Braggy friend

[Anonymous]

My DD8 has a girl in her dance classes/routines that she's been friends with for several years. They've been great friends, but there's some competitiveness coming up between them. My DD is pretty easy going, or just isn't super competitive with others. She never comments on what others can/can't do and just focuses on herself. This other girl has started pointing out what others can't do and what she can do better. I guess in class, if my DD (or others) can't do a certain skill, she will say "well I[i][u] can" and then go on and on about it. Half the time, she can't really do the skill either, but that's neither here nor there. Understandably, it's irritating my DD. She said it makes her no want to be friends with this girl. I know it's probably more likely this girl is just insecure and I've told her be empathetic. In a totally non-biased opinion, I'd say this girl is average to below average in skill.

However, it's just getting worse and worse and is starting to ruin my DD's experience at dance. I can't put her into different classes (thankfully they are not in all the same routines so they get a bit of a break there) so we are working on coping skills for DD. I've told DD to call her out when she's not being kind (particularly to others), move to a different spot on the floor/in line, or just walk away. This girl's mom is very much the same way (very braggy, only talks about herself, never shows interest in others, compares kids, etc), so I'm sure it's just an ingrained habit and I don't think she's a truly unkind kid.

Any other tips I'm not thinking of? One of the other moms said I should point it out to the teachers/director, but that seems like overkill to me?

[Anonymous]

I have boys. There is so much trash talking.

My son has left tennis and quit tennis over kids talking so much trash. He has overcome it and is now an excellent tennis player as a teen.

My friend’s daughter is a ranked gymnast. There is a lot of mean girl behavior in dance, gymnastics and cheer. You have a long way to go and if you and your daughter can’t handle a little bragging from a friend who isn’t even good, you both need to grow a thicker skin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have boys. There is so much trash talking.

My son has left tennis and quit tennis over kids talking so much trash. He has overcome it and is now an excellent tennis player as a teen.

My friend’s daughter is a ranked gymnast. There is a lot of mean girl behavior in dance, gymnastics and cheer. You have a long way to go and if you and your daughter can’t handle a little bragging from a friend who isn’t even good, you both need to grow a thicker skin.

OP here. Understood, that's why I was asking for advice on coping skills and don't think running to the teacher/director is the way to go.

[Anonymous]

Complaining to the teacher will probably only make things worse. She’s going to have to handle it herself or distance herself.

Responding with passive-aggressive snarky comments tends to make the bragger shut up and start doubting herself, while making the victim feel better.

[Anonymous]

I like to just say "yup, everyone learns at their own pace". Don't fawn over the kid who is bragging, that's what the bragger is looking for. Just respond neutrally with a "oh!" and move on.

Next work on your kid's self esteem. Compliment their hard work and things you've noticed they are working on. If this kid ruins dance for you kid, fine. Dance wasn't really for her then.

My kid has bestie who is like this. And I've noticed the bragging also really doesn't bother my kid as much as it bothers me. My kid is confidant and mostly just ignores a lot of the bragging. The longer it goes on, the more it starts to reek of insecurity, so just let the kid ramble.

[Anonymous]

My DD has had this person on her gymnastics team before. One girl mellowed out and became a close friend. Once they started competitions it provided an external ranking so they girls dropped comparisons within practice. During comp season, the most braggiest trash-talking girl quit after the first meet. After that experience, we’ve stuck to the policy of avoiding the braggy kids who are truly awful and have braggy parents, and trying to give space to the ones with nice parents in the hopes that they evolve. A few of the annoying girls are still around but everyone steers clear of them.

I have noticed that the bragging ramps up in the time before competition season and when new girls join the group in summer. I think it’s how some people manage insecurity or try to create/maintain a pecking order that makes them feel good. The moms are the worst at doing this. I read a lot if I’m early to gym pickup because I don’t need to engage with crazies who have sat there for 4 hours scrutinizing children and wanting to gossip about it and brag.

