New Great Schools Ratings Released for FCPS/APS High Schools

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fairfax falling to a 6. It used to be a solidly middle class county with pockets of wealthy.
The county has been overrun with poverty. The score reflects that.

Got it the first time.

You can go back now to pondering why no Arlington high school is higher than a 7, and why the APS School Board can't figure out how to build a fourth high school.

FCPS is huge and has a very uneven distribution of income. Where is is good, it is excellent. Where it is bad, it is really bad. And there is not a lot in the middle of the bell curve. We can all say we wish the schools were more even, but geographically that's tough. The Eastern county is killing us. Killing ACPS too. But, I bought a nice SFH in a GS 8-10, ES, MS and HS zone for under 700k. So you can get GS 8 schools without buying a million dollar home. Whereas, you can't get a GS 8 high school in APS, not matter what you spend.

And I'm sure all the parents of kids starting ES are thrilled about APS's overcrowding issues. By the time those kids start HS, the SB is still going to be trying to make the Ed Center work, or have moved on to 2 shift HSs or whatever else.

We've all got our issues. FCPS's is definately demographic. I can't figure out how we keep being ranked up there with Arlington in most educated, most affluent, and be getting poorer. But there you have it.

Fairfax is not getting poorer. Average incomes are not dropping, the overall FARMS percentage is three percentage points lower than in Arlington, and the FARMS percentage in FCPS has gone down for two years in a row. Fairfax also has a much larger "middle" than the other large suburban county with decent schools, Montgomery.

[Anonymous]

+1

The unfortunate truth is you could shut the average wealthy kid in a room alone with a textbook and they'd probably still score better than the average ESL/FARMS kid with full classroom instruction.

Perhaps...you, too, would score worse on a test in a different language if you were up against a "wealthy kid" taking it in his native language.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fairfax falling to a 6. It used to be a solidly middle class county with pockets of wealthy.
The county has been overrun with poverty. The score reflects that.

Got it the first time.

You can go back now to pondering why no Arlington high school is higher than a 7, and why the APS School Board can't figure out how to build a fourth high school.

FCPS is huge and has a very uneven distribution of income. Where is is good, it is excellent. Where it is bad, it is really bad. And there is not a lot in the middle of the bell curve. We can all say we wish the schools were more even, but geographically that's tough. The Eastern county is killing us. Killing ACPS too. But, I bought a nice SFH in a GS 8-10, ES, MS and HS zone for under 700k. So you can get GS 8 schools without buying a million dollar home. Whereas, you can't get a GS 8 high school in APS, not matter what you spend.

And I'm sure all the parents of kids starting ES are thrilled about APS's overcrowding issues. By the time those kids start HS, the SB is still going to be trying to make the Ed Center work, or have moved on to 2 shift HSs or whatever else.

We've all got our issues. FCPS's is definately demographic. I can't figure out how we keep being ranked up there with Arlington in most educated, most affluent, and be getting poorer. But there you have it.

Fairfax is not getting poorer. Average incomes are not dropping, the overall FARMS percentage is three percentage points lower than in Arlington, and the FARMS percentage in FCPS has gone down for two years in a row. Fairfax also has a much larger "middle" than the other large suburban county with decent schools, Montgomery.

Ok. Well then fairfax county is just sucking because it sucks. Mystery solved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fairfax falling to a 6. It used to be a solidly middle class county with pockets of wealthy.
The county has been overrun with poverty. The score reflects that.

Got it the first time.

You can go back now to pondering why no Arlington high school is higher than a 7, and why the APS School Board can't figure out how to build a fourth high school.

FCPS is huge and has a very uneven distribution of income. Where is is good, it is excellent. Where it is bad, it is really bad. And there is not a lot in the middle of the bell curve. We can all say we wish the schools were more even, but geographically that's tough. The Eastern county is killing us. Killing ACPS too. But, I bought a nice SFH in a GS 8-10, ES, MS and HS zone for under 700k. So you can get GS 8 schools without buying a million dollar home. Whereas, you can't get a GS 8 high school in APS, not matter what you spend.

