GT children at independent schools

[Anonymous]

If your child is above grade level in one or more areas and attends an independent school, could you speak to how the school provides differentiated instruction? How happy are you overall with the school's approach?

[Anonymous]

My child started reading at age 2.5 years and is about 2 years ahead on math as well. He is also socially and emotionally about 2 years behind his peers!! What to do?! We put him in an independent school so that he could receive more individualized attention--more support and help with his delays as well as more one on one time with teachers to keep him challenged academically. He is in K this year--I prefer not to say which school other than it is an excellent school in Virginia. It has worked out well so far. As we expected, navigating the social scene has been a real challenge for him and we are thankful that he is in a small, cozy and supportive environment while he catches up socially and emotionally. As for the academics, the teachers have made a real effort to give him more advanced reading and math instruction, although they can only do so much given they have many other children whose families desire individual attention too! The teachers tell me that my child expends most of his energy on the social skills which does not leave much for his academics. In other words, he does well with what he is asked to do and is advancing nicely, but would not benefit from additional challenge at this point. The question is how well he will be challenged in a few years when he is hopefully more on a par with his peers socially/emotionally. Then we will have to reassess. Children are so unpredictable!! Hope this helps a little. Small class size definitely helps the academically advanced and a school that encourages parent coop time allows teachers more one-on-one time with children that supplements the small group work they also do.

[Anonymous]

I can give you a helpful perspective on the Cathedral schools.

NCS and St. Albans are easy to explain. Beauvoir is a bit harder.

NCS does some differentiation with homework in that they sometimes do things like give a page of three story problems where one is required, the next hardest is recommended, and the hardest is totally optional. As far as I can tell, my daughter hasn't received differentiated instruction in class (She's in fourth grade, so I don't have a lot of evidence yet). I know they read all the same books, do all the same assignments, take all the same tests, etc.

I've never seen any differentiation of homework or instruction at STA. Somtimes my son has come home with a book from the librarian that she asked him to review for her, but that's it. I'm a bit frustrated, but thankfully he's "solid" in most academic areas... not so advanced that he needs a lot of extra challenge and not struggling such that he needs extra help. If he were really gifted academically or was an expert in a particular subject/skill area, I'd probably be a lot more frustrated than I am.

Beauvoir seems to differentiate with their reading groups, i.e. kids are reading "just right" or on level books for their reading level. I think almost every teacher does them, but I've heard that one or two might not. We only had one teacher where there was clear evidence that he did a lot of differentiation in math. In some grades, the directing teacher and associate teacher each took half of the class, so there may have been some differentiation there, but I'm not sure. There seemed to be a fair amount of differentiation in K with different games and centers.

[Anonymous]

Thanks to both PPs for their thoughtful replies. Does anyone else have experience in this area?

[Anonymous]

I was wondering about this too. Any instances where children who are "too smart" end up getting turned away at these schools because they pose too many difficulties in trying to individualize the curriculum?

[Anonymous]

My daughter is GT and has been at Burgundy Farm since kindergarten (she's now in middle school). The school has allowed her to interpret projects so as to make them more challenging for her. She's been able to come up with her own ideas for research papers, and routinely hands in papers that are much, much longer than the other kids'. Also, most of the assignments allow the kids to interpret them in many different ways (for example, describe and illustrate a "digestion machine"). There are also two levels of math in the middle school, one on-grade and another above-grade. I know that one boy who was far ahead of the other kids in math was provided with individual projects and assistance, since math is one area where it's a bit harder to provide differentiation.

I'd also highly recommend that you encourage your child to pursue outside interests, such as music or sports. Music, in particular, provides great intellectual challenges for all kids.

[Anonymous]

PP here again. I'd also like to add that Burgundy has been an amazing experience for my daughter. We couldn't be happier with our school choice.

[Anonymous]

None of the schools seem to differentiate before 4th grade anywhere other than reading. And, surprisingly for those of us who come from New York, where WPSCII scores matter hugely - the "top tier" DC schools don't select on WPSCII scores. Or rather, they select out children who score below a certain level. So all of these schools are getting a much broader range of IQs than there NYC top tier counterparts (who tend to take only 95%+ kids). Classrooms move more slowly and expectations, particularly in the early grades, seem to be lower - they teach to the middle, not the top.

[Anonymous]

Would an academically gifted child who is highly sociable be better off in MD or VA public school, where he or she could be in a GT program, than in an independent school? I'm starting to that that might be the case for our DC, who is both highly gifted and highly sociable, and who by all accounts had a stellar application, yet was unable to secure a spot at any of the independent schools we applied to. Our concern is that even the "prestigious" independent schools wouldn't be able to sufficiently challenge our child. Perhaps being turned away was a blessing in disguise.

[Anonymous]

We have also been wrestling w/ this public/private choice for GT kids. In visiting the private schools, I have to say that I had the strong impression that most taught one lesson for the class and that any kids reading or working at a higher level were pretty much left on their own. There seemed to be very little differentiation in the classroom even at the "best" private schools. I was also puzzled by the strong bias at the private schools not to consider children with late birthdays and whether they might do better as the youngest in a grade instead of the oldest. A mother at one school open house asked how that private school would handle an entering pre-K child who was already reading and the response of the school teacher was, "please don't teach them to read, you don't know how, leave those things to us, very few kids are actually gifted." These things were actually a red flag for me.

By contrast, I was pleasantly surprised when I visited several Montgomery County public schools which did seem to emphasize differentiation w/i the classroom, w/i grade regrouping, and flexible math pathways, which would be much better suited for a GT child already working several grades above level. In addition, the highly gifted centers sounded wonderful, although I got to see very little of them and admission prospects are difficult to measure.