I imagine that some of this will lessen for your DD once choreography is fully learned and performances/competitions/showcases are happening- it sounds like this might be competitive dance, which is probably even grosser than gymnastics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DD has had this person on her gymnastics team before. One girl mellowed out and became a close friend. Once they started competitions it provided an external ranking so they girls dropped comparisons within practice. During comp season, the most braggiest trash-talking girl quit after the first meet. After that experience, we’ve stuck to the policy of avoiding the braggy kids who are truly awful and have braggy parents, and trying to give space to the ones with nice parents in the hopes that they evolve. A few of the annoying girls are still around but everyone steers clear of them.

I have noticed that the bragging ramps up in the time before competition season and when new girls join the group in summer. I think it’s how some people manage insecurity or try to create/maintain a pecking order that makes them feel good. The moms are the worst at doing this. I read a lot if I’m early to gym pickup because I don’t need to engage with crazies who have sat there for 4 hours scrutinizing children and wanting to gossip about it and brag.

I imagine that some of this will lessen for your DD once choreography is fully learned and performances/competitions/showcases are happening- it sounds like this might be competitive dance, which is probably even grosser than gymnastics.

OP here, it is competitive dance. We honestly have had a really positive experience minus this one kid and a couple annoying moms. They are through choreography and have had their placements for awhile, so I thought it would die down, but it really hasn't. I think what sparked it is this girl didn't get as desirable of routine placements and she and her mom have had a chip on their shoulder ever since. DD and this girl are both decent dancers, they just have different strengths. So this girl gets onto my DD during classes she's not as strong in, but my DD knows better than to act like that in classes where she is the stronger one.

I do try to avoid the mom in the lobby, though it's awkward as I've known her for years. If she does sit next to me, I try to avoid the topic of dance at all costs. The mom is JUST like the daughter, it's uncanny. It's funny though, because the mom embellishes stories ("they thought Larla was so awesome at XYZ, they wanted to move her up a level") and then the kid says "my mom asked if I could move up a level" so it's no wonder where she gets it from.

Maybe "ruining" dance is too strong of a phrase, but DD is really hurt that someone she considered a friend is being unkind to her and others. I told her to say "Larla, that's unkind to say that and I would never say that to a friend" or something along those lines. Or move. Though she says the girl follows her if she moves. I told her if the girl doesn't stop following her, to go to the teacher and ask where she can stand to get space.

[Anonymous]

I’m the gymnastics mom and just want to commiserate. We have to deal with level move ups and that part sounds similar. The girls have to have all of their Level X skills to compete, but during the time when they prep for the season you will only ever hear chatter about the skills that the girls have. The moms will never volunteer that Larla is struggling with her back tuck- it’s always that Larla already has her giant and does my child have their giant? My favorite was the mom who had to update her payments with the front desk when her daughter was moved up and announced to them “we’re level 3!”. No, your daughter is Level 3 and you are the grownup who pays for it.

These activities attract the crazies, I think because they can be measured and leveled at a young age in a way that ball sports can’t until kids are far older. They also have a pretty high initial talent barrier to entry, so there’s an acute awareness of how good a kid is from Day 1.

Even a deliberately healthy environment- like our gym when it first opened- will eventually see this toxic behavior when parents bring their kids over from other places. I think it’s the parents, not the activities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m the gymnastics mom and just want to commiserate. We have to deal with level move ups and that part sounds similar. The girls have to have all of their Level X skills to compete, but during the time when they prep for the season you will only ever hear chatter about the skills that the girls have. The moms will never volunteer that Larla is struggling with her back tuck- it’s always that Larla already has her giant and does my child have their giant? My favorite was the mom who had to update her payments with the front desk when her daughter was moved up and announced to them “we’re level 3!”. No, your daughter is Level 3 and you are the grownup who pays for it.

