Yield Protection

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The two schools with very obvious yield protection at our private, based on Scattergrams, were Tulane and Northeastern, only the middle third of the class was green territory. This was for 2023 cycle, so basically the first three years post covid.

Northeastern get 100K apps from high stat kids and acceptance rate is mid single digit for Boston campus.
You can call it yield protection or whatever but the school has luxury to pick and choose right students with high stats for the school who want to be there.

+1000

Yield protection does not happen at schools with single digit acceptance rates.

It happens at like a CWRU with a 35-40% acceptance rate and yield issues. For them, if you are really high stats (higher than 80-90%) and you do NOT demonstrate considerable interest, they might not accept you. They smartly figure you are likely getting into one of the 10+ t25 you applied to and going there. So unless you convince them otherwise, they will offer the spot to someone more likely to attend.

And that’s fair and reasonable, they want students who want to attend not ones who will turn them down

Tufts is 10% acceptance rate and yield protection was named for them.

Colleges can can get to a very low acceptance rate by inducing people to apply through marketing and doing things like counting incomplete applications.

it was named after them in the 90s. They didn’t have a 10% accept rate then.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the problem for high stat kids…

There are only reaches and safeties no matches.

You apply to a safety because you are concerned you won’t get into your reaches and you might not get into your first choice safety due to yield protection.

You may apply to reaches and get rejected from all.

Kind of stinks to work so hard and have this happen.

Get a grip. High stat kids have thousands of colleges to choose from. Please stop and seek help if necessary.

New poster: genuinely high stats kids who have worked hard (versus all As for all) are usually not interested in those “thousands of colleges.”

Why not?

Though we both know you know why, I’ll answer anyway: Because their sights are higher, their academic history is what they worked on for years for it to result in a good placement relative to their ability, etc. not everyone, and there are other reasons to pick a lower ranked school, but in general, most high stats kids are applying to excellent schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the problem for high stat kids…

There are only reaches and safeties no matches.

You apply to a safety because you are concerned you won’t get into your reaches and you might not get into your first choice safety due to yield protection.

You may apply to reaches and get rejected from all.

Kind of stinks to work so hard and have this happen.

Get a grip. High stat kids have thousands of colleges to choose from. Please stop and seek help if necessary.

New poster: genuinely high stats kids who have worked hard (versus all As for all) are usually not interested in those “thousands of colleges.”

Why not?

Though we both know you know why, I’ll answer anyway: Because their sights are higher, their academic history is what they worked on for years for it to result in a good placement relative to their ability, etc. not everyone, and there are other reasons to pick a lower ranked school, but in general, most high stats kids are applying to excellent schools.

Would do you consider excellent? The top 10% of colleges? That would be the top 300-400. High stat kids can find an excellent college in the top 400 that doesn’t “yield protect”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is the problem for high stat kids…

There are only reaches and safeties no matches.

You apply to a safety because you are concerned you won’t get into your reaches and you might not get into your first choice safety due to yield protection.

You may apply to reaches and get rejected from all.

Kind of stinks to work so hard and have this happen.

And this is why every school needs ED. Then they know they’re your first choice and you will absolutely come.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:virginia tech big time

lol no

I know a 1590 female math major that was rejected by tech last round.

And? She wasn’t owed an acceptance.

Honestly, no one on here has ever said their kid was owed admission. They just said some schools, including Tech, clearly yield protect. A school with a 57% acceptance rate is not turning down a 4.6/1590 kid based on merit (or essays). They just don't think the kid will enroll. It is fine, they should just own it. To argue that they are not is laughable.

And yet, they do accept plenty of kids with those stats. Those are the top 25%. They can’t except *everyone,* you know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:virginia tech big time

lol no

I know a 1590 female math major that was rejected by tech last round.

And? She wasn’t owed an acceptance.

