Unpaid leave

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so obnoxious. Just quit your job and go back when you’re ready. It sounds like your employer has been generous and you’re exploiting them at that point.

You realize she is asking for UNpaid leave, yes? How is that obnoxious?

Because they need her back at her job and she isn’t entitled to unpaid leave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would not take unpaid leave. Does your spouse have parental leave that he/she can use? That way your baby isn't in daycare yet if you're not ready for that. Can you go part-time temporarily? That is what i would do if I felt like you do.

Thanks - partner already used leave at the beginning and has been back at work full time for months so that is not an option. Respectfully, what does part time get me if I am not ready to leave the baby?

Respectfully, you’re an adult and “not being ready” isn’t relevant to your job. Just do them a favor and quit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I tried to do this after a 4 month leave and it did not work out. It was frustrating and I definitely ran into some of the attitudes on this thread.

HOWEVER, after I quit my job, I wound up talking to someone in our HR department and she gave me a hard time for not pushing harder. Basically she told me I should have come to her and made the request formally through HR instead of just trying to work it out with my department. I had a director in my department who was VERY opposed to it and frankly angry with me for asking (not a parent, if you're wondering) and once I made the initial request, she was never going to change her mind. But my HR friend told me that there was actually blowback about the incident in the company because they view themselves as very family friendly and part of their hiring strategy is to hire people with a lot of experience who are looking for good work-life balance. So apparently people were upset with my director for, in their eyes, forcing me out by not being willing to compromise with a month or two of unpaid leave or some kind of offer to return gradually in a part time capacity.

Too late for me to benefit from this knowledge, but you still can! If you get pushback, talk to HR and also make sure you review all your company's leave policies very closely (my company had a policy of "up to a year" of leave, combining paid and unpaid, a the discretion of your manager, and I should have pushed a lot harder on that). If this matters to you, get what you can! Good luck!

You are either inexperienced, uneducated, or both. I am a mom, extremely pro family friendly policies, and own a small business. There’s zero chance I would survive if I had to hold open a job for every single mom I employ until an unspecified end date, paid or not. I offer generous leave but the deal is that you come back and do your job after it. What you are complaining about will lead to businesses just not hiring women of child-bearing age. Wow, what a women’s-rights activist you are!!

Uh that is illegal PP.

Neat. Prove it in court.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I tried to do this after a 4 month leave and it did not work out. It was frustrating and I definitely ran into some of the attitudes on this thread.

HOWEVER, after I quit my job, I wound up talking to someone in our HR department and she gave me a hard time for not pushing harder. Basically she told me I should have come to her and made the request formally through HR instead of just trying to work it out with my department. I had a director in my department who was VERY opposed to it and frankly angry with me for asking (not a parent, if you're wondering) and once I made the initial request, she was never going to change her mind. But my HR friend told me that there was actually blowback about the incident in the company because they view themselves as very family friendly and part of their hiring strategy is to hire people with a lot of experience who are looking for good work-life balance. So apparently people were upset with my director for, in their eyes, forcing me out by not being willing to compromise with a month or two of unpaid leave or some kind of offer to return gradually in a part time capacity.

Too late for me to benefit from this knowledge, but you still can! If you get pushback, talk to HR and also make sure you review all your company's leave policies very closely (my company had a policy of "up to a year" of leave, combining paid and unpaid, a the discretion of your manager, and I should have pushed a lot harder on that). If this matters to you, get what you can! Good luck!

You are either inexperienced, uneducated, or both. I am a mom, extremely pro family friendly policies, and own a small business. There’s zero chance I would survive if I had to hold open a job for every single mom I employ until an unspecified end date, paid or not. I offer generous leave but the deal is that you come back and do your job after it. What you are complaining about will lead to businesses just not hiring women of child-bearing age. Wow, what a women’s-rights activist you are!!

and still a misogynist. parents take leave. mom AND/OR dad

Does not appear you know what that word means. Women - who give birth - should absolutely be entitled to more leave you ghoul.

You are not entitled to anything unless your employer gives it to you and no one needs a year of maternity leave. Six months is more than generous. No employer should have to hold your job open for a year.

We are not a nanny society.

And look how well that has turned out for us. A country full of kids on Ritalin and school shootings. Maybe we should invest a little more in maternity leave we could solve some bigger social problems. We work 40+ years. Taking a few years off to care for an infant or two is not depriving our economy.

So QUIT and take the years OFF. Problem solved.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A PP asked but I didn't see an answer: how much more time are we talking? 1-2 additional months, or another 6 months?

I was asking what others may have done in this situation to try to gauge an answer to this question. But instead I got baseless accusations and almost entirely unhelpful nonsense. Just so upsetting.