These activities attract the crazies, I think because they can be measured and leveled at a young age in a way that ball sports can’t until kids are far older. They also have a pretty high initial talent barrier to entry, so there’s an acute awareness of how good a kid is from Day 1.

Even a deliberately healthy environment- like our gym when it first opened- will eventually see this toxic behavior when parents bring their kids over from other places. I think it’s the parents, not the activities.

NP here. I have a 6yo who likes dance and cheer. She is a total beginner and likes to dance. She is cheerful and excited to do dance. She has never done gymnastics. I know dance also includes gymnastics.

Is the talent really recognizable Day 1?

I have a friend with a Level 7? gymnast. She looks amazing in videos. Another friend simply seemed unimpressed with her Level 7 status. I thought they were jerks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m the gymnastics mom and just want to commiserate. We have to deal with level move ups and that part sounds similar. The girls have to have all of their Level X skills to compete, but during the time when they prep for the season you will only ever hear chatter about the skills that the girls have. The moms will never volunteer that Larla is struggling with her back tuck- it’s always that Larla already has her giant and does my child have their giant? My favorite was the mom who had to update her payments with the front desk when her daughter was moved up and announced to them “we’re level 3!”. No, your daughter is Level 3 and you are the grownup who pays for it.

These activities attract the crazies, I think because they can be measured and leveled at a young age in a way that ball sports can’t until kids are far older. They also have a pretty high initial talent barrier to entry, so there’s an acute awareness of how good a kid is from Day 1.

Even a deliberately healthy environment- like our gym when it first opened- will eventually see this toxic behavior when parents bring their kids over from other places. I think it’s the parents, not the activities.

NP here. I have a 6yo who likes dance and cheer. She is a total beginner and likes to dance. She is cheerful and excited to do dance. She has never done gymnastics. I know dance also includes gymnastics.

Is the talent really recognizable Day 1?

I have a friend with a Level 7? gymnast. She looks amazing in videos. Another friend simply seemed unimpressed with her Level 7 status. I thought they were jerks.

Yes, talent is recognizable on Day 1 and in both activities children are quickly tracked. My DD is moderately talented and currently becoming aware of the reality of prodigy teammates- the kind who are like Simone Biles and are plucked from open gym one day and inserted into the team structure a week later.

The most competitive gymnastics in the US is the Developmental Program run by USAG. It uses numbered levels (although NGA does, too- but that’s a different post). It would be hard to get to Level 7 without an amount of talent that wouldn’t be obvious in a beginning rec gymnastics class. Someone who is poo-pooing a Level 7 either is the parent of a level 9, 10 or elite and super snobby, an ignorant casual fan, or just being a contrarian jerk. Even if they’re not the best Level 7 or have so-so form, the skills involved can’t be obtained through just hard work and perseverance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m the gymnastics mom and just want to commiserate. We have to deal with level move ups and that part sounds similar. The girls have to have all of their Level X skills to compete, but during the time when they prep for the season you will only ever hear chatter about the skills that the girls have. The moms will never volunteer that Larla is struggling with her back tuck- it’s always that Larla already has her giant and does my child have their giant? My favorite was the mom who had to update her payments with the front desk when her daughter was moved up and announced to them “we’re level 3!”. No, your daughter is Level 3 and you are the grownup who pays for it.

These activities attract the crazies, I think because they can be measured and leveled at a young age in a way that ball sports can’t until kids are far older. They also have a pretty high initial talent barrier to entry, so there’s an acute awareness of how good a kid is from Day 1.

Even a deliberately healthy environment- like our gym when it first opened- will eventually see this toxic behavior when parents bring their kids over from other places. I think it’s the parents, not the activities.

NP here. I have a 6yo who likes dance and cheer. She is a total beginner and likes to dance. She is cheerful and excited to do dance. She has never done gymnastics. I know dance also includes gymnastics.

Is the talent really recognizable Day 1?