I have to admit to a secret feeling of relief that our kids were waitlisted everywhere despite stellar scores and great recs. (Please no flames.) It obviated the whole painful choice between private, which I somehow feel is "supposed" to be better, and public, which in DC has not been a good experience for us but which seems to hold more promise in MoCo.

Overall, we've tentatively decided to go public in MoCo, hope that the promised differentiation actually exists and to apply for the gifted centers.

[Anonymous]

PP: Do you have a sense of which elementaries in Mont Co are best at supporting GT children? I thought the highly gifted centers didn't begin until fourth grade, so I'm wondering what parents do before then.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We have also been wrestling w/ this public/private choice for GT kids. In visiting the private schools, I have to say that I had the strong impression that most taught one lesson for the class and that any kids reading or working at a higher level were pretty much left on their own. There seemed to be very little differentiation in the classroom even at the "best" private schools. I was also puzzled by the strong bias at the private schools not to consider children with late birthdays and whether they might do better as the youngest in a grade instead of the oldest. A mother at one school open house asked how that private school would handle an entering pre-K child who was already reading and the response of the school teacher was, "please don't teach them to read, you don't know how, leave those things to us, very few kids are actually gifted." These things were actually a red flag for me.

By contrast, I was pleasantly surprised when I visited several Montgomery County public schools which did seem to emphasize differentiation w/i the classroom, w/i grade regrouping, and flexible math pathways, which would be much better suited for a GT child already working several grades above level. In addition, the highly gifted centers sounded wonderful, although I got to see very little of them and admission prospects are difficult to measure.

I have to admit to a secret feeling of relief that our kids were waitlisted everywhere despite stellar scores and great recs. (Please no flames.) It obviated the whole painful choice between private, which I somehow feel is "supposed" to be better, and public, which in DC has not been a good experience for us but which seems to hold more promise in MoCo.

Overall, we've tentatively decided to go public in MoCo, hope that the promised differentiation actually exists and to apply for the gifted centers.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I'm the 4/21 20:57 poster. I'm also feeling somewhat relieved by our child not getting in to any of the schools we applied to (so I definitely won't be flaming you), especially after having visited our local public school and talking to the staff there about their attempts to teach the GT kids and strategies for differentiation. As far as our independent school applications, we are also on waitlists everywhere. It really does seem to be a combination of very few spaces, connections, preferences, and luck of the draw. We aren't a "connected" family, we're well off but not so well off that we would be considered a substantial benefactor to the school, and while our child's preschool is nice, it isn't one of the "feeder" preschools that are discussed ad nauseum on this board. According to the schools, our child's play visits went very well and teacher recs were wonderful. And with a WPPSI approaching 150, I don't think there was anything else we could have done. I'm sure everything will work out fine for our child, but I can't help but feel a little bitter about the private school admission process. Our public school option looks quite promising, though, so we'll just go there and hope for the best, and supplement the curriculum as well as we can.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: A mother at one school open house asked how that private school would handle an entering pre-K child who was already reading and the response of the school teacher was, "please don't teach them to read, you don't know how, leave those things to us, very few kids are actually gifted." These things were actually a red flag for me.

I am certainly not going to flame you just to shed some light on what the teacher in the private school may have meant although her seemingly dismissive tone was not called for.

There are some parents who teach their children to read/write/do math etc above their grade level but that does not necessarily mean that the child is any more gifted than another child with the same intellectual capabilities whose parents chose not to "push" (for want of a better word) them to study beyond their current grade. A teacher, who has had experience with thousands of children, may be better able to gauge the children who are truly gifted - those who would have picked up a book at two and started reading on their own - and those whose parents have made sure that their 5 year old starting K can read at the 2nd grade level. That is not to say that that child is not gifted but sometimes parents may think, incorrectly, that because they have taught their child ahead that the child is gifted. A teacher is better placed to gauge innate giftedness and acquired "giftedness" and in many cases what parents see as giftedness is not really that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote: A mother at one school open house asked how that private school would handle an entering pre-K child who was already reading and the response of the school teacher was, "please don't teach them to read, you don't know how, leave those things to us, very few kids are actually gifted." These things were actually a red flag for me.

I am certainly not going to flame you just to shed some light on what the teacher in the private school may have meant although her seemingly dismissive tone was not called for.

There are some parents who teach their children to read/write/do math etc above their grade level but that does not necessarily mean that the child is any more gifted than another child with the same intellectual capabilities whose parents chose not to "push" (for want of a better word) them to study beyond their current grade. A teacher, who has had experience with thousands of children, may be better able to gauge the children who are truly gifted - those who would have picked up a book at two and started reading on their own - and those whose parents have made sure that their 5 year old starting K can read at the 2nd grade level. That is not to say that that child is not gifted but sometimes parents may think, incorrectly, that because they have taught their child ahead that the child is gifted. A teacher is better placed to gauge innate giftedness and acquired "giftedness" and in many cases what parents see as giftedness is not really that.

I'm not the poster you quoted, and I understand your comment about "innate" vs. "acquired" giftedness, but isn't "innate giftedness" exactly what the WPPSI and WISC are designed to pick up? That comment by the school teacher is really appalling. I would think that there are a substantial number of children entering K who are reading or learning to read, and that they are learning to do so because they are being read to by their parents.

[Anonymous]

I didn't find the teacher's remark to be offensive in the least. I find myself thinking that my kid is so great sometimes because of his reading and comprehension, math skills, vocabulary, and WPPSI scores, and then I realize I need to get a grip. He's only FIVE. I think parents who walk into these private schools and say my little johnny is so gifted what can you do to challenge him can only be a turnoff. All the kids are gifted in some way - whether EQ or WPPSI or both or something else.

I think as parents we all need to get a grip.