Zohran Mamdani...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Would Mamdani style city governing work for DC?

Just used the now FREE Ride-On bus in MoCo to get to my destination. This is revolutionary! This may radicalize us!

you sound like the type of person who wishes Kamala Harris was President and has a Hate Has No Home Here sign in your yard.

[Anonymous]

Democrats prefer Donald Trump over Mamdani

[Anonymous]

You sound like a person who likes every American to enjoy basic services and a low stress lifestyle to focus on more important things.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Unlike many politicians he admits his Communism. 'Seize the means of production'.

No word on whether he will liquidate the Kulaks.

He never said that.

Boomers are really showing their age. Communism literally means nothing to millennials and Gen Z born after Cold war/1991.

Get with it, Gramps

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Mamdami learned from the Democratic party failures in the 2024 presidential election. You have to listen to the young people.

The young people told Biden and Harris that if they didn't speak out against Israel, they wouldn't vote for them...and they did not vote for them.

Also, if you get on BlueSky and TikTok where most Gen Z and Millennials are communicating, you'll realize the young people have learned a valuable lesson: there are more of us than old people. If we band together and vote, we can get the candidate we want who will enact the policies we want. Older generations roll their eyes at millennials, but we are the most educated generation and also the generation with the least (in terms of wealth, real estate holdings, and kids). We are also one of the most well-traveled generations. We've been to other places in the world and seen how the citizens of other countries live better than us because of proper taxation of the wealthy and corporations. We have learned that we could have all that in the US if our government simply taxed the rich and corporations at appropriate rates.

Also, just for reference, because for some reason reason people on DCUM have it perpetually stuck in their heads that Gen Z are teenagers and Millennials are 20-somethings, here are the official age breakdowns:

Baby Boomers: 1946-1964 (ages 79-61)
Gen X: 1965-1980 (ages 60-45)
Millennials: 1981-1996 (ages 44-29)
Gen Z: 1997-2012 (ages 28-13)

I'm 43. I make more right now than both of my parents did combined at this age. I don't own a house. I live with a partner, but we are not married. We do not want kids because of the cost of everything. My parents owned a house, 2 cars, and took 3 kids on 2-3 vacations each year when they were in their 40s and they did that on the salaries of a tow truck driver and an office admin.

43 is not “young”. You are middle aged (as am I, also 43).

Your observations are generally correct and applicable to millennials (but not universal; I enjoy a much better standard of living than my parents did, I am married and I have 3 kids). ZM is not going to deliver a standard of living you seek, and, if his policy proposals are actually implemented, it will make your problems worse.

NP here. Do you not think there is an affordability and housing crisis in our country? That fact seems undeniable to me and should not be surprising given the energy of the occupy wall street movement over a decade ago and the growing inequality since then. So if there are problems with affordability/housing, why not try to some ideas? What I find refreshing about Mamdani is that he does not seem wed to ideology - listen to him talk about his grocery stores. It's one in each borough (which can be funded through existing city food programs) and he outright says if it doesn't work, then he will close them. Food deserts are a huge issue that the private sector has not tried so why not experiment with a public sector solution?

PP.

Yes, there is a housing/affordability crisis. The problem with “trying ideas” is that it can make problems much worse and destroy capital, making the road to recovery that much harder. Look at California: they’ve tried many ideas for making housing affordable and it’s only gotten worse and they are in a deeper hole. Most of ZM’s proposals will make the problems worse. The answer is and will continue to be more supply, but ZM isn’t going near that. Instead he’s proposing ideas that have been proven to fail.

To be fair, as much as I disagree with him about most things, his idea to let property tax valuations float to be more aligned with market value is a correct position.

The grocery store issue does highlight how he can make problems worse as well as the incoherence of his positions.

There is no such thing as just trying changes to an economic ecosystem. Once you introduce the government stores it will be extremely difficult to get rid of them and they will destabilize the economic system. Whoever runs them will be incentivized to expand their footprint/mandate. While the bodegas are a real problem, grocery stores have notoriously thin margins and undercutting them on price will be destabilizing.

ZM simultaneously believes that greedy capitalists will exploit everyone but for some reason food deserts exist where capitalists don’t go do business. Perhaps his mental model is off….

How does 5 grocery stores (one in each burrough in food desserts where there are no private grocery stores operating) risk “destabilizing the economic system”?

And, why might there be food deserts in the city? Is it because crime drove businesses that used to be there out? If so, how do you think these government run grocery stores will fare?

And, as to your question.....

Economists and business leaders are sounding alarms over New York City mayoral candidate Zohran Mamdani’s plan to roll out city-owned grocery stores that he says will lower food costs.

"You don’t lower grocery bills by having government-run stores," Ryan Bourne, a top economist at the libertarian leaning Cato Institute think tank, told Fox Business. "Government-run entities have no market discipline — no need to earn profits, compete, or serve customers efficiently. That leads to bloated costs, empty shelves, and zero accountability."