You got the truth, which you didn’t like hearing. Oh well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would ask. A job is a just a job. If you’re not ready to go back, you should advocate for yourself, whether that means asking for unpaid leave or quitting.

I took maternity leave with every intention of coming back at the end of it, but a combination of PPD, Covid, and difficulty finding childcare led me to quit at the end of it. The place I left was a toxic dump anyway. Do I wish things had worked out differently? Yes, partially because I don’t want to give moms on leave a bad name. But I had to prioritize my own well-being and that of my baby.

Can I ask why you think this gives moms on leave a bad name? I think I understand but want to clarify. It’s so hard that people think this.

PP. I think some people probably think this was my plan all along, to game the system and get paid for several months of not working and then quit. In reality, it was an agonizing decision that I only came to after experiencing panic attacks and breakdowns and realizing that I wasn’t going to be able to return to work. But for a lot of reasons, I think some people don’t give parents (usually moms) on leave a lot of grace or benefit of the doubt.

Ha! You knew from the get go that you planned to game the system I've known too many employees like you and burned too many times.

I will give PP the benefit of the doubt that she didn't know what would happen when she was due to come back from leave, but unfortunately, people like PP do ruin it for the rest of the new parents who need a little more grace in their return to office plans.

No one has ruined anything for anyone except the people posting in this forum about greed and discouraging moms from what they need after baby.

WTH literally no one has told OP to go back to work against her will. No one. She has options - she can quit her job if she doesn’t want to work which is what it sounds like. Most sane people realize employers can’t hold jobs open for moms who don’t want to work.

OP did not say she doesn’t want to work. She said she’s not ready to leave her baby. Which is totally understandable. Some of these comments are literally insane. This country will never move the needle on leave and a better life for parents/families with people like this out there. What a shame.

We absolutely need universal paid maternity leave, but this is a policy decision that probably everyone women posting on this board supports and has very little ability to move the needle on save for calling their reps and demanding change and/or speaking to their company's HR department. Most women tell their boss how much leave they plan to take before going out and then coverage is found accordingly. If OP's dept. found coverage for six months it might not be easy to re-up the coverage for an additional X months while OP takes more time. Add to that OP probably quitting in the end ("I realized I'm not ready to go back after 9 months after all!") and it just feels gross. What many of us are trying to tell her is that it will probably come off as gross to her company and that will treat her accordingly and that given her current stance she may want to seriously consider quitting. OP needs to ask herself what will make her feel ready? Is she OK not feeling ready and going back anyway if she takes a few more months off? I worked for a giant healthcare company previously (healthcare is notorious, ironically, for bad benefits) and I needed to be there for two years before I could get 100% STD. I saved up all my vacation and took 13 weeks with my third. I had this fortune 15 company's corporate secretary tell me that 13 weeks was a lot of time. I see nothing wrong with going against the grain, but it's preferable to say something up front if you plan to take off more time so suitable coverage can be arranged and if your company has a very generous policy it's likely that they'll frown on extensions. I say this after being in Tech with my first two and getting 22 weeks off with both babies -- it's not common to take more than the paid time you are given if it's very generous and it rubs people the wrong way.

The assumption that I didn’t plan for this is inaccurate. Sorry you think this feels gross and glad you had a good experience with your three kids. Might it be possible for someone to feel differently? This is not my first child. I agonized over planning my leave and took every available option so that I could maximize time home with my family. At great sacrifice to my finances, let me add. Every day of life is different, let alone every birthing experience - I’m not ready to leave my baby. How could I have known six months ago what I would feel like today when feelings and emotions change all the time? It’s so sad people, mothers even, can’t have empathy in these situations.

You’re now just playing victim and going against everything you’ve said previously (quote: “most of it was paid.”) And empathy? I don’t think you’re one to talk, calling anyone who sees this as an overreach names and making baseless accusations. My workplace puts a lot of emphasis on good character - if you quit it sounds like it’ll be a win win for you AND them.

Lol. Good luck to you!

Lol. Same to you!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A PP asked but I didn't see an answer: how much more time are we talking? 1-2 additional months, or another 6 months?

I was asking what others may have done in this situation to try to gauge an answer to this question. But instead I got baseless accusations and almost entirely unhelpful nonsense. Just so upsetting.

I’m not sure why you’re attacking me, I was just asking a question that is relevant to what advice I would give. If you just want/need another month, I would think for a job you’ve been at 15 years, a good employer would accommodate. But if you’re looking for another 6 months or more, that puts a different level of strain on your colleagues covering for you.

Wasn’t directed at you as an attack. Very sorry it came off that way. Not my intention. Thanks for the advice. I agree.