Honestly, no one on here has ever said their kid was owed admission. They just said some schools, including Tech, clearly yield protect. A school with a 57% acceptance rate is not turning down a 4.6/1590 kid based on merit (or essays). They just don't think the kid will enroll. It is fine, they should just own it. To argue that they are not is laughable.

+1. If you haven't realized by now.. you CANNOT
- Say that Tech yield protects
- Say that Tech is your child's safety

If you do, "they" will hound you out of DCUM.

I'd say Tech is an anamoly with higher demand that it's ranking and profile deserve. Rutgers, Ohio State, Penn State, etc. have ranked above tech forever but are far easier to get into and more predictable. Gotta tell you though.. the Tech parents' groups on FB are fantastic. Way more helpful and committed than others we are a part of.

+1
VT parents are a great group and resource.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the problem for high stat kids…

There are only reaches and safeties no matches.

You apply to a safety because you are concerned you won’t get into your reaches and you might not get into your first choice safety due to yield protection.

You may apply to reaches and get rejected from all.

Kind of stinks to work so hard and have this happen.

And this is why every school needs ED. Then they know they’re your first choice and you will absolutely come.

For donut hole families that are looking for merit, they need to say this is the average merit package

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:virginia tech big time

1. VT is not a safety.
2. VT does not yield-protect and says as much right on their website.

"Yield Protection
Virginia Tech does not participate in yield protection."

https://www.vt.edu/admissions/undergraduate/counselor-corner.html#:~:text=Virginia%20Tech%20does%20not,participate%20in%20yield%20protection.

OP here.
I’ve heard that if you have over a 1500 SAT to watch out with VT. That’s really sad because it’s a top choice for my son. He submitted his app early (yesterday) plus we toured in Jan. Hopefully that signals to VT, that he is interested.

Next someone will say that VT doesn't care about DI. VT does care about DI AND yield protects regardless of what a lot VT cheerleaders come on here to say. If the department that your son is interested in has any sessions at all, make sure you attend to show interest even if you have attended a similar event previously. Engage with the department staff.

A lot of schools yield protect even though their stated policy may be "we don't yield protect". What are you going to do? Sue them? Kinda hard to prove your case given the opacity of the process. Don't really blame them though..A school that doesn't yield protect would pretty much admit every student that meets their academic/other threshold/standard for admission and deal with the consequences of low yield and waitlist management. Tech chooses not to do that and that's fine. People just need to be aware of this and plan accordingly.

If VT admitted every student that is in their profile, they would over enroll every year. Having the stats isn’t enough. If your kid had the stats and didn’t get in it’s not because of yield protection, it’s because that’s how selective admissions works. You can accept reality and move on or keep going in circles.

So you do admit they don't admit people that may fit their profile of an admitted student but they choose to not offer admission because that kid likely won't attend? That's the very definition of yield protection. And get over the stupid notion that these kids only have stats but are deficient in other ways. That might have worked in 1970 but no longer. Every high stats kid knows the game and plays it well.

No. That’s not what I said. Having the stats is only the starting point. VT reserves the right to reject a high stats kid that writes a bad essay or has boring activities.

Was waiting for someone to spew this bullsh*t. A 1590 kid, who likely got into school(s) tiers above Tech, suddenly 'writes a bad essay or has boring activities'? Occom's razor. Look it up.

1590 isn't enough. VT has their own essay that can determine admission or rejection. If that essay is written poorly or the kid comes across as a bad fit for VT, the kid is getting rejected.

And the adcom can absolutely tell who is using the application as a backup/throwaway/safety. Which is why they need to reinstitute ED.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:virginia tech big time

Absolutely not. They are perpetually overenrolled and crowded. They offer a lot of spots and a lot of kids take them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:virginia tech big time

Absolutely not. They are perpetually overenrolled and crowded. They offer a lot of spots and a lot of kids take them.

Overcrowded? Maybe a for couple of years in the past. Not anymore. Do you have any actual experience with the school or are you just part of the silly peanut galley?
DP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The two schools with very obvious yield protection at our private, based on Scattergrams, were Tulane and Northeastern, only the middle third of the class was green territory. This was for 2023 cycle, so basically the first three years post covid.

