Why choose West Point?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DCUM really allows people to be critical of others’ life decisions.

Want to attend an Ivy? Go for it. You are an awesome person.
Want to attend an Academy? Go for it. You are an awesome person.

Are we really trying to decide which is more prestigious, harder to attend, etc? Who cares? Attending either is an amazing achievement.

I’m a teacher. My school sends outstanding students to both Ivy schools and Academies each year. They are top of the class, extremely high achievers. Why would I ever sit here and try to quantify which of these students are better than others? They are all impressive students.

Define top of the class.
is 1400 SAT top of the class at your school?

Data doesn't agree with your claim.
People are here for accurate information.

What “accurate information” can you possibly be looking for on this thread? What claim did I make, other than both types of admissions are impressive?

If my students are getting into these schools, I’m assuming their SATs are well over 1400. That said: I am also well aware that their SAT scores are a small, small part of the overall package. That’s why I’m not sure all the SAT talk here is worth the time people put into it. It’s a test, one which doesn’t clearly illustrate aptitude or intellect.

I agree with the previous poster. Many people come here to put others down, as if somehow a DCUM poster’s self-worth is wrapped up in other people agreeing with them. Why feel threatened if I say either road (Ivy League or service academy) is admirable?

There's huge difference between information at least with some sources and guess/assumption.

First you claimed you are a teacher establishing some sort of credentials, then you just throw out assumptions without any source while it was already proven otherwise.
Your assumptions are wrong. If you are a teacher, you need to teach your kids better than this.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/usma-media/inline-images/about/g5/G5OIR_CDS_2019-2020_FINAL.pdf
I consider this accurate information. This was when scores were mandatory.
Academically they seem pretty average at the best.
You probably have your own definition of things, so that's why I first asked your definition of 'top of the class'

This is hopeless. I’m not sure why you are threatened by my comment. I don’t know why you need to question my credentials… and even insult me. I have 20 years experience watching students get accepted / attend both types of schools. My honest and sincere comment that they are all impressive students offends you for some reason. It’s not worth going down that road because you are correct: I do have my own definition of things. It isn’t wrapped up in notions of superiority.

You seem to need to feel superior, hence your statement about students going to academies are “pretty average at best.” You don’t seem to even be aware of what “average” looks like. Average students aren’t going to any of these schools. (They are doing other amazing things, but can I assume you won’t care?)

I said 'Academically seem pretty average'
I have the objective source but you have your own personal definitions.

Using your source… 53% of applicants have an unweighted 4.0. That’s only one of MANY data points that don’t define “average” students.

Please define “academically… pretty average” for me. I also teach students who have 2.5 GPAs. If unweighted 4.0s are “average,” can you tell me what a 2.5 is?

Also answer this: why do you care so much? How does the idea of strong students going to an academy threaten you?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
So in summary, military academies could be a big bang for the buck when you are academically average, have a physical good enough to play high school sports, and you are fine with military lifestyle and even like it. 
 
Education is free, job security is very good, and it's fairly well respected in the society.
If you are well above the average and stand out, then it's even better.
So it's understandable some kids choosing this path.

Academically average = 1000 SAT

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DCUM really allows people to be critical of others’ life decisions.

Want to attend an Ivy? Go for it. You are an awesome person.
Want to attend an Academy? Go for it. You are an awesome person.

Are we really trying to decide which is more prestigious, harder to attend, etc? Who cares? Attending either is an amazing achievement.

I’m a teacher. My school sends outstanding students to both Ivy schools and Academies each year. They are top of the class, extremely high achievers. Why would I ever sit here and try to quantify which of these students are better than others? They are all impressive students.

Define top of the class.
is 1400 SAT top of the class at your school?

Data doesn't agree with your claim.
People are here for accurate information.

What “accurate information” can you possibly be looking for on this thread? What claim did I make, other than both types of admissions are impressive?

If my students are getting into these schools, I’m assuming their SATs are well over 1400. That said: I am also well aware that their SAT scores are a small, small part of the overall package. That’s why I’m not sure all the SAT talk here is worth the time people put into it. It’s a test, one which doesn’t clearly illustrate aptitude or intellect.

I agree with the previous poster. Many people come here to put others down, as if somehow a DCUM poster’s self-worth is wrapped up in other people agreeing with them. Why feel threatened if I say either road (Ivy League or service academy) is admirable?