Why aren’t you answering how much longer you want for leave?

OP isn't sure how much time she might want or could get. That's why she asked here what other's experience has been. If people came on and said "yes I got an extra month and it was just what I needed to help my feel ready -- babies change so much in a short period" that would have been informative. If people came on and said "I asked for an extra month and my employer said absolutely not and I had to go back right away and this was my experience with that" that would also be informative.

Everyone is acting like OP is asking them, personally, for extended leave. She's not. She's asking on here for feedback on experiences so that she can be more informed as she makes this decision of whether to ask for more leave and if so how much. She's the one gathering info about the landscape. No one is entitled to info about her personal life and she doesn't have to justify her interest in more leave to ANYONE on this forum.

I wonder if the responses to this would be different if OP was taking bereavement leave after losing a spouse and came on here saying "I want to ask my employer for extra time as unpaid leave because I just don't feel ready to be back in the office -- does anyone have experience with this?" For some reason our culture acts like women recovering from childbirth or making the transition to motherhood are trying to pull one over on society and that actually that's just easy and effortless and it's normal for women to be ready to return to their jobs in a short period of time. It's so weird! We were all babies once. We all have mothers. And yet we act like the act of having children and becoming a mom is a horrible imposition on other people, a personal hobby that women use to get out of "real" societal contributions like sitting in offices and sending emails and making corporations incrementally more money.

Our priorities are so f****d.

Oh, please. If she’d already had SIX MONTHS of bereavement leave (“mostly paid”) while the company held her position and her coworkers did her work (and don’t say they aren’t, because if they aren’t, OP’s job doesn’t need to exist), she would be told she could come back or quit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

So in my company, they got wise to this scheme and now you have to pay your leave back unless you return on time and work at least as long as you were off.

You are just thinking about yourself, OP. Back at your job, everyone is working harder because you are not there.

All companies should do this, absent an ADA covered medical condition confirmed by an M.D.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is so obnoxious. Just quit your job and go back when you’re ready. It sounds like your employer has been generous and you’re exploiting them at that point.

Not op. You are a big problem with what is wrong in this country. GTFOOH

This is so OP. You are just frustrated with the responses because no one is saying "after I took 6 months off, I requested another 10 months and my employer promoted me two weeks after I got back. It was great being there for Larla in her first 16 months but never actually needing to leave the workforce because my company let me take as much time as I needed to be mentally and physically and emotionally ready to leave her with a nanny."

Unfortunately, our country doesn't have good maternity leave policies but OP is so lucky that her company gives employees 6 months of paid leave. She is not the person I feel bad for when it comes to maternity leave. Even some type of universal leave will likely only cover 12 weeks.

OP here. I didn’t write this. This forum is so f-ing toxic. Accusing me of lying about this being my second kid. JFC. I’m done here. This made everything so much worse.

Translation: You didn’t blow smoke up my skirt and tell me what I wanted to hear, so I’m TAKING MY BALL AMD GOING HOME. *dramatic foot stomp*

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I tried to do this after a 4 month leave and it did not work out. It was frustrating and I definitely ran into some of the attitudes on this thread.

HOWEVER, after I quit my job, I wound up talking to someone in our HR department and she gave me a hard time for not pushing harder. Basically she told me I should have come to her and made the request formally through HR instead of just trying to work it out with my department. I had a director in my department who was VERY opposed to it and frankly angry with me for asking (not a parent, if you're wondering) and once I made the initial request, she was never going to change her mind. But my HR friend told me that there was actually blowback about the incident in the company because they view themselves as very family friendly and part of their hiring strategy is to hire people with a lot of experience who are looking for good work-life balance. So apparently people were upset with my director for, in their eyes, forcing me out by not being willing to compromise with a month or two of unpaid leave or some kind of offer to return gradually in a part time capacity.

Too late for me to benefit from this knowledge, but you still can! If you get pushback, talk to HR and also make sure you review all your company's leave policies very closely (my company had a policy of "up to a year" of leave, combining paid and unpaid, a the discretion of your manager, and I should have pushed a lot harder on that). If this matters to you, get what you can! Good luck!

You are either inexperienced, uneducated, or both. I am a mom, extremely pro family friendly policies, and own a small business. There’s zero chance I would survive if I had to hold open a job for every single mom I employ until an unspecified end date, paid or not. I offer generous leave but the deal is that you come back and do your job after it. What you are complaining about will lead to businesses just not hiring women of child-bearing age. Wow, what a women’s-rights activist you are!!

What an unnecessarily hostile response. Your situation is not true for a lot of big businesses. You are ridiculous.

