Passing (different question)

[Anonymous]

So, do FTM men ever truly “pass”? I feel like something usually fees FTM and then the question is quickly settled just by looking at hands.

Related questions:
1) if a person undergoes top surgery with the expectation of then “passing,” but it’s still apparent per above that they are FTM, is there risk of increased psychological distress?
2) let’s say someone does pass, what then? What’s the end game if you attract someone who thinks you are the acquired gender but there are not matching genitals?

[Anonymous]

What in the world? Weird questions. Are you a straight cis person?

[Anonymous]

Yes, straight cis person. What is weird, these are questions that come up around the subject of surgical transition.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So, do FTM men ever truly “pass”? I feel like something usually fees FTM and then the question is quickly settled just by looking at hands.

Related questions:
1) if a person undergoes top surgery with the expectation of then “passing,” but it’s still apparent per above that they are FTM, is there risk of increased psychological distress?
2) let’s say someone does pass, what then? What’s the end game if you attract someone who thinks you are the acquired gender but there are not matching genitals?

I’m a cis, heterosexual woman but re 2) I think it’s really offensive and stupid that you’re implying if someone wants to “pass” it would be about attracting and/or deceiving a romantic partner. I think it’s about the other 99.5% of your life.

[Anonymous]

I am not implying in any way that it is about deceit, way to put an incredibly negative spin on an honest question. I think it’s pretty obvious that if you attract someone while passing as one gender that there is going to be an unveiling of reality pretty quickly. I understand that gender and sexuality are two different things, but if seeking to pass, then that requires the other party to participate in the passing as well. It gets complicated.

Also I don’t think that forming romantic relationships is 0.5% of life. For many or most people who they choose to spend their life with is one of if not the most important determinant in how that life goes, irrespective of education or career.

[Anonymous]

I totally agree with the poster above.

I'll add to answer # 1, I know transmen who can pass, either after top surgery, or because they were small chested and can bind.

As far as your question # 1: Passing isn't about no one knowing that you are trans, just like being closeted wasn't about no one knowing you were gay. It's about being in control of who knows, and being able to pick and choose. People can choose to tell the people who need to know (e.g. medical providers), and the people they trust (e.g. romantic partners, close friends, trustworthy members of your family), while not sharing with people who don't need to know, like the cashier at the grocery store, your neighbors, colleagues, and people who haven't shown themselves to be safe.

[Anonymous]

Thank you. I’m curious, with the trans men you know, who are they with romantically? I know plenty of butch lesbians, and several MTF (most are partnered with women), but only one FTM transman who is currently single and I don’t know their sexual orientation.

[Anonymous]

I'm a trans woman, not a trans man for transparency.

Your first question is asking about getting top surgery with the expectation of passing. Okay so people get surgery because they are dysphoric about that part, not to specifically pass. Some people may be dysphoric if they think their chest makes them not pass but binding typically resolves this unless he started with a very large chest. Many trans guys bind before surgery, some even when alone even though it's not super healthy to not take a break from it. People aren't binding when alone to pass. They're doing it because they're uncomfortable with their secondary sex characteristics. So this question is being asked as though it's all for your (your being the general cishet world's) benefit.

Your second question was addressed well by the previous person's reply but I'll add this: this is the offensive question. Why? Because straight people can't stop asking trans people to talk about our genitals. It's really not your business what's going on there and unless you're interested in dating a trans person it's completely irrelevant. I wouldn't ask a straight cisgender woman like you about your genitals or your husband's genitals nor would you ask a random stranger on the street who is cisgender about theirs yet so many people seem to think it's normal to just start asking or talking about trans people's genitals. It's weird to discuss someone's private parts like this.

When transgender people date other people, what happens is between the two of them and not everyone has the same genital preference (though it exists). There's a broad range in sexualities well beyond just straight and gay. Despite the claims of ballooning numbers of trans people, there really aren't that many of us. There's far fewer of us than people that are willing or even specifically want to date us because our numbers are so small. Many trans people also prefer to date other trans people because there's a shared understanding and no need to teach a cis person about the experience. It's an enormous effort to teach a potential partner about the trans experience and many people just don't want to do that so they only date other trans people.