Bourne called Mamdani's city-run grocery stores "the height of political hubris" by failing to acknowledge that grocers operate in competitive arenas and on razor-thin profit margins.

"If we just do the simple math here, there's no way you can sell these products at lower prices and still make money," said E.J. Antoni, chief economist at the conservative leaning Heritage Foundation think tank.

"The other problem is that if he (Mamdani) is selling things substantially less than the private market, who is going to want to go to the private market? Everyone is going to want to go to these grocery stores," Antoni told Fox Business, adding that the city-run grocery stores have the potential to exacerbate food shortages in New York City.

"If the government is going to make it impossible for the private market to compete, then the private market will stop competing. If you make it unprofitable for a grocer to do business in Manhattan, then people like John Catsimatidis are going to pull the plug," Antoni said, referencing the billionaire supermarket magnate.

In an interview with Fox Business, Catsimatidis said retail food was the toughest company in his Red Apple Group portfolio, which also includes real estate, energy and insurance assets.

"If the city of New York is going socialist, I will definitely close, or sell, or move or franchise the Gristedes locations," he said. Catsimatidis, a high-profile political donor in conservative circles, operates more than 15 Gristedes and nearly a dozen D'Agostino grocery stores in Manhattan.

"It’s going to hurt New York," Catsimatidis said of Mamdani's economic agenda should he win the November general election. He added that he is considering moving his corporate offices to New Jersey if that happens.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/mamdanis-public-grocery-stores-may-have-devastating-effects-citys-food-supply

I live in Manhattan and didn’t vote for Mamdani, but… have you ever been to a Gristedes or D’Agostino? It would not be a loss if they all shut down. They are all extortionately priced and somehow still gross. Even Whole Foods is at least 25-40% cheaper. I would love for the free market to deal with them.

This news actually makes me like Mamdani more.

This was just an example. You think Whole Foods will stay? It will soon be like those pictures of the Soviet grocery stores with a scale and empty counters and a line of babushkas waiting for that one type of meat that is available today.

I actually live in Manhattan. You think one little city grocery in each borough will cause WF to leave? lol. You have no clue about NYC

Why are we as Americans so programmed against helping the poor but ok with helping the rich?

Because entitlements make recipients demand more entitlements. No end in sight. To the dependency, lack of accountability, lack of work ethic.

The poor already get tons of help in America. They are net recipients of tons of welfare, housing, snap food, smartphones, Medicaid healthcare, donations, public assistance and don’t pay federal taxes. The bottom 40% of incomes don’t pay in. And if you work off the books or make nothing, obviously you don’t either.

The working poor literally bust their asses and work over 40 hours/week. The average American works way too much and is still in so much debt.

People like you never think giving welfare, government handouts, or tax breaks to the rich tech bros who fly drones all day is a problem.

[Anonymous]

What Mamdani got that Democrats apparently do not get is that debt is poverty, living paycheck to paycheck, and needing two income households, six figures to go to college, or roommates after college is not normal, and paying hundreds per month in premiums to go to the doctor once a year along with paying into Medicare and Medicaid via taxes is not normal.

[Anonymous]

The current system is broken, and the quality of life, work/life balance and financial security is just not there for many Americans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mamdami learned from the Democratic party failures in the 2024 presidential election. You have to listen to the young people.

The young people told Biden and Harris that if they didn't speak out against Israel, they wouldn't vote for them...and they did not vote for them.

Also, if you get on BlueSky and TikTok where most Gen Z and Millennials are communicating, you'll realize the young people have learned a valuable lesson: there are more of us than old people. If we band together and vote, we can get the candidate we want who will enact the policies we want. Older generations roll their eyes at millennials, but we are the most educated generation and also the generation with the least (in terms of wealth, real estate holdings, and kids). We are also one of the most well-traveled generations. We've been to other places in the world and seen how the citizens of other countries live better than us because of proper taxation of the wealthy and corporations. We have learned that we could have all that in the US if our government simply taxed the rich and corporations at appropriate rates.

Also, just for reference, because for some reason reason people on DCUM have it perpetually stuck in their heads that Gen Z are teenagers and Millennials are 20-somethings, here are the official age breakdowns:

Baby Boomers: 1946-1964 (ages 79-61)
Gen X: 1965-1980 (ages 60-45)
Millennials: 1981-1996 (ages 44-29)
Gen Z: 1997-2012 (ages 28-13)

I'm 43. I make more right now than both of my parents did combined at this age. I don't own a house. I live with a partner, but we are not married. We do not want kids because of the cost of everything. My parents owned a house, 2 cars, and took 3 kids on 2-3 vacations each year when they were in their 40s and they did that on the salaries of a tow truck driver and an office admin.

43 is not “young”. You are middle aged (as am I, also 43).

Your observations are generally correct and applicable to millennials (but not universal; I enjoy a much better standard of living than my parents did, I am married and I have 3 kids). ZM is not going to deliver a standard of living you seek, and, if his policy proposals are actually implemented, it will make your problems worse.