Northeastern get 100K apps from high stat kids and acceptance rate is mid single digit for Boston campus.
You can call it yield protection or whatever but the school has luxury to pick and choose right students with high stats for the school who want to be there.

+1000

Yield protection does not happen at schools with single digit acceptance rates.

It happens at like a CWRU with a 35-40% acceptance rate and yield issues. For them, if you are really high stats (higher than 80-90%) and you do NOT demonstrate considerable interest, they might not accept you. They smartly figure you are likely getting into one of the 10+ t25 you applied to and going there. So unless you convince them otherwise, they will offer the spot to someone more likely to attend.

And that’s fair and reasonable, they want students who want to attend not ones who will turn them down

Tufts is 10% acceptance rate and yield protection was named for them.

Colleges can can get to a very low acceptance rate by inducing people to apply through marketing and doing things like counting incomplete applications.

Tufts acceptance rate was NOT 10% when they became associated with "yield protection"/Tufts syndrome (more like 20-25%).

Fact still stands that there are also kids with extremely high stats who get accepted at tufts. It's just when 60%+ of those applying have a 1520+, that is everyone. So yes, Tufts (and all schools) have a goal of actually expecting the students they accept to matriculate there (or at least a certain percent). The goal is to get they yield as close to 100% as possible. The way you do that is determine who "really wants to attend" and "who is using you as a backup and has multiple better choices they would attend in a heartbeat".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The two schools with very obvious yield protection at our private, based on Scattergrams, were Tulane and Northeastern, only the middle third of the class was green territory. This was for 2023 cycle, so basically the first three years post covid.

Northeastern get 100K apps from high stat kids and acceptance rate is mid single digit for Boston campus.
You can call it yield protection or whatever but the school has luxury to pick and choose right students with high stats for the school who want to be there.

+1000

Yield protection does not happen at schools with single digit acceptance rates.

It happens at like a CWRU with a 35-40% acceptance rate and yield issues. For them, if you are really high stats (higher than 80-90%) and you do NOT demonstrate considerable interest, they might not accept you. They smartly figure you are likely getting into one of the 10+ t25 you applied to and going there. So unless you convince them otherwise, they will offer the spot to someone more likely to attend.

And that’s fair and reasonable, they want students who want to attend not ones who will turn them down

+1
I always laugh at the people who feel their kid should be accepted everywhere, even though it’s obvious they assume certain schools are “safeties” and use them accordingly. No one has to accept your kid or owes them anything. Wish people would get that through their heads.

Agreed! My kid ended up with CwRU as their 2nd choice (after all acceptances were it). They offered $34K/year in merit, but my kid turned it down for their top choice (which I must say really is a better fit for them despite the extra costs). The school they are at (as well as CWRU---they have a few friends there) are both school known for "not being in an area that is as exciting as many other schools---cold, dreary, not so nice towns" and "for being filled with T25 rejects". My kid was WL at 2 T25, and spring start at another. 10+ of their friends had similar results (at least 1 WL and/or Spring start at a T25/Ivy). It's the same at CWRU. Those schools are literally filled with kids who "had the resume for T25", bought their lottery ticket and didn't win the lottery. That describes at least 40-50% of students at both schools. It's a well know fact at both schools, written about each year in the student newspaper.

I think my kid ended up at a better school for them. This school has some unique aspects that make it perfect for them. And when we did tours, it probably was their top or 2nd choice if they were honest with themselves. They left that tour very happy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Case Western

What Case does is more, they have a yield problem. Not that many want to be in Cleveland. And yes, they do end up with a lot of people who wanted T25 schools but didn't get in. Case uses merit to entice you as well. They want to make offers to students who want them. That's their job. So you must show demonstrated interest, especially if you are above the 80% for stats, otherwise they might assume you are "applying just because" and most likely will attend elsewhere. But if you show interest, you can get accepted. My 1520, 3.98UW/10 AP kid got accepted (female, engineering) and got the top Merit award. ($42K/year).

