Competitive academics - what to tell the smart, hard-working kid who isn't "the best"

[Anonymous]

We are struggling with this in our house right now. We have a bright, academically-inclined, hard-working kid who gets good grades and likes school. When it comes to anything where she is assessed based on her own progress and ability to master coursework, she does great. She's going to go to college, I think she has the skills to do well there as well, and I feel confident that she can have a good career in her desired field (she's very science-focused with a particular interest in earth sciences). I don't worry about her in this way. She's a well rounded kid with a mix of natural intelligence, genuine interest in subject matter, and good study and practice habits.

The problem: she is at a school with some intensely academically competitive kids, who don't just work hard or do the homework, but study hours every night, do lots of supplementing to get ahead, do all academic summer programming etc. Some of that is the parents, but a lot of it at this point is the kids -- just super driven in a very specific way not just to do well but to win. It's only a handful of kids, but they are the superstars at school. A couple are also athletic superstars. It's just how it is, some people are like that, I never look at them and wish my kid was more like that (I think our family doesn't have the intensity for that kind of approach anyway, we are not super competitive people). I don't even think my kid actually wants to be like that -- she wants to do her homework and then read a book or draw in her sketchbook or go play a rec sport. She does not want to be working hours a day to compete.

But she gets frustrated watching these kids win all the accolades. I get it -- everyone wants to be recognized. But I'm worried because I have started hearing some self talk creep in that is (1) not helpful, and (2) not even true. Like she's started to say stuff like "I'm not that smart" or "Maybe I'm just not an academic person." This is BS -- she is. I've never met a kid who loves books or learning about different kinds of rocks or the history of the universe as much as she did. She's smart and she's academic. She's just not *competitive* in the way these kids are.

How do you reconcile this? She gets good grades, it's all going to work out. But I don't want this focus on competitive academic achievement to undermine her. We say the stuff you're supposed to say -- run your own race, focus on your own goals and how to get there, cheer on your classmates for doing the same, etc. But we're getting to the time of year where they hand out the awards and prizes for academics. DD is going to make honor roll again and usually gets a standout award in a class or two for writing or her passion for science. But she will also see these other kids getting ALL the awards and I can tell it bugs her. What do I say? How do I encourage her without taking anything away from these other kids? It's not like only the top 3 kids from school get to go to college or something, but DD doesn't seem to understand this context right now.

[Anonymous]

What accolades are they winning?

[Anonymous]

99.99% of kids who thought they were the brightest get to high school or college, or graduate school, or the workforce and find out they aren't. It's part of growing up

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What accolades are they winning?

The school selects two students from each grade based on GPA with teachers voting for tie breaks, so they'll win that. Mathletes plus there's a math competition in the spring (DD did well but did not win). Each subject teacher will select 1-2 students to win an award for that subject for the year -- DD may get one or maybe two of these, but there will be kids who get it for every single subject. That kind of thing. There is an awards dinner for all the kids who receive an academic award, plus everyone who has a GPA in the top ten percent of the class will get an award for that. This will be DD's second year attending (sophomore) and she sounds unenthusiastic about going because, in her words, "[XYZ students] will win everything again." Not exactly true but I get why this is her perception based on last year's experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:99.99% of kids who thought they were the brightest get to high school or college, or graduate school, or the workforce and find out they aren't. It's part of growing up

OP here and totally agree. I've told her this. Right now her world is small, it doesn't sink in. I don't even think she really wants the life that goes with being that specific kind of academic achiever. Right now all she sees is the attention and the kind of "glow" these kids have around them. She doesn't understand this glow will go away as soon as these kids are out of this environment and in places where there are a lot more kids just like them (and also that she could get that glow too, in the right college program or job that suits her interests and strengths well).

[Anonymous]

My oldest, despite being intelligent and extremely hard-working, has low processing speed, and needs to work 10 times more than his peers to achieve LESS.

He's now in college. He made his peace with it, over the years. You know what the silver lining has been? He's built incredible work ethic and a strong sense of self. He knows he cannot compare himself to others.
(His little sister is gifted, which makes any comparison even more difficult. So we don't do that.)