NP here. Do you not think there is an affordability and housing crisis in our country? That fact seems undeniable to me and should not be surprising given the energy of the occupy wall street movement over a decade ago and the growing inequality since then. So if there are problems with affordability/housing, why not try to some ideas? What I find refreshing about Mamdani is that he does not seem wed to ideology - listen to him talk about his grocery stores. It's one in each borough (which can be funded through existing city food programs) and he outright says if it doesn't work, then he will close them. Food deserts are a huge issue that the private sector has not tried so why not experiment with a public sector solution?

PP.

Yes, there is a housing/affordability crisis. The problem with “trying ideas” is that it can make problems much worse and destroy capital, making the road to recovery that much harder. Look at California: they’ve tried many ideas for making housing affordable and it’s only gotten worse and they are in a deeper hole. Most of ZM’s proposals will make the problems worse. The answer is and will continue to be more supply, but ZM isn’t going near that. Instead he’s proposing ideas that have been proven to fail.

To be fair, as much as I disagree with him about most things, his idea to let property tax valuations float to be more aligned with market value is a correct position.

The grocery store issue does highlight how he can make problems worse as well as the incoherence of his positions.

There is no such thing as just trying changes to an economic ecosystem. Once you introduce the government stores it will be extremely difficult to get rid of them and they will destabilize the economic system. Whoever runs them will be incentivized to expand their footprint/mandate. While the bodegas are a real problem, grocery stores have notoriously thin margins and undercutting them on price will be destabilizing.

ZM simultaneously believes that greedy capitalists will exploit everyone but for some reason food deserts exist where capitalists don’t go do business. Perhaps his mental model is off….

How does 5 grocery stores (one in each burrough in food desserts where there are no private grocery stores operating) risk “destabilizing the economic system”?

And, why might there be food deserts in the city? Is it because crime drove businesses that used to be there out? If so, how do you think these government run grocery stores will fare?

And, as to your question.....

Economists and business leaders are sounding alarms over New York City mayoral candidate Zohran Mamdani’s plan to roll out city-owned grocery stores that he says will lower food costs.

"You don’t lower grocery bills by having government-run stores," Ryan Bourne, a top economist at the libertarian leaning Cato Institute think tank, told Fox Business. "Government-run entities have no market discipline — no need to earn profits, compete, or serve customers efficiently. That leads to bloated costs, empty shelves, and zero accountability."

Bourne called Mamdani's city-run grocery stores "the height of political hubris" by failing to acknowledge that grocers operate in competitive arenas and on razor-thin profit margins.

"If we just do the simple math here, there's no way you can sell these products at lower prices and still make money," said E.J. Antoni, chief economist at the conservative leaning Heritage Foundation think tank.

"The other problem is that if he (Mamdani) is selling things substantially less than the private market, who is going to want to go to the private market? Everyone is going to want to go to these grocery stores," Antoni told Fox Business, adding that the city-run grocery stores have the potential to exacerbate food shortages in New York City.

"If the government is going to make it impossible for the private market to compete, then the private market will stop competing. If you make it unprofitable for a grocer to do business in Manhattan, then people like John Catsimatidis are going to pull the plug," Antoni said, referencing the billionaire supermarket magnate.

In an interview with Fox Business, Catsimatidis said retail food was the toughest company in his Red Apple Group portfolio, which also includes real estate, energy and insurance assets.

"If the city of New York is going socialist, I will definitely close, or sell, or move or franchise the Gristedes locations," he said. Catsimatidis, a high-profile political donor in conservative circles, operates more than 15 Gristedes and nearly a dozen D'Agostino grocery stores in Manhattan.

"It’s going to hurt New York," Catsimatidis said of Mamdani's economic agenda should he win the November general election. He added that he is considering moving his corporate offices to New Jersey if that happens.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/mamdanis-public-grocery-stores-may-have-devastating-effects-citys-food-supply

I live in Manhattan and didn’t vote for Mamdani, but… have you ever been to a Gristedes or D’Agostino? It would not be a loss if they all shut down. They are all extortionately priced and somehow still gross. Even Whole Foods is at least 25-40% cheaper. I would love for the free market to deal with them.

This news actually makes me like Mamdani more.

DP. A government grocery store is not the free market.

PP. Any market, then, including one where there’s five government-subsidized grocery stores in NYC. The proposal is one per borough. I think it’s kind of a dumb idea personally, but the fact that it’s causing so much hysteria is also dumb. It’s at least a new idea and it’s not like it’s going to cost billions of dollars. And those grocery stores will still at least be better than Gristedes.

Because it's fake hysteria. The real hysteria is due to him not being Pro-Israel.

"The lobby" will either physically try to harm him or they will plant a false flag operation in NYC.

What they don't understand is it will open the floodgates.

