're going to wow us and automatically get a promotion, and when that doesn't happen they leave. Please don't do this!