And I'm sure all the parents of kids starting ES are thrilled about APS's overcrowding issues. By the time those kids start HS, the SB is still going to be trying to make the Ed Center work, or have moved on to 2 shift HSs or whatever else.

We've all got our issues. FCPS's is definately demographic. I can't figure out how we keep being ranked up there with Arlington in most educated, most affluent, and be getting poorer. But there you have it.

Fairfax is not getting poorer. Average incomes are not dropping, the overall FARMS percentage is three percentage points lower than in Arlington, and the FARMS percentage in FCPS has gone down for two years in a row. Fairfax also has a much larger "middle" than the other large suburban county with decent schools, Montgomery.

Ok. Well then fairfax county is just sucking because it sucks. Mystery solved.

Go back to the drawing board and try to come up with something new. So far you just keep making a fool out of yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow Yorktown

Yorktown's college placement is garbage. I feel so sorry for those kids. They work hard there, but very little payoff when they come out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

+1

The unfortunate truth is you could shut the average wealthy kid in a room alone with a textbook and they'd probably still score better than the average ESL/FARMS kid with full classroom instruction.

Perhaps...you, too, would score worse on a test in a different language if you were up against a "wealthy kid" taking it in his native language.

Sounds like that's what pp is saying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow Yorktown

Don't worry, Yorktown blows them all away in the latest Challenge Index

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/local/high-school-challenge-2017/

Yorktown and W-L score high in terms of the average number of AP or IB classes taken by graduating seniors. They don't do as well in terms of the percentage who both take and pass an AP or IB exam - look at the "E&E" ratings published with the Challenge Index.

Yorktown and W-L are the worst of both worlds: Intense, pressure cooker schools but with mediocre outcomes and abysmal college placement. Their graduates head off to mediocre colleges and universities either a) dispirited; or b) with a big chip on their shoulders.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow Yorktown

Don't worry, Yorktown blows them all away in the latest Challenge Index

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/local/high-school-challenge-2017/

Yorktown and W-L score high in terms of the average number of AP or IB classes taken by graduating seniors. They don't do as well in terms of the percentage who both take and pass an AP or IB exam - look at the "E&E" ratings published with the Challenge Index.

Yorktown and W-L are the worst of both worlds: Intense, pressure cooker schools but with mediocre outcomes and abysmal college placement. Their graduates head off to mediocre colleges and universities either a) dispirited; or b) with a big chip on their shoulders.

Sounds like you're trying to justify your decision to go private rather than send your kids to APS. Do you interview every Yorktown and W-L grad personally?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow Yorktown

Yorktown's college placement is garbage. I feel so sorry for those kids. They work hard there, but very little payoff when they come out.

That depends. If you like UVA, W&M, and JMU, Yorktown is great. If your kid wants to go to a top 10 USNWR school, it's doable, but they will need to earn their way in...there's no boost/cache coming from Yorktown.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow Yorktown

Yorktown's college placement is garbage. I feel so sorry for those kids. They work hard there, but very little payoff when they come out.

That depends. If you like UVA, W&M, and JMU, Yorktown is great. If your kid wants to go to a top 10 USNWR school, it's doable, but they will need to earn their way in...there's no boost/cache coming from Yorktown.