I see only of two ways they can rid of him:
A. Deport him under the guise of national security. Not likely because it would raise way too much controversy
B. Have someone try to harm him via false flag. Most likely a Zionist masquerading as a Pro-Palestinian supporter who's pretending to be upset that Mamdani said Israel has a right to exist

No, they can let him be elected, and then watch what happens when NYC becomes a magnet for illegals, the police are defunded out of existence, and the tax base moves to Florida. The city will become a third world cesspool and frame the 2028 election as a choice between conservative values and lawlessness.

This is what will likely happen and even without any framing, just by virtue of his stupid policies. He needs to be put in a Time Machine and transported to USSR and then let’s revisit his policies when he comes back. It’s just all ridiculous.

I can’t until summer is over and these kids go back to school.

Why are some of these policies, which are comparable to mainstream political parties in other high-income OECD countries, stupid? Like honestly the Americans on this thread need to be deprogrammed. You do not realize how bad everyone but the ultra rich has it in this country. AND WE PAY JUST AS MUCH IN TAXES.

What happens in in America is the bottom 40% of income HHs pay negligible income taxes (don't have enough W-2 income, or collect welfare, or work black market cash jobs) and the tippy top 0.1% pay negligible income taxes (as they don't have much W-2 income).

Meanwhile the UMC, top 1% to top 20% pay the majority of the federal, state, and city income taxes, and the MC pay the remainder.

So pandering to the bottom half who get freebies and the top 0.1% who live off wealth works well for politicians.

Either way ZM ain't goining to help the people paying 30-50% of their W-2 income to the government. They will pay more, and get nothing in return. As usual.

And don't get started on what a failure property taxes and public schools are in America since common core standards' new BS curricula choices, NCLB teach to the test standards, Google classroom/chromebooks everywhere, and public teacher unions.
So UMC and MC is screwed there too. K

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The current system is broken, and the quality of life, work/life balance and financial security is just not there for many Americans.

This^. My uncle moved to my aunt's country after retirement so they can have affordable healthcare and lifestyle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mamdami learned from the Democratic party failures in the 2024 presidential election. You have to listen to the young people.

The young people told Biden and Harris that if they didn't speak out against Israel, they wouldn't vote for them...and they did not vote for them.

Also, if you get on BlueSky and TikTok where most Gen Z and Millennials are communicating, you'll realize the young people have learned a valuable lesson: there are more of us than old people. If we band together and vote, we can get the candidate we want who will enact the policies we want. Older generations roll their eyes at millennials, but we are the most educated generation and also the generation with the least (in terms of wealth, real estate holdings, and kids). We are also one of the most well-traveled generations. We've been to other places in the world and seen how the citizens of other countries live better than us because of proper taxation of the wealthy and corporations. We have learned that we could have all that in the US if our government simply taxed the rich and corporations at appropriate rates.

Also, just for reference, because for some reason reason people on DCUM have it perpetually stuck in their heads that Gen Z are teenagers and Millennials are 20-somethings, here are the official age breakdowns:

Baby Boomers: 1946-1964 (ages 79-61)
Gen X: 1965-1980 (ages 60-45)
Millennials: 1981-1996 (ages 44-29)
Gen Z: 1997-2012 (ages 28-13)

I'm 43. I make more right now than both of my parents did combined at this age. I don't own a house. I live with a partner, but we are not married. We do not want kids because of the cost of everything. My parents owned a house, 2 cars, and took 3 kids on 2-3 vacations each year when they were in their 40s and they did that on the salaries of a tow truck driver and an office admin.

43 is not “young”. You are middle aged (as am I, also 43).

Your observations are generally correct and applicable to millennials (but not universal; I enjoy a much better standard of living than my parents did, I am married and I have 3 kids). ZM is not going to deliver a standard of living you seek, and, if his policy proposals are actually implemented, it will make your problems worse.

NP here. Do you not think there is an affordability and housing crisis in our country? That fact seems undeniable to me and should not be surprising given the energy of the occupy wall street movement over a decade ago and the growing inequality since then. So if there are problems with affordability/housing, why not try to some ideas? What I find refreshing about Mamdani is that he does not seem wed to ideology - listen to him talk about his grocery stores. It's one in each borough (which can be funded through existing city food programs) and he outright says if it doesn't work, then he will close them. Food deserts are a huge issue that the private sector has not tried so why not experiment with a public sector solution?

PP.

Yes, there is a housing/affordability crisis. The problem with “trying ideas” is that it can make problems much worse and destroy capital, making the road to recovery that much harder. Look at California: they’ve tried many ideas for making housing affordable and it’s only gotten worse and they are in a deeper hole. Most of ZM’s proposals will make the problems worse. The answer is and will continue to be more supply, but ZM isn’t going near that. Instead he’s proposing ideas that have been proven to fail.

To be fair, as much as I disagree with him about most things, his idea to let property tax valuations float to be more aligned with market value is a correct position.

The grocery store issue does highlight how he can make problems worse as well as the incoherence of his positions.

