APEX - why are kids dropping out?

[Anonymous]

My DD is a freshman in the APEX program at Walter Johnson. She reports that a lot of kids are dropping out of the program. Does anyone know why this is happening?

[Anonymous]

No value to the program.

[Anonymous]

Freshman year there is a slight benefit to being in APEX because the English and Biology classes are cohorted. After that, there is no real benefit. So if the requirements get in the way of a student selecting different classes, there is no value added

[Anonymous]

Is that right that there is no cohorting in sophomore year for English? I don't think I realized that. My impression is that there aren't a lot of requirements for sophomore year, other than take a bunch of APs, so I'm not sure why that would drive kids out (unless they just are feeling turned off by their AP Gov class).

I have heard that they significantly changed the APEX Bio curriculum this year and made it much, much harder than Honors Bio (although on the transcript it is just reflected as Honors Bio). I don't know if some kids are maybe feeling a little burned by that. I'm a little curious what the average grades in that class are, and how it compares to the regular "honors" Bio.

They expanded the APEX program a LOT a few years ago -- maybe now they are trying to shrink it through an old-school look-to-your-left-look-to-your-right approach.

[Anonymous]

Not well known by colleges, schedule blocks preventing them from taking courses they want.

[Anonymous]

There's always attrition freshman year. The barriers to entry are not much (basically have above a certain GPA in MS) but the classes are more demanding than regular honors, and there are required AP classes starting in 9th - which are also harder than regular honors. So those that would rather get easier As in honors classes rather vs work a little harder in AP/APEX drop out. Also, there are those for whom the schedule doesn't work due to band/Varsity sports/other EC commitments without serious shuffling, which may not seem worth the effort.

[Anonymous]

There are still cohorts in Sophomore year. By the time you get to junior year, however, it's whatever AP classes you are in - so will likely be a mix of APEX and non.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No value to the program.

I’ve said this since 2017. WJ and parents acted like it was a prestigious program, but 9th graders elsewhere are managing AP courses without cohorting and a study hall essentially.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No value to the program.

I disagree with this. I have a current junior in the program and though I wish the kids were given some sort of credit for taking the harder classes in 9th and 10th grades, I do see them as being quite valuable. My student benefited from being cohorted in those classes with other focused and motivated students. The classes also served as a really great stepping stone to prepare them for all of the AP courses they are taking now and will take next year. It's a really great program, and the teachers are excellent.

[Anonymous]

My DS is a ninth grader in APEX. He likes it and is learning a lot but he reports that others have dropped it because they are failing APEX biology. He just told me the people teaching it plow through the material, there are no quizzes to chunk learning before big tests, and the teachers are unsympathetic to the kids who struggle. This is concerning. He says the English and AP Government classes are fine. He's doing ok in biology for now, but he says it's much more difficult than the other classes by far.

[Anonymous]

Did they change the bio curriculum because the state wide test is now 20% of the kids’ final grade? I’d love for people in Apex and not to let us know how that test goes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Freshman year there is a slight benefit to being in APEX because the English and Biology classes are cohorted. After that, there is no real benefit. So if the requirements get in the way of a student selecting different classes, there is no value added

I’m not sure the requirements really get in the way anymore since they basically created a non-pathway pathway so you only have to worry about number of APs aside from the basics. They don’t even have the evening meetings or anything anymore, I think.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No value to the program.

I’ve said this since 2017. WJ and parents acted like it was a prestigious program, but 9th graders elsewhere are managing AP courses without cohorting and a study hall essentially.

What study hall?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There's always attrition freshman year. The barriers to entry are not much (basically have above a certain GPA in MS) but the classes are more demanding than regular honors, and there are required AP classes starting in 9th - which are also harder than regular honors. So those that would rather get easier As in honors classes rather vs work a little harder in AP/APEX drop out. Also, there are those for whom the schedule doesn't work due to band/Varsity sports/other EC commitments without serious shuffling, which may not seem worth the effort.

How does it interfere with sports and EC commitments? I hadn’t heard this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No value to the program.

I’ve said this since 2017. WJ and parents acted like it was a prestigious program, but 9th graders elsewhere are managing AP courses without cohorting and a study hall essentially.

There is no study hall - at least not for my kid. DC perhaps could have "managed" without a cohort - but he benefitted immensely from cohort - in MS didn't really care about grades, but put with high-achieving kids that care - DC upped their game. DC will have completed 10 AP Courses before Senior year (and will take a handful more in senior year)- and has already received 2 5s and 2 3s on AP Exams in Freshman and Sophomore year - which, while not perfect, is still quite good for a kid that never studies and is a testament to the level of teaching in the APEX program. I would absolutely recommend it to anyone who has a kid that can achieve at that level but might need a little peer pressure to do so.