I will grant you that -- the APS high schools do place well into UVa, W&M and JMU, but the USNWR Top 25 Universities and Top 25 Liberal Arts colleges (not just the Top 10) are a REAL stretch -- even for kids with weighted GPAs well above 4.0. W-L and Yorktown are grinders, and the payoff at the end of the tunnel is merely a state university at the outer edges of the USNWR Top 25 (not trying to disparage UVa and W&M in any way; they are very good schools). I don't get it, because W-L has a fantastic IB program, and Yorktown offers more AP classes than just about any school in the greater DC area; its very impressive. Both schools use Naviance to help the kids, just like the elite private HS do. Something doesn't add up, that's all I'm saying. An admissions director at a top Northeast SLAC told me that he was well aware of the stunt W-L pulled a few years ago, announcing 250 valedictorians. It watered things down for everyone. Maybe APS should go back to ranking students? I know this isn't the trend nationally (even at private HS), but if it results in significantly better college placement I would bet that the top third of students at W-L and Yorktown would be in favor of it. Maybe the top 25s (other than in-state UVa and W&M) view any APS kid who didn't attend TJ as not worth their while. TJ may be hurting college placement for other NoVa high schools, but Langley and McLean seem to do well, albeit not as well as Whitman, Churchill and BCC in Maryland. Something needs to change -- way too many bright kids here not achieving what they've earned.

[Anonymous]

None of the VA schools (aside from TJ) do well with college placement. Maybe TJ is pulling spots from other area HSs?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:None of the VA schools (aside from TJ) do well with college placement. Maybe TJ is pulling spots from other area HSs?

This has been debated to death in AAP. Especially considering the top state schools (UVA/WM/VT Engineering). General thought is:

1. They aren't, because TJ kids have a different curriculum and different (and harder) grading. So TJ kids are separately evaluated. Otherwise, it's not fair to TJ kids (harder classes and more requirements harder grading) or base school kids (TJ kids have more opportunities, and take slots).

2. And even if they were, TJ kids are really impressive. They would probably be top 10% in base schools, and suck up spots in top schools from base schools too. .

For example, 224 TJ admits to UVA last year. That's huge. But, even if TJ wasn't there and there were more NOVA slots, Kids now in TJ would likely have taken them up.

College admission is just tough from NOVA vs. ROVA. Lots of smart, motivated, talented kids competing-- at TJ and in base schools.

[Anonymous]

Tj kids can't be separated from the gen pop.

They are part of FCPS. If they were at their base schools they'd be in the top 2% at their home schools and snagging top schools regardless.
APS and FCPS both suffer from having huge populations of high achieving kids. It's hard to stand out. Also there are some top private schools here, and I would venture they take most of the Ivy League spots.
I thought most colleges are looking for geographic diversity.
The kids are in a rat race to nowhere here.

[Anonymous]

The unfortunate truth is you could shut the average wealthy kid in a room alone with a textbook and they'd probably still score better than the average ESL/FARMS kid with full classroom instruction.


Perhaps...you, too, would score worse on a test in a different language if you were up against a "wealthy kid" taking it in his native language.



Sounds like that's what pp is saying.

No. The tone is completely different (read: condescending)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are all HSs pushed down 1 rating because they need to make TJ a 10 and need to differentiate between TJ and everything else? It's more like a state ranking/tiers right, instead of true rating. Which is why you can't compare across states.

What? I don't understand what you are meaning about rankings?
TJ is the only 10 in FFX APS etc, because it is much further ahead of the pack. Your school can't be a 10 in comparison.

Right. That is what I was trying to say. TJ is a 10, making it impossible for any other school in VA to be a 10 because nothing else compares. And the 9s are the next tier, etc. If TJ disappeared one day, all remaining schools would +1.

So not a true "rating" calculated numerically, but a ranking of 10 tiers across the state.

Lately, I've seen this idea that a "7" here is better than, say, a "7" in Florida or Texas gain currency. But most states that I know of, including southern states that have school systems that generally get derided on this forum, have magnet schools similar to TJ. If you look at the US News rankings, TJ is #2 in the STEM category, but if you look at the magnet category, the top 10 schools are in Texas, Florida, South Carolina, Tennessee, and Maine. Wouldn't their tier system be equally affected? In fact, TJ is ranked #6 overall, while the #1 school in Texas is ranked #4 nationwide. In fact, 5 of the top 10 are in Arizona, and 2 are in Texas. Texas has 4 schools in the top 20. Virginia has 1 (TJ). I'm sure the top tier schools are all roughly comparable -- I'm just noting that I don't buy the whole "the scoring is harder in Virginia because of TJ" line.