There is no such thing as just trying changes to an economic ecosystem. Once you introduce the government stores it will be extremely difficult to get rid of them and they will destabilize the economic system. Whoever runs them will be incentivized to expand their footprint/mandate. While the bodegas are a real problem, grocery stores have notoriously thin margins and undercutting them on price will be destabilizing.

ZM simultaneously believes that greedy capitalists will exploit everyone but for some reason food deserts exist where capitalists don’t go do business. Perhaps his mental model is off….

How does 5 grocery stores (one in each burrough in food desserts where there are no private grocery stores operating) risk “destabilizing the economic system”?

And, why might there be food deserts in the city? Is it because crime drove businesses that used to be there out? If so, how do you think these government run grocery stores will fare?

And, as to your question.....

Economists and business leaders are sounding alarms over New York City mayoral candidate Zohran Mamdani’s plan to roll out city-owned grocery stores that he says will lower food costs.

"You don’t lower grocery bills by having government-run stores," Ryan Bourne, a top economist at the libertarian leaning Cato Institute think tank, told Fox Business. "Government-run entities have no market discipline — no need to earn profits, compete, or serve customers efficiently. That leads to bloated costs, empty shelves, and zero accountability."

Bourne called Mamdani's city-run grocery stores "the height of political hubris" by failing to acknowledge that grocers operate in competitive arenas and on razor-thin profit margins.

"If we just do the simple math here, there's no way you can sell these products at lower prices and still make money," said E.J. Antoni, chief economist at the conservative leaning Heritage Foundation think tank.

"The other problem is that if he (Mamdani) is selling things substantially less than the private market, who is going to want to go to the private market? Everyone is going to want to go to these grocery stores," Antoni told Fox Business, adding that the city-run grocery stores have the potential to exacerbate food shortages in New York City.

"If the government is going to make it impossible for the private market to compete, then the private market will stop competing. If you make it unprofitable for a grocer to do business in Manhattan, then people like John Catsimatidis are going to pull the plug," Antoni said, referencing the billionaire supermarket magnate.

In an interview with Fox Business, Catsimatidis said retail food was the toughest company in his Red Apple Group portfolio, which also includes real estate, energy and insurance assets.

"If the city of New York is going socialist, I will definitely close, or sell, or move or franchise the Gristedes locations," he said. Catsimatidis, a high-profile political donor in conservative circles, operates more than 15 Gristedes and nearly a dozen D'Agostino grocery stores in Manhattan.

"It’s going to hurt New York," Catsimatidis said of Mamdani's economic agenda should he win the November general election. He added that he is considering moving his corporate offices to New Jersey if that happens.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/mamdanis-public-grocery-stores-may-have-devastating-effects-citys-food-supply

I live in Manhattan and didn’t vote for Mamdani, but… have you ever been to a Gristedes or D’Agostino? It would not be a loss if they all shut down. They are all extortionately priced and somehow still gross. Even Whole Foods is at least 25-40% cheaper. I would love for the free market to deal with them.

This news actually makes me like Mamdani more.

This was just an example. You think Whole Foods will stay? It will soon be like those pictures of the Soviet grocery stores with a scale and empty counters and a line of babushkas waiting for that one type of meat that is available today.

I actually live in Manhattan. You think one little city grocery in each borough will cause WF to leave? lol. You have no clue about NYC

Why are we as Americans so programmed against helping the poor but ok with helping the rich?

Because entitlements make recipients demand more entitlements. No end in sight. To the dependency, lack of accountability, lack of work ethic.

The poor already get tons of help in America. They are net recipients of tons of welfare, housing, snap food, smartphones, Medicaid healthcare, donations, public assistance and don’t pay federal taxes. The bottom 40% of incomes don’t pay in. And if you work off the books or make nothing, obviously you don’t either.

This is true too. There are no Poor People who are not "taken care of" by the system. Only the criminals or mentally ill or drug addicts who don't want to be in the system.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Unlike many politicians he admits his Communism. 'Seize the means of production'.

No word on whether he will liquidate the Kulaks.

He never said that.

Boomers are really showing their age. Communism literally means nothing to millennials and Gen Z born after Cold war/1991.

Get with it, Gramps

You could say the same about fascism. This is what the kids are liking on social media and Tik Tok now. Google census numbers for the US’s Black population.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Would Mamdani style city governing work for DC?

Just used the now FREE Ride-On bus in MoCo to get to my destination. This is revolutionary! This may radicalize us!

And have public unions operate and run it!! Another winning two way swing for USA!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mamdami learned from the Democratic party failures in the 2024 presidential election. You have to listen to the young people.

The young people told Biden and Harris that if they didn't speak out against Israel, they wouldn't vote for them...and they did not vote for them.

