1530 SAT at McLean High not enough for UVA now?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

How it is arbitrary to take four years of a language? STEM isn't the only thing that matters in this world, even for a STEM major.

DP.
World Language makes sense only for non-pointy kids with no ECs that stand out. What else do they have but classes the kid took?

I'm hoping a National Science Fair/Olympiad winner without language could get in? If that kid can't get in then UVA is in big trouble; VA Tech will soon take over for the top spot. W&M what happened to you? neck and neck with UVA for a good part of history.

If your kid is that bright why wouldn't they take a language for at least two years?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why is UVA so impossible from McL now?

UVA was a difficult admit from McLean HS or Langley HS decades ago. It is not new.

Every year UVA accepts multiple students from each of those HSs. Downstate in a rural county HS maybe 1 or 2 students would get admission offers from UVA.

For admissions to any college a student is competing against other students from his/her own school. This is the fundamental. The secondary consideration is that *many* students at those 2 HSs are applying to UVA. The tertiary consideration is that UVA is much smaller than many public universities (both in VA and in other states).

It likely is easier to get good college admissions as a top student at (contrived example) W Potomac HS or Mt Vernon HS -- simply because there is less competition.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

How it is arbitrary to take four years of a language? STEM isn't the only thing that matters in this world, even for a STEM major.

DP.
World Language makes sense only for non-pointy kids with no ECs that stand out. What else do they have but classes the kid took?

I'm hoping a National Science Fair/Olympiad winner without language could get in? If that kid can't get in then UVA is in big trouble; VA Tech will soon take over for the top spot. W&M what happened to you? neck and neck with UVA for a good part of history.

If your kid is that bright why wouldn't they take a language for at least two years?

The pointy tech kids the real ones don't do anything well outside their field. One guy I met at VA Tech - even in engineering the only thing he could do is Computer Engineering. He was good at it but bad at everything else. I met a guy at GMU who knew everything about robotics he had a terrible GPA and couldn't break 1200 SAT (back in the 1990s) - no good at Math. But during the 1990s could build impressive robots. If you want passion you sacrifice well-rounded. Two years is easy - take the AP test and score a 4 or 5 is next-level which neither could achieve.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

Language game poster here and I agree. While my kid is happy with his chosen college and I think it's a better fit than UVA, I am still a little disappointed he won't be taking advantage of instate tuition at my alma mater. I don't think the state flagship should have this weird standard. It definitely hurts STEM kids. He had to choose between a STEM AP double period class and a language. I think he picked correctly and I'm miffed that UVA penalizes kids for following their interests.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child goes to McLean High. He got a 1530 SAT as a junior and came home saying it is not good enough because most kids are getting higher scores, so he wants to retake it a third time. Is this really where we are now, that you need a perfect SAT score?

He is already in all DE and AP classes and he is in Calc 2 as a junior. Now he is saying he needs to take summer classes at NOVA so he can take Calc 3 and then differential equations senior year. It feels insane, although he has already taken about five NOVA dual enrollment classes, so I guess we are saving some money.

I graduated in the 90s, got a 1350, felt great about it, did not take calculus until college, and I turned out fine. Is the bar just totally different now?

For those familiar with UVA admissions, is a 1530 SAT at McLean High with a 4.2 weighted GPA and all AP and DE since sophomore year actually not enough, or is this just the pressure cooker effect?

This is going to be pretty formulaic but just so you are prepared. Look at Naviance or whatever tool your high school uses. See how many kids apply to UVA from McLean (you compete first against kids in your own school) and see how many get in over the past 3 years. Is your kid’s GPA lower than the “n” number of kids admitted. If so scoring higher on the SAT isn’t going to matter for UVA. Just not going to move the needle. It is just that simple.

Make applicants get a statistical bump at W&M if staying in state is a goal. VT if going engineering is a crap shoot otherwise an option, again if in state matters. Otherwise look to the south or mid west. Good luck.

But keep in mind the reported GPA on Naviance is from senior year, so you can't really tell for sure now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

It’s not arbitrary.

It does narrow the field to top students.

The top STEM public university in VA is VT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

It seems very basic and incurious to denigrate foreign languages.

For upper class people, fluency in other languages is a sign of being educated and cultured. In the lower class, it’s often valued as well. Why do middle class people convince themselves it’s not a good thing to study languages?

Of course it's a good thing, but so is studying advanced science. Sometimes both don't fit a kid's interests or literally fit into the high school schedule. When that happens, why is foreign language automatically deemed better by UVA? That's the point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

It’s not arbitrary.

It does narrow the field to top students.

The top STEM public university in VA is VT.

Well it excludes top STEM students. They didn't get my NMSF with a perfect SAT score. Their loss!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

How it is arbitrary to take four years of a language? STEM isn't the only thing that matters in this world, even for a STEM major.

DP.
World Language makes sense only for non-pointy kids with no ECs that stand out. What else do they have but classes the kid took?

