Is pre-med at UChicago a bad idea?

[Anonymous]

Primary concerns are 1) grade deflation = lower GPA for med school apps and 2) grind culture and so much busy work = no time left for meaningful pre-med internships. We watched a "Day in the life of a UChicago student" video on Youtube. The girl who made it described her workload in details and said she has 7 hours of homework a day on average in additional to going to classes, office hours, clubs and ECs on campus. She's not evening STEM/Engineering or Comp Sci!. How is that sustainable?

DD (junior) is curious about UChicago because she likes their essay prompt Qs which makes her think it's a campus full of "her kind of people". She's not deterred by the reputation of challenging academics (she has a history of excelling when things get more challenging). However, she is not what you would call a recluse nerd, she has lots of friends, is very social and active now in high school and manages to work year-round at a part-time job with coworkers she is friendly with. She says her ideal college will have top teaching, challenging academics, good for pre-med but also has lots of campus traditions, events and activities (non-Greek, Harry Potter Quidditch type). The latter part doesn't sound like UChicago to me, am I right?

[Anonymous]

Premed is a grind anywhere. Emory, WashU, JHU, Penn, Case Western, Vandy, all grinds for premed.

Chicago has grade inflation now. It's not what it used to be.

[Anonymous]

If you want the best combination of education, experience, and med school success attend a top SLAC.

[Anonymous]

DD sounds similar to yours and is now a junior majoring in a STEM field at UChi. She's completed (as part of the sequence of classes needed for her major) all of the pre-med classes. The grade deflation situation and rigor is real although it is not, as you said, "busy work. Med schools/internship opportunities are aware of the situation at Chicago and take that into account. Kids are nose down a lot of the time as lectures + labs + discussion groups take a lot of time and the problem sets are no joke. She does finds time to work out and "goes out" maybe once a week. She was dead set on UChi, but had she had a slightly less strenuous option she was considering we might have pushed her in that direction knowing what we know now. But then again, she's happy and has found her people and she's definitely being challenged!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you want the best combination of education, experience, and med school success attend a top SLAC.

Which LACS would be best for pre-med, science major, opportunities to learn closely with professors, and access to opportunities for medicine field-related internships?

[Anonymous]

I wouldn't worry about grade inflation/deflation for med school applications. I talked to someone that used to be on admissions committee for a top med school and he said they are how the various schools grade, and they take that into consideration.

The trimester system for premed is really challenging, I will say that.

Do the premeds have more fun at Brown? Or UMd? Or ASU? I don't know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Premed is a grind anywhere. Emory, WashU, JHU, Penn, Case Western, Vandy, all grinds for premed.

Chicago has grade inflation now. It's not what it used to be.

Chicago definitely does not have grade inflation. Agree that pre-med is a grind at top schools, but I think the quarter system makes it even more challenging.

[Anonymous]

In general premed is a "bad" idea if one worries about gpa and workloads. When we visited JHU last year, the tour guide really left an impression on us. She seemed like one of those kids who has almost no time to sleep, if she even sleeps at all. She was double majoring in biology and public health, volunteering, getting clinical hours, and doing lab research, all at once. She had even already been ready to publish as a sophomore. Very high energy vibe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Premed is a grind anywhere. Emory, WashU, JHU, Penn, Case Western, Vandy, all grinds for premed.

Chicago has grade inflation now. It's not what it used to be.

Where would UVA, UNC, and W&M fit in this group in terms of effort required for the same level of success, where success is a certain medical school tier?

The person having second thought about Chicago. Would they have considered one of these in hindsight?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Premed is a grind anywhere. Emory, WashU, JHU, Penn, Case Western, Vandy, all grinds for premed.

Chicago has grade inflation now. It's not what it used to be.

Chicago definitely does not have grade inflation. Agree that pre-med is a grind at top schools, but I think the quarter system makes it even more challenging.

There have been multiple posts On UChicago and "grade deflation" lately what is going on? While the quarter system does make the pace harder, the grades at UChicago are most certainly NOT DEFLATED compared to peer schools. Are they "inflated"? Not to the extent of Harvard/Brown which have medians around 3.9 nor Duke and Dartmouth where 3.9 is around top third, 3.80-3.84 around average. But Chicago is indeed inflated compared to 30 years ago. All schools are. Every single one. In fact some of the classic toxic schools (JHU, CMU), have shifted medians to the right more than peers to try and overcome some of the reputation.