How much would it be then per year including housing?

You can search and find the current costs. This was 2 years ago. So instead of $85K, it would have been 43K. Instead we are paying $90K (fully funded 529 and not a financial issues for us). But if we had been searching merit, that was our best choice and a damn good one if your budget is $30-35K (in state) easily and willing to stretch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:virginia tech big time

1. VT is not a safety.
2. VT does not yield-protect and says as much right on their website.

"Yield Protection
Virginia Tech does not participate in yield protection."

https://www.vt.edu/admissions/undergraduate/counselor-corner.html#:~:text=Virginia%20Tech%20does%20not,participate%20in%20yield%20protection.

OP here.
I’ve heard that if you have over a 1500 SAT to watch out with VT. That’s really sad because it’s a top choice for my son. He submitted his app early (yesterday) plus we toured in Jan. Hopefully that signals to VT, that he is interested.

Next someone will say that VT doesn't care about DI. VT does care about DI AND yield protects regardless of what a lot VT cheerleaders come on here to say. If the department that your son is interested in has any sessions at all, make sure you attend to show interest even if you have attended a similar event previously. Engage with the department staff.

A lot of schools yield protect even though their stated policy may be "we don't yield protect". What are you going to do? Sue them? Kinda hard to prove your case given the opacity of the process. Don't really blame them though..A school that doesn't yield protect would pretty much admit every student that meets their academic/other threshold/standard for admission and deal with the consequences of low yield and waitlist management. Tech chooses not to do that and that's fine. People just need to be aware of this and plan accordingly.

If VT admitted every student that is in their profile, they would over enroll every year. Having the stats isn’t enough. If your kid had the stats and didn’t get in it’s not because of yield protection, it’s because that’s how selective admissions works. You can accept reality and move on or keep going in circles.

So you do admit they don't admit people that may fit their profile of an admitted student but they choose to not offer admission because that kid likely won't attend? That's the very definition of yield protection. And get over the stupid notion that these kids only have stats but are deficient in other ways. That might have worked in 1970 but no longer. Every high stats kid knows the game and plays it well.

No. That’s not what I said. Having the stats is only the starting point. VT reserves the right to reject a high stats kid that writes a bad essay or has boring activities.

Plus, there are too many "High stats" kids. As well as, most colleges set a limit, say 1520, and anything over that is "very high stats" to them and they don't care the differences. Because 1520 and 1580 are both really really smart kids. So they look at everything else and decide from that.
The sheer numbers involved mean that yes, many "high stats" kids will get rejected. There are not enough spaces for everyone. And yes, it can mean your 1590 kid was not as impressive as a 1500 kid with a better essay, better recommendations and more interesting/more dedicated to their ECs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is the problem for high stat kids…

There are only reaches and safeties no matches.

You apply to a safety because you are concerned you won’t get into your reaches and you might not get into your first choice safety due to yield protection.

You may apply to reaches and get rejected from all.

Kind of stinks to work so hard and have this happen.

Everyone has reaches, targets, safeties and likelies. Apply to some in each category (and consider the definitions of those categories carefully---15% acceptance rate is a REACH for EVERYONE) Then you must show demonstrated interest. You have to sell yourself to the university and make them think that yes, "you with your 1580, 4.785, 15+ APs and stellar ECs and leadership really do want to attend University of Z". Trust me, there will be high stats kids at those schools, someone gets in. Your job is to convince the AO that you want to attend and why it's your top choice.

So yes, for a high stats kid, the targets might be ranked 30-70, the safeties/likelies might be 65-120+. Much better to find that true safety/likely that your kid actually likes, than to be left wondering where you can apply to come April.

What stinks? That your kid didn't get into a T30 School? Most kids dont'. There are plenty of high stats kids who don't each year. There simply are not enough spaces for all of them in that few schools