I'm hoping a National Science Fair/Olympiad winner without language could get in? If that kid can't get in then UVA is in big trouble; VA Tech will soon take over for the top spot. W&M what happened to you? neck and neck with UVA for a good part of history.

If your kid is that bright why wouldn't they take a language for at least two years?

Mine did take a lang for two years but he hated it and it was his weakest subject. After two years it didn't fit into his schedule given all the AP sciences he wanted to take.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

How it is arbitrary to take four years of a language? STEM isn't the only thing that matters in this world, even for a STEM major.

DP.
World Language makes sense only for non-pointy kids with no ECs that stand out. What else do they have but classes the kid took?

I'm hoping a National Science Fair/Olympiad winner without language could get in? If that kid can't get in then UVA is in big trouble; VA Tech will soon take over for the top spot. W&M what happened to you? neck and neck with UVA for a good part of history.

If your kid is that bright why wouldn't they take a language for at least two years?

Oh, but he did. He was in language immersion from ES so he started HS language classes while in 7th, then level 3 freshman year, but wanted to switch to another language sophomore year, only to learn later that this messed him up for UVA. So he has had 3 years of language A and 1 year of language B. So, 4 years of HS language, just not the way UVA likes it because 2 years were before HS and not all 4 years were the same language.

[Anonymous]

Yes UVA's requirement of one language is even sillier than the language requirement. Penalizes students who want to switch. Makes no sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child goes to McLean High. He got a 1530 SAT as a junior and came home saying it is not good enough because most kids are getting higher scores, so he wants to retake it a third time. Is this really where we are now, that you need a perfect SAT score?

He is already in all DE and AP classes and he is in Calc 2 as a junior. Now he is saying he needs to take summer classes at NOVA so he can take Calc 3 and then differential equations senior year. It feels insane, although he has already taken about five NOVA dual enrollment classes, so I guess we are saving some money.

I graduated in the 90s, got a 1350, felt great about it, did not take calculus until college, and I turned out fine. Is the bar just totally different now?

For those familiar with UVA admissions, is a 1530 SAT at McLean High with a 4.2 weighted GPA and all AP and DE since sophomore year actually not enough, or is this just the pressure cooker effect?

This is going to be pretty formulaic but just so you are prepared. Look at Naviance or whatever tool your high school uses. See how many kids apply to UVA from McLean (you compete first against kids in your own school) and see how many get in over the past 3 years. Is your kid’s GPA lower than the “n” number of kids admitted. If so scoring higher on the SAT isn’t going to matter for UVA. Just not going to move the needle. It is just that simple.

Make applicants get a statistical bump at W&M if staying in state is a goal. VT if going engineering is a crap shoot otherwise an option, again if in state matters. Otherwise look to the south or mid west. Good luck.

But keep in mind the reported GPA on Naviance is from senior year, so you can't really tell for sure now.

You also can't tell the trend, i.e. did grades improve in Junior year?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's your zip code.

This. From McLean and Langley, you need a 4.5 on top of that SAT score. Highest rigor, highest grades. No room for an emotional breakup, friend troubles, personal issues to work through, or family struggle. Be perfect since age 14 or no UVA for you.

Which means there are lots of parents helicoptering and snow plowing to make this happen and they have all the money they need to support that.

If you have more money you don’t obsess about your kids going to an in-state school like UVA. You let your kids enjoy life a bit more and go to another in-state school, a SLAC or an OOS flagship, comfortable that their basic smarts and social skills will serve them well later.

You must be posting from the south. That’s how southern wealthy parents act, not DC/Northern Virginia parents.

We are in NoVa and not rich, but we saw the writing on the wall. UVA wasn’t going to be for our DC, who had some transcript/GPA things that would have been issues at UVA. We went the SLAC route and with aid ended up being less than what we would have paid for UVA.

Similar story here, DC took a very rigorous STEM focused courseload but didn’t want to play UVA’s language game. Headed to a top SLAC instead. Who knows whether he would have gotten into UVA. Pulled his app when he got in the SLAC ED.

"language game" - aka it was never the right fit and that's fine!

DP.
Disagree that a state flagship should have such an arbitrary standard on world languages if they are trying to attract top students, particularly top STEM students.

It’s not arbitrary.

It does narrow the field to top students.

The top STEM public university in VA is VT.

Well it excludes top STEM students. They didn't get my NMSF with a perfect SAT score. Their loss!

You said he didn’t play/apply. How can you say they exclude him? He probably knew it’s not a good fit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes UVA's requirement of one language is even sillier than the language requirement. Penalizes students who want to switch. Makes no sense.

It does make sense. Taking intro Spanish, after intro French and maybe intro Latin/german/sign language is not a the same as one language up to level 4+. Get a grip.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yes UVA's requirement of one language is even sillier than the language requirement. Penalizes students who want to switch. Makes no sense.

How is that silly? Mastery of a language is important. Quitting one and switching to another language shows the kid took an easier route and impacts how rigor is viewed