There's huge difference between information at least with some sources and guess/assumption.

First you claimed you are a teacher establishing some sort of credentials, then you just throw out assumptions without any source while it was already proven otherwise.
Your assumptions are wrong. If you are a teacher, you need to teach your kids better than this.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/usma-media/inline-images/about/g5/G5OIR_CDS_2019-2020_FINAL.pdf
I consider this accurate information. This was when scores were mandatory.
Academically they seem pretty average at the best.
You probably have your own definition of things, so that's why I first asked your definition of 'top of the class'

This is hopeless. I’m not sure why you are threatened by my comment. I don’t know why you need to question my credentials… and even insult me. I have 20 years experience watching students get accepted / attend both types of schools. My honest and sincere comment that they are all impressive students offends you for some reason. It’s not worth going down that road because you are correct: I do have my own definition of things. It isn’t wrapped up in notions of superiority.

You seem to need to feel superior, hence your statement about students going to academies are “pretty average at best.” You don’t seem to even be aware of what “average” looks like. Average students aren’t going to any of these schools. (They are doing other amazing things, but can I assume you won’t care?)

I said 'Academically seem pretty average'
I have the objective source but you have your own personal definitions.

Using your source… 53% of applicants have an unweighted 4.0. That’s only one of MANY data points that don’t define “average” students.

Please define “academically… pretty average” for me. I also teach students who have 2.5 GPAs. If unweighted 4.0s are “average,” can you tell me what a 2.5 is?

Also answer this: why do you care so much? How does the idea of strong students going to an academy threaten you?

You can take bunch of easy classes and get 4.0.
Academic strength = gpa + academic rigor + test scores
Top students at other top schools are high on all of them.
Do you think there's some very strange reason that makes West Point students somehow get good gpa but mediocre test scores?

I just spotted wrong information and corrected it. It doesn't threaten me at all.
These kinds of wrong information may discourage perfectly good candidates from applying to those schools.
We need good information for people.

[Anonymous]

https://s3.amazonaws.com/usma-media/inline-images/about/g5/G5OIR_CDS_2019-2020_FINAL.pdf

Here's the actual information, you decide.
This was just before pandemic when test scores were mandatory.

SAT Composite
25th Percentile: 1170
75th Percentile: 1360

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DC's "Big Three" sends at least one graduate each year to either USNA or West Point. Most turned down Ivy or other top schools to do this. Amazing, selfless and patriotic individuals.

OP here.

Yes, kid I know turned down HYP Ivy.

Yes, and? My cousin got into several Ivies and the USNA. Full ride. She now flies the world's coolest planes, travels the world, and is serving her country. Please name an Ivy that would lead her to that path?

ROTC at an Ivy

No, you don’t go from ROTC to elite flying programs. But thank you for playing!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DCUM really allows people to be critical of others’ life decisions.

Want to attend an Ivy? Go for it. You are an awesome person.
Want to attend an Academy? Go for it. You are an awesome person.

Are we really trying to decide which is more prestigious, harder to attend, etc? Who cares? Attending either is an amazing achievement.

I’m a teacher. My school sends outstanding students to both Ivy schools and Academies each year. They are top of the class, extremely high achievers. Why would I ever sit here and try to quantify which of these students are better than others? They are all impressive students.

Define top of the class.
is 1400 SAT top of the class at your school?

Data doesn't agree with your claim.
People are here for accurate information.

What “accurate information” can you possibly be looking for on this thread? What claim did I make, other than both types of admissions are impressive?

If my students are getting into these schools, I’m assuming their SATs are well over 1400. That said: I am also well aware that their SAT scores are a small, small part of the overall package. That’s why I’m not sure all the SAT talk here is worth the time people put into it. It’s a test, one which doesn’t clearly illustrate aptitude or intellect.

I agree with the previous poster. Many people come here to put others down, as if somehow a DCUM poster’s self-worth is wrapped up in other people agreeing with them. Why feel threatened if I say either road (Ivy League or service academy) is admirable?

There's huge difference between information at least with some sources and guess/assumption.