Also, if you get on BlueSky and TikTok where most Gen Z and Millennials are communicating, you'll realize the young people have learned a valuable lesson: there are more of us than old people. If we band together and vote, we can get the candidate we want who will enact the policies we want. Older generations roll their eyes at millennials, but we are the most educated generation and also the generation with the least (in terms of wealth, real estate holdings, and kids). We are also one of the most well-traveled generations. We've been to other places in the world and seen how the citizens of other countries live better than us because of proper taxation of the wealthy and corporations. We have learned that we could have all that in the US if our government simply taxed the rich and corporations at appropriate rates.

Also, just for reference, because for some reason reason people on DCUM have it perpetually stuck in their heads that Gen Z are teenagers and Millennials are 20-somethings, here are the official age breakdowns:

Baby Boomers: 1946-1964 (ages 79-61)
Gen X: 1965-1980 (ages 60-45)
Millennials: 1981-1996 (ages 44-29)
Gen Z: 1997-2012 (ages 28-13)

I'm 43. I make more right now than both of my parents did combined at this age. I don't own a house. I live with a partner, but we are not married. We do not want kids because of the cost of everything. My parents owned a house, 2 cars, and took 3 kids on 2-3 vacations each year when they were in their 40s and they did that on the salaries of a tow truck driver and an office admin.

43 is not “young”. You are middle aged (as am I, also 43).

Your observations are generally correct and applicable to millennials (but not universal; I enjoy a much better standard of living than my parents did, I am married and I have 3 kids). ZM is not going to deliver a standard of living you seek, and, if his policy proposals are actually implemented, it will make your problems worse.

NP here. Do you not think there is an affordability and housing crisis in our country? That fact seems undeniable to me and should not be surprising given the energy of the occupy wall street movement over a decade ago and the growing inequality since then. So if there are problems with affordability/housing, why not try to some ideas? What I find refreshing about Mamdani is that he does not seem wed to ideology - listen to him talk about his grocery stores. It's one in each borough (which can be funded through existing city food programs) and he outright says if it doesn't work, then he will close them. Food deserts are a huge issue that the private sector has not tried so why not experiment with a public sector solution?

PP.

Yes, there is a housing/affordability crisis. The problem with “trying ideas” is that it can make problems much worse and destroy capital, making the road to recovery that much harder. Look at California: they’ve tried many ideas for making housing affordable and it’s only gotten worse and they are in a deeper hole. Most of ZM’s proposals will make the problems worse. The answer is and will continue to be more supply, but ZM isn’t going near that. Instead he’s proposing ideas that have been proven to fail.

To be fair, as much as I disagree with him about most things, his idea to let property tax valuations float to be more aligned with market value is a correct position.

The grocery store issue does highlight how he can make problems worse as well as the incoherence of his positions.

There is no such thing as just trying changes to an economic ecosystem. Once you introduce the government stores it will be extremely difficult to get rid of them and they will destabilize the economic system. Whoever runs them will be incentivized to expand their footprint/mandate. While the bodegas are a real problem, grocery stores have notoriously thin margins and undercutting them on price will be destabilizing.

ZM simultaneously believes that greedy capitalists will exploit everyone but for some reason food deserts exist where capitalists don’t go do business. Perhaps his mental model is off….

How does 5 grocery stores (one in each burrough in food desserts where there are no private grocery stores operating) risk “destabilizing the economic system”?

And, why might there be food deserts in the city? Is it because crime drove businesses that used to be there out? If so, how do you think these government run grocery stores will fare?

And, as to your question.....

Economists and business leaders are sounding alarms over New York City mayoral candidate Zohran Mamdani’s plan to roll out city-owned grocery stores that he says will lower food costs.

"You don’t lower grocery bills by having government-run stores," Ryan Bourne, a top economist at the libertarian leaning Cato Institute think tank, told Fox Business. "Government-run entities have no market discipline — no need to earn profits, compete, or serve customers efficiently. That leads to bloated costs, empty shelves, and zero accountability."

Bourne called Mamdani's city-run grocery stores "the height of political hubris" by failing to acknowledge that grocers operate in competitive arenas and on razor-thin profit margins.

"If we just do the simple math here, there's no way you can sell these products at lower prices and still make money," said E.J. Antoni, chief economist at the conservative leaning Heritage Foundation think tank.

"The other problem is that if he (Mamdani) is selling things substantially less than the private market, who is going to want to go to the private market? Everyone is going to want to go to these grocery stores," Antoni told Fox Business, adding that the city-run grocery stores have the potential to exacerbate food shortages in New York City.

"If the government is going to make it impossible for the private market to compete, then the private market will stop competing. If you make it unprofitable for a grocer to do business in Manhattan, then people like John Catsimatidis are going to pull the plug," Antoni said, referencing the billionaire supermarket magnate.

In an interview with Fox Business, Catsimatidis said retail food was the toughest company in his Red Apple Group portfolio, which also includes real estate, energy and insurance assets.

"If the city of New York is going socialist, I will definitely close, or sell, or move or franchise the Gristedes locations," he said. Catsimatidis, a high-profile political donor in conservative circles, operates more than 15 Gristedes and nearly a dozen D'Agostino grocery stores in Manhattan.