[Anonymous]

Your daughter sounds just like our current babysitter, who is college-aged. Let me tell you about her in the hopes that it shows you another path.

We live on the west coast near a college campus, and she came to this school specifically for its environmental sciences program. She was not bound for an elite school and probably didn't have a 4.5 and a 1600. She is a laid-back, kind, energetic person. She is the opposite of competitive but she is crazy smart and went to a competitive HS on the east coast that people from NY/NJ/CT would recognize. I imagine her decision to go to school across the country was in part to get away from all of them.

She is having a brilliant college career. She works for multiple professors in their labs, does field study, and is taking an intense, exciting course load (or at least that's how it sounds to us). She will have so many options after graduation. More importantly, she is kind, generous and enthusiastic.

We are fortunate to have her as a role model for our smart elementary school kid who is surrounded by very competitive classmates and their families.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My oldest, despite being intelligent and extremely hard-working, has low processing speed, and needs to work 10 times more than his peers to achieve LESS.

He's now in college. He made his peace with it, over the years. You know what the silver lining has been? He's built incredible work ethic and a strong sense of self. He knows he cannot compare himself to others.
(His little sister is gifted, which makes any comparison even more difficult. So we don't do that.)

Than you for this. This is totally what I want for DD -- just to make peace with where she is at, which is great. I personally think her approach to academics is a good one -- she puts in the work, including on things that are not her favorite, but then really digs in when she cares about the subject matter. I am hoping she learns that this is actually a pretty great approach to life generally! You don't need to be great at everything and there are diminishing returns to trying when you could just focus on the stuff that actually matters to you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Your daughter sounds just like our current babysitter, who is college-aged. Let me tell you about her in the hopes that it shows you another path.

We live on the west coast near a college campus, and she came to this school specifically for its environmental sciences program. She was not bound for an elite school and probably didn't have a 4.5 and a 1600. She is a laid-back, kind, energetic person. She is the opposite of competitive but she is crazy smart and went to a competitive HS on the east coast that people from NY/NJ/CT would recognize. I imagine her decision to go to school across the country was in part to get away from all of them.

She is having a brilliant college career. She works for multiple professors in their labs, does field study, and is taking an intense, exciting course load (or at least that's how it sounds to us). She will have so many options after graduation. More importantly, she is kind, generous and enthusiastic.

We are fortunate to have her as a role model for our smart elementary school kid who is surrounded by very competitive classmates and their families.

Thank you! Yes, this sounds very similar to DD and this is pretty much what we hope for her -- she is not aiming for an Ivy or a top SLAC, we just want a school with a good rep and great teaching/opportunities in her major, and there are lots of options there, especially out West. Maybe I can find a way to relate this to her (without revealing I'm talking about her on the internet) to let her know that she can follow a path like this and that others have found success in it.

[Anonymous]

You described our 8th grade DD and her situation exactly. I try to tie her worth to her character. To tell her that she matters to our family. To protect her self-esteem. But it's a losing battle. I understand, OP!
I have another, older DD with dyslexia and it always helped to have an outside-of-school interest where she excelled. Different situation, but I'm thinking about this as 8th grader goes off to high school. I want her to feel confident and successful at something outside of school, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:99.99% of kids who thought they were the brightest get to high school or college, or graduate school, or the workforce and find out they aren't. It's part of growing up

OP here and totally agree. I've told her this. Right now her world is small, it doesn't sink in. I don't even think she really wants the life that goes with being that specific kind of academic achiever. Right now all she sees is the attention and the kind of "glow" these kids have around them. She doesn't understand this glow will go away as soon as these kids are out of this environment and in places where there are a lot more kids just like them (and also that she could get that glow too, in the right college program or job that suits her interests and strengths well).