First you claimed you are a teacher establishing some sort of credentials, then you just throw out assumptions without any source while it was already proven otherwise.
Your assumptions are wrong. If you are a teacher, you need to teach your kids better than this.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/usma-media/inline-images/about/g5/G5OIR_CDS_2019-2020_FINAL.pdf
I consider this accurate information. This was when scores were mandatory.
Academically they seem pretty average at the best.
You probably have your own definition of things, so that's why I first asked your definition of 'top of the class'

This is hopeless. I’m not sure why you are threatened by my comment. I don’t know why you need to question my credentials… and even insult me. I have 20 years experience watching students get accepted / attend both types of schools. My honest and sincere comment that they are all impressive students offends you for some reason. It’s not worth going down that road because you are correct: I do have my own definition of things. It isn’t wrapped up in notions of superiority.

You seem to need to feel superior, hence your statement about students going to academies are “pretty average at best.” You don’t seem to even be aware of what “average” looks like. Average students aren’t going to any of these schools. (They are doing other amazing things, but can I assume you won’t care?)

I said 'Academically seem pretty average'
I have the objective source but you have your own personal definitions.

Using your source… 53% of applicants have an unweighted 4.0. That’s only one of MANY data points that don’t define “average” students.

Please define “academically… pretty average” for me. I also teach students who have 2.5 GPAs. If unweighted 4.0s are “average,” can you tell me what a 2.5 is?

Also answer this: why do you care so much? How does the idea of strong students going to an academy threaten you?

You can take bunch of easy classes and get 4.0.
Academic strength = gpa + academic rigor + test scores
Top students at other top schools are high on all of them.
Do you think there's some very strange reason that makes West Point students somehow get good gpa but mediocre test scores?

I just spotted wrong information and corrected it. It doesn't threaten me at all.
These kinds of wrong information may discourage perfectly good candidates from applying to those schools.
We need good information for people.

Two points:
1. These students don’t have mediocre test scores. Your own data shows that. Those scores are above average to exceptional, seeing as how the national average is closer to 1000.
2. Your own data doesn’t show the type of class students took. Therefore, you can make no claim re: AP/IB course placements versus regular placements.

We need good information, but we also need to know how to read it. You have not provided any mediocre numbers.

[Anonymous]

I hope at least there is no more people claiming that these students are 'top of the class' with this scores anymore

SAT Composite
25th Percentile: 1170
75th Percentile: 1360

Also I would be very impressed with the physical requirements from the special forces types, but not at all for these academies.
Average athletic HS kids would easily pass it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

By the time he left the navy he was like 27 and essentially a recent college grad whereas his friends were making great headway into their careers. It is a sacrifice to spend five years on a submarine. I think he feels it was a net negative in terms of his career.

You're not a recent college grad. You have five years of work experience. But that work experience simply is not relevant to anything in the real world.

You are being silly. No one. And I mean no one graduates from USNA, spends 5 years on a submarine and comes out feeling like they are recent college grads. They are trained and way ahead of their peers career wise especially if they were on a sub.

Trained to do what? Operate stuff on a ship or a sub? Yay. People not in the military will respect that experience, but that experience did not train them to do anything non-military.

I served on Active Duty for 12 years. My civilian bosses have remarked that military service is a plus.

Junior officers, based on their military job, can be responsible for a tremendous amount of resources, in both personnel and equipment. Decisions made can be incredibly impactful. Transition to civilian jobs can be a challenge because the degree of responsibility is often significantly lower.

I think the comments above have no merit. The skills and experience attained in military service are easily transferable and highly relevant.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I hope at least there is no more people claiming that these students are 'top of the class' with this scores anymore

SAT Composite
25th Percentile: 1170
75th Percentile: 1360

Also I would be very impressed with the physical requirements from the special forces types, but not at all for these academies.
Average athletic HS kids would easily pass it.

I’m starting to think this is a troll at work. There’s really no reason to keep disparaging academy students. This is either someone with an axe to grind against academies or somebody who has almost no knowledge about them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DC's "Big Three" sends at least one graduate each year to either USNA or West Point. Most turned down Ivy or other top schools to do this. Amazing, selfless and patriotic individuals.

OP here.

Yes, kid I know turned down HYP Ivy.

Yes, and? My cousin got into several Ivies and the USNA. Full ride. She now flies the world's coolest planes, travels the world, and is serving her country. Please name an Ivy that would lead her to that path?

ROTC at an Ivy

No, you don’t go from ROTC to elite flying programs. But thank you for playing!