"It’s going to hurt New York," Catsimatidis said of Mamdani's economic agenda should he win the November general election. He added that he is considering moving his corporate offices to New Jersey if that happens.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/mamdanis-public-grocery-stores-may-have-devastating-effects-citys-food-supply

I live in Manhattan and didn’t vote for Mamdani, but… have you ever been to a Gristedes or D’Agostino? It would not be a loss if they all shut down. They are all extortionately priced and somehow still gross. Even Whole Foods is at least 25-40% cheaper. I would love for the free market to deal with them.

This news actually makes me like Mamdani more.

DP. A government grocery store is not the free market.

PP. Any market, then, including one where there’s five government-subsidized grocery stores in NYC. The proposal is one per borough. I think it’s kind of a dumb idea personally, but the fact that it’s causing so much hysteria is also dumb. It’s at least a new idea and it’s not like it’s going to cost billions of dollars. And those grocery stores will still at least be better than Gristedes.

Because it's fake hysteria. The real hysteria is due to him not being Pro-Israel.

"The lobby" will either physically try to harm him or they will plant a false flag operation in NYC.

What they don't understand is it will open the floodgates.

I see only of two ways they can rid of him:
A. Deport him under the guise of national security. Not likely because it would raise way too much controversy
B. Have someone try to harm him via false flag. Most likely a Zionist masquerading as a Pro-Palestinian supporter who's pretending to be upset that Mamdani said Israel has a right to exist

No, they can let him be elected, and then watch what happens when NYC becomes a magnet for illegals, the police are defunded out of existence, and the tax base moves to Florida. The city will become a third world cesspool and frame the 2028 election as a choice between conservative values and lawlessness.

Yep, if you feed children and have a progressive tax system all hell will break loose. Pretty sure it was in the Bible.

You know that people can read what you are writing, right?

You want a progressive tax system? great, be specific. Suppose a Wall Street trader earns $1 million in a year and lives in New York city. How much do you think that he should pay in combined federal, state, and city taxes?

let's have him go from 43% fed tax rate + 10 % NY state + 7% NY city rate + 3.6% medicare/aid rate + 3% SS up to whatever + 2% fee on income over $200k rates.

and just like double those all. THat'll get that free fresh fruit to the Bronx for the artists and 30 yo unemployed theater kids

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Anonymous wrote:Mamdami learned from the Democratic party failures in the 2024 presidential election. You have to listen to the young people.

The young people told Biden and Harris that if they didn't speak out against Israel, they wouldn't vote for them...and they did not vote for them.

Also, if you get on BlueSky and TikTok where most Gen Z and Millennials are communicating, you'll realize the young people have learned a valuable lesson: there are more of us than old people. If we band together and vote, we can get the candidate we want who will enact the policies we want. Older generations roll their eyes at millennials, but we are the most educated generation and also the generation with the least (in terms of wealth, real estate holdings, and kids). We are also one of the most well-traveled generations. We've been to other places in the world and seen how the citizens of other countries live better than us because of proper taxation of the wealthy and corporations. We have learned that we could have all that in the US if our government simply taxed the rich and corporations at appropriate rates.

Also, just for reference, because for some reason reason people on DCUM have it perpetually stuck in their heads that Gen Z are teenagers and Millennials are 20-somethings, here are the official age breakdowns:

Baby Boomers: 1946-1964 (ages 79-61)
Gen X: 1965-1980 (ages 60-45)
Millennials: 1981-1996 (ages 44-29)
Gen Z: 1997-2012 (ages 28-13)

I'm 43. I make more right now than both of my parents did combined at this age. I don't own a house. I live with a partner, but we are not married. We do not want kids because of the cost of everything. My parents owned a house, 2 cars, and took 3 kids on 2-3 vacations each year when they were in their 40s and they did that on the salaries of a tow truck driver and an office admin.

43 is not “young”. You are middle aged (as am I, also 43).

Your observations are generally correct and applicable to millennials (but not universal; I enjoy a much better standard of living than my parents did, I am married and I have 3 kids). ZM is not going to deliver a standard of living you seek, and, if his policy proposals are actually implemented, it will make your problems worse.

NP here. Do you not think there is an affordability and housing crisis in our country? That fact seems undeniable to me and should not be surprising given the energy of the occupy wall street movement over a decade ago and the growing inequality since then. So if there are problems with affordability/housing, why not try to some ideas? What I find refreshing about Mamdani is that he does not seem wed to ideology - listen to him talk about his grocery stores. It's one in each borough (which can be funded through existing city food programs) and he outright says if it doesn't work, then he will close them. Food deserts are a huge issue that the private sector has not tried so why not experiment with a public sector solution?

PP.

Yes, there is a housing/affordability crisis. The problem with “trying ideas” is that it can make problems much worse and destroy capital, making the road to recovery that much harder. Look at California: they’ve tried many ideas for making housing affordable and it’s only gotten worse and they are in a deeper hole. Most of ZM’s proposals will make the problems worse. The answer is and will continue to be more supply, but ZM isn’t going near that. Instead he’s proposing ideas that have been proven to fail.