No, but it is true of big business because hiring managers are people (like the mom/business owner above) and once they get burned by something like this it's unlikely they'll be up for getting burned again. Many companies have flat budgets in FY23 and FY24 and many departments don't have excess funds to cover more than 6+ months of maternity leave or employees who are willing to pick up the slack for moms who aren't ready to return after 6 months. And for those saying that there is something wrong with everyone responding, you get 6 months in Canada and many other countries..6 months is a very reasonable amount of time. It's not as generous as many European countries but then again we don't pay the same high taxes as many Europeans.

nonsense. They retained a senior employee for 15 years. They made out great. Frankly if they gave her another year of unpaid leave and hired a temp for a year and got her back for another 10 year that would great for the company. What you are saying makes no business sense. You just want to punish her for no reason I can see except maybe sour grapes.

Absolutely not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Idk why I can’t quit this but I genuinely hope this will be my last time defending myself from this level of insanity. I wish I could high five the few people who I feel like live on the same planet as I do - thank you

OP, the terrible, here.

For my previous maternity leave with my fake first born, it was during the height of COVID. I went back after six months, cried most days for a long time and sucked it up because I still got to WFH as it was the height of the pandemic.

My employer no longer allows me to WFH and the answer to that request is a definite no. And after fighting to get myself from a very dark place after my first, I know there has to be a better way for me to go back.

So again, I was looking for experiences of those who extended any amount of leave. I am unsure where i said that my grand plan was to ask for an indefinite amount of time, but many have certainly taken that and run with it.

At this point anything I say is only pouring gasoline on this dumpster fire. This has definitely been an eye opening experience. I can see now why America is the way it is. So sad.

“I wish I could high five the few people who told me what I wanted to hear.”

FTFY

[Anonymous]

To the poster who is responding very angrily to every comment, can you share what happened in your own company that made you so resentful of your female employees? Genuinely curious! I've seen you make these comments again and again and there seems to be lots of strong emotion around it.

[Anonymous]

Why does OP need to be coddled like a child? She has been given realistic options and advice over the last 9 pages. Her options are very clearly laid out and she is privileged to be in a position to make a choice that works well for her and her family.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To the poster who is responding very angrily to every comment, can you share what happened in your own company that made you so resentful of your female employees? Genuinely curious! I've seen you make these comments again and again and there seems to be lots of strong emotion around it.

Many different people have commented and we're probably all female (I am). We are just trying to help you understand the reality of your situation. We have nothing against you or your situation - and definitely nothing against working moms as the vast majority of us have BTDT at least once when it comes to maternity leave, probably more (I've done it x3). This is the Expectant and Postpartum moms forum. You are getting mothers, many of whom work. Sorry you don't like the advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Idk why I can’t quit this but I genuinely hope this will be my last time defending myself from this level of insanity. I wish I could high five the few people who I feel like live on the same planet as I do - thank you

OP, the terrible, here.

For my previous maternity leave with my fake first born, it was during the height of COVID. I went back after six months, cried most days for a long time and sucked it up because I still got to WFH as it was the height of the pandemic.

My employer no longer allows me to WFH and the answer to that request is a definite no. And after fighting to get myself from a very dark place after my first, I know there has to be a better way for me to go back.

So again, I was looking for experiences of those who extended any amount of leave. I am unsure where i said that my grand plan was to ask for an indefinite amount of time, but many have certainly taken that and run with it.

At this point anything I say is only pouring gasoline on this dumpster fire. This has definitely been an eye opening experience. I can see now why America is the way it is. So sad.

America wouldn’t be the successful country it is if people didn’t go to work. That’s the problem. You had a child and you also want to do both. Eventually you have to go back. Sure European countries offer longer leaves but you also don’t have the opportunities you have here. An extra 6 months of leave to make 30% less my entire career? No thanks. I get it’s frustrating that you want to be home and also have a rewarding career but something eventually has to give. Just own it that you want to be home and stay home for a while. Or don’t. But stop blaming it on your country. It’s a GOOD thing that you’ll miss out of opportunities at work by not going to work.

np here. In what ways is America more successful than Canada? I'm honestly curious. Canadians can currently take between 12 -18 months off with maternity leave. In the 90's we took 6 months maternity. My contract allowed an extra 2 months unpaid leave if we requested it one month before our 6 months was up. Most of us took the extra 2 months. We really see things differently. OP, this Canadian's advice is to ask for 2 months unpaid leave. I also went back part time for a couple months after my second baby. My replacement and I shared the job. Part time helped me get used to balancing home and work life, daycare, etc.

Now I'm in my 50's and own a busy business with my partner. We have 30 employees and they would all say we are very considerate of their families and time off.