Uchicago has median graduating gpa around 3.7, roughly the same as UVA and the three "deflated" ivies Princeton Penn and Cornell. UChcago curves the typical freshman premed courses to a B/B+ with Cs being rare. Upper-level stem courses have B+/A- medians.

Med school AOs know the differences in grading. They get data from the undergrad schools and they track applicant data themselves. Also, they're quite aware of the differences in peer group: a median GPA from UChicago, whatever it is, is far more impressive than a top-quarter GPA from a T50. And, a 3.7 from Chicago is indeed more impressive than a 3.7 from UVA, two schools with similar medians yet different student intellectual ability averages.

Med schools also use the MCAT and have access to MCAT tier data from different undergrads. UChicago and other ivy+ typically have average -GPA students earning an mcat of 515-517 while UVA is roughly 505 for the average-GPA undergrad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In general premed is a "bad" idea if one worries about gpa and workloads. When we visited JHU last year, the tour guide really left an impression on us. She seemed like one of those kids who has almost no time to sleep, if she even sleeps at all. She was double majoring in biology and public health, volunteering, getting clinical hours, and doing lab research, all at once. She had even already been ready to publish as a sophomore. Very high energy vibe.

Agree. That is how premeds and honestly most students are at ivies and the like! It is simply how they are and most of them enjoy it! Most of them do in fact sleep.
-Parent of premed engineer at ivy, they and most all of their friends premed or not, engineering or not, fit this description, fill in TA instead of clinical hours or performing arts group, et al.

[Anonymous]

She sounds like an absolute perfect fit for UChicago.

I have 2 kids there, and they're having a college experience that matches exactly what your DD wants. Challenging academics, rigor, collaboration, lots to do outside of classes, and many opportunities for socialization with Greek life, houses, RSOs, and "going out" to downtown Chicago. Note, none of my kids are pre-med, but they have friends who are, and they seem to be having similar experiences with workload and social life. I would recommend UChicago for your DD.

[Anonymous]

Not sure if it’s the Chicago boosters or the busters who are promoting the idea of Chicago grade deflation. The average GPA used to be 3.2 or something like that. It’s not the case anymore for a while now. It’s just not the truth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Primary concerns are 1) grade deflation = lower GPA for med school apps and 2) grind culture and so much busy work = no time left for meaningful pre-med internships. We watched a "Day in the life of a UChicago student" video on Youtube. The girl who made it described her workload in details and said she has 7 hours of homework a day on average in additional to going to classes, office hours, clubs and ECs on campus. She's not evening STEM/Engineering or Comp Sci!. How is that sustainable?

DD (junior) is curious about UChicago because she likes their essay prompt Qs which makes her think it's a campus full of "her kind of people". She's not deterred by the reputation of challenging academics (she has a history of excelling when things get more challenging). However, she is not what you would call a recluse nerd, she has lots of friends, is very social and active now in high school and manages to work year-round at a part-time job with coworkers she is friendly with. She says her ideal college will have top teaching, challenging academics, good for pre-med but also has lots of campus traditions, events and activities (non-Greek, Harry Potter Quidditch type). The latter part doesn't sound like UChicago to me, am I right?

7 hours a DAY of homework is more than average for sure. We have our own and know various current students at different ivies as well as UChicago and none average 7 hours a day. During a bad week, sure, but not average per day over an entire semester.
The ideal college description you wrote fits UChicago as well as most Ivies as well as William and Mary. Students at these schools are certainly social, it is just a different kind of social than that of more homogenous large southern public football schools. The old Fun goes to Die trope is a joke from decades ago and not at all true at UChicago.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want the best combination of education, experience, and med school success attend a top SLAC.

Which LACS would be best for pre-med, science major, opportunities to learn closely with professors, and access to opportunities for medicine field-related internships?

Any of the top 10-15 SLACs will be great places for someone looking to go on to medical school. They all have strong science programs with easy access to research, very supportive pre-health programs. close student faculty relationships, etc. which translates to success rates far above the norm.