I have a friend with a Level 7? gymnast. She looks amazing in videos. Another friend simply seemed unimpressed with her Level 7 status. I thought they were jerks.

Yes, talent is recognizable on Day 1 and in both activities children are quickly tracked. My DD is moderately talented and currently becoming aware of the reality of prodigy teammates- the kind who are like Simone Biles and are plucked from open gym one day and inserted into the team structure a week later.

The most competitive gymnastics in the US is the Developmental Program run by USAG. It uses numbered levels (although NGA does, too- but that’s a different post). It would be hard to get to Level 7 without an amount of talent that wouldn’t be obvious in a beginning rec gymnastics class. Someone who is poo-pooing a Level 7 either is the parent of a level 9, 10 or elite and super snobby, an ignorant casual fan, or just being a contrarian jerk. Even if they’re not the best Level 7 or have so-so form, the skills involved can’t be obtained through just hard work and perseverance.

Pp here. I am not athletic. I do not think my daughter is especially talented in dance. She has done ballet since preschool, just started hip hop and did one cheer class. I don’t need or even want her to be a competitive dancer. It would be a hobby.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m the gymnastics mom and just want to commiserate. We have to deal with level move ups and that part sounds similar. The girls have to have all of their Level X skills to compete, but during the time when they prep for the season you will only ever hear chatter about the skills that the girls have. The moms will never volunteer that Larla is struggling with her back tuck- it’s always that Larla already has her giant and does my child have their giant? My favorite was the mom who had to update her payments with the front desk when her daughter was moved up and announced to them “we’re level 3!”. No, your daughter is Level 3 and you are the grownup who pays for it.

These activities attract the crazies, I think because they can be measured and leveled at a young age in a way that ball sports can’t until kids are far older. They also have a pretty high initial talent barrier to entry, so there’s an acute awareness of how good a kid is from Day 1.

Even a deliberately healthy environment- like our gym when it first opened- will eventually see this toxic behavior when parents bring their kids over from other places. I think it’s the parents, not the activities.

Op here. Our studio was initially very conscious of being positive and not tolerating toxic behavior… and now that more outsiders are coming in, it’s kind of gone out the window. Some of the moms are crazy, which is to be expected. But it’s the previously non crazy moms turned nutso that I struggle with… and apparently my DD is struggling with the girls changing too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m the gymnastics mom and just want to commiserate. We have to deal with level move ups and that part sounds similar. The girls have to have all of their Level X skills to compete, but during the time when they prep for the season you will only ever hear chatter about the skills that the girls have. The moms will never volunteer that Larla is struggling with her back tuck- it’s always that Larla already has her giant and does my child have their giant? My favorite was the mom who had to update her payments with the front desk when her daughter was moved up and announced to them “we’re level 3!”. No, your daughter is Level 3 and you are the grownup who pays for it.

These activities attract the crazies, I think because they can be measured and leveled at a young age in a way that ball sports can’t until kids are far older. They also have a pretty high initial talent barrier to entry, so there’s an acute awareness of how good a kid is from Day 1.

Even a deliberately healthy environment- like our gym when it first opened- will eventually see this toxic behavior when parents bring their kids over from other places. I think it’s the parents, not the activities.

NP here. I have a 6yo who likes dance and cheer. She is a total beginner and likes to dance. She is cheerful and excited to do dance. She has never done gymnastics. I know dance also includes gymnastics.

Is the talent really recognizable Day 1?

I have a friend with a Level 7? gymnast. She looks amazing in videos. Another friend simply seemed unimpressed with her Level 7 status. I thought they were jerks.

Yes, talent is recognizable on Day 1 and in both activities children are quickly tracked. My DD is moderately talented and currently becoming aware of the reality of prodigy teammates- the kind who are like Simone Biles and are plucked from open gym one day and inserted into the team structure a week later.