Trans people come in all sexual orientations. Of the transmasc people I know, one is ace and has zero interest in dating anyone. One started out as a lesbian and transitioned to nonbinary and is married to a woman that identifies as a lesbian. One started out as a lesbian and was married to a bi woman - he's a trans man and they went from looking like a lesbian couple to a completely straight looking cishet couple. One went from lesbian to straight. One went from straight woman to gay twink and has no trouble finding gay and bi men that are attracted to men and want to date or have sex with him. A couple went from bi to bi (shocking!). I know two trans men that are married. I know trans men that date trans women. For transgender people there are plenty of options out there, especially if you're attractive and in shape. It's not that different from being hot and cis other than some people are specifically looking for trans people and some people specifically don't want to date us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So, do FTM men ever truly “pass”? I feel like something usually fees FTM and then the question is quickly settled just by looking at hands.

Related questions:
1) if a person undergoes top surgery with the expectation of then “passing,” but it’s still apparent per above that they are FTM, is there risk of increased psychological distress?
2) let’s say someone does pass, what then? What’s the end game if you attract someone who thinks you are the acquired gender but there are not matching genitals?

If I was really into a woman, couldn’t tell she was MTF and she eventually told me she has the same plumbing as I do, I wouldn’t care.

[Anonymous]

The Adam's apple, or lack thereof, is always a give away

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, do FTM men ever truly “pass”? I feel like something usually fees FTM and then the question is quickly settled just by looking at hands.

Related questions:
1) if a person undergoes top surgery with the expectation of then “passing,” but it’s still apparent per above that they are FTM, is there risk of increased psychological distress?
2) let’s say someone does pass, what then? What’s the end game if you attract someone who thinks you are the acquired gender but there are not matching genitals?

If I was really into a woman, couldn’t tell she was MTF and she eventually told me she has the same plumbing as I do, I wouldn’t care.

Thank you but the question is asking about FTM trans people.

[Anonymous]

To 06:18: Thank you for taking the time to type all this out. I am sorry if my question is offending anyone. To clarify, the question is not about genitals as a subject of prurient interest; it is about navigating the relationship dynamic in the context of passing. Insofar as gender and sexuality are two different things, the question was asking what happens when a person of one sexuality discovers that their attraction is to someone whose sexuality different than they initially thought (again, the question was about passing--so someone presenting as a man, not self-identifying as a trans-man from the get go). And yes, I know that we are all attracting to people primary, but typically within certain parameters defined by our sexuality. Again thank you for the reply.

[Anonymous]

It seems like a very strange way to approach the matter, OP. Do you think there are a bunch of trans men cavalierly deceiving straight women into falling for them by hiding that they’re trans? Do you think trans men are going around jumping into physical contact or relationships with a woman without telling them who they are? What generally happens with people of all genders, identities, and orientations is that, after the initial attraction, people get to know each other and figure out if they’re compatible. Why would this be any different? If a straight woman is attracted to a trans man, she will get to know that person and figure out, after learning that they’re trans, whether they want to be with them. If they don’t, the initial attraction will lead to nothing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So, do FTM men ever truly “pass”? I feel like something usually fees FTM and then the question is quickly settled just by looking at hands.

Related questions:
1) if a person undergoes top surgery with the expectation of then “passing,” but it’s still apparent per above that they are FTM, is there risk of increased psychological distress?
2) let’s say someone does pass, what then? What’s the end game if you attract someone who thinks you are the acquired gender but there are not matching genitals?

If I was really into a woman, couldn’t tell she was MTF and she eventually told me she has the same plumbing as I do, I wouldn’t care.

Thank you but the question is asking about FTM trans people.

Sorry… I need glasses!