Tell her this and continue to tell her to run her own race. This self doubt is normal and the result of the normal comparisons she is doing. Remind her she is smart and amazing for who she is, also keep encouraging her to work hard and explore her passions. If she wants to do more let her do it too. Your family may not be super intense but maybe she is more intense than you think. Her race is not your race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your daughter sounds just like our current babysitter, who is college-aged. Let me tell you about her in the hopes that it shows you another path.

We live on the west coast near a college campus, and she came to this school specifically for its environmental sciences program. She was not bound for an elite school and probably didn't have a 4.5 and a 1600. She is a laid-back, kind, energetic person. She is the opposite of competitive but she is crazy smart and went to a competitive HS on the east coast that people from NY/NJ/CT would recognize. I imagine her decision to go to school across the country was in part to get away from all of them.

She is having a brilliant college career. She works for multiple professors in their labs, does field study, and is taking an intense, exciting course load (or at least that's how it sounds to us). She will have so many options after graduation. More importantly, she is kind, generous and enthusiastic.

We are fortunate to have her as a role model for our smart elementary school kid who is surrounded by very competitive classmates and their families.

Thank you! Yes, this sounds very similar to DD and this is pretty much what we hope for her -- she is not aiming for an Ivy or a top SLAC, we just want a school with a good rep and great teaching/opportunities in her major, and there are lots of options there, especially out West. Maybe I can find a way to relate this to her (without revealing I'm talking about her on the internet) to let her know that she can follow a path like this and that others have found success in it.

Tell her you were talking to a friend of a friend or a colleague or something and they mentioned their babysitter. It's a small world and I'm sure we could find a friend in common to make it true!

[Anonymous]

Ugh that’s hard OP. Is she at a private? Maybe you can think about switching schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You described our 8th grade DD and her situation exactly. I try to tie her worth to her character. To tell her that she matters to our family. To protect her self-esteem. But it's a losing battle. I understand, OP!
I have another, older DD with dyslexia and it always helped to have an outside-of-school interest where she excelled. Different situation, but I'm thinking about this as 8th grader goes off to high school. I want her to feel confident and successful at something outside of school, too.

OP here and yes, I commiserate. DD had an outside interest for many years that I think balanced things out (ballet) but this year she switched from a pre-professional program (because she does not actually want to pursue it professionally) to just regular adult classes, and while I think this was the right choice for her, I do think she feels like she lost some "specialness" with it. High school has just had a lot of focus on being a stand out and I think she's having a little identity crisis around that -- if she's not "the best" at something, what is she? I know she's a wonderful, balanced person with great character, but I think right now it feels like that doesn't matter or doesn't count within the social/academic hierarchies at school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Your daughter sounds just like our current babysitter, who is college-aged. Let me tell you about her in the hopes that it shows you another path.

We live on the west coast near a college campus, and she came to this school specifically for its environmental sciences program. She was not bound for an elite school and probably didn't have a 4.5 and a 1600. She is a laid-back, kind, energetic person. She is the opposite of competitive but she is crazy smart and went to a competitive HS on the east coast that people from NY/NJ/CT would recognize. I imagine her decision to go to school across the country was in part to get away from all of them.

She is having a brilliant college career. She works for multiple professors in their labs, does field study, and is taking an intense, exciting course load (or at least that's how it sounds to us). She will have so many options after graduation. More importantly, she is kind, generous and enthusiastic.

We are fortunate to have her as a role model for our smart elementary school kid who is surrounded by very competitive classmates and their families.

Thank you! Yes, this sounds very similar to DD and this is pretty much what we hope for her -- she is not aiming for an Ivy or a top SLAC, we just want a school with a good rep and great teaching/opportunities in her major, and there are lots of options there, especially out West. Maybe I can find a way to relate this to her (without revealing I'm talking about her on the internet) to let her know that she can follow a path like this and that others have found success in it.

Tell her you were talking to a friend of a friend or a colleague or something and they mentioned their babysitter. It's a small world and I'm sure we could find a friend in common to make it true!

+1, I will! She'll roll her eyes at me but maybe it will sink in eventually. I do think she needs some more concrete role models -- maybe we'll start thinking of ways to find some locally who might be able to reinforce this.