The most competitive gymnastics in the US is the Developmental Program run by USAG. It uses numbered levels (although NGA does, too- but that’s a different post). It would be hard to get to Level 7 without an amount of talent that wouldn’t be obvious in a beginning rec gymnastics class. Someone who is poo-pooing a Level 7 either is the parent of a level 9, 10 or elite and super snobby, an ignorant casual fan, or just being a contrarian jerk. Even if they’re not the best Level 7 or have so-so form, the skills involved can’t be obtained through just hard work and perseverance.

Pp here. I am not athletic. I do not think my daughter is especially talented in dance. She has done ballet since preschool, just started hip hop and did one cheer class. I don’t need or even want her to be a competitive dancer. It would be a hobby.

Op here. My DD is not a natural talent. Took us landing at the right studio to really see improvement. She also works her butt off.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m the gymnastics mom and just want to commiserate. We have to deal with level move ups and that part sounds similar. The girls have to have all of their Level X skills to compete, but during the time when they prep for the season you will only ever hear chatter about the skills that the girls have. The moms will never volunteer that Larla is struggling with her back tuck- it’s always that Larla already has her giant and does my child have their giant? My favorite was the mom who had to update her payments with the front desk when her daughter was moved up and announced to them “we’re level 3!”. No, your daughter is Level 3 and you are the grownup who pays for it.

These activities attract the crazies, I think because they can be measured and leveled at a young age in a way that ball sports can’t until kids are far older. They also have a pretty high initial talent barrier to entry, so there’s an acute awareness of how good a kid is from Day 1.

Even a deliberately healthy environment- like our gym when it first opened- will eventually see this toxic behavior when parents bring their kids over from other places. I think it’s the parents, not the activities.

NP here. I have a 6yo who likes dance and cheer. She is a total beginner and likes to dance. She is cheerful and excited to do dance. She has never done gymnastics. I know dance also includes gymnastics.

Is the talent really recognizable Day 1?

I have a friend with a Level 7? gymnast. She looks amazing in videos. Another friend simply seemed unimpressed with her Level 7 status. I thought they were jerks.

Yes, talent is recognizable on Day 1 and in both activities children are quickly tracked. My DD is moderately talented and currently becoming aware of the reality of prodigy teammates- the kind who are like Simone Biles and are plucked from open gym one day and inserted into the team structure a week later.

The most competitive gymnastics in the US is the Developmental Program run by USAG. It uses numbered levels (although NGA does, too- but that’s a different post). It would be hard to get to Level 7 without an amount of talent that wouldn’t be obvious in a beginning rec gymnastics class. Someone who is poo-pooing a Level 7 either is the parent of a level 9, 10 or elite and super snobby, an ignorant casual fan, or just being a contrarian jerk. Even if they’re not the best Level 7 or have so-so form, the skills involved can’t be obtained through just hard work and perseverance.

Pp here. I am not athletic. I do not think my daughter is especially talented in dance. She has done ballet since preschool, just started hip hop and did one cheer class. I don’t need or even want her to be a competitive dancer. It would be a hobby.

Op here. My DD is not a natural talent. Took us landing at the right studio to really see improvement. She also works her butt off.

I think the right studio and instructors bring out the talent. And hard work can polish it. Dance is harder to fake than gymnastics. I personally don’t think you can create a natural performer or teach rhythm, but if someone has those things and you teach them how to move their body, then you’re just cultivating their natural talent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Complaining to the teacher will probably only make things worse. She’s going to have to handle it herself or distance herself.

Responding with passive-aggressive snarky comments tends to make the bragger shut up and start doubting herself, while making the victim feel better.

That's what you want to teach your kids?!?

Okay...... I would rather my kids just choose better friends that don't do this. Braggy kids will eventually understand why they are by themselves or with kids just like them. Kids (and adults) gravitate towards others who make them feel good about themselves. Teach your kid to be a good friend AND to CHOOSE good friends. Personally, I can't stand passive aggressive snarky adults; I usually avoid them when I can.