To be fair, as much as I disagree with him about most things, his idea to let property tax valuations float to be more aligned with market value is a correct position.

The grocery store issue does highlight how he can make problems worse as well as the incoherence of his positions.

There is no such thing as just trying changes to an economic ecosystem. Once you introduce the government stores it will be extremely difficult to get rid of them and they will destabilize the economic system. Whoever runs them will be incentivized to expand their footprint/mandate. While the bodegas are a real problem, grocery stores have notoriously thin margins and undercutting them on price will be destabilizing.

ZM simultaneously believes that greedy capitalists will exploit everyone but for some reason food deserts exist where capitalists don’t go do business. Perhaps his mental model is off….

How does 5 grocery stores (one in each burrough in food desserts where there are no private grocery stores operating) risk “destabilizing the economic system”?

And, why might there be food deserts in the city? Is it because crime drove businesses that used to be there out? If so, how do you think these government run grocery stores will fare?

And, as to your question.....

Economists and business leaders are sounding alarms over New York City mayoral candidate Zohran Mamdani’s plan to roll out city-owned grocery stores that he says will lower food costs.

"You don’t lower grocery bills by having government-run stores," Ryan Bourne, a top economist at the libertarian leaning Cato Institute think tank, told Fox Business. "Government-run entities have no market discipline — no need to earn profits, compete, or serve customers efficiently. That leads to bloated costs, empty shelves, and zero accountability."

Bourne called Mamdani's city-run grocery stores "the height of political hubris" by failing to acknowledge that grocers operate in competitive arenas and on razor-thin profit margins.

"If we just do the simple math here, there's no way you can sell these products at lower prices and still make money," said E.J. Antoni, chief economist at the conservative leaning Heritage Foundation think tank.

"The other problem is that if he (Mamdani) is selling things substantially less than the private market, who is going to want to go to the private market? Everyone is going to want to go to these grocery stores," Antoni told Fox Business, adding that the city-run grocery stores have the potential to exacerbate food shortages in New York City.

"If the government is going to make it impossible for the private market to compete, then the private market will stop competing. If you make it unprofitable for a grocer to do business in Manhattan, then people like John Catsimatidis are going to pull the plug," Antoni said, referencing the billionaire supermarket magnate.

In an interview with Fox Business, Catsimatidis said retail food was the toughest company in his Red Apple Group portfolio, which also includes real estate, energy and insurance assets.

"If the city of New York is going socialist, I will definitely close, or sell, or move or franchise the Gristedes locations," he said. Catsimatidis, a high-profile political donor in conservative circles, operates more than 15 Gristedes and nearly a dozen D'Agostino grocery stores in Manhattan.

"It’s going to hurt New York," Catsimatidis said of Mamdani's economic agenda should he win the November general election. He added that he is considering moving his corporate offices to New Jersey if that happens.

https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/mamdanis-public-grocery-stores-may-have-devastating-effects-citys-food-supply

I live in Manhattan and didn’t vote for Mamdani, but… have you ever been to a Gristedes or D’Agostino? It would not be a loss if they all shut down. They are all extortionately priced and somehow still gross. Even Whole Foods is at least 25-40% cheaper. I would love for the free market to deal with them.

This news actually makes me like Mamdani more.

This was just an example. You think Whole Foods will stay? It will soon be like those pictures of the Soviet grocery stores with a scale and empty counters and a line of babushkas waiting for that one type of meat that is available today.

I actually live in Manhattan. You think one little city grocery in each borough will cause WF to leave? lol. You have no clue about NYC

Why are we as Americans so programmed against helping the poor but ok with helping the rich?

Because entitlements make recipients demand more entitlements. No end in sight. To the dependency, lack of accountability, lack of work ethic.

The poor already get tons of help in America. They are net recipients of tons of welfare, housing, snap food, smartphones, Medicaid healthcare, donations, public assistance and don’t pay federal taxes. The bottom 40% of incomes don’t pay in. And if you work off the books or make nothing, obviously you don’t either.

The working poor literally bust their asses and work over 40 hours/week. The average American works way too much and is still in so much debt.

People like you never think giving welfare, government handouts, or tax breaks to the rich tech bros who fly drones all day is a problem.

Go to a tough HS and college, grad w a STEM & econ degree, start a company, fund it, work 100 hours a week to build something sustainable, create jobs for 100s or 1000s of people, raise public funding, take out 10% of your money, go fly a drone around and report back PP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What Mamdani got that Democrats apparently do not get is that debt is poverty, living paycheck to paycheck, and needing two income households, six figures to go to college, or roommates after college is not normal, and paying hundreds per month in premiums to go to the doctor once a year along with paying into Medicare and Medicaid via taxes is not normal.

Move to a cheaper COLA place with more opps. Like your legal immigrant ancestors did decades ago.