Of course you can! I know someone who did precisely that

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Because he wants to be in the Army. Why is this confusing?

One of the most impressive men I know went to West Point and later the Army paid for his master's degree at Harvard. He was a career Army guy, then retired and now in consulting. And, no, his parents didn't push him into it or have a family history of going to West Point.

One would hope, but I get the impression that some choose it for the selectivity and "free" tuition aspect and don't fully consider the payback requirements.

The number of students entering West Point who don't understand what they're committed to post-graduation is vanishingly small.

There's a difference between knowing and understanding.

Oh puhleeze!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hope at least there is no more people claiming that these students are 'top of the class' with this scores anymore

SAT Composite
25th Percentile: 1170
75th Percentile: 1360

Also I would be very impressed with the physical requirements from the special forces types, but not at all for these academies.
Average athletic HS kids would easily pass it.

I’m starting to think this is a troll at work. There’s really no reason to keep disparaging academy students. This is either someone with an axe to grind against academies or somebody who has almost no knowledge about them.

Sign... I once thought that these kids are really top of the class in everyway, but no facts are facts.

https://www.westpoint.edu/admissions/prospective-cadets/cadet-fitness-assessment

It says it's pass/fail, and give you maximum.
So if you do 60%, you probably pass.
I'm 50 and I think I can pass.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
So in summary, military academies could be a big bang for the buck when you are academically average, have a physical good enough to play high school sports, and you are fine with military lifestyle and even like it. 
 
Education is free, job security is very good, and it's fairly well respected in the society.
If you are well above the average and stand out, then it's even better.
So it's understandable some kids choosing this path.

35
Academically average = 1000 SAT

Yeah, this thread has devolved into stupidity, as usual. 28-33 ACT is not "average," though not up to par with the 34-36 ACT score expected on DCUM. USMA and the other academies public their class profiles; you can look it up. USMA is not test optional and, last I heard, requires the writing portion of the ACT. Admissions are holistic, with grades and standardized test scores being one factor. Leadership and fitness are other factors. Also, the medical requirements posted above are more or less true, although I believe it's possible to get in with an ADHD diagnosis if you can show that you have not needed or taken medication for it for some time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
So in summary, military academies could be a big bang for the buck when you are academically average, have a physical good enough to play high school sports, and you are fine with military lifestyle and even like it. 
 
Education is free, job security is very good, and it's fairly well respected in the society.
If you are well above the average and stand out, then it's even better.
So it's understandable some kids choosing this path.

35
Academically average = 1000 SAT

Yeah, this thread has devolved into stupidity, as usual. 28-33 ACT is not "average," though not up to par with the 34-36 ACT score expected on DCUM. USMA and the other academies public their class profiles; you can look it up. USMA is not test optional and, last I heard, requires the writing portion of the ACT. Admissions are holistic, with grades and standardized test scores being one factor. Leadership and fitness are other factors. Also, the medical requirements posted above are more or less true, although I believe it's possible to get in with an ADHD diagnosis if you can show that you have not needed or taken medication for it for some time.

I'm also not sure that you can get in with accommodations on standardized tests, i.e., "extra time."

Doing ROTC at an Ivy is also a possibility. Princeton has ROTC, for example, I'm pretty certain.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
So in summary, military academies could be a big bang for the buck when you are academically average, have a physical good enough to play high school sports, and you are fine with military lifestyle and even like it. 
 
Education is free, job security is very good, and it's fairly well respected in the society.
If you are well above the average and stand out, then it's even better.
So it's understandable some kids choosing this path.

35
Academically average = 1000 SAT

Yeah, this thread has devolved into stupidity, as usual. 28-33 ACT is not "average," though not up to par with the 34-36 ACT score expected on DCUM. USMA and the other academies public their class profiles; you can look it up. USMA is not test optional and, last I heard, requires the writing portion of the ACT. Admissions are holistic, with grades and standardized test scores being one factor. Leadership and fitness are other factors. Also, the medical requirements posted above are more or less true, although I believe it's possible to get in with an ADHD diagnosis if you can show that you have not needed or taken medication for it for some time.

It's all because of the people claiming they are top of class.
So people stared checking the facts.

Look above for fitness test. I'm sure majority of 17 years old kids don't have disease.
Every school is holistic and value leadership very much.